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chris froome

1246

Comments

  • #152
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,176 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    MOD VOICE: Unless he fails a control or admits to it, suggestions that Chris Frome is doping are not acceptable. Please read the very clear rules on the forums front page. It's the summertime now so there will be zero tolerance from me from now on. Any clarity needed? Please PM me.


  • #153
    pelevin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭pelevin


    Arequipa wrote: »
    Remember when someone rides away from a group of top riders(some of whom have been caught cheating previously) with relative ease, you're entitled to ask questions...
    -advances in technology,
    -use of wind tunnel, aerodynamics
    -loss of weight by certain riders
    -advanced new training techniques etc..

    Human physiology hasnt advanced this quickly..
    In a clean race, riders get progressively tired and eventually fall back & the fittest, genetically strongest with highest VO2 generally win...
    Maybe this is Froome.. But maybe other factors are at play...

    Probably time will tell....

    I consider an open-mind is the only reasonable position regarding virtually all professional athletes, & it's healthy & right to ask questions. That Kimmage quote I gave though doesn't remotely fall within that. For me it's fairly typical self-righteous Kimmage absolutism. But now he's the hard but fair adviser to Froome on what's right and wrong.


  • #154
    Arequipa
    Registered Users Posts: 1,034 ✭✭✭Arequipa


    12 sprocket, i admire the hard work and natural talent that gets guys to the top of the sport.


  • #155
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,176 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    pelevin wrote: »
    For me it's fairly typical self-righteous Kimmage absolutism. But now he's the hard but fair adviser to Froome on what's right and wrong.
    I understand Kimmages criticism but Froome is right, he followed the rules to the letter, whatever his own teams policies or other teams policies, he hasn't thus far broken any rules. I imagine if UCI said, right, no TUEs for short-term illnesses, then he would have either packed in the race it tried and presumably done alot worse.

    On a side note, I read the part against "advice of his handlers" and then read the way his partner controlled the conversation if it didn't sound right, and laughed to myself. I think he came across well but would have come across better if it was one on one.


  • #156
    Junior
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,218 ✭✭✭Junior


    Is it me or did he get the Vaughters Bee Sting story arseways as well ... I thought the team wanted to give Vaughters a shot and Vaughters didn't want it and hence couldn't continue ... Not the other way round ..


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  • #157
    12 sprocket
    Registered Users Posts: 382 ✭✭12 sprocket


    Arequipa wrote: »
    12 sprocket, i admire the hard work and natural talent that gets guys to the top of the sport.

    Quoting edited post


  • #158
    Raam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,317 ✭✭✭✭Raam


    Junior wrote: »
    Is it me or did he get the Vaughters Bee Sting story arseways as well ... I thought the team wanted to give Vaughters a shot and Vaughters didn't want it and hence couldn't continue ... Not the other way round ..

    According to this...

    http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/jonathan-vaughters-the-sleek-geek
    ...referring to his infamous wasp sting, which swelled his right eye to golf ball proportions, a week before he was due to finish his first Tour de France in 2001, and being told by the team doctor that if he took a cortisone injection and was tested, he'd be declared positive. He chose to quit the race.


  • #159
    Arequipa
    Registered Users Posts: 1,034 ✭✭✭Arequipa


    First of all 12 sprocket; apologies for calling you naive...

    Re Froome... I think it is interesting how he talks about wind tunnel tests and attacking while still in the saddle; prefer the bouncing styke of Contador, but Froome's way defo works....

    I imagine Froome plays close attention to him powermeter & knows for x distance he can put down x power & nobody can stay with him...


  • #160
    Raam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,317 ✭✭✭✭Raam


    Also...

    http://velonews.competitor.com/2001/07/news/frustrating-end-for-vaughters_1265
    Vaughters was stung just above the right eye during a team training ride on Monday. When he got back to the Crédit Agricole hotel in Pau, the team took him to a local hospital for treatment. There, just to be perfectly clear on the situation, a doctor contacted the UCI, which said that Vaughters could not be treated with cortisone to reduce the swelling.
    Read more at http://velonews.competitor.com/2001/07/news/frustrating-end-for-vaughters_1265#2ckIS4bMAmMFV43r.99


  • #161
    MPFG
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,606 ✭✭✭MPFG


    I got to say that interview is one time I actually feel sorry for Chris Froome...I am not a fan of his, mainly because of 2012 Tour, extracts I read from his book, etc....

