Tips for coming back ONLINE full-time!

davidgti · 25-07-2008 01:34AM #1

Right, I am starting back online full-time in 2 weeks or so. I have read some posts and information on tips for playing online poker. I want to do everything right this time and make loads of cash. I've a few questions that might help me have everything set out right this time.

My plan is to start on 50/1 with 50-60 Buyins and work my way up the stakes.
I used to play 1/2 and 2/4 alot, but would i be right to fall back to 50/1 again, as i haven't played cash on the Ipoker network in a while.

I while be buying a new monitor soon to go with my DELL Inspiron 530 and getting a fairly good ghrapics card to run with my one or two monitors. I am also setting up poker tracker, SharkScope and a Neteller A/C. What other things might i need?

I have heard from certain online players that the Ipoker network seems to be getting harder and harder... They are telling me that the stardard has risen very high recently. Do you agree with this and do you think it's harder or easier to make a living of this site?

I am setting myself out some rules that I CANNOT break. Rules like, Not playing tiered, sticking to proper levels to suit my bankroll, stop playing if i feel im not playing well or on TILT, never playing on more than 8 tables, never mixing games, always spend a few minutes watching the players before sitting down at a cash table, give your full concentration to tournaments and watch players carefully, go through what happened in the day after the end of the session has finished, move up stakes if your bankroll exceeds ....
What other rules do you think i should set out?

Thanks in advance

Pulsar Eagle · 25-07-2008 01:41AM

Good luck with this.

RoadSweeper · 25-07-2008 02:09AM

You dont need sharkscope for cash.

You'll have to buyin for 100bbs to play propper poker.

Its gonna be v hard to build a roll and live off 100nl unless you have a v high winrate (maybe you not living off it)

Ipoker standard has gotten alot nittier due to bonuses and people adapting to making the most form their bonus , not play poker.

Requiem4adream · 25-07-2008 02:44AM

davidgti wrote: »

I am setting myself out some rules that I CANNOT break. Rules like, Not playing tiered, sticking to proper levels to suit my bankroll, stop playing if i feel im not playing well or on TILT, never playing on more than 8 tables, never mixing games, always spend a few minutes watching the players before sitting down at a cash table, give your full concentration to tournaments and watch players carefully, go through what happened in the day after the end of the session has finished, move up stakes if your bankroll exceeds ....
What other rules do you think i should set out?

Thanks in advance

Replace the word rules with aspirations. These are very good aspirations too and the closer you follow them the better.

Having 'rules' wont work - breaking them carries no consequences. Some aspirations are more difficult to achieve than others. "Stopping when you feel you're on TILT/playing badly": tilt is a loss of control induced by internal or external factors, such as emotions, feelings, bad beats, getting no action off monsters etc. How do you control a loss-of-control? Not easily.

Similarly, recognition of how you're playing is very subjective - and can be muddled by the fact you can play brilliantly and lose, play terribly and win. Winning or losing can blur the lines between playing good and running good (or bad). That's without mentioning EGO, most players have faith in their own ability, rightly or wrongly, and will have faith in themselves to turn around a losing session or to play better. Awareness of how well you're playing and over-riding the ego to stop playing, is difficult.

Personally i never analyse a session, i play too high a volume to make it worthwhile to sit down for hours analysing it. It'd be easier to do in cash games where the sessions are far shorter. I think actually playing > analysing in terms of improving your game. Improving your muscle memory, building up a knowledge of opponents,

In general, to succeed at online poker fulltime, you just need to be ultra low on committments and responsibilities - wife/mortgage/kids etc forget about it imo! Comfy chair, decent pc, and a fairly chilled disposition are all very helpful

OutOfPosition · 25-07-2008 05:23AM

davidgti wrote: »

My plan is to start on 50/1 with 50-60 BB and work my way up the stakes.

i may be reading this wrong, but your starting with $50 - $60

Macspower · 25-07-2008 09:06AM

very best of luck with this..

I managed to live off the i-poker network for 18 months while I was out of work...

things that were essential for me....

1) bankroll management!!! this was the key to it really.... I alway played overrolled and was able to handle the few masive swings this way

2) make sure to have a real good "loyalty" scheme.... there were months where the only money I made was from my bonuses

3) I took a "wage" each week/month whether I won or lost.. As it happened I think i only had one loosing month overall but some others did come close.... I set the mimimum amount I needed to make it worthwhile and live off it.. for me it was 500 pw and I took this regardless from my roll.. i decided that if I couldn't make this amount I would give up...

4) get tooled up for the job..... I think you'll need eyepoker/ reload script/ large monitor / pokertracker/holdem manager/ reload betpot script/ iboilde/ decent mouse

5) cardrunners helped me as well.... there are others just as good/better I believe....

