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Hit a taxi - do I have to pay for loss of earnings?

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  • 04-05-2010 2:23pm
    #1
    midlandsmissus
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,838 ✭✭✭


    I bumped into a taxi in a carpark last week, the damage is minimal - 2 small dents.

    He rang me back today and said it would cost 400 to get it done (quote from his friend who is a mechanic), when I challenged him on this he said 'Well I do know a lad that would do it for half the price but I know this other guy and he would do a good job".
    Then he said 'I could charge you for loss of earnings aswell, as the car will be off the road for a day and a half but I'm not'.
    Ima bit confused about this I think he's rounding up the price to consider what he sees as loss of earnings, but saying that he isn't?
    He agreed to let me get a quote from my mechanic.
    Do I have to pay for loss of earnings, and if so how can I calculate it fairly instead of him giving me a number off the top of his head? I don't mind paying it - just want to know exactly where I stand,

    Thanks for any help.


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    #2
    eagle_&_bear
    Registered Users Posts: 328 ✭✭eagle_&_bear


    speak to a solicitor.

    Practitioners can not give you advise on these boards.


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    #3
    John Lynch Ph.D
    Closed Accounts Posts: 49 ✭John Lynch Ph.D


    It would be the responsibility of his insurance policy to cover any cost relating to loss of earnings.


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    #4
    eagle_&_bear
    Registered Users Posts: 328 ✭✭eagle_&_bear


    John Lynch Ph.D wrote: »
    It would be the responsibility of his insurance policy to cover any cost relating to loss of earnings.

    which in turn would be levied back on the incident causer!


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    #5
    meathstevie
    Registered Users Posts: 4,772 ✭✭✭meathstevie


    And where would they recoup the money they paid out as a result of an accident caused by a third party you reckon ?


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    #6
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Strictly speaking, if you are at fault, then yes you would be required to compensate him for all loss of earnings while the vehicle is off the road.

    That's common sense moreso than any legal advice.

    Calculating loss of earnings is a little bit more complex because taxi drivers' earnings aren't the same across the board. The only fair way would be to take his yearly earnings (before tax) and divide that figure by 260. That gives you the value of one day's earnings.

    So if he tells you that he earned €26,000 last year, then you would owe him €100 for each day the car is off the road.

    If I was doing it myself, I would assume that he earned €40,000 last year, which gives a figure of about €150/day. If he asked for much more than that, it would trigger alarm bells in my head, and I would go to a solicitor.


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    #7
    Gurgle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,064 ✭✭✭Gurgle


    midlandsmissus wrote: »
    I bumped into a taxi in a carpark last week
    If you caused the accident, you're responsible for the consequences.
    Flip side is that anything he bills you for he has to be able to prove. If he's messing around / threatening more costs then hand over to your insurance company and let them sort it out.


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    #8
    MrPudding
    Registered Users Posts: 9,788 ✭✭✭MrPudding


    seamus wrote: »
    Strictly speaking, if you are at fault, then yes you would be required to compensate him for all loss of earnings while the vehicle is off the road.
    Gurgle wrote: »
    If you caused the accident, you're responsible for the consequences.

    From a theoretical point of view, only if the losses were foreseeable, reasonable and that he took steps to mitigate the losses. It is not a simple case of you caused soem damage and have to pay for everything that could conceivably to connected to it... I think. :D
    seamus wrote: »
    That's common sense moreso than any legal advice.
    The law is often a far cry from common sense.

    MrP


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    #9
    Crazy Taxi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Crazy Taxi


    midlandsmissus wrote: »
    I bumped into a taxi in a carpark last week, the damage is minimal - 2 small dents.

    He rang me back today and said it would cost 400 to get it done (quote from his friend who is a mechanic), when I challenged him on this he said 'Well I do know a lad that would do it for half the price but I know this other guy and he would do a good job".
    Then he said 'I could charge you for loss of earnings aswell, as the car will be off the road for a day and a half but I'm not'.
    Ima bit confused about this I think he's rounding up the price to consider what he sees as loss of earnings, but saying that he isn't?
    He agreed to let me get a quote from my mechanic.
    Do I have to pay for loss of earnings, and if so how can I calculate it fairly instead of him giving me a number off the top of his head? I don't mind paying it - just want to know exactly where I stand,

    Thanks for any help.
    Why would you feel you wouldn't have to pay his loss of earnings????
    You have damaged the "tool of his trade"
    And whats more, he could charge you the rental for a replacement car too.
    It sounds like he's being a nice guy about the whole thing! There is an agreed amount between insurers regarding a Taxi drivers earnings so maybe you should pass it over to your insurer.
    Then the taxi driver will have to go and get an official repair quote and you can be sure it'll be well into 4 figures just for the repair + loss of earnings for 2-3 days + a rental car. Actually, you SHOULD do the taxi driver a favour and pass it to your insurer.


