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Dublin Bus strike from Sunday 04/08 [called off - service resumes 07/08]

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    #2
    Stevek101
    Registered Users Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Stevek101


    I'd imagine the drivers will walk out on Sunday, possibly unofficially. SIPTU hasn't received a letter from DB regarding the changes being implemented but CEO Paddy Doherty has told SIPTU rep Bill McCamley that they are being implemented. There won't be an official response until the snail mail is delivered.

    I would also hazard a guess no one will pass the picket for fear of being stoned for their sins ;)


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    #3
    liger
    Registered Users Posts: 756 ✭✭✭liger


    Well at least its happening on the bank holiday weekend, 2 days of not much interuption and then agree to sit down and talk in time for everyone to make it to work on Tuesday.

    It will be a lot of Huffing and Puffing and not much else. Neither side has the Nuts to hold out for long.


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    #4
    lil5
    Registered Users Posts: 430 ✭✭lil5


    liger wrote: »
    Well at least its happening on the bank holiday weekend, 2 days of not much interuption ...

    Tell that to the people who rely on the bus to go to work on the weekend ...


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    #5
    Stevek101
    Registered Users Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Stevek101


    liger wrote: »
    Well at least its happening on the bank holiday weekend, 2 days of not much interuption and then agree to sit down and talk in time for everyone to make it to work on Tuesday.

    It will be a lot of Huffing and Puffing and not much else. Neither side has the Nuts to hold out for long.

    I'm not too sure on this one. Can't see there being as much leeway as there was with the BÉ deal. A good few million more with this one. Also there is a fair few schedule changes attached to the deal.


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    #6
    cdebru
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,761 ✭✭✭cdebru


    Stevek101 wrote: »
    I'm not too sure on this one. Can't see there being as much leeway as there was with the BÉ deal. A good few million more with this one. Also there is a fair few schedule changes attached to the deal.


    I think liger is right, this is just pantomime much like the BE fiasco, couple of days all night talks minor change and a 4% pay cut for management, job done.
    The details of what will be agreed will only become clear weeks or months later.


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    #7
    hytrogen
    Registered Users Posts: 952 ✭✭✭hytrogen


    Well if privatising 10% of DB routes will cut costs what's the problem? Bringing competition into an already mafia'd market, means more businesses opening & business opportunities which should bring more employment right?


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    #8
    cdebru
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,761 ✭✭✭cdebru


    hytrogen wrote: »
    Well if privatising 10% of DB routes will cut costs what's the problem? Bringing competition into an already mafia'd market, means more businesses opening & business opportunities which should bring more employment right?

    Brilliant except for one thing, it has nothing to do with the 10%.


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    #9
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 28,997 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    hytrogen wrote: »
    Well if privatising 10% of DB routes will cut costs what's the problem?
    the problem is that most likely it either won't cut much costs at all and we'l still be paying the same subsidy, also more then likely it will be badly implamented
    hytrogen wrote: »
    Bringing competition into an already mafia'd market, means more businesses opening & business opportunities which should bring more employment right?
    can't see most of that happening, about all we may get is more customers riding the busses, but i suppose you never know

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #10
    rx8
    Registered Users Posts: 1,826 ✭✭✭rx8


    There are too many unknowns in the Labour Court recommendations, for the drivers to vote yes to.

    The Company cannot be trusted to stick to Labour Court time lines, of resolving the remaining issues within 3 months,they have shown this in the past with other recommendations.

    When it suits to ignore them, they do, and when it suits them to implement them, they force drivers to take action that nobody wants.

    Drivers are not living in cloud cuckoo land, they realise that some sacrifices have to be made in order for the company to get back on a sound financial footing and are quite prepared to accept most of the conditions, as we knew we wouldn't remain untouched, but, this agreement, according to the LC, is supposed to be for a 19 month period, but the company have stated that after 19 months, things will stay as they are.

    Also, they want carte-blanche on what schedules will be changed or cut, and how many part-time staff will be hired, if any.

