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Why is the price of Pharmasuiticals higher here than the UK and Other EU countries?

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    #122
    Claregirl
    Registered Users Posts: 531 ✭✭✭Claregirl


    Save your delight until you actually purchase by all accounts the pharmacists are not obliged to pass on the reduction.

    I get what the pharmacists are saying on this page but to be honest something stinks.

    As a "private" patient who's drugs cost less than 120 per month I'm "subsidising" the various HSE schmes ok fair enough point taken but I'm paying 50% subsidy in 2010 when unemployment has gone through the roof meaning more people are on medical cards and also the HSE has reduced what it's paying to pharmacists but get this I was still being charged 50% mark up in 2007 when there were fewer medical card recipients and pharmacists were paid more by the HSE!


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    #123
    RobFowl
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 11,667 Mod ✭✭✭✭RobFowl


    Claregirl wrote: »
    As a "private" patient who's drugs cost less than 120 per month I'm "subsidising" the various HSE schmes ok fair enough point taken but I'm paying 50% subsidy in 2010 when unemployment has gone through the roof meaning more people are on medical cards and also the HSE has reduced what it's paying to pharmacists but get this I was still being charged 50% mark up in 2007 when there were fewer medical card recipients and pharmacists were paid more by the HSE!

    Hang on a second Claregirl.

    Even with a 50% mark you you will still be paying less!!!

    Lipitor for example has gone from 24 to 14 euro so retail will reduce from 32 to 21 euro.

    The pharmacist still earns less than they did before and you pay less.

    In terms of subsidising medical card and DPS schemes, you've been doing that since they started.

    The only people losing financially here are big pharma AND small pharmacies who will both get less income.


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    #124
    Claregirl
    Registered Users Posts: 531 ✭✭✭Claregirl


    So would you accept that most pharmacies were making a large profit during the "Celtic Tiger" era?

    Also if pharmacies are finding the various HSE schemes so unprofitable can they not "opt out" and just supply private patients at competitive prices?

    I'm a hard pressed PAYE worker on reduced income not entitled to any help with the cost of GP's and prescriptions, as far as I'm concerned I already subsidise the medical card scheme through my taxes, prsi etc.

    Unfortunately I have to think about every visit to my GP and often have to put off visits / picking up medication until payday perhaps I should just build up all my prescriptions until I reach the magic 120 figure in an effort to save costs. It just strikes me as very unfair!


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    #125
    locum-motion
    Registered Users Posts: 5,143 ✭✭✭locum-motion


    Claregirl wrote: »
    So would you accept that most pharmacies were making a large profit during the "Celtic Tiger" era?

    Yes, some were, but in many cases large proportions of the profit were going to pay the bank loans that had been taken out to buy the pharmacy or pay the key money on renting the premises. My point is that pharmacies haven't all been creaming it in for years, despite what people seem determined to believe. As in any other sector, some did well during those years, some less so, and the banks/builders/developers got their cut like they did everywhere else.
    Claregirl wrote: »
    Also if pharmacies are finding the various HSE schemes so unprofitable can they not "opt out" and just supply private patients at competitive prices?

    Because the Community Drugs Schemes account for 73% of the drugs dispensed in the country.
    Let's just say that there's 2 pharmacies close to each other, each doing approx the same amount of business initially. One does as you suggest. At a stroke, the other has 173% of the business they previously had, while our hero has 27%. But of course he's charging less for it, so he actually has ... ooh, I dunno ...15-20% of his previous business. Even if he attracts some of his competitor's private business, he's going out of business very, very quickly.
    Claregirl wrote: »
    I'm a hard pressed PAYE worker on reduced income not entitled to any help with the cost of GP's and prescriptions, as far as I'm concerned I already subsidise the medical card scheme through my taxes, prsi etc.

    And you also subsidise it by paying for your prescriptions too*. Sorry, but that's just the way it is. As long as the Government continues to pay pharmacies a lesser amount than the true economic cost of providing 73% of the country's pharmaceutical services, then those who pay for the other 27% will end up paying more. The Government has used it's power to force through - under the guise of the Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest Act - a massive discount for itself on the dispensing of those prescriptions that it pays for, effective since last summer. Then, effective yesterday, it 'negotiated' for itself a discount of the ingredient cost of some of those medicines. In between the two, on 1/1/10, it increased the proportion that you the public have to pay for, from €100 per month to €120 per month. And they're trying to portray in the press that the pharmacies are ripping you off!

