Radio Forum.

kneemos · 13-07-2014 11:06am #1

Seeing as it's feedback I'd like to give it on the Radio Forum.
The amount of spite,vitriol and hatred directed towards people is just depressing,even AH I'm pretty sure wouldn't tolerate some of what goes on.
I stopped following the Newstalk Thread because every single post without fail was either negative or spiteful,people have opinions of course but what's the point if all of them are negative.
There was some particularly vitriolic comments on the Marian Finnucane thread last night which just seemed to be vindictive for thevsake of it.I'm not really given to reporting posts so It didn't occur to me,but it appears to be the norm anyway.

I'm only familiar with the Newstalk and less so the Marian threads so can't comment on others,but judgeing from those I really don't see the point of them other than to provide an outlet for negativity,begrudgery and spite.

wnolan1992 · 13-07-2014 11:47am

The obvious answer here is to report the posts and let mods deal with them.

I do agree though, some of the stuff recently is really starting to cross a line. The Ray D'Arcy thread is plagued with it. I mean don't get me wrong here, if you don't like a show or presenter, fair enough, express your opinion (the old "Ah shur why don't you just turn off?" argument has always irked me), but do it in a way that isn't akin to a bloody YouTube comment.

And as well as the "Just turn off" brigade, there's the cohort that immediately say crap like "Oh hello [presenter name]!" whenever a new poster arrives in a thread which praises a show. I got it myself a few times when I first started posting in the Ray Foley thread back in the day, and it really is off putting. Admittedly, there seems to have been a bit of a clamp down on this from what I can see, so for that I think the mods deserve credit.

Calhoun · 14-07-2014 2:06am

How well do you think you are having an impact on this Rope? Don't take this the wrong way but is it a positive or negative influence because yes you are all over it but are you stepping on toes?

Can't say i would be to happy if i was putting my free time into something and the CMOD was building his "set image" of the forum and letting the world know of it. Apologies if this comes across as blunt but my understanding is the mods are supposed to be a representation of the forum posters themselves and yet the only person talking about radio at any point lately has been you. I maybe wrong here and have taken you up wrong but i do wonder when the Cmod does allot more talking than the mods themselves.

If you really want to get all of this back on track and get a consensus for change why not have a large feedback engagement session like they have with soccer. Clearly outline with the community what is and is not expected from them, one thing i would be pushing is the report a post as i dont see how anything can change if people are not really given to reporting. If you keep addressing stuff in here when people are not reporting it sets a negative trend, why bother reporting when you can create a feedback thread and get on the batphone to a cmod who is getting stuff done.

Also there has to be a better definition than below:

Physical Adjectives like "fat" "oily" "greasy" or whatever will result in action. However, we generally won't action opinions on style like calling someone "boring" "smug" or "pompous", but we reserve to right to action these where deemed appropriate.
Nouns like "git", "asshole", "bore" will result in action as will vulgar language (or substitute words such as "cnut" or "pr1ck" used to get around the boards.ie vulgarity filters). So, it's ok to call someone boring, but not to call them a bore - yes it may be a crap system, but it's the system.
None of the mods are strongly pro- or anti- these shows or their presenters. We like a bitching session as much as the next man. However, this is not pub banter, comments are available for everyone to see, for the foreseeable future.

Calhoun · 14-07-2014 12:41pm

Can you not open a dialogue with the community while reworking all of this? My concern here is it seems like there is one person pulling all the strings and reworking the forum in their image.

If you do engage with the community then you wont actually have to have a feedback thread because folk will know your working on things.

Don't get me wrong i don't take it to heart at all, i am just questioning as you have allot to say about a forum you arent a direct mod and you say yourself you have a harsher view point. I just wonder what the forum will look like when you have done your job.

Nody · 14-07-2014 1:37pm

RopeDrink wrote: »

Mention of my 'vision' is a reference to the fact that an Arts CMod simply wants to help Radio get changed. It does not mean I am some overseer or overlord who is utmost responsible for it, or what it may become. For all I know it may not change at all as it is not up to me - But I aim to keep barking until it does, for the better, somehow. The Mod team is the core on any Forum - We're not even supposed to act on reported posts as a CMod, let alone pull the rug out from the Mods and dictate to them how to do their job or what they should do with their forum, so have no fear of it being string pulled by some vocal, dastardly CMod :pac:

What really goes on in the Arts Radio Mod forum though:

Give them time to drop by and post here (when RL and/or week day work or whatever they get up to in life is done for the day). The core changes are up to them more than me - And I can tell you we do discuss it all quite frequently - But until they can cement their own plan, it will be a bit of same old same old for a bit. Just know it's being looked into - That is all I really came here to say.

I'll chip in since it was asked for; I'd normally read but not comment on a thread like this until there's an agreement by the (active) mods on the direction to take it (if any) because of the risk of it being taken as "The Vision" or similar of the forum.