6) post hands for analysis and use this forum and others to your benefit..

7) I like your "rules" but they never worked for me.... I regularly made them and broke them... I had a rule where if I lost 3 buy in's i would stop playing for the day... turned out a bad rule for me.... As I rarely tilted I could play on regardless and often ended up with a winning session despite being down a few buy in's to start with.... sometimes you'll have to play tired as the games might be too good to leave... some time you'll have to leave fresh as there are very few good tables.

8) plan your hours... i-poker is a lot tougher during the day.... so maybe play 1 daytime session with the intention of building rakeback and then play more in the evening/night... I found about 2/3 am it became tougher again and the golden hours were 8pm till 1 am...

9) game select well.. very table your at should have a reason to be there....

10) most important one.... RUN GOOD!!!

anything else you need help with just ask....

big_iain · 25-07-2008 09:44AM

GL with this.

I have never play full time for my salary so i wont pretend to know much about it. I would suggest that you limit the risk by maybe using different providers such as ipoker, stars and another. You may find that you can be more profitable on different sites at different times.

From listening to many leading professionals on podcasts on pocket fives. I think a common rule is routine. Start at the same time everyday. Play only 8 hours. Ensure you take breaks as you would a regular job. Ensure that you do not play any game for the craic. Keep it professional always.

As i said GL. I wish you all the best.

zuutroy · 25-07-2008 10:09AM

Requiem4adream wrote: »

I think actually playing > analysing in terms of improving your game. Improving your muscle memory, building up a knowledge of opponents,

I don't agree with this in terms of playing cash anyway. If you play and never review what your doing then you'll never iron out your leaks. Practice makes permanent when it comes to poker. I think the time spent reviewing your session and reading HH's on 2p2 is where you actually program the neurons to what they're meant to and the sessions are just about executing. The same goes for getting a feel for your opponents. There's only so much you can pick up about them if you're 4-6 tabling. But if you look up how they play their big hands in HM or PT you'll learn about how they think a lot quicker. I'd recommend at least an hour of analysis for every 2 hours play.

TwoShedsJackson · 25-07-2008 10:15AM

davidgti wrote: »

My plan is to start on 50/1 with 50-60 BB and work my way up the stakes.
I used to play 1/2 and 2/4 alot, but would i be right to fall back to 50/1 again, as i haven't played cash on the Ipoker network in a while.

So what do you do if you get stacked in the third hand you play due to set over set or something?? You need more than 50-60BB.

Ste05 · 25-07-2008 10:20AM

As R4aD says your "rules" are very subjective and you will definitely break and that could have a negative affect on your mental state.

Instead keep them as aspirations and instead set yourself real hard and fast rules that are not subjective. Such as I will play for X number of hours this week, X on Monday, Y on Tuesday, Wednesday off/ studying analysing my game for X hours, etc. etc. weekend nights are the most profitable times of the weeks so plan to play those times, etc. etc.

I wouldn't set yourself a stop loss unless you find once you're down you end up spewing money trying to win it back, but you have to approach it as a proper job and put in the time and effort required.

Also, I assume he meant 50-60 Buy-Ins, not Big Bets?

Ste05 · 25-07-2008 10:24AM

Another quicky; NEVER NEVER NEVER play drunk, would you go into work drunk? If you did you could expect to be fired, the same could happen if you play drunk, i.e. BR destroyed!!

cooker3 · 25-07-2008 10:27AM

zuutroy wrote: »

I don't agree with this in terms of playing cash anyway. If you play and never review what your doing then you'll never iron out your leaks. Practice makes permanent when it comes to poker. I think the time spent reviewing your session and reading HH's on 2p2 is where you actually program the neurons to what they're meant to and the sessions are just about executing. The same goes for getting a feel for your opponents. There's only so much you can pick up about them if you're 4-6 tabling. But if you look up how they play their big hands in HM or PT you'll learn about how they think a lot quicker. I'd recommend at least an hour of analysis for every 2 hours play.

Yeah. I completely agree with you here. Most of the decision you make while playing are fairly robotic. For me learning how to be a good player comes away from the table, from studying hands, figuring spots your unsure of and asking questions and thinking about what to do.

Also I assume he means 50-60 buyins, not bb's. That would be the worst plan ever.

Macspower · 25-07-2008 10:41AM

I also assumed 50-60 buy in's and anything else wouldn't make sense and as david laued a lot before

Tight Ted · 25-07-2008 11:15AM

I read it as that he's going to be buying into the games for 50-60BBs.

AdMMM · 25-07-2008 11:19AM

Best of luck with this Dave.

