Right.....here it goes.

Aard · 11-01-2013 5:38pm

So what exactly does one do once they've learnt all the kanji? Start with the various readings?

hibby · 15-01-2013 5:21am

fanki na pengin wrote: »

That's cheap enough, hope one of them works out for you.

I had my two trial lessons on Sunday. They were both good and I seriously considered going with both. But in the end I decided to go with the lady who will teach me at home, for practical reasons.

I must say I felt really guilty about telling the other lady I wouldn't become her student. She seemed really nice, and fun, and an excellent teacher (and beautiful, not that that should be relevant). Not only that, but she spent over an hour and a half on the trial lesson, which only cost 1000 yen (barely enough to cover her train fare, let alone her time and effort).

One option I considered is Skype lessons. You can pay up-front for 5 lessons. On the plus side, you save travel time and travel cost. On the other hand, I feel it would lack the immediacy of a face-to-face lesson and probably not be as effective.

So now I will be having 1-hour conversation lessons at home once a week on Sunday mornings.

Tristram · 18-01-2013 7:21am

Good luck Hibby!

fanki na pengin · 27-01-2013 5:31pm

In my exuberance, I can't believe I didn't update this.....

HEISIG IS DONE!

BUT, it's just the beginning. Actually, Konata will know as I was messaging her, that I'm thinking of studying translation studies in DCU when I get back to Ireland. It means that (long story short), I need a decent level of Irish or French....sooooooooo

I must know turn my attentions towards one of them, while keeping a decent level of Japanese. :eek:

Honestly, looking forward to it! Plan of starting in DCU in 2014 I'd imagine. Leaving Japan in 6 months! Will have at least JLP4 by then, not taking it fast.

just-joe · 28-01-2013 12:00pm

Nice one! It seems like you managed it quickly just by popping on here every once in a while, but it must have been a long road. I'll be interested to see how it leads to reading kanji - how is it going for ya? Can you recognise most/all the kanji you see?

And, (I guess I could check on the website but) do you need French/another language too? I thought only Japanese would be ok?

fanki na pengin · 28-01-2013 12:15pm

Well, most of the time with the kanji I recognise it's general meaning. Let's say about 70%. For me, that's brilliant! there are people on the JET programme that I talk to about this and for them that's not enough. I also tell them it's better than 69% and far better than 0%.

The course I want to try for in DCU requires one of Spanish, French, German or Irish to a LC Higher level, then you can pick beginners Japanese. There's a feeder PLC for a year in Coolock for it, so I might give that a bash. My French might be lacking straight away, but I'll make up for it with the Japanese.

That's the plan anyway! ^_^

Tristram · 29-01-2013 2:07am

Go on the funky penguin!

JLPT results came out here today and I received the good word. Now the hard slog to N2!

hibby · 29-01-2013 3:14am

Tristram wrote: »

Go on the funky penguin!

JLPT results came out here today and I received the good word. Now the hard slog to N2!

Results are out? Well done on conquering N3, and best of luck with N2!

hibby · 29-01-2013 3:31am

As expected, I failed.

However, my scores weren't quite as disastrous as I expected:
Vocab/Grammar: 27/60
Reading: 30/60
Listening: 28/60

To my amazement, I actually scraped a pass mark (50%) in the reading and was not that far off in the other two sections.

I'm in no rush to try again, to be honest. That kind of intensive study is great for building up a solid body of vocab and grammar points, but it's pretty sterile.

Since I finished the exam I have felt much more free to learn in more "natural" ways.

just-joe · 29-01-2013 12:06pm

Hibby, thats so close, unlucky! You will nail it the next time.

just-joe · 29-01-2013 12:15pm

fanki na pengin wrote: »

Well, most of the time with the kanji I recognise it's general meaning. Let's say about 70%. For me, that's brilliant! there are people on the JET programme that I talk to about this and for them that's not enough. I also tell them it's better than 69% and far better than 0%.