Purely from a PERSONAL mod perspective I think there's work to be done on the charter (a few ideas have already been kicked around how to streamline it), the tone in some threads (from slagging of every caller, their accent, their language, their intelligence to how every presenter is only talked about to point out their latest flaws and stupid action they did) and a rather hostile attitude in general (not helped by some low post users who appear to either be trolls and/or shills but in some cases turned out to be regulars sock pupping to rage against...) and lets not even talk about the moment Travellers get mentioned...

Having said that; I'm not here to Mod what I think things should be but what's in the charter and general agreed Mod level/tone. Due to this I'm restraining on commenting further and simply ask for a wee bit of patience (as in before end of this week) to get something out there

Calhoun · 14-07-2014 2:07pm

RopeDrink wrote: »

Mention of my 'vision' is a reference to the fact that an Arts CMod simply wants to help Radio get changed. It does not mean I am some overseer or overlord who is utmost responsible for it, or what it may become. For all I know it may not change at all as it is not up to me - But I aim to keep barking until it does, for the better, somehow. The Mod team is the core on any Forum - We're not even supposed to act on reported posts as a CMod, let alone pull the rug out from the Mods and dictate to them how to do their job or what they should do with their forum, so have no fear of it being string pulled by some vocal, dastardly CMod :pac:

Technically I've already done it :cool:

Give them time to drop by and post here (when RL and/or week day work or whatever they get up to in life is done for the day). The core changes are up to them more than me - And I can tell you we do discuss it all quite frequently - But until they can cement their own plan, it will be a bit of same old same old for a bit. Just know it's being looked into - That is all I really came here to say.

Thanks Rope for taking time to answer me, don't get me wrong i dont really think that you are a global mastermind bent on world domination with one forum at a time. I was just sounding out and trying to digest what you were saying.

foxtrot101 · 15-07-2014 2:06am

The radio forum has always been thus. I not talking about abusive posts here, I mean there has always been a hell of alot more negative posts than positive ones - but no more than say the general TV forum or the Celebrity & Showbiz forum. In fact I always found the radio forum to be much more strictly moderated than those other two. That's not an criticism, it's just an observation.

I'm sorry RopeDrink, but statements like the radio forum "needing a good slap" or "somewhere I want to strangle" are just ridiculously OTT. It's really not that bad and certainly no worse than other forums on here.

foxtrot101 · 15-07-2014 5:12am

Well, obviously I can't see the reported posts, but generally speaking is the style of, tone of or type of posts in the radio forum really that different from those in the TV forum? I don't think so. Could it be that you're getting more reported posts form the radio forum mainly because it's busier then most of the other Arts ones?

kneemos · 15-07-2014 9:03am

foxtrot101 wrote: »

Well, obviously I can't see the reported posts, but generally speaking is the style of, tone of or type of posts in the radio forum really that different from those in the TV forum? I don't think so. Could it be that you're getting more reported posts form the radio forum mainly because it's busier then most of the other Arts ones?

Very different from what I've seen of it.The Vin B thread tends to be a bit critical for the sake of it,but it's mostly giving opinions on shows and adding praise or constructive criticism.
You could literally stick a pin in The Radio Forum all day long and come up with nothing but nitpicking,negativity and personal comments about guests and presenters.It's almost impressive in it's purity.

Harry Palmr · 15-07-2014 9:55am

People have a much more person relationship with radio than they do TV. So the rabble get very angry indeed (or they really really love someone). Not excusing abuse but that's the emotions expressed tend to be stronger.

foxtrot101 · 15-07-2014 2:16pm

I was thinking of the Late Late Show thread in particular, but homegrown shows do tend to get it in the neck in TV forum. Callans Kicks being a current example.

The radio forum charter has always outlawed personal comments about radio presenters, and rightly so, but negativity and nitpicking hasn't been. Nor should they be really.

kneemos · 15-07-2014 9:55pm

Nody wrote: »

What really goes on in the Arts Radio Mod forum though:

I'll chip in since it was asked for; I'd normally read but not comment on a thread like this until there's an agreement by the (active) mods on the direction to take it (if any) because of the risk of it being taken as "The Vision" or similar of the forum.

Purely from a PERSONAL mod perspective I think there's work to be done on the charter (a few ideas have already been kicked around how to streamline it), the tone in some threads (from slagging of every caller, their accent, their language, their intelligence to how every presenter is only talked about to point out their latest flaws and stupid action they did) and a rather hostile attitude in general (not helped by some low post users who appear to either be trolls and/or shills but in some cases turned out to be regulars sock pupping to rage against...) and lets not even talk about the moment Travellers get mentioned...

Having said that; I'm not here to Mod what I think things should be but what's in the charter and general agreed Mod level/tone. Due to this I'm restraining on commenting further and simply ask for a wee bit of patience (as in before end of this week) to get something out there

Presumably it won't be a case of changing the charter or laying down the law and handing out a load of bans before anyone has a chance to figure out what the hell is going on?
If people are used to posting in a certain style it's only fair that they are well warned of any changes.
A little dialogue can go a long way.

kneemos · 16-07-2014 5:26am

RopeDrink wrote: »

If that 'posting style' is unacceptable to begin with, then no, there would be no 'time given to adapt' because it shouldn't be happening, anyway.