    What ultimately will be required, is going to be a 10% pay cut by management.

    I don't want to be striking next week, but unless there are guarantees of sacrifices at the top, then everyone will suffer.


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    #11
    n97 mini
    Registered Users Posts: 8,295 ✭✭✭n97 mini


    rx8 wrote: »
    What ultimately will be required, is going to be a 10% pay cut by management.
    What ultimately is required is that no entity can hold the travelling public to ransom every time they feel aggrieved.

    If privatisation solves this problem, bring it on.


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    #12
    bmaxi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,859 ✭✭✭bmaxi


    rx8 wrote: »

    Also, they want carte-blanche on what schedules will be changed or cut, and how many part-time staff will be hired, if any.
    While I would sympathise with a lot of what you say, I can't see what is unreasonable about this. Management have to be allowed to manage, why should employees have a veto on what services are or aren't provided or whether a company should employ part time staff?
    I reckon the vibes from the Government have been pretty clear on the CIE issue, there are going to be cuts and they don't care how they're achieved.


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    #13
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 28,997 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    n97 mini wrote: »
    What ultimately is required is that no entity can hold the travelling public to ransom every time they feel aggrieved.
    claptrap, their not holding the traveling public to ransom as their are many options to get round if a strike goes ahead, yeah it might mean getting up and leaving the house a little earlier or either driving or getting a taxi rather then the bus but if striking as a last resort means that all options are examined for cuts rather then the staff just being the first port of call because its easier then thats what has to happen.
    n97 mini wrote: »
    If privatisation solves this problem, bring it on.
    not a good enough reason for privatisation, and i can't see it ending strike action anyway, no strike clauses should be illegal

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #14
    bmaxi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,859 ✭✭✭bmaxi


    n97 mini wrote: »
    What ultimately is required is that no entity can hold the travelling public to ransom every time they feel aggrieved.

    If privatisation solves this problem, bring it on.

    As long as it's regulated privatisation and we don't have a great track record there. Too many powerful people in each other's pockets.


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    #15
    end of the road
    Registered Users Posts: 28,997 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    bmaxi wrote: »
    Too many powerful people in each other's pockets.
    sums up ireland perfectly

    ticking a box on a form does not make you of a religion.



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    #16
    n97 mini
    Registered Users Posts: 8,295 ✭✭✭n97 mini


    end of the road wrote: »
    claptrap, their not holding the traveling public to ransom as their are many options to get round if a strike goes ahead, yeah it might mean getting up and leaving the house a little earlier or either driving or getting a taxi rather then the bus but if striking as a last resort means that all options are examined for cuts rather then the staff just being the first port of call because its easier then thats what has to happen.

    not a good enough reason for privatisation, and i can't see it ending strike action anyway, no strike clauses should be illegal

    Suggesting people can just go get a taxi shows little grip on the reality of the value of money, and I'm sure the people with no cars and no options in outlying areas will not appreciate that advice one bit.


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    #17
    Stevek101
    Registered Users Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Stevek101


    Summer schedules up on the site now.


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    #18
    cdebru
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,761 ✭✭✭cdebru


    n97 mini wrote: »
    Suggesting people can just go get a taxi shows little grip on the reality of the value of money, and I'm sure the people with no cars and no options in outlying areas will not appreciate that advice one bit.

    Its not a strike it is an illegal attempt by one party to a contract to alter that contract unilaterally, it is a clear breach of contract law. Any one working under those conditions would be de facto accepting the new conditions which would then become their new contract of employment.

    The only real question is why the unions in Dublin bus don't just get an injunction preventing Dublin bus from making unilateral changes to a contract.