The course I want to try for in DCU requires one of Spanish, French, German or Irish to a LC Higher level, then you can pick beginners Japanese. There's a feeder PLC for a year in Coolock for it, so I might give that a bash. My French might be lacking straight away, but I'll make up for it with the Japanese.

That's the plan anyway! ^_^

70% is a massive number. That's quite amazing. If you can progress to reading all the kanji you understand it will be great. I guess it would take a lot of time but if ya get to it the same way you did for going through heisig you'll kick ass.

Yeah I checked the translation studies and it seems there's a one language route or a two language route. It says you have to have a degree in one language though, I wonder is it ok to not have one?

Konata · 29-01-2013 12:34pm

just-joe wrote: »

Yeah I checked the translation studies and it seems there's a one language route or a two language route. It says you have to have a degree in one language though, I wonder is it ok to not have one?

I'm currently studying the Applied Languages & Translation Studies course in DCU which fanki na pengin is considering. Here's a link to the course page: http://www.dcu.ie/prospective/deginfo.php?classname=ALIS

I'm not sure what course you're looking at? This one is an undergrad so no previous degrees required. It's also strictly a 2 language pathway course. Currently, there is an option to drop the second language after 2nd year and continue with a single language pathway for 3rd and 4th year but any incoming students from 2013 onwards no longer have that option and must study both languages for the whole 4 years.

fanki na pengin · 29-01-2013 12:41pm

According to Konata, it's now a two language route?

You used to be able to focus on one during the later years, but now you must continue with two (which I honestly don'y mind).

Wait, are you looking at undergrad or postgrad? I want to do the undergrad, as I have hopes and dreams of never leaving college! :pac:

PS hard luck hibby, but it sounds like you're not too bothered, and the experience itself was far more valuable than any result. Saying that, a friend here got 54%
....ouch.

EDIT: Woops, I'm mad late with that reply......

just-joe · 31-01-2013 2:11pm

Ahhhh sorry sorry sorry, I was looking at the masters course.

****surei itashima****a.

Woah! Going back to start an undergrad would be a long road!

fanki na pengin · 01-02-2013 4:45am

Yeah, but to be honest, I always saw myself doing two degrees. My first was in Music, which was just something I really wanted to do at the time. (I actually started that late too, at 20 years old). But now.....well I suppose it is going to take some more time (I'll be 33 when graduating) but I just don't see my career being in music.

Maybe sharing a bit too much. :pac:

hibby · 01-02-2013 9:23am

I think you should go ahead and do it, if circumstances allow. So you'll have followed a unique career path - how many people will have a music degree and a Japanese translation degree? - but there's nothing wrong with having a unique skill set and making your own path.

Actually, a friend and colleague of mine, a qualified mechanical engineer with 10 years of experience (he's an extremely smart and competent engineer) recently left a good job and started a medical degree in his mid-30s. And that was the right decision for him; the great thing is that he was brave enough to go ahead and do it.

And you'll be qualified with a translation studies degree long before he's a doctor!

Just Like Heaven · 01-03-2013 11:20am

Decided to start the Heisig method myself, not gonna go at it too intensely but try for consistency, 20-25 a day. Will let you know how I do. Shame Funky penguin isn't around, would like to know if he bothered with the second book for learning the readings or tried to pick them up in a more natural method.

Any guesses on which language he'll re-register his username in?

just-joe · 03-03-2013 8:43am

funky penguin is gone?

gone where?

Just Like Heaven · 03-03-2013 8:27pm

I dunno his account is closed again though. Probably finding boards a distraction and trying to spend as much time as possible immersed in Japanese!

just-joe · 05-03-2013 12:41pm

What we should all be doing..:eek:

Just Like Heaven · 07-03-2013 10:07am

395 Kanji. Will start an Anki deck later today and start adding stuff in context.

Just Like Heaven · 09-03-2013 9:08am

Covered a whole 92 Kanji yesterday, was feeling pleased with myself until I read the log of somebody who covered the book in 15 days. In a single day they covered 241 Kanji :eek:

552.

just-joe · 14-03-2013 11:43am

I tend to be very sceptical about anyone who learns 241 kanji in a day. That's just ridiculous.

