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Why do atheists spend so much time talking about religion?

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  • 15-07-2010 4:07pm
    #1
    antiskeptic
    Registered Users Posts: 9,555 ✭✭✭


    I'm curious. When I scan down the list of topics in this forum I see that nigh on every issue revolves in some way around religion, in the anti sense of the word naturally.

    I know that atheists consider themselves to be defined as people who lack a belief in God but that shouldn't mean their sole interest is being anti-religious. Surely there are thousands of topics relevant to your position as an atheist that you'd like to discuss other than the anti-theist position.

    Why is this? Why is it that the raison d'etre for this forum centres around (nay requires the existance of) an unbelieved in God. Should I suppose that if Ireland was 100% secularised there would be no topics of discussion left for atheism?


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    #2
    biko
    Registered Users Posts: 81,223 ✭✭✭✭biko


    I only talk about it when someone ask me my religion or there is a discussion about religion. I don't like when people push their belief in my face and so I won't disturb them with my non-belief.


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    #3
    antiskeptic
    Registered Users Posts: 9,555 ✭✭✭antiskeptic


    biko wrote: »
    I only talk about it when someone ask me my religion or there is a discussion about religion. I don't like when people push their belief in my face and so I won't disturb them with my non-belief.

    So you don't consider your worldview to be something worth evangelising?


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    #4
    Ickle Magoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,485 ✭✭✭✭Ickle Magoo


    When I can live my life without fear of some religious nut job knocking on the door & disturbing my evening, my child being refused a place in a school because of lacking a baptism cert and no other part of my life is affected by religion or the religious unless I choose it, I will have absolutely nothing to say about religion - actually, I'd probably have a great deal more positive things to say.

    They are unavoidably interlinked anyway, without theism, there is no such thing as atheism - one only exists because of the other and often as a direct result of the other. The forum is not just for atheists btw, give-away in the title. :cool:


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    #5
    King Mob
    Registered Users Posts: 25,229 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    antiskeptic wrote: »
    I'm curious. When I scan down the list of topics in this forum I see that nigh on every issue revolves in some way around religion, in the anti sense of the word naturally.

    I know that atheists consider themselves to be defined as people who lack a belief in God but that shouldn't mean their sole interest is being anti-religious. Surely there are thousands of topics relevant to your position as an atheist that you'd like to discuss other than the anti-theist position.

    Why is this? Why is it that the raison d'etre for this forum centres around (nay requires the existance of) an unbelieved in God. Should I suppose that if Ireland was 100% secularised there would be no topics of discussion left for atheism?
    Because I like discussing these topics?
    Because I enjoy challenging my positions and seeing if they hold up to scrutiny?
    Because I enjoy learning new things that such discussions bring up?
    Because I have other interests as well.
    Because not all of the topics on this forum are "anti-theist"?


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    #6
    eightyfish
    Registered Users Posts: 2,100 ✭✭✭eightyfish


    antiskeptic wrote: »
    When I scan down the list of topics in this forum I see that nigh on every issue revolves in some way around religion

    I wish Underworld were playing at the Electric Picnic this year. It'd be brilliant.


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    #7
    Zombrex
    Closed Accounts Posts: 25,848 ✭✭✭✭Zombrex


    antiskeptic wrote: »
    I'm curious. When I scan down the list of topics in this forum I see that nigh on every issue revolves in some way around religion, in the anti sense of the word naturally.

    I know that atheists consider themselves to be defined as people who lack a belief in God but that shouldn't mean their sole interest is being anti-religious. Surely there are thousands of topics relevant to your position as an atheist that you'd like to discuss other than the anti-theist position.

    Why is this? Why is it that the raison d'etre for this forum centres around (nay requires the existance of) an unbelieved in God. Should I suppose that if Ireland was 100% secularised there would be no topics of discussion left for atheism?

    Atheism is a rejection of the ideas of theists. It makes sense then that most discussion in the Atheist forum will be about the rejection of the ideas of theists.

    If I want to discuss Team Fortress 2 I go to the gaming section. If I want to discuss Predators I got the film section.

    I'm not sure what the confusion here is?

    Perhaps you can clarify, what would you expect to be discussed in an atheist forum?


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    #8
    biko
    Registered Users Posts: 81,223 ✭✭✭✭biko


    antiskeptic wrote: »
    So you don't consider your worldview to be something worth evangelising?
    No, certainly not evangelising :)

    I grew up with a Christian sister and New Age mum and me fervent atheist, so can say we've pretty much covered every aspect of belief systems and no-one changed their mind.