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    #10
    Goesague
    Closed Accounts Posts: 65 ✭✭Goesague


    He can't have a rental car and loss of earnings together. It is one or the other. With the kind of cars driven as taxis in this city I am surprised two dents stood out and were visible among all the other damage and dirt on the body of the car.


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    #11
    Zulu
    Registered Users Posts: 10,965 ✭✭✭✭Zulu


    Crazy Taxi wrote: »
    you can be sure it'll be well into 4 figures
    The only thing the OP can be sure of is, that without looking at the damage, you're "4 figures" is horseshit. :rolleyes:

    I'd seek legal advice OP - I'm sure he doesn't work 24/7, and if he's currently using the car, I'd be hesitant about paying for "loss of earnings".


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    #12
    VERYinterested
    Closed Accounts Posts: 923 ✭✭✭VERYinterested


    I wouldn't be too worried about having to pay his loss of earnings! As any taxi man will tell you when you stumble in to his car, they don't earn anything near what they used to!


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    #13
    Crazy Taxi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Crazy Taxi


    Goesague wrote: »
    He can't have a rental car and loss of earnings together. It is one or the other. With the kind of cars driven as taxis in this city I am surprised two dents stood out and were visible among all the other damage and dirt on the body of the car.

    Actually he can, I didn't say a replacement rental taxi, I said a rental car. He is entitled to wheels while his own is off the road. Your attitude is just typical and very similar to OP's. Do you think taxi drivers are some sort of sub class who shouldn't be compensated like any other motorist?

    I recently received an insurance settlement and it included compensation
    for,

    1 damage to vehicle
    2 loss of use
    3 loss of earnings

    So put that in your pipe and smoke it.


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    #14
    Crazy Taxi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Crazy Taxi


    Zulu wrote: »
    The only thing the OP can be sure of is, that without looking at the damage, you're "4 figures" is horseshit. :rolleyes:

    I'd seek legal advice OP - I'm sure he doesn't work 24/7, and if he's currently using the car, I'd be hesitant about paying for "loss of earnings".

    Really?? when's the last time you got a quote for car repairs?
    I got a quote recently for a dented wing and it was almost a grand.
    And loss of earnings is to cover the period while the car is being repaired.
    I really hope the driver puts in a proper claim instead of doing the OP a favour
    and getting his car repaired on the cheap.


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    #15
    Zulu
    Registered Users Posts: 10,965 ✭✭✭✭Zulu


    Crazy Taxi wrote: »
    So put that in your pipe and smoke it.

    Oh don't worry we all will through our premiums. Rest assured the insurance company didn't pay.


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    #16
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    Crazy Taxi wrote: »
    Actually he can, I didn't say a replacement rental taxi, I said a rental car. He is entitled to wheels while his own is off the road. Your attitude is just typical and very similar to OP's. Do you think taxi drivers are some sort of sub class who shouldn't be compensated like any other motorist?

    I recently received an insurance settlement and it included compensation
    for,

    1 damage to vehicle
    2 loss of use
    3 loss of earnings

    So put that in your pipe and smoke it.

    You got screwed. The taxi is still roadworthy and useable. It can easily be put in for repairs on a day off so there would be no loss of earnings.


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    #17
    problemchimp
    Registered Users Posts: 1,025 ✭✭✭problemchimp


    Goesague wrote: »
    He can't have a rental car and loss of earnings together. It is one or the other. With the kind of cars driven as taxis in this city I am surprised two dents stood out and were visible among all the other damage and dirt on the body of the car.
    not very helpful


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    #18
    amcalester
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭amcalester


    Crazy Taxi wrote: »

    Your attitude is just typical and very similar to OP's.

    The OP said he didnt mind paying for loss of earnings but wanted to know how a fair figure could be reached.

    While its admirable that you would support a fellow taxi driver maybe you should pay more attention to the little details.


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    #19
    Crazy Taxi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Crazy Taxi


    amcalester wrote: »
    The OP said he didnt mind paying for loss of earnings but wanted to know how a fair figure could be reached.

    While its admirable that you would support a fellow taxi driver maybe you should pay more attention to the little details.

    Actually, its you who needs to pay attention, OP's questioning whether they should pay "loss of earnings" at all and if so, how much?


