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Website business idea

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  • 17-11-2011 12:49am
    #1
    El Guapo!
    Registered Users Posts: 12,430 ✭✭✭✭


    Hi all,
    Just looking for a bit of advice please.
    I have an idea for a new web business and just have a quick question or two.
    I don't want to go into too much detail as to what the business is at the minute but basically the entire business is based around this site. The way the business will make money is through subscriptions and advertisements.

    So my first question is how much does a website normally charge for advertising space on its homepage etc? I know this may be a "how long is a piece of string" question but just a general idea would be helpful.

    Also the site would need an extensive search function for users and a large database. What is the going rate for the design and maintainance of a site like this?

    Cheers,
    Dean.


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    #2
    The Apprentice
    Registered Users Posts: 1,130 ✭✭✭The Apprentice


    Well ok.. i think i know what your at.

    Lets say it was a directory with names, nos , details etc. Im assuming its this and you would change for people for said directory, details names etc.

    its aLL about the quality of your directory or website and the content details etc. Make sure it hasnt been done before.. some pro research would be good hear

    A website normally charges based on pageviews, Unique vistiors, Page Rank and location of add/banner that you are using. So yes, very broad, giving u nothing really :P
    Its such a how long is a piece of string question so i cant really be specific.
    Done deal for example are selling 30,000 pageviews for 100.s in specific areas of their site. Dog section etc

    Design dont know.. depends on what u need..
    Maintenance can be broadly based on the structure and bits and bots needed to be maintened .. 50 quid an hour maybe.. 100 ??
    Any more is pie in the sky bull****t.


    Think thats it, unless u have more concrete info i cannot be any more helpfull..

    best of luck buddy in your venture.


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    #3
    El Guapo!
    Registered Users Posts: 12,430 ✭✭✭✭El Guapo!


    Thanks for the reply.
    I know its hard to give advice based on the info I've given but unfortunately I can't really go into much more detail and give too much away as it has never been done before and I don't want to give away too much info! :P
    Basically companies would advertise their items for sale on my site and I'd charge for this service. And also charge for banner advertisements etc. Kind of a catalogue type site!
    I suppose I just have to do a lot more market research to get the finer details.
    Thanks for your help.


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    #4
    Axwell
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 10,461 Mod ✭✭✭✭Axwell


    Starting out you are going to be in a catch 22 situation, you need the advertisers to fill up the ad space on the homepage etc but you need the site to be busy before they will sign up and pay in the first place. You will have to considering offering free space initially or at a huge discount to get things rolling and then look at returning to normal rates once the introductory offer or whatever you want to call it has passed.

    Anyone looking to advertise is going to ask you what the traffic to the website is like and until you build up the site and have people using it that's not going to be a very impressive number. Your priority should be getting the people to the site that are going to use it and sell their items etc and focus your efforts on building up the traffic to the site. Then you can approach people when you have the stats and figures to say back up the costs of your advertising space.


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    #5
    amen
    Registered Users Posts: 2,781 ✭✭✭amen


    has never been done before and I don't want to give away too much info! Basically companies would advertise their items for sale on my site and I'd charge for this service.
    don't want to burst any bubbles but I bets its been done before.

    If not there is probably a good reason why its hasn't been done i.e. no market.


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    #6
    El Guapo!
    Registered Users Posts: 12,430 ✭✭✭✭El Guapo!


    Axwell wrote: »
    Starting out you are going to be in a catch 22 situation, you need the advertisers to fill up the ad space on the homepage etc but you need the site to be busy before they will sign up and pay in the first place. You will have to considering offering free space initially or at a huge discount to get things rolling and then look at returning to normal rates once the introductory offer or whatever you want to call it has passed.

    Anyone looking to advertise is going to ask you what the traffic to the website is like and until you build up the site and have people using it that's not going to be a very impressive number. Your priority should be getting the people to the site that are going to use it and sell their items etc and focus your efforts on building up the traffic to the site. Then you can approach people when you have the stats and figures to say back up the costs of your advertising space.
    Thanks for that. Yeah I realise I would need good figures of traffic before anyone would be willing to spend good money on advertising. I could probably offer a free banner once they subscribe and then start charging once the traffic picks up. Thanks for the advice, much appreciated.
    amen wrote: »
    don't want to burst any bubbles but I bets its been done before.

    If not there is probably a good reason why its hasn't been done i.e. no market.

    I have already done a fair bit of research into it and it hasn't been done before. There would definitely be a market for it too. It may not make me a millionaire or anything but it'll definitely be a useful and hopefully popular resource for people.
    Sure if I don't take a chance I'll never know and I'll always regret it, especially when I think it has great potential! :)


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    #7
    sirreally
    Registered Users Posts: 109 ✭✭sirreally


    No offence, but I think you're way out of your depth and you need to talk to people who have a firm grasp of business, specifically online businesses. There are plenty of people out there who you could talk to, and who wouldn't give up their day job to steal your idea. And I know you are here looking for advice, but it's impossible to answer any of your questions even remotely accurately.
    Dean09 wrote: »
    The way the business will make money is through subscriptions and advertisements.