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    #9
    smokingman
    Registered Users Posts: 3,740 ✭✭✭smokingman


    I think you'll find most atheists have much more to talk about besides religion.
    Just so happens that this being an atheists forum, that's all there is to the subject....no belief in any god. Simples.

    It's a wonderfully simple way of life after you crawl away from the oppression of religion and the only reason why we may seem to "go on" about religion in here is because many of us can't understand why the religious would choose to be treated so badly. We're humanists at heart ;)


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    #10
    Ickle Magoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,485 ✭✭✭✭Ickle Magoo


    A quick scan down the christianity forum reveals many of the threads are in relation to non-believers or are discussing people or sections of society or religions that hold opposing views - why would A&A be any different?


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    #11
    eightyfish
    Registered Users Posts: 2,100 ✭✭✭eightyfish


    OP this is an atheist forum. Therefore it is going to be concerned with atheistic - and therefore also theistic - issues. We atheists all talk about many other things on boards. Just not in this forum.


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    #12
    Mr. Presentable
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,496 ✭✭✭Mr. Presentable


    I think they've confused being non-believers with being dis-believers.


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    #13
    ChocolateSauce
    Registered Users Posts: 2,892 ✭✭✭ChocolateSauce


    I think the reason we talk about religion so much is because this is a forum which was designed specifically for us to talk about religion. Check our posts in other forums and you'll find that a far smaller proportion of posts are about religion.

    I know that IRL I rarely talk about religion specifically. Atheists I meet (and myself for that matter) want to talk about something else, and theists I meet are even less interested than I am in me trying to convert them.

    We're not one-trick horses. Tell me, if you reached into a jar with many different kinds of marble and pulled out only one, would you assume that all the marbles were just like that one?


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    #14
    NothingMan
    Registered Users Posts: 11,178 ✭✭✭✭NothingMan


    ....
















    ....


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    #15
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,403 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    antiskeptic wrote: »
    Surely there are thousands of topics relevant to your position as an atheist that you'd like to discuss other than the anti-theist position.
    Have a read of the forum -- other than Fred Phelps and creationists, I can't think of anything which is persistently "anti-theist".

    The "Interesting Stuff" thread is a good place to start:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2054990656


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    #16
    Ickle Magoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,485 ✭✭✭✭Ickle Magoo


    ^^^^ talk about living up to your name... :p

    Edited to add - Sorry Robin, that was meant for nothingman...:o damn you silly laptop and your slow typing flat keys


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    #17
    Pygmalion
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,082 ✭✭✭Pygmalion


    antiskeptic wrote: »
    When I scan down the list of topics in this forum I see that nigh on every issue revolves in some way around religion, in the anti sense of the word naturally.

    If you go to the Computers and Technology forum nigh on every issue revolves in some way around Computers and/or Technology.
    I know that atheists consider themselves to be defined as people who lack a belief in God but that shouldn't mean their sole interest is being anti-religious. Surely there are thousands of topics relevant to your position as an atheist that you'd like to discuss other than the anti-theist position.
    There are lots of topics relevant to us that we like to discuss. These topics generally aren't relevant to Atheism or Agnosticism though.
    People in the Computers and Technology forum also have interests apart from Computers and Technology, but they don't post about them in that forum, because it would be off-topic.

    Of my 4,000 posts I'd say less than 100 of them are in this forum, so it's not my sole interest, it makes up less than 2.5% of my interest if you're going by amount of discussion it generates.
    Why is this? Why is it that the raison d'etre for this forum centres around (nay requires the existance of) an unbelieved in God.
    You're aware of the name of the forum right?
    Why is is that the Computers and Technology forum exists only to discuss computers and technology?
    Should I suppose that if Ireland was 100% secularised there would be no topics of discussion left for atheism?
    There would be a lot less indeed.
    We'd still probably discuss matters abroad if they interested us, and if the entire world was secular there'd be even less.
    We'd probably still post funny comics/videos in the "funny side of religion" thread.


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    #18
    NothingMan
    Registered Users Posts: 11,178 ✭✭✭✭NothingMan


    Ickle Magoo wrote: »
    ^^^^ talk about living up to your name... :p

    Edited to add - Sorry Robin, that was meant for nothingman...:o damn you silly laptop and your slow typing flat keys


    It was my weak attempt at humour about what could be discussed in an atheist forum if it wasn't peoples reasons for questioning/rejecting theism.


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    #19
    The Mad Hatter
    Registered Users Posts: 4,718 ✭✭✭The Mad Hatter


    antiskeptic wrote: »
    I'm curious. When I scan down the list of topics in this forum I see that nigh on every issue revolves in some way around religion, in the anti sense of the word naturally.

