Because I'm not bitter - (it was 20 years ago today)

finbarrk · 13-06-2008 12:07am

Mr Alan wrote: »

why the **** was there a 5 minute piece on the news about the England game 20 years ago?

how ****ing embarrasing

Embarassing for you maybe? Not for anyone that was there with a green shirt on their backs.

Unearthly · 13-06-2008 12:13am

Are we going to celebrate the David O'Leary 20 year anniversary penalty in 2 years time to?

Can't wait for that!!1

Mr Alan · 13-06-2008 12:24am

finbarrk wrote: »

Embarassing for you maybe? Not for anyone that was there with a green shirt on their backs.

anyone who celebrates a one nil win in the group stages of any tournament 20 years later except for the person who scored the goal is, imo, embarrasing themselves.

for a national broadcaster to be celebrating it on a news programe? Christ its mortifying.

finbarrk · 13-06-2008 12:24am

Wouldn't think so, it was a drawn match. A great result from the penaltys in fairness, 5/5 but Stuttgart was the real special victory.

monkey9 · 13-06-2008 12:33am

What the fVck is wrong with people!!! That was one of the greatest days in Irish footballing history. Actually making it there was an achievement in itself so to be drawn against England and then beating them in the opening match was such a great feeling and a catalyst for the good times ahead.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with remembering that event. It's not just a match, it's a part of our history!! It lifted a whole nation when it needed lifting.

Bubs101 · 13-06-2008 12:39am

I'm sure England would have swapped their semi-final birth for a 1-0 over us in a heartbeat

estebancambias · 13-06-2008 12:41am

Yeah but monkey on boards there is an element of people who hate everything Irish. As you can see over on the James McCarthy thread some people despise the Irish team so much they call them ''minnows''

Mr Alan · 13-06-2008 12:43am

Bubs101 wrote: »

I'm sure England would have swapped their semi-final birth for a 1-0 over us in a heartbeat

ha ha ha I ****ing doubt it mate!

do you think they even remember that game? i wouldnt imagine so

estebancambias · 13-06-2008 12:44am

They didn't have a good team back then really. I'd say we were near enough, or just as good as them.

Obviously I don't know, cause' I wasn't born, but this is what I hear.

Guy:Incognito · 13-06-2008 12:45am

Bubs101 wrote: »

I'm sure England would have swapped their semi-final birth for a 1-0 over us in a heartbeat

What semi final berth?

estebancambias · 13-06-2008 12:46am

Yeah, they(England) finished bottom of the group.

*mixed up 1990 me thinks*

As I said we were probably better than them back then.....until about 1996 I'd say, then they pulled away in terms of quality.

OPENROAD · 13-06-2008 12:52am

estebancambias wrote: »

They didn't have a good team back then really. I'd say we were near enough, or just as good as them.

Obviously I don't know, cause' I wasn't born, but this is what I hear.

To be fair England had a very good team back then, from what I remember of the match particularly the 2nd half it was all England and they just could not get the ball in the net, but results are the important thing, Ireland won, England went out in the group stages, two years later England reached the semi-final and were very very unlucky not to make the final. And then again in 96 were very very good.

grenache · 13-06-2008 12:52am

DesF wrote: »

I just hate this shít of celebrating a win that happened all that time ago.

Its what Forest fans are good at doing, the reason we've just spent the last 3 years in the third division.

finbarrk · 13-06-2008 12:53am

Mr Alan doesn't remember it either, or should I say doesn't want to remember it, funny how a few minutes about a match 20 years ago got him going for whatever reason. Lighten up lad, its only a game anyway.

estebancambias · 13-06-2008 12:54am

OPENROAD wrote: »

To be fair England had a very good team back then, from what I remember of the match particularly the 2nd half it was all England and they just could not get the ball in the net, but results are the important thing, Ireland won, England went out in the group stages, two years later England reached the semi-final and were very very unlucky not to make the final. And then again in 96 were very very good.

Well we made the Quarter finals, and played the host nation.

I'm not saying Cameroon were bad, but I imagine the Italians were a bit better.

We also played them in euro 1992 qualifying(and although they came out on top, we scored more and conceded less in the group)

Mr Alan · 13-06-2008 1:01am

finbarrk wrote: »

Mr Alan doesn't remember it either, or should I say doesn't want to remember it, funny how a few minutes about a match 20 years ago got him going for whatever reason. Lighten up lad, its only a game anyway.

I was 4 years of age in 1988.

If it was only a game, why is it on the news 20 years later?!

