Reference checks

psalbmb · 16-09-2013 12:29pm #1

Just quick question, Im currently employed at "Y" however I was unfairy dismissed by my "X" employer, a case I won. However nearly a year into being employed by Y, they are looking for references from "X". I know they will give them a bad reference for me., is their anything I can do? can they legally ring "X" even though I don't have them down as a reference, I have only the Managers contact details. I'm unsure where people stand in regards to references and the law.. Any opinions are most welcoming

Peregrinus · 16-09-2013 12:44pm

Yes, they can ring X. Why not?

You should tell Y that you were unfairly dismissed by X, and that you successfully took proceedings against them for unfair dismissal, and that you fear that this would colour any reference they might obtain from X.

the world wonders · 16-09-2013 12:49pm

psalbmb wrote: »

can they legally ring "X" even though I don't have them down as a reference

Yes, they can make phone calls to whoever they want. However, given the circumstances where you fought and won an unfair dismissal claim, "X" would be incredibly stupid to say anything beyond confirming the dates of your employment and your job title.

However nearly a year into being employed by Y

Check your contract to see how long your probation period with "Y" lasts. It can last for up to 1 year during which unfair dismissal law does not apply and you can be dismissed for basically any (non-discriminatory) reason. If your probation period is over, and you didn't misrepresent your history with "X" during your interview with "Y", you are in a much better position.

psalbmb · 16-09-2013 1:26pm

[QUOTE= Check your contract to see how long your probation period with "Y" lasts. It can last for up to 1 year during which unfair dismissal law does not apply and you can be dismissed for basically any (non-discriminatory) reason. If your probation period is over, and you didn't misrepresent your history with "X" during your interview with "Y", you are in a much better position.[/QUOTE]

I've already passed my probation period which lasted 6 months, and was granted a permanent position however under employment legislation, Am I right in thinking you still need 1 years service before you have any rights as an employee. Like if they called me up today and sacked me due to finding out I was dismissed from "X", there is nothing I can do?

Bepolite · 16-09-2013 1:54pm

psalbmb wrote: »

I've already passed my probation period which lasted 6 months, and was granted a permanent position however under employment legislation, Am I right in thinking you still need 1 years service before you have any rights as an employee. Like if they called me up today and sacked me due to finding out I was dismissed from "X", there is nothing I can do?

Thats not strictly true. You've no access to EAT but I believe, and a I stand to be corrected on this, you've still employment rights under contract/fair procedures etc. and could, potentially, and expensively, pursue a claim in the circuit court.

This is a musing on my part and I treat all posts here as hypothetical. Therefore, I assume you are not relying on anything posted here.

psalbmb · 16-09-2013 3:29pm

Bepolite wrote: »

Thats not strictly true. You've no access to EAT but I believe, and a I stand to be corrected on this, you've still employment rights under contract/fair procedures etc. and could, potentially, and expensively, pursue a claim in the circuit court.

This is a musing on my part and I treat all posts here as hypothetical. Therefore, I assume you are not relying on anything posted here.

No of course not... Just curious as I remember in college when I done employment law, their was something to do with regards to references but I forgot. I'm just worried now as 2 weeks ago I got offered another position in a similar environment as my "X" Employer, got a start date etc, and the day before, they rang me to tell me indirectly that the position was no "unavailable" however I believe it was something to do with my references, but I could never prove it.

16-09-2013 6:49pm

Generally speaking employers who might otherwise give unfavourable references are well advised to keep quite. If they chose to provide a reference then they can be liable for any damages where the reference was negligently written. So unless the employee in question was actually awful then they should only give dates of employment and job title/description of position.

OU812 · 16-09-2013 6:53pm

Get someone you know to call the old company pretending to check your references (on behalf of totally fictitious company z). See what they say.

Fred Swanson · 16-09-2013 8:17pm

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OU812 · 16-09-2013 8:26pm

If the caller is misrepresenting himself (as being from the actual company) it ma be inadvisable, otherwise what's the problem ?

psalbmb · 17-09-2013 12:08pm

OU812 wrote: »

Get someone you know to call the old company pretending to check your references (on behalf of totally fictitious company z). See what they say.

But If I make up a company, then they may check if that said company actually exists after the call? I don't want to get in trouble, all I want to know is if they keep giving me a negative reference for jobs, at least I would know and I could work around it

OU812 · 17-09-2013 1:18pm

Pick any company but the one you're working for...

"Hello, we're thinking of employing a chap called psalbmb... He worked for you 2008 - 2012, how did you find him ? "

Done.

psalbmb · 27-09-2013 3:21pm

Just an update Guys, I applied for another job and today received a call to say my application was unsuccessful. the HR Manager stated I was given an unfavourable and negative reference however she wouldn't get into what was said and who said what etc. As I'd stated I had took a claim against my former employer... a case I won and in the terms of settlement there was a Confidentiality clause:

"Mediation is conducted in private and the terms of any settlement are not published. Information furnished at mediation may not be published or disclosed except on the order of the High Court or Circuit Court or with the consent of the person furnishing the information and of any other person to whom the information may relate. Any person who discloses information in contravention of the Acts is guilty of an offence (Section 97(2) of the Employment Equality Acts). "

I've since emailed the HR Manager back explaining exacting what had happened etc, and that I was requesting more information relating to the references under the Freedom of Information Act 1997, as I feel the former employer is in Breach of this settlement and have being negligent in providing an accurate and factual reference. anyone's opinions most welcome. where do I go from here

Stheno · 27-09-2013 3:26pm

psalbmb wrote: »

Just an update Guys, I applied for another job and today received a call to say my application was unsuccessful. the HR Manager stated I was given an unfavourable and negative reference however she wouldn't get into what was said and who said what etc. As I'd stated I had took a claim against my former employer... a case I won and in the terms of settlement there was a Confidentiality clause:

"Mediation is conducted in private and the terms of any settlement are not published. Information furnished at mediation may not be published or disclosed except on the order of the High Court or Circuit Court or with the consent of the person furnishing the information and of any other person to whom the information may relate. Any person who discloses information in contravention of the Acts is guilty of an offence (Section 97(2) of the Employment Equality Acts). "

I've since emailed the HR Manager back explaining exacting what had happened etc, and that I was requesting more information relating to the references under the Freedom of Information Act 1997, as I feel the former employer is in Breach of this settlement and have being negligent in providing an accurate and factual reference. anyone's opinions most welcome. where do I go from here

Were details of your case ever published in the media?