    But between Kimmage & Cound.....now there is somewhere I wouldln't put my worst enemy


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  • #162
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,176 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    Arequipa wrote: »
    I imagine Froome plays close attention to him powermeter & knows for x distance he can put down x power & nobody can stay with him...
    Its not just your imagination, it's widely accepted that all Chris does is stare at his data or possibly just ignores everyone else: http://chrisfroomelookingatstems.tumblr.com/


  • #163
    petethedrummer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,604 ✭✭✭petethedrummer


    Team Sky are a public relations disaster.


  • #164
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    CramCycle wrote: »

    On a side note, I read the part against "advice of his handlers" and then read the way his partner controlled the conversation if it didn't sound right, and laughed to myself. I think he came across well but would have come across better if it was one on one.

    It would appear from the interview that the no. 1 handler was there making sure the interview went in the right direction.

    I found the passage about the history of the tour laughable. I've only got in to cycling in the last 18 months or so watching/following etc but it would appear that despite being a professional for many years Froome knows little about it.

    It just seems to black and white. He loves cycling his bike and anything outside of his bike and/or ambitions is irrelevant.


  • #165
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,176 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    godtabh wrote: »
    It would appear from the interview that the no. 1 handler was there making sure the interview went in the right direction.

    I found the passage about the history of the tour laughable. I've only got in to cycling in the last 18 months or so watching/following etc but it would appear that despite being a professional for many years Froome knows little about it.

    It just seems to black and white. He loves cycling his bike and anything outside of his bike and/or ambitions is irrelevant.
    "One hundred per cent," he replied. "It's normal that people ask questions given the history of the sport, that's the unfortunate position we find ourselves in at the moment, that eyebrows are going to be raised. For me, it's a personal mission to show that the sport has changed. I certainly know that the results I'm getting are not going to be stripped."
    MC: Chris doesn't know the history of the sport . . .
    CF: I'm learning about it but I am very naive still.

    So he does know the history, oh wait, he doesn't, oh wait .......

    Talk about conflicting statements, good thing MC was there to tell me that he didn't know.


  • #166
    A P
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 380 ✭✭A P


    And part 2: http://www.independent.ie/sport/other-sports/paul-kimmage-chris-froome-in-the-eye-of-the-storm-part-2-30394950.html


  • #167
    Quigs Snr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,165 ✭✭✭Quigs Snr


    Cound comes across a little bit yoko ono in these interviews.


  • #168
    pelevin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭pelevin


    Quigs Snr wrote: »
    Cound comes across a little bit yoko ono in these interviews.

    I blame her for breaking up the happy Sky family. Look how things have gone - they won't even bring Wiggins on Tour with them now. And he was the coolest one.


  • #169
    fat bloke
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,933 ✭✭✭fat bloke


    Excellent piece. Excellent interview. Kimmage is da shizzle. Froome comes across well too


  • #170
    furiousox
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,014 ✭✭✭furiousox


    Michelle Cound is a bloody pest during that interview.

    CPL 593H



  • #171
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    who was being interviewed? Froome or Cound?


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  • #172
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,141 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    Quigs Snr wrote: »
    Cound comes across a little bit yoko ono in these interviews.
    furiousox wrote: »
    Michelle Cound is a bloody pest during that interview.
    godtabh wrote: »
    who was being interviewed? Froome or Cound?

    I don't get the criticism of Cound. We all like to simplify complex things, to treat people as individuals, but her presence in the interview and her outspoken social media presence reflects the importance of her personal partnership with Froome. They are a team within a team.


  • #173
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    Lumen wrote: »
    I don't get the criticism of Cound. We all like to simplify complex things, to treat people as individuals, but her presence in the interview and her outspoken social media presence reflects the importance of her personal partnership with Froome. They are a team within a team.

    People would rather here Froome talk


  • #174
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,141 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    godtabh wrote: »
    People would rather here Froome talk
    In this interview, perhaps, but that doesn't explain this sort of criticism:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=90721567&postcount=61
    Inquitus wrote: »
    Froome and Cound were the ones to first demonstrate their lack of trustworthyness, what with Froome's needless "dropping" of Wiggins and head turning coupled with his muppet missus's continuous twitter meltdowns.

    "Muppet missus"? Meltdowns? There's a whiff of misogyny about it.