OPENROAD · 13-06-2008 1:02am

estebancambias wrote: »

Well we made the Quarter finals, and played the host nation.

I'm not saying Cameroon were bad, but I imagine the Italians were a bit better.

And reaching the quarters was a great achievment but more importantly gave the country a huge boost.Cameroon were excelent in world cup 90 imo so it was no pushover for England, but England were very good in 1990 and it was also very good for England as a country, Hillsborough had happened a year previously and football was at a low, Englands run in the world cup gave football there a huge boost and they were very very unlucky against (West)Germany. Really felt for Sir Bobby cause he had taken so much stick from the English media in 1988.

Coillte_Bhoy · 13-06-2008 2:07am

Mr Alan wrote: »

I was 4 years of age in 1988.

If it was only a game, why is it on the news 20 years later?!

I think it was much more than a game and was a seminal moment in the modern history of our state. The RTE lads had a good discussion on it this evenin and i think Giles and Dunphy summed it up perectly. If you were'nt living in Ireland at the time (i mean as an adult) then it's probably impossible to accurately describe what it meant. In fairness to England going on about 66, this was our similar moment. Im gettin goosepimples just thinkin about it. If younger posters dont get it ften air enough, but for those of us who lived through those dark miserable days in the ****hole that Ireland was back then, it was a momentous event.

Pigman II · 13-06-2008 6:43am

Bubs101 wrote: »

semi-final birth

sounds painful

finbarrk · 13-06-2008 9:22am

Mr Alan wrote: »

I was 4 years of age in 1988.

If it was only a game, why is it on the news 20 years later?!

4 yo in 1988, that explains it.

redspider · 13-06-2008 10:04am

I think the results of the 1988 team should be applauded, and remembered as well with fondness and with pride, yes, even after 20 years.

As mentioned, the final tournament consisted of only 8 teams so we were in the last 8. We also drew with Russia who got to the final, and the Dutch, who won it overall, were also in our group and only got past us with a jammy goal near the end from Van Kieft. In interviews later on he admitted how lucky it was as it span into the net beating Packie.

And yes, we also beat a team wearing white shirts. Y'wha? The country went mad in celebration for the first time in a footballing sense!

Not only were the results good, we also played well. We did well against Russia and could have done them.

The achievment of this team should be lauded, and not forgotten, and should be remembered after 20 years, 30 years, 40 years, 50 years, 100 years, etc, etc.

> Chippy - If I knew that was in the bag Bill, I wouldnt have come on the show tonight

:-)

ROCKMAN · 13-06-2008 10:10am

After last night I find it hard to admit but I had to agree with Giles and Dunphy , YES its was only a group match and yes we failed to progress , But as the lads said last night it mean a hell of a lot more to the older Irish soccer Fans . That game and the following matches brought the country together like nothing before. The 80's in Ireland was a very bleak place to grow up and live in . Most 17-20 year olds had to leave to try make a living. So when a sporting event came along that had the power to united and lift the spirits of a nation . Its was embraced and enjoy. Ok I can understand younger fans not understanding the hype etc because it was something you had to live through and experience first hand .
OK maybe the media my have gone over the top but whats new there .
It was a massive moment in Irish Soccer history , a moment that should be looked back at fondly and remember with a big

and something that 20 years later we are looking and need to happen again.

redspider · 13-06-2008 10:15am

For those who want to re-live, read:

http://en.euro2008.uefa.com/history/season=1988/round=212/match=13/index.html

England 0 - 1 Republic of Ireland
Houghton 6

Houghton humbles England
England were favourites against an Irish side making a historic first appearance in any finals. But the absence of the injured Terry Butcher put pressure on England's young central defenders, whose inexperience was exploited almost immediately.

Houghton goal
Kevin Moran took a free-kick and hit it long, the Republic of Ireland´s main attacking weapon. Mark Wright moved out to the right to cover, but managed only to get in Gary Stevens' way. The ball fell to Tony Galvin, who hooked in a cross that Kenny Sansom mis-kicked up in the air. John Aldridge headed it to Ray Houghton, whose own header looped beyond Peter Shilton.

England chances
It took England until half-time to recover from the shock, Shilton having to dive at Houghton's feet when the busy little midfield player broke the offside trap. But the second half was one long England attack, producing enough chances to have won the match twice over.

Bonner saves
Three times Gary Lineker was put clean through, to have one shot saved by Pat Bonner, clip the bar with the second and put the other just past the far post. After the match Bobby Robson did nothing for team morale by blaming his players, mentioning Lineker by name. Like everyone else, he was not to know that the striker was suffering from a form of hepatitis.

