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MHEG5 quirk in Ireland?

  • 30-07-2011 1:35pm
    #1
    Badgermonkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,019 ✭✭✭


    Bought an AOC 32" WA91 in November last as its blurb stated it possessed MPEG4 (H.264) HD and MHEG5.

    http://v1.aoc-europe.com/en/televisions/lcdtv/32_L32WA91.php

    I upgraded aerial set up in May to receive Saorview and discovered no digital teletext was being received, EBU only.

    Following protracted correspondence with the manufacturer, I've been told the MHEG5 problem is a known issue AOC are experiencing with Saorview and is particular to DTT in Ireland only.

    Is there an unusual or quirky specification of MHEG5 which RTENL rolled out which would explain this anomaly?


Comments

  • #2
    STB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,178 ✭✭✭STB


    Is that right now.

    Its per the UK profile v1.06.

    How come the other manufacturers dont have a problem with v1.06 ???!!!
    Get a refund. If they put MHEG5 on the box then it should do MHEG5. Cheap ass rubbish.


  • #3
    Badgermonkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,019 ✭✭✭Badgermonkey


    Ta STB

    Is the v1.06 UK MHEG5 profile identical to that adopted here?

    I purchased this set from ebuyer UK btw, but cannot find any reports of an AOC MHEG5 issue showing up on UK AV forums etc.

    Are there continental European MHEG5 profiles and if so, is it likely this is what my TV has onboard?


  • #4
    STB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,178 ✭✭✭STB


    Badgermonkey wrote: »
    Ta STB

    Is the v1.06 UK MHEG5 profile identical to that adopted here?

    I purchased this set from ebuyer UK btw, but cannot find any reports of an AOC MHEG5 issue showing up on UK AV forums etc.

    Are there continental European MHEG5 profiles and if so, is it likely this is what my TV has onboard?

    There are no European MHEG5 profiles full stop. The only countries that use it within Europe are UK and Ireland. The version is 1.06. On the continent they use MHP.

    MHEG5 only loads on RTE1 at the moment on my Samsung. Are you trying it on RTE1 ? If it isnt loading on RTE1 I wonder is there an menu option to switch between middleware types - perhaps it is MHP by default, have a look in the menus ?

    AOC products are sold almost exclusively in Ireland by DID Electrical.


  • #5
    Badgermonkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,019 ✭✭✭Badgermonkey


    STB wrote: »
    If it isnt loading on RTE1 I wonder is there an menu option to switch between middleware types - perhaps it is MHP by default, have a look in the menus ?

    This is what I originally thought STB and contacted AOC on May 9th to check.
    Having received little or no assistance, I then contacted their head office on June 7th who then confirmed a problem with MHEG5.

    I have been told by a senior manager that they are working on a firmware update via USB. He also told me this problem is specific to Ireland only and tbh that's now confusing me.

    If we share the UK profile and I bought the set from a UK e-tailer, where is this lack of compatability with the Saorview spec coming from? As you said above, how come other manufacturers have not experienced these issues with the v1.06.UK profile?

    AOC's own website states this under my Models spec, no mention of MHP.
    Convenience
    Text page memory (pages) Yes (1000 Pages)
    Electronic progamme guide (EPG) 7 days
    Interactive MHEG5
    Auto volume level Yes
    OAD (over air download)


  • #6
    STB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,178 ✭✭✭STB


    Badgermonkey wrote: »

    If we share the UK profile and I bought the set from a UK e-tailer, where is this lack of compatability with the Saorview spec coming from? As you said above, how come other manufacturers have not experienced these issues with the v1.06.UK profile?

    That is a question for AOC! Yes we are the same profile as UK. The UK people must be having same issues. Sounds like MHEG5 engine isnt actually present at all!


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  • #7
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,658 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Badgermonkey wrote: »
    I have been told by a senior manager that they are working on a firmware update via USB. He also told me this problem is specific to Ireland only and tbh that's now confusing me.

    If we share the UK profile and I bought the set from a UK e-tailer, where is this lack of compatability with the Saorview spec coming from? As you said above, how come other manufacturers have not experienced these issues with the v1.06.UK profile?

    AOC's own website states this under my Models spec, no mention of MHP.

    Is the TV setup with Ireland as the country?
    Have you tried UK as the country?

    My 2008 Sony gives me MHEG-5 interactivity if I install it with UK as the country but no MHEG-5 if I use Ireland as the country, probably because the UK was the only european country that used MHEG-5 at the time the firmware was written. Possibly the reason the AOC issue is particular to DTT in Ireland only, they haven't bothered to update the firmware regarding Ireland & MHEG-5 since. Similar niggles with other manufacturers reported here over the years.


  • #8
    STB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,178 ✭✭✭STB


    Some times the simplest things are missed.

    Well spotted The Cush. Would explain why the engine isnt present.

    A country set up could most certainly turn off MHEG5. The Irish profile doesnt turn on MHEG5 is probably the issue, if its a multiple country setup.

    Bet AOC's USB firmware update is exactly that (to turn it on when Ireland is selected, rather than MHP which is probably the default!)


  • #9
    Badgermonkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,019 ✭✭✭Badgermonkey


    The Cush wrote: »
    Is the TV setup with Ireland as the country?
    Have you tried UK as the country?