    *But you are entitled to help; there's a threshold above which you don't have to pay. That's help. Also, you can claim both your GP costs and prescription costs against income tax.
    Claregirl wrote: »
    Unfortunately I have to think about every visit to my GP and often have to put off visits / picking up medication until payday perhaps I should just build up all my prescriptions until I reach the magic 120 figure in an effort to save costs. It just strikes me as very unfair!

    Unfortunately, that's not really a good idea, as you might well end up delaying treatment that is needed.


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    #126
    Claregirl
    Registered Users Posts: 531 ✭✭✭Claregirl


    locum-motion wrote: »
    Unfortunately, that's not really a good idea, as you might well end up delaying treatment that is needed.

    It may not be a good idea but unfortunately for myself and many others it's a necessity.

    I just did a quick mental tot and in a town the size of Ennis there are 11 pharmacies and have been for quite some time it may be just me but I doubt they are all running at a loss and most of those are independant pharmacies only one large chain.

    Given what's been said previously about big pharma companys and wholesalers making all the profit at the expence of the poor pharmacist it seems to me that the only way the PATIENT is going to get a fair deal is if the HSE sets up it's own dispensary's.


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    #127
    Mary Hairney
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33 ✭Mary Hairney


    Claregirl wrote: »
    It may not be a good idea but unfortunately for myself and many others it's a necessity.

    I just did a quick mental tot and in a town the size of Ennis there are 11 pharmacies and have been for quite some time it may be just me but I doubt they are all running at a loss and most of those are independant pharmacies only one large chain.

    Given what's been said previously about big pharma companys and wholesalers making all the profit at the expence of the poor pharmacist it seems to me that the only way the PATIENT is going to get a fair deal is if the HSE sets up it's own dispensary's.

    I think a lot of the problem is there are far too many pharmacies and far to many side by side competing without price reductions.

    The HSE dispensaries were terrible in August (I heard) and I do remember them as a child being very poor in service.

    If Mary Harney had a brain she might make any new pharmacies setting up go with the cost+20 % structure before handing them out a license so then we would have a bit of competition!
    If Mary harney had a brain..............


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    #128
    sam34
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,073 ✭✭✭sam34


    Claregirl wrote: »
    So would you accept that most pharmacies were making a large profit during the "Celtic Tiger" era?
    Claregirl wrote: »
    I just did a quick mental tot and in a town the size of Ennis there are 11 pharmacies and have been for quite some time it may be just me but I doubt they are all running at a loss.

    *shrug* pharmacies are businesses. pharmacists are business people. they go to work every day and expect to make a living out of that.


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    #129
    Mary Hairney
    Closed Accounts Posts: 33 ✭Mary Hairney


    locum-motion wrote: »
    Yes, some were, but in many cases large proportions of the profit were going to pay the bank loans that had been taken out to buy the pharmacy or pay the key money on renting the premises. My point is that pharmacies haven't all been creaming it in for years, despite what people seem determined to believe. As in any other sector, some did well during those years, some less so, and the banks/builders/developers got their cut like they did everywhere else.



    .

    This is what I'm reading between the lines in the Sunday Business Post 3 articles! All 3 stories have to be connected and the common denominator seems to be the words "irish owned" and "wholesaler chain".This is where the problem lies and the real reason why the price cut couldn't be passed on. Why not ? Isn't it the reason why most businesses are in trouble and why most prices are so high in Ireland- the retail sector is completely milked by the Banks who control money; and money is what decides how easily you can go it alone vs. taking on the bank's partner. I'm guessing, but I bet I'm right, that if I was a pharmacist in Ireland and went to my bank in the past few years wanting a loan for my own shop I'd be refused it. Meanwhile, if I happened to phone up my wholesaler for help there'd be no problem getting their help to buy an old pharmacy at some ridiculous price and tied in with buying stock from them exclusively.
    Mr Bankmanager-Mr wholesaler monopolise the market, spending on drugs rockets to pay for this and harney focuses on the little guy to get at the banks/wholesaler!
    I wish some reporter would investigate this sort of thing. My Colm and his wife Vera are paying through the nose for their house which was similarly made super expensive by the bank-builder-auctioner monopoly.

    And its the same with all the retail shops...crucified in debt laid on by being manipulated into unnecessary expenses by banks and their silent partners
    Ah, maybe I'm just a paranoid old bat?
    Something stinks in this country way beyond pharmacy prices issues.


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