    Don't include one cent of banner advertising revenue in the financial projections of your business plan. Unless your site has huge traffic, it will make virtually no money from advertising. Even sites like DAFT, boards and Irishtimes.ie make relatively very little from banner advertising.
    Dean09 wrote: »
    ...how much does a website normally charge for advertising space on its homepage etc?

    That's like asking how much is an ad on the front page of a newspaper. Do you mean the Irish Times or the Longford Leader?

    You clearly don't have a firm understanding about online advertising, so you should forget about that until it becomes relevant and just focus on offering a service that people will want. If they like it, then traffic and (some) ad revenue will follow.
    Dean09 wrote: »
    Basically companies would advertise their items for sale on my site and I'd charge for this service.

    Why would a company advertise items for sale on your site when they can use Ebay, Amazon, affiliates etc and only pay commission on actual sales? Maybe they will pay you a small fee, but where are you going to get the traffic from? Remember, it's incredibly hard to change or even influence the behaviour of businesses and consumers - even using enticements like a free trial.
    Dean09 wrote: »
    Also the site would need an extensive search function for users and a large database. What is the going rate for the design and maintainance of a site like this?

    There is no going rate for a bespoke project. That's like asking how much a house will cost to build and only saying that it needs a garage and a big garden. If you want to find out the price, talk to at least 3 recommended website development companies. Then you'll have a range to go by, with actual market rates, rather than just random guesses (my random guess is €15k, for what little it's worth).

    What I can tell you is that in-site search engines are notoriously hard to get right. Many sites just end up using the Google search function, which costs a fortune (unless you're happy to have Google Adwords all over your results, which may not work for the service you are describing).

    As for the rest, it's natural to assume that your idea is great and that you should keep quiet about it, but that's a fatal mistake made by many would-be entrepreneurs. Here's the best advice I ever read about starting a business:

    "Before you start your new company, figure out what your product is, then figure out who will buy it (I mean, who is the specific person in an organization that would need to make a purchase decision). Then, go talk to 2 or 3 of those people.

    At this stage, if you can't figure out who those people are, then you have a problem that isn't going to go away once you've spent 12 months building your product. You have no market, do something else.

    If you can't get a meeting with those people, then you also have a problem that isn't going to go away after you've built your product. You can't penetrate your market, do something else.

    When you get a meeting with them, don't try to pitch them your idea. Tell them that you are exploring a market opportunity, and that you'd like to describe a product and ask them if they would buy it. Make it clear to them that they are very welcome to say "no, I won't buy that". In fact, you should try to get them to tell you they won't buy it. If they tell you they won't buy it, your market doesn't want it, do something else.

    If they say they'll buy it, ask them if they would sign a non-binding letter of intent saying that if you build the product, and it does what you say it will do, that they will purchase it. This commits them to nothing, but these LoIs are gold if you are ever pitching investors. They are also a robust sign that they aren't just telling you what you want to hear. If they won't sign LoIs, then they weren't serious when they said they'd buy your product, your market doesn't want it, do something else.

    Get 2 or three LoIs in your back pocket, then you're ready to quit your job and start your business.

    I guess the key idea here that most entrepreneurs miss is that you really need to vet your own ideas. Many aspiring entrepreneurs dream up an idea, and then stick to it doggedly, either because its the only idea they have, or they find it technically interesting. They don't want to discover that it won't work, so they don't try to figure it out!

    The one thing worse than not starting a company is wasting 6 or 12 months of your life on an idea that has no market. Be smart, and do your due diligence on your own ideas before you take the plunge and start a company."


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    #8
    MyPeopleDrankTheSoup
    Registered Users Posts: 2,713 ✭✭✭MyPeopleDrankTheSoup


    No offence OP, but I know your type, you'll be getting everyone you meet to sign your expensive NDA before talking about the idea. I'd say just get it outsourced on odesk.com and don't spend too much time and cash on it before seeing if it's a winner or not.


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    #9
    The Apprentice
    Registered Users Posts: 1,130 ✭✭✭The Apprentice


    Send it to me... I have a brain/experience for the Development side/Internet side of things and have a business Qualification so i have broad knowledge of marketing/finance also..

    I,ll sign any Non disclosure Agreements you can throw at me.. i give you my word i wont pinch your idea because i have tried this and its a pain in the hole and i wont ever be going down this route again. Agreed if u have something that no one else has, your on the money but if not you could be flogging a dead horse.

    I can pretty much assure you that it has been done in on way shape or form which is fine, your probably not first to market on this project but all you need to do is solve a problem that people have or that people didnt know they had !!


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    #10
    betonit
    Registered Users Posts: 525 ✭✭✭betonit


    If there's a market for it, it is going to be very difficult and expensive to let the market know about it. The risk with websites sites with a usp is that they are instantly copyable and someone with major resources will blow you out of the water before the mass market knows that you even exist. Unless its a new technology your not going to be able to protect your idea. For these reasons you cant keep it too close to your chest, your probably going to need a backer in this field with a proven track record, for it to be a success. I dont want to come across negative but thems are the facts. Think about the cost and speed of the succesful execution of your plan.