    I know that atheists consider themselves to be defined as people who lack a belief in God but that shouldn't mean their sole interest is being anti-religious. Surely there are thousands of topics relevant to your position as an atheist that you'd like to discuss other than the anti-theist position.

    Why is this? Why is it that the raison d'etre for this forum centres around (nay requires the existance of) an unbelieved in God. Should I suppose that if Ireland was 100% secularised there would be no topics of discussion left for atheism?

    Yes, but not for atheists. Well, not none, but certainly fewer. As Robin said, the Interesting Stuff thread is cool, for one thing.

    Do a search for any poster on A&A - you'll find in most cases that this isn't the only place we post.


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    #20
    antiskeptic
    Registered Users Posts: 9,555 ✭✭✭antiskeptic


    King Mob wrote: »
    Because not all of the topics on this forum are "anti-theist"?

    True. But they do form the vast bulk of the discussion


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    #21
    antiskeptic
    Registered Users Posts: 9,555 ✭✭✭antiskeptic


    Wicknight wrote: »
    Atheism is a rejection of the ideas of theists. It makes sense then that most discussion in the Atheist forum will be about the rejection of the ideas of theists.

    I was under the impression that atheism was a lack of belief in God, an absence of belief rather than the preference for a competing set of beliefs (a competing set of beliefs being required in order to leverage the rejection of theist beliefs). Thus has the charge that atheism is a faith-based system been circumvented.

    Now you appear to want it the other way..


    I'm not sure what the confusion here is?

    Perhaps you can clarify, what would you expect to be discussed in an atheist forum?


    Something other than anti-theism?


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    #22
    King Mob
    Registered Users Posts: 25,229 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    antiskeptic wrote: »
    True. But they do form the vast bulk of the discussion
    And the bulk of topics on the Christian forum is about theism.
    What's your point exactly?

    What do you think should make the vast bulk of the topics here?


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    #23
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,340 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    antiskeptic wrote: »
    Surely there are thousands of topics relevant to your position as an atheist that you'd like to discuss other than the anti-theist position.

    Why do you expect us to have particular things to talk about when you say „Surely there are thousands of topics relevant to your position“. As you said the entire position is defined as NOT being your position. What else would we talk about except the position we are defined as not having.

    There is no other link between two people that are atheists other than they are defined not to be religious. That’s it. For example if you got a large group of people together where the only thing they all have in common is... they all do not play golf.... what "common subject" would they have to talk about across the entirety of the group except for non-golf playing that is "relevant to their position"?)) There simply is no other 100% universal topic there relevant to their position.

    If you insist on labeling people by what they are not, you are going to result in really dumb questions I am afraid, without meaning to.

    However, to answer your question anyway, despite it being a bad one for the reasons I just mentioned, the reason I personally talk about religion so much is I literally have no choice.

    The things I AM interested in, and I talk about at length on this forum, other forums, with this user name and other user names are: Politics, education, science, sexuality, morality, ethics, the environment among others.

    In EVER single one of those realms of discourse I am confronted by the religious, touting religious opinions, based solely on a premise that not one of them has bothered to validate… namely that there is a controlling non-human intelligence who’s wishes we need to adhere to.

    I mean literally every one of them, and I mean literally daily in each of them.

    I would love to wake up tomorrow and not read about, talk about or fight against religion ever again… ever. I want nothing more than to leave religion alone.

    I… simply… am… not… let.

    As long as ANYONE, including the religious, come into the realms of discourse I am interested in touting opinions without a solid or real or even ANY foundation, that they literally can not be arsed validating the credibility of… I will be forced to confront them, either on a personal level or as part of a group. Given the size and diversity of religion I choose to confront it as a group, on forums such as this or as a member of Atheist Ireland.

    My motto on life is that if a premise appears before me lacking ANY evidence to support it, then I will move to have it removed from the discourse at hand. Given that there is not a jot of evidence, argument, data or reasons on offer that there IS a non human intelligence responsible for the creation and subsequent maintenance of our universe… I move strongly to have that premise removed from use in our discourse in our halls of power, law and society.

    Put another way, I have NO problem with people having religion, thinking there is a god, and rotating THEIR lives around the concept. However when they publicly enter one of the realms of discourse using that belief in sentences similar to “We must X because God Y” or “God says X so now we are not allowed Y” I will immediately move to say “Hang on, you are welcome to your belief, but if you want to use it in this conversation then show it is actually valid and true before proceeding with it, or leave it out entirely”.

    And it is not even that this request is unfair, unjust, or weird. We do it ALL the time. Take alien abductions and invasions for example. We have no evidence FOR or AGAINST the existence of these things. So where does it figure in our political, education, or scientific discourse? Nowhere. No one speaks for it. No one speaks against it. It simply is left out until such time as we find any reason to lend it an iota of credence.