Just Like Heaven · 14-03-2013 12:13pm

Well really the 'learning' comes through the weeks of reviewing following making up a little story about the kanji. So yeah I'd imagine after those two weeks his retention on Anki was probably quite a low percentage, but I'd say he was getting 98%+ right still months and months faster than most people who saw the book through.

just-joe · 15-03-2013 8:47am

That may be true. I guess if you use it enough and complete it it gets kanji into your head.

I'm yet to meet someone who did the book and can now read Japanese well. (though i dont many who have finished, just a lot who read the start and didn't go through with it)

ConFurioso · 18-03-2013 4:13pm

fewtinsoffroth wrote: »

Decided to start the Heisig method myself, not gonna go at it too intensely but try for consistency, 20-25 a day. Will let you know how I do. Shame Funky penguin isn't around, would like to know if he bothered with the second book for learning the readings or tried to pick them up in a more natural method.

Any guesses on which language he'll re-register his username in?

I bet you he'll do something silly like use his PSN account name.....

>_>

<_<

ConFurioso · 19-03-2013 5:19am

Seriously though, fair play fewtins!

You're exactly right. After I finished heisig, the load was so much, that I needed no distractions. But I feel I have some sense of grasp on it at the moment.

Doing a few sentences but nothing too hyper. Honestly, I think the studying has taken a back seat to enjoying my last few months in Japan. Hope everyone is well and getting to grips with Japanese!

Just Like Heaven · 19-03-2013 12:21pm

Lost a bit of enthusiasm for Heisig

Lost a couple of days during St. Patrick's weekend as well >_<

845 kanji.

ConFurioso · 19-03-2013 6:23pm

That's a HUGE amount! Really give yourself a moment to sit back and realise you can write 845 kanji! It's a great achievement! you're nearly half way there! ^_^

MomijiHime · 28-03-2013 1:31pm

Good on all of you for working so hard! I can't imagine learning over 100 kanji in a day.. I'm going to start studying Japanese once I finish my Junior cert in June and I'm in TY next year so I hope to learn a lot then!

Just Like Heaven · 28-03-2013 1:33pm

Enjoy it

I self studied Japanese for the leaving cert, starting in TY is a great idea.

MomijiHime · 28-03-2013 1:37pm

fewtinsoffroth wrote: »

Enjoy it I self studied Japanese for the leaving cert, starting in TY is a great idea.

Thanks!

Just Like Heaven · 23-06-2013 9:24am

Had the chance to speak Japanese in work on Friday with a Japanese girl who was over for an interview, I fluffed a bit and was nervous at first, but it was okay. However I left a bit thrown as I've been studying for quite a while now, and my speaking ability should have been much better. I'm reading short stories and newspaper articles with real comprehensibility now, and should have little difficulty scoring quite well on N3 this December, but it left me sort of upset cause I knew I was better than I let on.

Overall I guess it was good, cause now I'm gonna pay more attention to speaking and active use of the language, it is after all what I'm more passionate about I guess. Whilst talking to her I found it interesting that she said she often stumbles when writing kanji, and that a lot of people her age do, because she writes with a pen so little these days, and recognition is much easier than active production of kanji, so they have no problem writing in full kanji on a phone/computer because it's automatic. Kinda helped put it in perspective I guess, for me it is more important to be able to communicate without constantly stumbling than getting an N2 certificate etc. So if the occasional hiccup when writing kanji is okay for a native speaker, surely it's good enough for me?

Tristram · 23-06-2013 11:47am

fewtins wrote: »

Had the chance to speak Japanese in work on Friday with a Japanese girl who was over for an interview, I fluffed a bit and was nervous at first, but it was okay. However I left a bit thrown as I've been studying for quite a while now, and my speaking ability should have been much better. I'm reading short stories and newspaper articles with real comprehensibility now, and should have little difficulty scoring quite well on N3 this December, but it left me sort of upset cause I knew I was better than I let on.