  • #175
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    Lumen wrote: »
    In this interview, perhaps, but that doesn't explain this sort of criticism:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=90721567&postcount=61



    "Muppet missus"? Meltdowns? There's a whiff of misogyny about it.

    I agree with the Cound statement. She isnt riding for Team Sky yet seems to get involved in everything.

    The Wiggins/Froome thing is a different issue


  • #176
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,176 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    I just felt she ruined what could have been a great interview, it was interesting but her constant interruption like a mother stopping her son saying the wrong thing to a teacher made it difficult to read. I know nothing else about her other than the interview as I haven't looked at twitter in awhile.

    Not a criticism of her, she wants to protect him.


  • #177
    Raam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,317 ✭✭✭✭Raam


    She has deleted her twitter account.


  • #178
    MPFG
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,606 ✭✭✭MPFG


    Lumen wrote: »
    I don't get the criticism of Cound. We all like to simplify complex things, to treat people as individuals, but her presence in the interview and her outspoken social media presence reflects the importance of her personal partnership with Froome. They are a team within a team.

    I am not a Froome fan but I feel sorry for the man as Cound has moved in , tells him what to eat, maneuvers his career and for gods sake tells him what to say in interviews ....It smacks of controlling

    He obviously had a difficult childhood and did not have a good relationship with his father but had a great relationship with his mother ...He is obviously attracted to strong women like his mother, more so as he is a very laid back guy who doesn't like direct conflict. Cound is an attractive woman but she will own him all his life ....run for the hills Chris :D


  • #179
    AstraMonti
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,718 ✭✭✭AstraMonti


    MPFG wrote: »
    run for the hills Chris :D

    now it all makes sense. He is not trying to win the tour, he is trying to get away from her!


  • #180
    simonrooneyzaga
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,001 ✭✭✭simonrooneyzaga


    good interview - annoying at times when Cound butts in but I suppose that's part of the story!

    Impressed with Froome for giving such an open and in depth interview. This is the kind of transparency that's needed. "Who was the doctor... etc etc..". Forensic questioning from Kimmage.

    What an interesting character in a boring kind of way.


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  • #181
    Rua_ri
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 322 ✭✭Rua_ri


    CramCycle wrote: »
    I just felt she ruined what could have been a great interview, it was interesting but her constant interruption like a mother stopping her son saying the wrong thing to a teacher made it difficult to read. I know nothing else about her other than the interview as I haven't looked at twitter in awhile.

    Not a criticism of her, she wants to protect him.

    IMO Cound came across more as his lawyer rather than his partner.


  • #182
    Esroh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,508 ✭✭✭Esroh


    Rua_ri wrote: »
    IMO Cound came across more as his lawyer rather than his partner.
    ,
    His Accountant. I'll interupt there to make sure you keep all team owners/managers present and future happy.


  • #183
    Trojan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,413 ✭✭✭✭Trojan


    I think she's been way out of line with some of the stuff she's posted on Twitter, but no probs with how she comes across in that PK interview.

    I'd have a bit more time for Froome after reading that.

    🎙️ The Recognized Authority Podcast



  • #184
    Arequipa
    Registered Users Posts: 1,034 ✭✭✭Arequipa


    Hey! Part 2 of the interview here:

    http://m.independent.ie/sport/other-sports/paul-kimmage-chris-froome-in-the-eye-of-the-storm-part-2-30394950.html

    I thought the relationship between Froome and his girlfriend came across as a bit weird.
    She often answers for him, corrects or backs up what he says..
    Why is she there?
    I think Froome should have just done the interview on his own...

    I would defo say she wears the trousers in that relationship...

    I have no doubt Froome is a nice guy...
    Maybe he could get a bit more clued in on UCI Regulations, the Blood Passport, various systems in the Sky team and just procedures to be followed at the top level...

    He did come across a bit 'green' about many issues..
    But maybe he just puts that naivity on a bit....?!!!


  • #185
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,176 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    Arequipa wrote: »
    Maybe he could get a bit more clued in on UCI Regulations, the Blood Passport, various systems in the Sky team and just procedures to be followed at the top level...

    IMO he is clued in as he needs to be, why would he need to know what a blood passport analysis looks like. I find it interesting but that was part of an old job in a vaguely related area but it would be like me understanding economic growth and in depth analysis if I was a clerk in a bank. I might have an interest in it but its not necessary to my job and unless i had that interest or an incentive i would most likely not bother finding out.


