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Unix - Is it dying out?

  • 16-03-2015 9:50am
    #1
    L.Jenkins
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,241 Mod ✭✭✭✭


    I know it isn't but I thought I'd ask for the lulz. I worked for IBM who still cling on to AIX and now I work for another, who continue to use their own home rolled version of Unix. Not that I have or had an issue with either. I've found that in both cases, they've moved to RHEL for most of their internal Applications and Enterprise on RHEL is a given. Even Oracle continue to support Solaris.

    Does anyone here believe that Unix is a dying bread or still has a purpose outside of the Organisations that still use it? Unix is great and all, but I'd rather use RHEL or CentOS for work purposes and Fedora or Mint for home use.


Comments

  • #2
    Skrynesaver
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,109 ✭✭✭Skrynesaver


    I've worked on enterprise deployments for the last 10 years or so...

    Up until the Oracle takeover Solaris was very common in Northern Europe and the US, everyone else has used RHEL or CentOs for enterprise production platforms for a decade or more.

    In the last few years, since the Oracle take over, I've seen a strong move towards RHEL even in those sections of the Telecoms and enterprise markets that would have been quite scathing of "hobby platforms" previously, whether this is a recognition of the quality improvements in Linux or a fear of Larry I cannot say.


  • #3
    jimgoose
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,180 ✭✭✭✭jimgoose


    Solaris is very much still used in the telecomms industry, and AIX is popular in finance/insurance/banking. How much of this is due to inertia/if-it-ain't-broke is harder to say, but AIX is very much under active development.


  • #4
    Tom Dunne
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,212 ✭✭✭✭Tom Dunne


    Hang on - Linux is a flavour of Unix in my book.

    So no, Unix is not dying out. Especially, as others have said, in more established industries.


  • #5
    liamo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,193 ✭✭✭liamo


    The BSDs are still going strong:

    OpenBSD v 5.6 released 2014-11-01
    NetBSD v 6.1.5 released 2014-09-22
    FreeBSD v 10.1 released 2014-11-14


  • #6
    L.Jenkins
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,241 Mod ✭✭✭✭L.Jenkins


    The idea struck me as I never saw the likes of AIX, Solaris and HP-UX used outside of large organisations. I stand corrected.


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  • #7
    Tom Dunne
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,212 ✭✭✭✭Tom Dunne


    AIX is probably the one flavour of Unix I haven't worked on.

    I think the perception that Unix is dying out is back to a topic that came up in a different thread - back in the day, a company supplied their own hardware and software solution, with their own flavour of Unix. I remember working in one of the big US tech companies on a kind of image processing (defect analysis). For the data gathering (taking the image), we had one flavour of Unix (HP-UX, I think) with the hardware, for image analysis, we had a Silicon Graphics machine with it's version of Unix (can't remember), for general work, we used custom apps on Solaris across the network on an x-terminal (anyone remember them?) and so on.

    Now that x86 hardware has become so cheap, RHEL has emerged as the cheaper/most consistent/easier/call-it-what-you-will way to utulise an enterprise class OS.

    OT: This is probably not the thread to mention my VAX/VMS days. Fond memories. Now there's an OS that is dying out. :pac:


  • #8
    Kinet1c
    Closed Accounts Posts: 824 ✭✭✭Kinet1c


    Tom Dunne wrote: »
    OT: This is probably not the thread to mention my VAX/VMS days. Fond memories. Now there's an OS that is dying out. :pac:

    You'll have to speak up, I can't hear you over the sound of your creeking Zimmer frame.


  • #9
    L.Jenkins
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,241 Mod ✭✭✭✭L.Jenkins


    Kinet1c wrote: »
    You'll have to speak up, I can't hear you over the sound of your creeking Zimmer frame.

    I'm just waiting for someone to mention how they used punch cards back in the day.


  • #10
    bonzodog2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,251 ✭✭✭bonzodog2


    Itzy wrote: »
    I'm just waiting for someone to mention how they used punch cards back in the day.

    Back in 1974-1979 or so, guess what? Also paper tape.

    edit: It wasn't UNIX though.


  • #11
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,031 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    Was using paper tape back in '79, '80 ..... and a teletype machine .... had forgotten about that :D


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  • #12
    L.Jenkins
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,241 Mod ✭✭✭✭L.Jenkins


    Johnboy1951 wrote: »
    Was using paper tape back in '79, '80 ..... and a teletype machine .... had forgotten about that :D

    Ah here! You'd need WD40 for those hips if you were any older :P


  • #13
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,031 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    Itzy wrote: »
    Ah here! You'd need WD40 for those hips if you were any older :P

    They didn't have WD40 back in the day :D:D .... and too late now ;)


  • #14
    thiagoborn
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭thiagoborn


    I think Unix is losing space. I work with Unix and Linux on a federal institution in Brazil, in this past 5 years RHEL gained some respect. Nowadays the x86 evolution, virtual machines easy to manage, and low cost are really heavy in time decision.
    In my opinion is frustrating sometimes, because Solaris is a incredible OS, but RHEL has excellent features, and I can use at home without problem. The x86 version of Solaris is terrible.
    The Oracle Support Team are very professional.
    The "customer Portal" from RedHat is awesome.