Overall I guess it was good, cause now I'm gonna pay more attention to speaking and active use of the language, it is after all what I'm more passionate about I guess. Whilst talking to her I found it interesting that she said she often stumbles when writing kanji, and that a lot of people her age do, because she writes with a pen so little these days, and recognition is much easier than active production of kanji, so they have no problem writing in full kanji on a phone/computer because it's automatic. Kinda helped put it in perspective I guess, for me it is more important to be able to communicate without constantly stumbling than getting an N2 certificate etc. So if the occasional hiccup when writing kanji is okay for a native speaker, surely it's good enough for me?

It's becoming more of an issue for young Japanese people now. My students spend hours every week just writing kanji. There's no writing on JLPT btw.

ConFurioso · 23-06-2013 3:34pm

Yeah writing is becoming a dying art with Japans youth, mainly down to technology. Phones and computers mean that only recognition is important, rather than remembering that one....tiny....little stroke.

Jury's out I suppose on the significance of this, but what it means is that it can help the language learner, if all they want to do it speak, listen or read. Benny, from fluent in 3 months discusses this in his articles about learning Madarin (on a phone, can't link, but it's a good read).

Ironically, it means that really serious learners of Japanese (gaijin that is) sometimes have a firmer grasp on kanji than natives. Kazumoto on ajatt has mentioned this a few times, as has the chap on Level up your Japanese.

Personally, I love kanji, and want to learn as much as possible about them (with regards to practical kanji....not those REALLY old ones). But.....if your goal is just communication through speaking, there's a strong argument for not worrying about learning how to write them. Just focus on recognition for when computers/cell phones prompt.

Just Like Heaven · 23-06-2013 3:39pm

Tristram wrote: »

It's becoming more of an issue for young Japanese people now. My students spend hours every week just writing kanji. There's no writing on JLPT btw.

That's interesting. And yeah I know, but I always put a lot of effort in to writing anyway as I just felt 'I should', but now starting to consider if I really need such a thorough grasp on that aspect of the language, especially seeing as in the future we'll all probably be typing more and writing even less. And it's not as if I'm personally ever going to need Japanese for work/school etc.

just-joe · 24-06-2013 1:08pm

ConFurioso wrote: »

Ironically, it means that really serious learners of Japanese (gaijin that is) sometimes have a firmer grasp on kanji than natives. Kazumoto on ajatt has mentioned this a few times, as has the chap on Level up your Japanese.

These cases must be seriously few and far between. And it would have to be some super super serious kanji learner, against a not so clever native....

I imagine it parallels english-speakers ability to spell words. I imagine some people are saying children growing up are getting worse at spelling because of auto correct.

Could you post some links to the stuff you mentioned? onegai shimasu!

ConFurioso · 24-06-2013 2:15pm

You'd be surprised!

I think I should clarify though! When I said that foreigners sometimes have a firmer grasp, it is literally the difference of a stroke or two, that's it (imagine, as you rightly said, a Japanese person correcting your spelling of say.....camouflage, or whatever word you might consistently slip up with regards to spelling. It may be a difficult one to spell off the top of the head, but we can read it immediately upon seeing it).

It actually happened to me once. My Japanese teacher couldn't remember how to write 描, meaning to sketch, or draw/paint. It was the top radical that confused her, but I came to the rescue and she couldn't believe i knew it.

http://www.fluentin3months.com/chinese-week-1/

This is Benny's take on Mandarin. It's not the one I read specifically, but he does mention his technological approach, and reliance on phones/apps etc.

These blogs are ridiculously difficult to navigate, and as such I also can't find Kazumoto's one...

I'll have a proper search later (about to hit the hay) and see if I can find them, sorry!

Right.....here it goes.

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