  • #186
    Arequipa
    Registered Users Posts: 1,034 ✭✭✭Arequipa


    I dont agree.. I think it is in Froome's interest to know exactly how team Sky tick, who to talk to in x situation..
    Also, given how many doping controls he will have to undergo & a media ready to pounce on any inaccuracy or mistake.. I think it is in his interest to know what the testing procedures are, what the banned substances are and the protocol and procedures to be followed in big evebts like the Tour...he doesnt have to know everything, but as his career depends on these matters, he should have a good understanding...

    The problem with big stars, is that they get more and more advisers and agents & doctors etc... They all give Froome advices on all issues...
    In certain circumstances he could be advised (hypthetically) to take x and not know what it is...

    If i was Froome I would keep things simple, learn about all this stuff and keep only a couple of people in his close circle....


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  • #187
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,176 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    Arequipa wrote: »
    The problem with big stars, is that they get more and more advisers and agents & doctors etc... They all give Froome advices on all issues...
    In certain circumstances he could be advised (hypthetically) to take x and not know what it is...

    Fair enough, its like he said at his previous team a doctor walked in gave them a shot of amino acids and that was that, did he see the bottle it was withdrawn from etc. It certainly raised a voice in my head thinking, surely you would have probed a little, particularly if it had never happened before? No reason to suspect different than what the doctor said but I would have thought it was in his best interests to probe a little deeper.


  • #188
    Trojan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,413 ✭✭✭✭Trojan


    Sometimes the big stars have far less advisers and supervisors than you might think.

    🎙️ The Recognized Authority Podcast



  • #189
    Raymzor
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 356 ✭✭Raymzor


    tomdempsey200 wrote: »
    I don't think there's any way froome is going to dominate the tour going forward

    He is just too underweight and will struggle with illness and loss of form imo

    Interesting reading over this thread! Read inside team sky. Lots of positives from it. Sky appear willing to give the stats if other teams will reveal their data! Reluctance must be due to the Sky competitive advantage!


  • #190
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,581 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Raymzor wrote: »
    Interesting reading over this thread! Read inside team sky. Lots of positives from it. Sky appear willing to give the stats if other teams will reveal their data! Reluctance must be due to the Sky competitive advantage!

    That's complete BS though. Since day 1 Sky promised transparency and failed to deliver. That doesn't mean they're doping, I don't think they are, it means they're doing a very poor job at defending themselves.

    What use is power data to a competitor in cycling? The rider who can generate the most w/kg for the longest time wins. It's how they train to get the highest w/kg that's the real secret sauce. Without knowing how they get there, the data is useless.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




  • #191
    Thud
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,644 ✭✭✭Thud


    Some of the riders were posting the stages on strava (some had power and hrm data others didnt) how hard would it be for all of them to do that? Not a huge amount to be gained from it, possibly with a day or two delay to protect someone getting targetted after a tough day.


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  • #192
    Leroy42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,764 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    but the power data calculated by the boffins based in the results have been shown to be fairly accurate, so in effect we have the power data already.


  • #193
    dastardly00
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,458 ✭✭✭✭dastardly00


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    but the power data calculated by the boffins based in the results have been shown to be fairly accurate, so in effect we have the power data already.

    True. But the quantity of data released needs to be increased. More climbs, more stages, more riders etc. That will allow the data to be compared over a long period of time. It would be far more efficient for the rider/team to provide the data to the UCI/boffins, rather than having the boffins just calculating it. That will also mean that the pro teams can't denounce it as 'pseudoscience'.


  • #194
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 77,569 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    but the power data calculated by the boffins based in the results have been shown to be fairly accurate, so in effect we have the power data already.

    There are way too many variables for the data to be anything approaching accurate. Even in a TT you need to accurately estimate frontal area and other factors that can only be sensibly estimated in a wind tunnel. Add to that the benefits of drafting, wind variability etc and you start to appreciate how inaccurate the estimates must be. Then there are other factors affecting performance. So, for example, a rider may be able to shelter in the peloton or get shielded by his team meaning when he hits the climbs he can be still quite fresh.


  • #195
    Leroy42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,764 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    Beasty wrote: »
    There are way too many variables for the data to be anything approaching accurate. Even in a TT you need to accurately estimate frontal area and other factors that can only be sensibly estimated in a wind tunnel. Add to that the benefits of drafting, wind variability etc and you start to appreciate how inaccurate the estimates must be. Then there are other factors affecting performance. So, for example, a rider may be able to shelter in the peloton or get shielded by his team meaning when he hits the climbs he can be still quite fresh.