If that posting style was already within the charter then there would be nothing to worry about - Because it's not like we're going to add 50 new harsh rules that demand people step in line - But I would encourage a trimmer charter that remains to the point and helps stamp out the level of abuse that goes on in there.

As for nitpicking - There is a fine line between critique and insult. The whole desire behind (what I jokingly refer to as) "The Radio Crusade" is to cut out the abuse, full-stop.

If people can pick their nits in a manner that encourages discussion and debate in a decent manner, or even critique the presenters in a wholesome manner, that is all great and should be allowed - Yet a lot of people's concept of 'nitpicking' or 'critique' is to flat out insult presenters, or post rib-digging comments about people who appear on the station during segments, masking it as 'opinion'.

Shouldn't be tolerated, much like it is not tolerated anywhere else. Abuse is abuse.

The regimental nature of Boards is a thing I don't like about it.Most of the Forums are club like in nature and entirely capable of change given encouragement,there's no need to be beaten over the head and have Ryanair style Customer Relations.

kneemos · 16-07-2014 5:27am

RopeDrink wrote: »

If that 'posting style' is unacceptable to begin with, then no, there would be no 'time given to adapt' because it shouldn't be happening, anyway.

If that posting style was already within the charter then there would be nothing to worry about - Because it's not like we're going to add 50 new harsh rules that demand people step in line - But I would encourage a trimmer charter that remains to the point and helps stamp out the level of abuse that goes on in there.

As for nitpicking - There is a fine line between critique and insult. The whole desire behind (what I jokingly refer to as) "The Radio Crusade" is to cut out the abuse, full-stop.

If people can pick their nits in a manner that encourages discussion and debate in a decent manner, or even critique the presenters in a wholesome manner, that is all great and should be allowed - Yet a lot of people's concept of 'nitpicking' or 'critique' is to flat out insult presenters, or post rib-digging comments about people who appear on the station during segments, masking it as 'opinion'.

Shouldn't be tolerated, much like it is not tolerated anywhere else. Abuse is abuse.

The regimental nature of Boards is a thing I don't like about it.Most of the Forums are club like in nature and entirely capable of change given encouragement,there's no need to be beaten over the head and have Ryanair style Customer Relations.

Aidric · 16-07-2014 8:09am

The radio forum has been in terminal decline since tbh left moderating duties.

Everyone can accept that moderators have busy periods in their private lives. However, it isn't a recent decline in standards on the radio forum, this has been going on for well over a year. If the moderators are busy with private matters for a year or more why are they still moderating one of the most active forums on boards?

Personal abuse has been mentioned already on the thread and it is the main problem. Persistent trolling is another. We had the vitriolic and continuous abuse of Ryan Tubridy on the Tubridy thread, chiefly from one contributor. Then there was the laughable situation of a number of troll accounts operating on the Marty Whelan thread. In both instances there was minimal moderator involvement or none at all.

I have reported instances of personal abuse against presenters where I've seen it, two particular vitriolic posts in the last couple of months, neither of which had any action taken on them. Before anyone accuse me of plowing my own furrow here I have consulted some other regular radio forum contributors to get their feedback on the situation. They all report similar stories of reporting abusive posts and no action being taken.

The next logical step was to impart my views to the cmod of the radio forum. I done this recently, only to be met by a curt one line response to the points I raised. Again this is an experience shared by other users.
This leads me to believe that: A. There is an attitudinal problem pervasive within the radio moderating group. B. Nothing much is going to change.

A real shame for what was once one of the great forums on Boards.

bbability · 15-10-2014 9:32pm

I'm insulted by your comments Adric. Who do you think you are? This isn't a paid subscription service. I'm a volunteer like everyone else. I do what I can. I can't read every single post on the forum. And just for for your information around three years ago I was left alone to deal with an awful lot of messing. As soon as I put the hammer down I was not backed up. I threw the toys out of the pram and then things started to change spoon afterwards.
If your so well up on matters why don't you apply to be a mod yourself?
I don't agree with the recent heavy handed tactics but there was no choice in the matter as is was becoming very obvious that previous banned users from the forum were re registering and following old traits. In order to narrow these down the tools we use are only as good as they can be. Our eyes , ears and gut feelings are one but the main way to manage the forum correctly is when users of the forum REPORT POSTS. Users of the forum have to trust the mods to make the call. Sometimes action is taken and sometimes not. But the main thing is all reported posts are looked at and have always been looked at by me.
By the way I was trained by the best in my opinion and I would have loved a bit more time under his wing but TBH had other things going on.

Zaph · 15-10-2014 11:39pm

Given that the last post on this thread was 3 months ago, I'm going to close this thread as the issues raised may or may not be current. If someone feels the need to start a new up to date thread, please feel free to do so.

Radio Forum.

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