    My 2008 Sony gives me MHEG-5 interactivity if I install it with UK as the country but no MHEG-5 if I use Ireland as the country, probably because the UK was the only european country that used MHEG-5 at the time the firmware was written. Possibly the reason the AOC issue is particular to DTT in Ireland only, they haven't bothered to update the firmware regarding Ireland & MHEG-5 since. Similar niggles with other manufacturers reported here over the years.

    Wish that was it The Cush.

    It was one of the first things I tried, changing country setting to UK then France, as I thought there may have been some TNT oddity at play but nothing's resolved it.

    On a UK setting, it put the RTE's up in the 8 or 900's but still displayed only traditional teletext.


  • #10
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,658 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Badgermonkey wrote: »
    It was one of the first things I tried, changing country setting to UK then France, as I thought there may have been some TNT oddity at play but nothing's resolved it.

    On a UK setting, it put the RTE's up in the 8 or 900's but still displayed only traditional teletext.

    OK thanks for that.

    I've done the UK thing with a number of pre-Saorview TVs e.g. Sony, Philips, Samsung and all have displayed MHEG-5 text correctly.

    Maybe as STB suggested MHEG-5 isn't there at all.


  • #11
    Badgermonkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,019 ✭✭✭Badgermonkey


    The Cush wrote: »

    Maybe as STB suggested MHEG-5 isn't there at all.

    Would appear to be the case.

    As an aside, I'd read the Nordic countries also use DVB-T+ MPEG4 HD + MHEG5, so changed country profile to Norway-still no MHEG5 but it did place digital terrestrial channels at 1,2,3 etc.


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  • #12
    The Cush
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,658 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Badgermonkey wrote: »
    As an aside, I'd read the Nordic countries also use DVB-T+ MPEG4 HD + MHEG5, so changed country profile to Norway-still no MHEG5 but it did place digital terrestrial channels at 1,2,3 etc.

    Not correct I'm afraid - http://www.impala.org/deployments

    Boxer Sweden did plan to use it at one time but that plan was dropped in favour of MHP.


  • #13
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,417 ✭✭✭✭watty


    MHP is practically dead. Most that "claim" to use it don't or have abandoned it. Non-MHEG5 countries are now looking at HbbTV.

    MHP is basically Java. Not a good match for setboxes/TVs with streamed broadcast data and needs more resource than MHEG5.

    I'd not buy an AOC anyway. They are not expert at TV.


  • #14
    Badgermonkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,019 ✭✭✭Badgermonkey


    watty wrote: »

    I'd not buy an AOC anyway. They are not expert at TV.

    I was initially pleasantly surprised by the sets quality but the process of trying to seek a remedy from AOC for the MHEG5 issue has been kinda exasperating.


  • #15
    Badgermonkey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,019 ✭✭✭Badgermonkey


    Just to update, full refund was issued by Ebuyer.

    I tested the TV on the Freeview signal up north and surprisingly, it displayed BBC digital teletext via the 'Red Button'.

    So this AOC is a bit of an oddity - Won't do MHEG5 on Saorview when set to UK profile but MHEG5 was indeed present.


  • #16
    byte
    Moderators, Regional North West Moderators Posts: 19,127 Mod ✭✭✭✭byte
    byte


    Some Hannspree models proclaiming MHEG5 on the packaging will also not work with Saorview. Yet the MHEG5 services are fine on Freeview... it's strange, but only affects these cheap brands.

    I guess you do get what you pay for...

    Good you got a refund though.


  • #17
    SRB
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 820 ✭✭✭SRB


    I wonder is it because RTE also transmit "normal" teletext as well as MHEG5. It could be a s/w issue where the box "checks" is VBI text present and if so defaults to it. Just a thought....


  • #18
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,864 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    SRB wrote: »
    I wonder is it because RTE also transmit "normal" teletext as well as MHEG5. It could be a s/w issue where the box "checks" is VBI text present and if so defaults to it. Just a thought....

    But that is not so with RTE 2 HD, which has no VBI teletext. Another little 'feature' of the RTE NL experience.


  • #19
    SRB
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 820 ✭✭✭SRB


    I meant as a service, it's flagged as carrying vbi txt in the mux data stream, rather than per channel, the BBC Mux doesn't flag VBI text (obviously) though RTE does.
    The BT vision boxes didn't see the RTE MHEG5 when it first appeared either.


  • #20
    watty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,417 ✭✭✭✭watty


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    But that is not so with RTE 2 HD, which has no VBI teletext. Another little 'feature' of the RTE NL experience.

    It's nothing to do with how RTE does MHEG5. It's Shoddy TV makers that have not implemented the spec properly. They have taken short cuts. Usually traditional Monitor makers with no experience implementing TV software.

    LG even has option for Ireland to cope with EBU and MHEG5 text both being present. After 2013 there may be no EBU text on Irish TV at which point the setting will do nothing.

    Same with Pansonic who forget that D-Book is an addition to DVB spec. Some of their "freeview" kit isn't properly DVB compliant. Philips fixed some issues. Panasonic won't even admit they are in the wrong.

    Never test only against a Transmission. The test standard is the spec. That's why decent 3rd party test house should be used for verification.


  • #21
    SRB
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 820 ✭✭✭SRB


    watty wrote: »

    LG even has option for Ireland to cope with EBU and MHEG5 text both being present. After 2013 there may be no EBU text on Irish TV at which point the setting will do nothing.

    That's a bit harsh Watty, - quite a few TV's have that option and if some channels are using both, they are at least giving the user the option of which txt service they use.


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