And how did the HR manager get contact details for your former company?
An unfavourable reference can simply be as follows:

Hiring manager: "Would you rehire psalbmb in the future?"
Former employer: "ehhhhhhhhhhhhhh........................possibly"

Marcusm · 28-09-2013 6:28am

psalbmb wrote: »

Just an update Guys, I applied for another job and today received a call to say my application was unsuccessful. the HR Manager stated I was given an unfavourable and negative reference however she wouldn't get into what was said and who said what etc. As I'd stated I had took a claim against my former employer... a case I won and in the terms of settlement there was a Confidentiality clause:

"Mediation is conducted in private and the terms of any settlement are not published. Information furnished at mediation may not be published or disclosed except on the order of the High Court or Circuit Court or with the consent of the person furnishing the information and of any other person to whom the information may relate. Any person who discloses information in contravention of the Acts is guilty of an offence (Section 97(2) of the Employment Equality Acts). "

I've since emailed the HR Manager back explaining exacting what had happened etc, and that I was requesting more information relating to the references under the Freedom of Information Act 1997, as I feel the former employer is in Breach of this settlement and have being negligent in providing an accurate and factual reference. anyone's opinions most welcome. where do I go from here

Did your mediation settlement not set out the basis on which the former employer would respond to requests for references from future potential employers. If not, it's a bit of an oversight on the part of whoever drew it up/advised you.

psalbmb · 28-09-2013 12:54pm

Stheno wrote: »

Were details of your case ever published in the media?

And how did the HR manager get contact details for your former company?
An unfavourable reference can simply be as follows:

Hiring manager: "Would you rehire psalbmb in the future?"
Former employer: "ehhhhhhhhhhhhhh........................possibly"

No , details of my case where never published. ok I have to leave out some details due to the nature of the incident but here goes... I went for the interview. during the interview, I'd mentioned a manager who I worked with previously in the job. the HR Manager who was interviewing me was aware of his name and when I asked how she knew him, due to the fact her English wasn't that good, her reply was "I know him"; but I don't know whether she knows him personally or that he also went for an interview. after the interview, the HR Manager indirectly told me I had the position provided my 2 references (which were not that manager) where positive. my 2 references where contacted and gave me 2 great references. she then called me yesterday to tell me "she won't be taking my application any further"... when I asked why, she responded "well eh... it was something to do with a reference". I questioned her on this and asked for clarity on the subject, and she said "look I can't get into it for legal reasons but I've heard something but best of luck in the future".

I've since emailed her and explained the situation from my point of view and that I believe I was given a reference with was factually inaccurate and misleading to my character. I've requested under the Freedom of Information Act clarity on who exactly gave this reference, so to find whether or not it was that manager or my former employer. I know in the eyes of employment law in Ireland, References are a tricky subject, so any feedback most welcome. thanks guys:). I just feel that as a result of me suing my former employer I'm getting blacklisted from everyone. Its not as if I wanted to sue, money wasn't the issue, it was the fact I was unfairly treated for years, and was accused of a serious allegation which hindered my character. I'd never ever steal anything

Fred Swanson · 28-09-2013 2:15pm

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Mike 1972 · 29-09-2013 5:58pm

psalbmb wrote: »

"X" employer, a case I won. However nearly a year into being employed by Y, they are looking for references from "X"g

Im a bit puzzled.

Why would someone whom you were employed by for nearly a year suddenly care about references from a previous employer ?

Does this sort of thing happen often ?

If references were such a deal breaker why werent they checked before they employed you ?

mlumley · 29-09-2013 6:08pm

Can you not ask for any information held on computer? I thought they had to give that up when asked.

You could say that you are thinking of taking legal action for defamation, they may not want to be drawn in and give what they have on file.

Just a thought.

Fred Swanson · 29-09-2013 6:13pm

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DylanII · 30-09-2013 10:02am

psalbmb wrote: »

No of course not... Just curious as I remember in college when I done employment law, their was something to do with regards to references but I forgot. I'm just worried now as 2 weeks ago I got offered another position in a similar environment as my "X" Employer, got a start date etc, and the day before, they rang me to tell me indirectly that the position was no "unavailable" however I believe it was something to do with my references, but I could never prove it.

Are you only starting to work for this company or have you been with them for a year?

psalbmb · 30-09-2013 2:30pm

DylanII wrote: »

Are you only starting to work for this company or have you been with them for a year?

I've been with them a year today so in the eyes of the law, Im safe now. I know, its very unprofessional for a company, after a year of employment to be conducting reference checks... it puzzled me also.

to everyone else, I haven't received an email back and I'm sure I prob wont get one. Im going to get someone to ring the said employer and pretend to get a reference for me. If they give me a bad reference and its recorded, is their anything I can do?

Fred Swanson · 30-09-2013 3:42pm

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Reference checks

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