    "Changes to your contract of employment
    Changes to your contract of employment can occur due to a change in the law, but otherwise, changes must be agreed between your employer and yourself. The requirement for both the employer's and the employee's consent to changes in the terms of the contract is part of contract law."

    http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/employment_rights_and_conditions/contracts_of_employment/contract_of_employment.html

    Any DB employees here should ask their trade union why they are not trying to enforce their legal rights before the courts instead of dragging you onto a picket where you will just lose more money on top of any money you will lose in the eventual agreement which we all know will happen.


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    #19
    starlit
    Registered Users Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭starlit


    Do i have a reason to freak out?! :/ im travelling a lot over weekend or is it dublin city buses only and or bus eireann affected?


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    #20
    cdebru
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,761 ✭✭✭cdebru


    Stevek101 wrote: »
    Summer schedules up on the site now.

    it goes to show the contempt that DB management have for the people working in the company that they put these up on their website before they even show them to their staff that they expect to work these.


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    #21
    cdebru
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,761 ✭✭✭cdebru


    doovdela wrote: »
    Do i have a reason to freak out?! :/ im travelling a lot over weekend or is it dublin city buses only and or bus eireann affected?

    Dublin bus only


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    #22
    Stevek101
    Registered Users Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Stevek101


    cdebru wrote: »
    it goes to show the contempt that DB management have for the people working in the company that they put these up on their website before they even show them to their staff that they expect to work these.

    After a year of negotiation something has to give.


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    #23
    rx8
    Registered Users Posts: 1,826 ✭✭✭rx8


    cdebru wrote: »
    it goes to show the contempt that DB management have for the people working in the company that they put these up on their website before they even show them to their staff that they expect to work these.

    The links are not working, atm , but you are right. ....utter contempt is what management have for the staff.
    The f**king cheek of them.


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    #24
    Stevek101
    Registered Users Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Stevek101


    rx8 wrote: »
    The links are not working, atm , but you are right. ....utter contempt is what management have for the staff.
    The f**king cheek of them.

    Links working fine here. IP block on drivers ;) But in all seriousness this is working out to be pretty contentious.


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    #25
    cdebru
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,761 ✭✭✭cdebru


    Stevek101 wrote: »
    After a year of negotiation something has to give.
    well it shouldn't be the law, which is quite clear, agreement of both parties is needed to change a contract. If you want to toss aside contract law that is fine but it would have much bigger implications than this dispute.


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    #26
    cdebru
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,761 ✭✭✭cdebru


    rx8 wrote: »
    The links are not working, atm , but you are right. ....utter contempt is what management have for the staff.
    The f**king cheek of them.

    they have been sitting on them for months and then throw them up on the website with out a by or leave to their staff as to how it will affect them.

    Shows what you are dealing with.


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    #27
    starlit
    Registered Users Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭starlit


    cdebru wrote: »
    Dublin bus only

    That's ok thanks.


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    #28
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    Is this going ahead for definite
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




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    #29
    rx8
    Registered Users Posts: 1,826 ✭✭✭rx8


    SIPTU are busy organising picket rosters, as of this evening.


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    #30
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 34,102 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    cdebru wrote: »
    well it shouldn't be the law, which is quite clear, agreement of both parties is needed to change a contract.

    Try telling that to all the civil and public servants who had legislation brought in to unilaterally change their contracts.

    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



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    #31
    Infini
    Registered Users Posts: 4,573 ✭✭✭Infini


    ninja900 wrote: »
    Try telling that to all the civil and public servants who had legislation brought in to unilaterally change their contracts.

    They shouldve all walked out on strike tbh. As it stands though this is all down to bad management appointed by the same lads running the government for the last few years they want to make changes that only benefits themselves and only themselves.

    One thing to watch is if Irish Rail join in now as well because management over there are trying the same thing there too, Unions over there are already voting on their own agreement and its a general consensus with the employees that theyve had enough. Theyre just taking the companies one at a time because all those managment and the goverment would be scared $hitless if all 3 companies went on strike at once triggering a perfect $hitstorm for them.

    They got BE in a new agreement but its not impossible if IR and DB went on strike that they could be called out too and thats the thing to watch for.


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