Firstly, get a tracker like Hold Em Manager and learn how to use it by watching a video like this on DeucesCracked. In fact, given how you haven't been playing online in along time, it would be of great benefit to subscrible there as the games have changed dramatically since you last played! I'd then recommend you purchase hand histories from somewhere like HandHQ and load these into Hold Em Manager. These will prove invaluable as you'll have tonnes of information on almost every reg at a particular level before you even play a hand!

My own rule of thumb is to only play a level with >20BI's, and by a buyin I mean 100BB's. Half stacking (50-60BBs), if that was what you were alluding to, is just gay and awkward. You're far better buying in for a full stack as you won't be losing value with your big hands. Say for example you flop a set vs a full stacked fish. You would have stood to win $200, but by buying in short you're only winning $100. That's a massive amount of value to be losing! Stick to buying in for a full stack, even if it means playing a lower level in order to have enough BI's behind you!

As for your playing set up, you seem to have the right idea! I'm currently playing on 8 tables on a 15" laptop screen which is far from ideal - there's overlap everywhere and misclicking my stack away with 8 high is not uncommon! I don't recommend starting with 8 tables though, start with something like 4, or even 2, and keep adding tables and you get more comfortable with the pace. I read in someone's well on here recently that at the lower levels, it's best to get yourself into as many different and unique spots as possible by multi-tabling. I agree with this, but only to a certain degree as there's no point in 8 tabling if you can't keep track of what's going on!

While playing, be disciplined! I have lost countless amounts of buyins on tilt and making strange plays. It can be argued that such spewy moments is good for your table image, but there's no doubt that poor play when not in the right frame of mind stunted my progress through the levels... in fact it still is, and it's something I'm working on as a matter of priority! Also, poker is not a matter of pride! You say you'll be starting at $100NL which is fine, but don't be afraid to drop down to $50NL if you're running bad and fall below 20BI's for your prefered level. To not do so would be irresponsible on your behalf and a sure fire guarantee for failure.

Finally, immerse yourself in forums like Boards and twoplustwo and make good use of your Deucescracked subscription. Post up hand histories for analysis, but also don't be afraid to critique other peoples hands. In fact, some of the biggest flaws in my game were put right by other players saying that my own advice was bad. So for that reason, don't be afraid to get involved in discussion of hands. You and your actions (and your recommended actions) may very well be criticised, but it's all constructive criticism that will help improve your game. Now go and enjoy yourself!

Oh and stay away from the roulette!

davidgti · 25-07-2008 11:55AM

Sorry for the confusion lads, i meant to write buyins. Thanks for all the replies. Want to make sure i have everything right this time.

davidgti · 25-07-2008 12:35PM

|.Murderer.| wrote: »

Oh and stay away from the roulette!

Oh believe me Adam i will

Requiem4adream wrote: »

Replace the word rules with aspirations. These are very good aspirations too and the closer you follow them the better.

Having 'rules' wont work - breaking them carries no consequences. Some aspirations are more difficult to achieve than others. "Stopping when you feel you're on TILT/playing badly": tilt is a loss of control induced by internal or external factors, such as emotions, feelings, bad beats, getting no action off monsters etc. How do you control a loss-of-control? Not easily.

I understand what your saying but I really feel that i need rules set out for myself. Otherwise, I feel i will be unproffessional and make lots of mistakes and impulse playing. Personally, I feel i won't break the rules I will stick with them and know that the rules are set out for disipline and for making money online. Maybe i should head it with Aspirations to make money online.

Consequences will be harsh, no food for weeks etc

. just kidding but i know i won't break the rules if i have them all set out perfectly.

Ste05 wrote: »

Another quicky; NEVER NEVER NEVER play drunk, would you go into work drunk? If you did you could expect to be fired, the same could happen if you play drunk, i.e. BR destroyed!!

Totally agree with you here, I rarely drink anway only one or two drinks at live events.

connie147 · 25-07-2008 12:46PM

GL in this David. I hope you succeed. I'm afraid I cant give you any advice on cash game play as I still havent got round to playing it online except for the odd dabble. I keep promising myself I have to have a crack at it, but I enjoy playing the mtt's and never seem to switch over. Anyway, from what I read its a totally different game (its probably something I'll start a thread about shortly), but as youve played it before, you should, with the right dicipline, be able to get back into it.

Post a hand or two a day in the theory forum and you wont be long finding out if your train of thought is along the right lines.

GL

Connie

H8GHOTI · 25-07-2008 02:49PM

|.Murderer.| wrote: »

I'd then recommend you purchase hand histories from somewhere like HandHQ and load these into Hold Em Manager. These will prove invaluable as you'll have tonnes of information on almost every reg at a particular level before you even play a hand!