    But the release of Froome's Ventoux data matched almost exactly to what the boffins had said, which of course Sky had dismissed at the time as totally inaccurate.

    While power data for all races would help in overall understanding, they don't really tell you very much. Its the data from the big moments, Ventoux, Alpe etc. that is required first.


  • #196
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 77,569 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    But the release of Froome's Ventoux data matched almost exactly to what the boffins had said, which of course Sky had dismissed at the time as totally inaccurate.

    While power data for all races would help in overall understanding, they don't really tell you very much. Its the data from the big moments, Ventoux, Alpe etc. that is required first.
    They may well have generic data that when applied across a wide sample is reasonably accurate. Getting it right for a single performance is likely to be a fluke (although hill climb estimates are likely to be less subject to variables, there will be such variables nonetheless).

    Comparing current performances with those in the past is also questionable. Training techniques improve and as I mention above riders may well be arriving at the start of a climb relatively fresh. I suspect the science behind all this was much less advanced even 10 years ago (as I believe Team GB, the Aussies, Team Sky and the like have taken it to a new level) meaning riders were less likely to put their best performances in when it mattered most.


  • #197
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,581 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Beasty wrote: »
    There are way too many variables for the data to be anything approaching accurate. Even in a TT you need to accurately estimate frontal area and other factors that can only be sensibly estimated in a wind tunnel. Add to that the benefits of drafting, wind variability etc and you start to appreciate how inaccurate the estimates must be. Then there are other factors affecting performance. So, for example, a rider may be able to shelter in the peloton or get shielded by his team meaning when he hits the climbs he can be still quite fresh.

    There's a reason you only really see power estimates for climbs. The variables for wind resistance are largely removed on a climb.

    It's not really a point you can argue, to be fair, the estimations done in the past have been fairly bang on when compared to actual data. Case on point Froome's ride on Ventoux in 2013. Hard to argue this years estimations are wrong when they've been proved right in the past.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




  • #198
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,581 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Beasty wrote: »
    They may well have generic data that when applied across a wide sample is reasonably accurate. Getting it right for a single performance is likely to be a fluke (although hill climb estimates are likely to be less subject to variables, there will be such variables nonetheless).

    Comparing current performances with those in the past is also questionable. Training techniques improve and as I mention above riders may well be arriving at the start of a climb relatively fresh. I suspect the science behind all this was much less advanced even 10 years ago (as I believe Team GB, the Aussies, Team Sky and the like have taken it to a new level) meaning riders were less likely to put their best performances in when it mattered most.

    I firmly believe "Team Sky" aren't doping systematically. But you can't dismiss the power estimates when they are usually right.

    Out of interest why is it "Team Sky" and "Team GB" but not "Team Australia" it's the Aussies? When the "team" start coming first? It used to be the ONCE team and the PDM team now it "Team Sky".

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




  • #199
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 77,569 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    Brian? wrote: »

    Out of interest why is it "Team Sky" and "Team GB" but not "Team Australia" it's the Aussies? When the "team" start coming first? It used to be the ONCE team and the PDM team now it "Team Sky".

    Didn't think the Australian team was commonly referred to as Team Australia and equally don't know if it's Team Australia or something like the Australian Sports Institute ( or whatever it's called ) behind their massive improvements particularly on the track. Apologies to anyone who found me referring to them as "Aussies" offensive though ;)


  • #200
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 21,581 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Beasty wrote: »
    Didn't think the Australian team was commonly referred to as Team Australia and equally don't know if it's Team Australia or something like the Australian Sports Institute ( or whatever it's called ) behind their massive improvements particularly on the track. Apologies to anyone who found me referring to them as "Aussies" offensive though ;)

    I didn't think it offensive. I'm just genuinely curious. I think the first time I heard this was the Canadian rugby team being referred to as Team Canada, by Canadians. Sounds strange on the ear.

    they/them/theirs


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek




  • #201
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 77,569 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    Brian? wrote: »
    I didn't think it offensive. I'm just genuinely curious. I think the first time I heard this was the Canadian rugby team being referred to as Team Canada, by Canadians. Sounds strange on the ear.

    My comment was in jest. Think it started with Team USA (who were perhaps less "proficient" at certain global team sports in the "amateur" age) at various Olympic events and has gained traction elsewhere since.


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