    The very best if luck


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    #11
    El Guapo!
    Registered Users Posts: 12,430 ✭✭✭✭El Guapo!


    Thanks for all the replies folks, I really appreciate them.
    I do realise I am somewhat out of my depth but that's why I'm just trying to get a general idea of what's involved before I dive in head first.

    I also realise I may need financial backing and/or the backing and insight of someone experienced in web based business and therefore I'll obviously have to share my idea with someone. It's not like its the holy grail of business ideas or anything, it's just an idea I had that I thought might be a runner and it's something that I would use myself if it was made available by somebody else. For all I know it might not take off at all. That's why I was looking for advice here.
    I was planning on putting the feelers out soon to see if I genuinely have something or if it's not realistic. I know I need to put a lot more thought into it first and bounce the idea back and forth a while first.
    @The Apprentice- I might take you up on that offer and send you the outline of my idea. It's a fairly simple one but I think it'd be useful for people.


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    #12
    Chet Zar
    Registered Users Posts: 968 ✭✭✭Chet Zar


    amen wrote: »
    don't want to burst any bubbles but I bets its been done before.

    If not there is probably a good reason why its hasn't been done i.e. no market.

    If everyone took this attitude then nobody would ever come up with anything new ;)

    Besides, there is always an angle that can be taken on an existing idea, if it exists.


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    #13
    The Apprentice
    Registered Users Posts: 1,130 ✭✭✭The Apprentice


    Ye i dont he did try to come across at this angle but perhaps did, As you know google are not innovators in their field either.
    You have a valid point stating this about taken an idea and coming back with an improved version, they have never had something fresh really and truly a lot of their new ideas bombed quicker than Afghanistan. It was some good buy outs and improved ideas that made them the market leaders we see today.
    Obviously dont be disheartned in any way, just keep putting ideas up on the drawing board and one will eventually pay off..

    Tis the entrepreneurs way :P


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    #14
    amen
    Registered Users Posts: 2,781 ✭✭✭amen


    If everyone took this attitude then nobody would ever come up with anything new

    Besides, there is always an angle that can be taken on an existing idea, if it exists

    not true. Most advances are incremental without someone taking an existing idea and making a little better or implementing it better (better ui, friendlier staff, no quibble refunds etc)
    As you know google are not innovators in their field either

    please clarify. First company to successfully figure out how to generate add revenue from search, some neat pieces in Analytics, Android, GMail offering etc


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    #15
    Chet Zar
    Registered Users Posts: 968 ✭✭✭Chet Zar


    amen wrote: »
    not true. Most advances are incremental without someone taking an existing idea and making a little better or implementing it better (better ui, friendlier staff, no quibble refunds etc)

    It is true - I don't really understand your post here but there is always a way to take an existing idea and improve on it, or make it so much better that it is effectively a new idea, or a very strong improvement on an existing one.

    Also, it is definitely not always the case that if something hasn't been created or is not yet on the market, or is not yet a service, that there isn't a market for it. That's only an illusion. Sure isn't marketing all about convincing someone that they need what you're offering!

    In addition, a lot of the best and most innovative ideas out there are often one where people go 'how come that wasn't out there already'?
    amen wrote: »
    please clarify. First company to successfully figure out how to generate add revenue from search, some neat pieces in Analytics, Android, GMail offering etc

    Google are probably one of the most innovative - if not thee most innovative - company in the world. They took what everyone else had tried to do unsuccessfully, and innovated to make their version an unprecedented success.


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    #16
    itsRayOk
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭itsRayOk


    dont mean to be an asshole but eBay will do a far better job then you


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    #17
    thomas01
    Registered Users Posts: 179 ✭✭thomas01


    You should try using trade doubler to fill some advertising space initially (affiliate program). They have companies like Groupon and some other Irish companies. It doesnt look as spammy as google adsense. The difficulty of building traffic to your site should not be under estimated but it can be done. Make sure you really like the business your getting into and try to get up to speed on basic webdesign. Building traffic doesnt happen over night and you dont want to rack up huge fees while your doing it. There should be a good CMS system in place.


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    #18
    allaboutclicks
    Registered Users Posts: 43 ✭allaboutclicks


    Why are you all so certain of what the idea is - why do you presume it's something that already been done & done. Maybe it is something new.

    Probably not. But it might be.

    Dean, if you want to set up an advertising platform on your website you need at a mininum to be able to track impressions and clicks. To begin with it would probably be easier to use some affiliate program like Adsense.

    There are many CMS packages that will help you to create online communities - your project may require a custom solution but I'd definitely recommend researching the different CMS solutions (maybe Drupal?). Without more info it's impossible to advise you but if you do have something new then you're right not to share it here.

    By the way a lot of CMS have plugins to help you with advertising as well.

    Hope it goes well and hope we get to find out what it is someday.


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