I was reading the Prohibited Online Poker Software FAQ section on Poker Stars the other day, about what tools they allow and what's not allowed and this isn't allowed. You're only allowed use info gained against players you've actually played with yourself.

iPoker might be different?

Lurker1977 · 25-07-2008 03:19PM

H8GHOTI wrote: »

I was reading the Prohibited Online Poker Software FAQ section on Poker Stars the other day, about what tools they allow and what's not allowed and this isn't allowed. You're only allowed use info gained against players you've actually played with yourself.

iPoker might be different?

Yes but how are they going to stop people buying them? There are no commercially available datamining programmes for Stars afaik but buying HH's from hand HQ's is never going to be traceable fwiw.

Ste05 · 25-07-2008 07:07PM

Deleted the chat about davidgti being a possible troll. He's clearly not and has been a long time poster.

Ste05

The Istanbul · 25-07-2008 07:22PM

Although, in fairness ,most of his posts are shi...te:pac:

Seriously GL this time-and invest in roulette barring software!

Lao Lao · 25-07-2008 08:54PM

Hi David, GL with this venture, really hope it works out! Do you mind if I ask some questions as I'm quite interested in this?

You say you used to play 1/2 and 2/4 before, was this full time of just recreational?

If it was full time before, why did you stop and how long did you stop for, what did you do instead for a job and why have you decided to go back to the poker now?

You have a bankroll of $5K - $6K correct?

How manys hours / hands do you plan to play per day?

What is your target profit either per day/session/week or even per year?

Apologies for the bombarding of questions but as I say, I am quite interested in this. Again, best of luck in this, I wish you every success, unless you end up at a table with me

Cheers

Brian

cooker3 · 25-07-2008 09:43PM

Do you really have only around $6000? That is really not that much, especially with how the $ is. Do you have a backup plan up if doesn't work out. Are your out-goings big. That's all pretty important.

dacman · 25-07-2008 09:46PM

My single best piece of advice is hire someone to cook and clean your house for you:D

AdMMM · 25-07-2008 11:38PM

I was reading the Prohibited Online Poker Software FAQ section on Poker Stars the other day, about what tools they allow and what's not allowed and this isn't allowed. You're only allowed use info gained against players you've actually played with yourself.

iPoker might be different?

It's certainly a grey area, I'll admit that. However, I was following the development of the datamining software for iPoker (GoldMine), and from what I could gather, Playtech didn't raise any reservations about the software being released. In fact, the developer of the software and the hand history website is a member here, so maybe he could clear this up?

Mr.Plough · 26-07-2008 12:55AM

Ste05 wrote: »

Another quicky; NEVER NEVER NEVER play drunk, would you go into work drunk? If you did you could expect to be fired, the same could happen if you play drunk, i.e. BR destroyed!!

flips ldo

Also, I also decided to not play tired anymore. I've gotten 8k hands in this month.

Caboose · 26-07-2008 08:43PM

Gl with this David and cheers for posting it up.

I havent played online properly for about a year and was thinking of getting into it part time again to pad the wage. Finding time to set aside EVERY day is becoming an issue so hence the part time stuff.

Keep us updated on the progress.

Cheers
Caboose

Tony_Montana · 26-07-2008 11:05PM

GL Dave, can't wait to play you over at the cash games in lawlors hotel with loadsa cash

. As you know i'm also playing online and doing the odd, regular job, day here and there when i get the call. So everything is easy for me at the moment, i just hope it lasts hehe. Wish you every luck and success in the world bud , you can do it

Best thing to remember, is keep the discipline and stick to the rules that you set out.
I've seen you kill 1/2 and 2/4 before for a hefty bankroll. No Roulette now or fishing, and we all know you love them draws lol.
On a serious note, you have the game to do it buddy

All d best.
P.S. we on 10%

MadDonna · 27-07-2008 02:13PM

Ste05 wrote: »

Another quicky; NEVER NEVER NEVER play drunk, would you go into work drunk? If you did you could expect to be fired, the same could happen if you play drunk, i.e. BR destroyed!!

But make sure that your working hours include playing while others are drunk ! Ive cracked some wine and had a couple of late nights. WOW what a difference. I may start playing nights :eek:

I would work your way around the skins too make sure you maximise the bonuses to help the roll building

GL

HiCloy · 27-07-2008 02:19PM

MadDonna wrote: »

But make sure that your working hours include playing while others are drunk ! Ive cracked some wine and had a couple of late nights. WOW what a difference. I may start playing nights :eek:

This is solid advice. I wonder is there any way in PT/HEM to seperate your database by day/time of day? I'd say the difference in win rate in some of the games I play would be huge

Tips for coming back ONLINE full-time!

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