Charlton's revenge
Bonner went on frustrating that talented England forward line by saving from John Barnes, Peter Beardsley, Lineker (three more times!) and Robson - and Jack Charlton had his revenge over his own country, who had turned him down as national coach back in 1977.

Lineups
England
No Player Name
1 Peter Shilton
2 Gary Stevens
3 Kenneth George Sansom
4 Neil Webb
19 Mark Wright
6 Tony Adams
7 Bryan Robson
12 Chris Waddle
9 Peter Beardsley
10 Gary Lineker
11 John Barnes
Substitutes
13 Christopher Woods
14 Vivian Anderson
15 Stephen McMahon
17 Glenn Hoddle
18 Mark Hateley

Republic of Ireland
No Player Name
1 Patrick Bonner
2 Christopher B Morris
3 Christopher Hughton
4 Michael Mccarthy
5 Kevin Moran
6 Ronald Whelan
7 Paul McGrath
8 Raymond Houghton
9 John William Aldridge
10 Francis Stapleton
11 Anthony Galvin
Substitutes
15 Kevin Sheedy
16 Gerald Peyton
17 John Byrne
19 John Anderson
20 Niall Quinn

and these:
http://en.euro2008.uefa.com/history/season=1988/round=212/match=18/index.html

http://en.euro2008.uefa.com/history/season=1988/round=212/match=16/index.html

patmac · 13-06-2008 10:37am

When people say we didn't get out of the group you must remember that only 8 teams qualified so it was a lot more difficult to make it to a Final championships then. The quality of the opposition England 3rd in the World Cup 2 years later a Dutch side with Van Basten, Rijkaard and Guillit at the top of their game and a Russian side with the pick of the whole of the Soviet Union (Ukraine, Georgia etc) was the ultimate Group of Death verified by the fact that both Russia and Holland won their Semi-Finals, England didn't even get a point. As was said at the time we won a game we should have lost, we drew a game we should have won, and we lost a game we should have drawn, just a kick away from the Semi-finals not a bad performance from a country with a population of just 3 million where soccer at the time was a minority sport a long way behing the GAA.
I can understand why the young ones are knocking it but it was a great lift for the country at the time and was a help in kick starting the economy that has the same young people living in the lap of luxury that was sadly missing in those days. I'm just off now to sit in the corner of the room in my rocking chair with my pipe and slippers and reminise about the bad old days, but we were happier then etc, etc,etc.

Mr Alan · 13-06-2008 10:50am

ROCKMAN wrote: »

After last night I find it hard to admit but I had to agree with Giles and Dunphy , YES its was only a group match and yes we failed to progress , But as the lads said last night it mean a hell of a lot more to the older Irish soccer Fans.

For the benefit of the tape, i dont have an issue with them mentioning it on the panel last night, especially as Whelan was there. Its just it being a feautre on the national news i found embarrasing. (and being in every newspaper)

patmac · 13-06-2008 10:56am

Mr Alan wrote: »

For the benefit of the tape, i dont have an issue with them mentioning it on the panel last night, especially as Whelan was there. Its just it being a feautre on the national news i found embarrasing. (and being in every newspaper)

I would say you are in a very small minority if you found it embarrassing, did you actually turn red, you must embarrass easily.

finbarrk · 13-06-2008 12:53pm

He was watching sesamae street when the match was on.

Mr Alan · 13-06-2008 12:59pm

Good one, slag my age :rolleyes:

we cannot argue we are decent team and should be challenging to qualify for major tournaments every time, and then at the same time celebrate 1 result in a group match that we barely won, 20 years later on the national news.

its sad.

Coillte_Bhoy · 13-06-2008 1:12pm

Mr Alan wrote: »

Good one, slag my age :rolleyes:

we cannot argue we are decent team and should be challenging to qualify for major tournaments every time, and then at the same time celebrate 1 result in a group match that we barely won, 20 years later on the national news.

its sad.

Lads, he just doesnt get it, does he?? If he has read through the thread and still doesnt understnd why it was so significant, well, thats his loss.

A Dub in Glasgo · 13-06-2008 3:37pm

Mr Alan wrote: »

Good one, slag my age :rolleyes:

we cannot argue we are decent team and should be challenging to qualify for major tournaments every time, and then at the same time celebrate 1 result in a group match that we barely won, 20 years later on the national news.

its sad.

It is quite clear that you were too young to appreciate or understand the mid to late 1980's.