    We here generally just want your religion to be the same as this and I have never quite figured out what the problem is with that request yet.


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    #24
    ColmDawson
    Registered Users Posts: 1,001 ✭✭✭ColmDawson


    antiskeptic wrote: »
    True. But they do form the vast bulk of the discussion
    I suppose that a lot of people who would feel opinionated enough to post here would also feel antipathy towards theism.

    Ickle Magoo's first post in this thread summed it up for me.


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    #25
    sink
    Registered Users Posts: 4,314 ✭✭✭sink


    OP I think you've got a skewed sample. Of course a board called 'Atheism & Agnosticism' in a section called 'Religion & Spirituality' is going to largely discuss matters associated with religion. But there are many, many atheists who post on boards but never even look at this forum. You can find them in politics, soccer, after hours and all others and they won't be discussing religion.


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    #26
    antiskeptic
    Registered Users Posts: 9,555 ✭✭✭antiskeptic


    eightyfish wrote: »
    OP this is an atheist forum. Therefore it is going to be concerned with atheistic - and therefore also theistic - issues. We atheists all talk about many other things on boards. Just not in this forum.

    My point was that atheism seems to concern itself with theism excessively, when there should be (I'd imagine) a whole raft of issues that could be addressed from the atheistic viewpoint. Morality struggles, sickness and death, life meaning, arguments that undergird your position. None of which need make any central reference to theism.

    In other words: athiesm (as seen in this forum) seems to advance forward whilst looking back at theism for it's reference points. Whereas I'dve thunk it would turn around and move forward using it's own foundational doctrines as a reference point.


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    #27
    ColmDawson
    Registered Users Posts: 1,001 ✭✭✭ColmDawson


    antiskeptic wrote: »
    My point was that atheism seems to concern itself with theism excessively, when there should be (I'd imagine) a whole raft of issues that could be addressed from the atheistic viewpoint. Morality struggles, sickness and death, life meaning, arguments that undergird your position. None of which need make any central reference to theism.

    In other words: athiesm (as seen in this forum) seems to advance forward whilst looking back at theism for it's reference points. Whereas I'dve thunk it would turn around and move forward using it's own foundational doctrines as a reference point.
    If you actually think atheism has 'foundational doctrines', then I don't know where to begin...


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    #28
    King Mob
    Registered Users Posts: 25,229 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    antiskeptic wrote: »
    Whereas I'dve thunk it would turn around and move forward using it's own foundational doctrines as a reference point.
    Atheism doesn't have doctrines.

    It's a lack of a belief in god.

    Can you please state a atheist doctrine?


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    #29
    antiskeptic
    Registered Users Posts: 9,555 ✭✭✭antiskeptic


    sink wrote: »
    OP I think you've got a skewed sample. Of course a board called 'Atheism & Agnosticism' in a section called 'Religion & Spirituality' is going to largely discuss matters associated with religion. But there are many, many atheists who post on boards but never even look at this forum. You can find them in politics, soccer, after hours and all others and they won't be discussing religion.

    I spend time on other topics too but that wasn't really what I was referring to. What I'm noting here is atheism-as-a-worldview seems to devote all its time to anti-theism rather than getting on with the business of it's worldview.

    In comparison (for example) the Christian forum spends significant portions of it's time looking inwardly at the issues that are raised internally by itself as a worldview. I know it also spends a lot of time in outreach/apologetics (which is to be expected given the 'Great Commission') but it's this examing the internal issues of Christianity that appear to be missing on the atheism forum.

    Look at it this way: if everyone was a Christian the Christian forum would have plenty to talk about. If everyone was an atheist then the atheist forum doesn't appear to have anything to talk about. If you see what I mean.


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    #30
    Ickle Magoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,485 ✭✭✭✭Ickle Magoo


    Like how a stamp collecting forum would discuss global philately, different variations of stamp, history of stamp, lick or peel, etc - and a forum dedicated to not collecting stamps would discuss why the hell anyone would want to collect stamps?


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    #31
    Deus Ex Machina
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,556 ✭✭✭Deus Ex Machina


    I think a lot of, but certainly not all, atheists talk about religion because it makes them feel smarter than other people. I don't think it necessarily applies to this forum, but in day to day life an atheist who brings up religion constantly does so because he wants to show everybody how smart he is to figure out the manifest logical problems associated with religious belief. I am not a theist, but I would gladly spend time with the most devout religous believer ahead of one of these rabid atheists who so often lack anything approaching tact, and merely throw out boring old refutations of Pascal's wager or rant on about Russell's teapot.


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