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UK Equality supports four Christians claiming religious discrimination

  • 13-07-2011 11:28am
    #1
    Moderators Posts: 51,859 ✭✭✭✭


    Four British Christians with religious discrimination claims at the European Court of Human Rights have been backed by the UK's equality watchdog.

    The claimants include an airline worker who was prevented from wearing a cross and a relationship counsellor who refused to deal with gay couples.

    The Equality and Human Rights Commission said judges had interpreted equality law "too narrowly".

    This made it difficult for employers to protect freedom of religion, it added.

    Cross row

    The cases involve British Airways check-in clerk Nadia Eweida, nurse Shirley Chaplin, relationship counsellor Gary McFarlane and registrar Lilian Ladele
    • Ms Eweida, a Pentecostal Christian, was sent home from work in 2006 after refusing to remove a necklace with a cross
    • Mrs Chaplin was moved to a desk job by Royal Devon and Exeter NHS Trust Hospital for similar reasons
    • Mr McFarlane, a Bristol counsellor, was sacked for refusing to give relationship advice to gay people
    • Ms Ladele was disciplined after she refused to conduct same-sex civil partnership ceremonies in north London

    'Reasonable adjustments'

    The commission said judges had interpreted equality laws too narrowly in religious claims, leading employers to place undue restriction on how far Christians could behave in accordance with their beliefs.

    John Wadham, legal group director at the commission, said: "Our intervention in these cases would encourage judges to interpret the law more broadly and more clearly to the benefit of people who are religious and those who are not.

    "The idea of making reasonable adjustments to accommodate a person's needs has served disability discrimination law well for decades.

    "It seems reasonable that a similar concept could be adopted to allow someone to manifest their religious beliefs."

    BBC.co.uk

    The wearing of a cross isn't too big an issue for me.

    The idea of people being able to discriminate on religious grounds while at their place of work is an issue for me.

    Imagine someone shows up for counselling and the counsellor uses religion as an excuse not to help a gay person. Are they honestly saying that people can use religion as an excuse to get away with discrimination?

    And with the two examples in the article, both were public servants. So the equality watchdog is ironically supporting a system where gay people can't be guaranteed equal treatment by any public sector organisations.

    If you can read this, you're too close!



Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,453 ✭✭✭Shenshen


    I agree, if the crosses worn don't constitute a safety problem, as they might in the case of a nurse wearing them for example, I don't have an issue with them.

    But as for refusing to do your job, I'm sorry, you'll have to make a decision between your beliefs and your employment.
    I work in Order Management, if I refuse to process orders destined for the occupied territories in Israel, how long do you think it would take before my employer decided that I need more free time to express my believes fully?

    If your believes prevent you from doing your job, find another job.


  • Moderators Posts: 51,859 ✭✭✭✭Delirium


    Shenshen wrote: »
    But as for refusing to do your job, I'm sorry, you'll have to make a decision between your beliefs and your employment.
    I work in Order Management, if I refuse to process orders destined for the occupied territories in Israel, how long do you think it would take before my employer decided that I need more free time to express my believes fully?

    If your believes prevent you from doing your job, find another job.

    Agreed. On a related note, a New York town clerk quit her job so she wouldn't have to sign same-sex marriage documents.

    But it is daft that someone can discriminate against someone, and then cry religion as a defense against a possible sacking.

    If you can read this, you're too close!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,457 ✭✭✭Morbert


    I have no issue with public displays of religion. But the irony is delicious. One person fighting against discrimination. The other person fighting for their right to discriminate.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    I can rule out McFarlane on the grounds that he was working for Relate a company that offered psychosexual services irrespective of sexual orientation.

    In Ladelle's case the only hope she has of winning is in noting that she was employed prior to changes in legislation coming in, but ultimately I can't see this winning.

    In Mrs Chaplin's case - In a hospital it probably isn't the best thing to wear on hygiene grounds. Although recently the NHS accommodated Muslims in respect to washing when it probably shouldn't have done. That may complicate things here.

    Ms Eweida may have a case I'd need more details to determine.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    philologos wrote: »
    In Mrs Chaplin's case - In a hospital it probably isn't the best thing to wear on hygiene grounds.
    Chaplin's case has been discussed here before.

    In short, she was asked to stop wearing a cross on a chain around her neck, since she worked (AFAIR) in A+E, which can be violent, and where people could hurt her by grabbing the chain and trying to choke her. The management suggested avoiding this risk by wear the cross on an badge or arm band or somewhere else instead, noting that wearing the cross around her neck on a chain wasn't even a requirement of any christian sect. She refused to take it off. The management wouldn't budge, citing risk of attack and reassigned her to a desk job. She claimed persecution and for the last two years she's been a cause celebrée for the Daily Telegraph and "christians are persecuted" circles.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,453 ✭✭✭Shenshen


    Reading this, I'm not quite sure what Eweida actually hopes to achieve...

    BA changed their uniform policy to allow members of staff to display symbols of faiths on lapel pins, and wherever it would not be hazard on chains and necklaces as well. The argument against allowing jewellery for everyone is safety based, as it can leads to accidents when handling baggage and the like.

    Despite this, the lady declined an out-of-court settlement regarding payment for the period of suspension, which was offered after the policy change, and after her case has been thrown out in all instances is now bothering the European Court of Human Rights.

    Sounds like she just likes the attention, to be honest.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭Bottle_of_Smoke


    robindch wrote: »
    Chaplin's case has been discussed here before.

    In short, she was asked to stop wearing a cross on a chain around her neck, since she worked (AFAIR) in A+E, which can be violent, and where people could hurt her by grabbing the chain and trying to choke her. The management suggested avoiding this risk by wear the cross on an badge or arm band or somewhere else instead, noting that wearing the cross around her neck on a chain wasn't even a requirement of any christian sect. She refused to take it off. The management wouldn't budge, citing risk of attack and reassigned her to a desk job. She claimed persecution and for the last two years she's been a cause celebrée for the Daily Telegraph and "christians are persecuted" circles.

    What an utter f*ckwit. That's a most oppressed people on earth wannabe if ever I've seen one.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,788 ✭✭✭MrPudding


    Interesting article in the Guardian

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/libertycentral/2011/jul/13/equality-human-rights-commission-religious

    It seems like the head of the EHRC is not quite sure what his job is...

    MrP


  • Moderators Posts: 51,859 ✭✭✭✭Delirium


    MrPudding wrote: »
    Interesting article in the Guardian

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/libertycentral/2011/jul/13/equality-human-rights-commission-religious

    It seems like the head of the EHRC is not quite sure what his job is...

    MrP

    Great start to the article:
    "Our business is defending the believer," the Equality and Human Rights Commission (EHRC) chair Trevor Phillips said last month.

    sounds like equality to me :rolleyes::rolleyes:

    If you can read this, you're too close!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,788 ✭✭✭MrPudding


    koth wrote: »
    Great start to the article:



    sounds like equality to me :rolleyes::rolleyes:
    Exactly. Way to miss the point of your job.

    MrP


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 25,848 ✭✭✭✭Zombrex


    Trevor Phillips has an er, 'interesting' bio

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trevor_Phillips

    From reading that (wikipedia, pinch of salt yada yada) he seems some what fixated on the principles of Britian, which could explain his traditionalist idea that most British people are religious that this should be the default position.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    Uk Equality? wtf??:confused:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,327 ✭✭✭AhSureTisGrand


    Sadly "equality" is a much-abused word nowadays


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,183 ✭✭✭dvpower


    Sadly "equality" is a much-abused word nowadays

    I see pastafarians are getting some of this equality stuff now.:pac:



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