FatherTed · 13-06-2008 4:01pm

Jeez, these young kids around here need a good clip around the ear and a history lesson to boot. Fact is that this was the first competition the country ever qualified for. And our first game was against our biggest rival. England had some great players at the height of their careers at the time e.g. Lineker, Barnes, Beardsley, Robson(though he was coming back from injury). They had breezed through qualifying (I don't think they even lost a game) while we got a little bit lucky with Scotland beating Bulgaria the previous November in the last minute to put us through. So noone gave us ANY chance, not even ourselves. I remember England and especially Lineker having a ton of chances but I rewatched it again yesterday and Aldridge, Houghton(twice) and Whelan also had good chances that I forgot about. Best day ever.

Take a good look at these:
BBC Highlights: http://www.shareonall.com/Euro88.England.V.Republic.Ireland.12.07.88.MotD.highlights.f54_bwhw_avi.htm
Full Game(Chinese comm

): http://www.shareonall.com/Euro_1988_Grp_B_-_England_v_Ireland_-_Chinese_Comm_-_12_Jun_1988_rwbv_rar.htm

estebancambias · 13-06-2008 4:32pm

I'm only 17, and I fully support celebrating the result.

Mr Alan · 13-06-2008 9:02pm

estebancambias wrote: »

I'm only 17, and I fully support celebrating the result.

You're 17?!?!?!?!:eek::eek::eek:

Guy:Incognito · 13-06-2008 9:06pm

Mr Alan wrote: »

You're 17?!?!?!?!:eek::eek::eek:

Think he hit the 1 by mistake.:D

kryogen · 13-06-2008 9:08pm

the result? great!
Signifigance? hell yeah!
relevance to today? no

it was great, it should be remembered.

but this is the present. you wouldnt hear the Dutch talking celebrating the time they beat Belgium 20 years after the event. it just doesnt happen with good teams. the fans of those teams tend to be more concerned about the upcoming tournaments

estebancambias · 13-06-2008 10:39pm

Mr Alan wrote: »

You're 17?!?!?!?!:eek::eek::eek:

Yeah...LOL. Whats it to you?

Mr Alan · 13-06-2008 11:39pm

nothing to me mate, just always had ya down as being older is all

dont take it personally, maybe its the Roma/Cambiasso thing, not many 17 yr olds around like that, its a compliment.

PM sent.

KdjaCL · 13-06-2008 11:47pm

a pats fans wrote:

Impossible to explain to anyone under the age of 35 what that day meant and I don't mean that in a bad way. Most of us felt of we only conceded 2 or 3 it would be respectable enough. To compare it to today it was the equivalent of Pats beating a premier league club in the uefa cup. The troubles were in full swing up the north and every time you turned on the telly it was thick paddies this and backwards that. The English were a shower of arrogant ***** back then with us being classed as some sort of third world country. Beating them felt like the whole country had a sense of purpose and pride in itself. It really was astonishing stuff, I honestly feel people would not have felt more pride if we had won the whole thing. To us we had won it.

Purely from a footballing point of view it changed the game for ever over here. I left school in 86 and in a class of around 35 about 8 of us followed football in any sort of a serious way. Football was a minority sport then in this country with only football playing people going to International games unless we were playing the big boys. We often had 18/20,000 for WC qualifiers.

i was a lounge boy in a pub in clondalkin, all i recall is having a full tray of drinks and not actually watching them (watching match) i went up some steps razor scored and i had no drinks and no tray and no float.

Pats fan sums up everythiing better than we ever could above.

another pats fan reply to above ......posting this as its relevant, tbh with the way this thread gone porn is relevant.

another pats fans wrote:

Its crazy that that was the case considering the side we had then.

Bonner, McCarthy and Morris had just won the double with Celtic (Scottish football was far better then than it is now.)
Whelan, Houghton and Aldridge had just won the 1st division with one of Liverpools best ever sides
McGrath and Moran had just finished 2nd with Man U
Hughton, Galvin (Spurs) and Stapleton (Arsenal) were also playing with top sides in England.
Add to that Brady and O'Leary didn't even make the squad because of disagreements with Charlton

Its a long time since we had that many players playing at that high a level.

kdjac

estebancambias · 13-06-2008 11:59pm

Mr Alan wrote: »

nothing to me mate, just always had ya down as being older is all

dont take it personally, maybe its the Roma/Cambiasso thing, not many 17 yr olds around like that, its a compliment.

PM sent.

You know that brought a tear to my eye.

God speed Alan, God speed.

Because I'm not bitter - (it was 20 years ago today)

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