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    #20
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    k_mac wrote: »
    You got screwed. The taxi is still roadworthy and useable. It can easily be put in for repairs on a day off so there would be no loss of earnings.
    The Vehicle Standards Guidelines for PSVs require that all damage is repaired, making it effectively illegal to drive a damaged taxi, even if it is roadworthy.
    Yes, he could drive it, but he runs the risk of being reporting to the regulator for breaching the regulations. And if he didn't cause the crash, why should he run that risk?

    If he has no other vehicle at his disposal, he is equally entitled to hire another vehicle for getting around while his is being repaired.


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    #21
    Dublin_Gunner
    Registered Users Posts: 7,692 ✭✭✭Dublin_Gunner


    John Lynch Ph.D wrote: »
    It would be the responsibility of his insurance policy to cover any cost relating to loss of earnings.


    Eh sorry, but his own insurer will NOT cover loss of earnings (unless he has some form of special taxi business interuption insurance).

    His motor insurer covers the cost of the car, and related items (car hire etc) if applicable.
    If the third party is off the road for any time directly due to the accident, then yes, the person at fault (i.e the OP / OP's insurer) would be liable for loss of earning also.

    He can also claim for a replacement vehicle / replacement taxi. However, if claiming for a replacement taxi - he would obviously not be in a position to claim loss of earnings.

    MrPudding - while yes, you do have to mitigate your losses - his car is off the road until it is repaired. There is very little can be done to mitigate loss of earnings there - apart from hire a taxi if possible, in which case he could claim the cost of same.


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    #22
    problemchimp
    Registered Users Posts: 1,025 ✭✭✭problemchimp


    there is an agreed figure with insurance companies and taxi unions for loss of earnings. 90euro per day on a 7 day week. It does sound like the taxi driver is being reasonable on this one so I suggest you just pay the man and learn your lesson.People slagging off taxi drivers here is not helpful.


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    #23
    Crazy Taxi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 67 ✭✭Crazy Taxi


    k_mac wrote: »
    You got screwed. The taxi is still roadworthy and useable. It can easily be put in for repairs on a day off so there would be no loss of earnings.

    I take Sunday as my day off, don't know many repair shops that open Sundays! or maybe your going to start deciding what peoples day off should be? You're beneath contempt.


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    #24
    Dublin_Gunner
    Registered Users Posts: 7,692 ✭✭✭Dublin_Gunner


    problemchimp wrote: »
    there is an agreed figure with insurance companies and taxi unions for loss of earnings. 90euro per day on a 7 day week. It does sound like the taxi driver is being reasonable on this one so I suggest you just pay the man and learn your lesson.People slagging off taxi drivers here is not helpful.

    I was going to post that tidbit also.

    It has risen from 75 to 90 in about the last 2 / 3 years IIRC.

    A taxi driver can of course claim more if he/she can adequately prove he would ordinarily earn more than the agreed rate. This would of course involve a statement form his/her accountant etc


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    #25
    midlandsmissus
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,838 ✭✭✭midlandsmissus


    Crazy Taxi wrote: »
    Why would you feel you wouldn't have to pay his loss of earnings????
    You have damaged the "tool of his trade"
    And whats more, he could charge you the rental for a replacement car too.
    It sounds like he's being a nice guy about the whole thing! There is an agreed amount between insurers regarding a Taxi drivers earnings so maybe you should pass it over to your insurer.
    Then the taxi driver will have to go and get an official repair quote and you can be sure it'll be well into 4 figures just for the repair + loss of earnings for 2-3 days + a rental car. Actually, you SHOULD do the taxi driver a favour and pass it to your insurer.

    Crazy Taxi,

    You're totally taking me up wrong.
    I've obviously never hit a taxi before, so I didn't know if I was meant to pay for loss of earnings. I wanted to ask somebody so I knew for sure. You wouldn't just go blindly paying something without checking it would you? I want to sort it out with him, I feel really bad about hitting his car in the first place.
    Just wanted to make sure, and just to clarify - it was two very small dents on an old car.
    At least I know what the legal points are behind the loss of earnings now. Thanks very much for all the advice.

    And I happen to think that taxi drivers are great workers so please don't take it up that I am insulting them!


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    #26
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    Crazy Taxi wrote: »
    I take Sunday as my day off, don't know many repair shops that open Sundays! or maybe your going to start deciding what peoples day off should be? You're beneath contempt.

    Beneath contempt? A bit extreme wouldn't you say. My point is that taxi drivers can set their own hours and working days. Admittedly a money grbbing one would of course claim that the only day he could take off was a Sunday or an evening and he couldn't spare the time it would take to repair two small dents during the day.


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