    The Mainframes still running zOS is tough and very expensive ;)

    17 years playing with this things


  • #15
    ArseBurger
    Registered Users Posts: 647 ✭✭✭ArseBurger


    thiagoborn wrote: »
    I think Unix is losing space. I work with Unix and Linux on a federal institution in Brazil

    So, what's your definition of UNIX? Similarly, Linux?

    Or are we really talking about GNU tools and distributions? Rather than operating systems and kernels.

    I find that a basic grasp of the fundamentals is lacking more and more with the entry of less Engineering focused qualified people into the Engineering/Internet space.

    Engineering != Comp Sci


  • #16
    thiagoborn
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭thiagoborn


    ArseBurger wrote: »
    So, what's your definition of UNIX? Similarly, Linux?

    Or are we really talking about GNU tools and distributions? Rather than operating systems and kernels.


    I think got your point. I mixed up two points of view, so It could be misunderstood. Talk about economic motivation and technology is complicated.
    Gnu/Linux kernel is open source and it's origin is Minix. Today the differences are massive, but We should respect the history.
    At my work RHEL delivery the service quite well. And It's cheaper than Solaris.

    BSD kernel in my experience with Solaris ( just a brand of BSD), has some kernel features to support dynamic tracing, ZFS, etc. The Solaris kernel must support those things.

    But the questions is "Unix is dying?".
    It's just my opinion.
    Unix depends on money.
    They are losing space in market. So less money less research less improvement. But maybe Oracle has the best hardware Engineers and best computer scientists in the world and they will work forever to keep things running. ;) I really like Solaris.

    "Engineering != Comp Sci"
    What do you understand about engineering and Computer Science?
    Why you are so incisive about that?

    Sorry if I was not completely clear. I am not a native speaker.


  • #17
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 92,489 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Tom Dunne wrote: »
    Hang on - Linux is a flavour of Unix in my book.

    So no, Unix is not dying out. Especially, as others have said, in more established industries.
    If you want to be pedantic,

    Apple have shipped 800 million iOS devices. BSD based etc.

    And that's dwarfed by Android 260 million smartphones shipped in the first three months of this year.

    Factor in tablets , TV dongles , NAS ,receivers and Set Top Boxes, smart TV's and then include websites.

    The only question is at what point half of the worlds population use a GUI running on a Unix like OS as their main tech interface. And it may already have happened.


  • #18
    Xterminator
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,758 ✭✭✭Xterminator


    im actually booked on a solaris admin course in a couple of weeks!

    all new systems have been going to SUSE in my place though.


  • #19
    thiagoborn
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭thiagoborn


    Xterminator wrote: »
    all new systems have been going to SUSE in my place though.

    Solaris is awesome running on Sparc machines ;) .


  • #20
    L.Jenkins
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,241 Mod ✭✭✭✭L.Jenkins


    Would love to get my hands on an old machine to run HP-UX. It's a pain in the hole, as I've come from Linux initially, but I do like it.


  • #21
    opus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,027 ✭✭✭opus


    Xterminator wrote: »
    im actually booked on a solaris admin course in a couple of weeks!

    all new systems have been going to SUSE in my place though.

    Found my solaris admin pin from many moons ago during a house move recently :)

    Centos is the favoured variant where I work although some are using RedHat as their s/w vendors refuse to support them on Centos.
    thiagoborn wrote: »
    Solaris is awesome running on Sparc machines ;) .

    Still have a few ancient boxes around but they're on the way out tbh. Will be sorry to see them go :(


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  • #22
    L.Jenkins
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,241 Mod ✭✭✭✭L.Jenkins


    opus wrote: »
    ...Centos is the favoured variant where I work although some are using RedHat as their s/w vendors refuse to support them on Centos...

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but CentOS mirrors RHEL with respect to updates and patches, with brief interlude updates for both as CentOS has to wait for Red Hat releases. So I don't see why vendors won't support the OS.


  • #23
    Tom Dunne
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,212 ✭✭✭✭Tom Dunne


    Itzy wrote: »
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but CentOS mirrors RHEL with respect to updates and patches, with brief interlude updates for both as CentOS has to wait for Red Hat releases. So I don't see why vendors won't support the OS.

    Correct. And I assume they won't support it simply because it isn't RHEL.


  • #24
    excollier
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,576 ✭✭✭excollier


    Shows how bright they are(n't)


  • #25
    Tom Dunne
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,212 ✭✭✭✭Tom Dunne


    excollier wrote: »
    Shows how bright they are(n't)

    No, it shows they have clearly defined specifications and documented support procedures, the deviation from which is outside of scope.

    Standard practice in corporate IT Support, especially for mission-critical systems.


  • #26
    opus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,027 ✭✭✭opus


    Tom Dunne wrote: »
    No, it shows they have clearly defined specifications and documented support procedures, the deviation from which is outside of scope.

    Standard practice in corporate IT Support, especially for mission-critical systems.

    Yup exactly that. To be fair, the cost of a RHEL client license is negligible compared to the cost of the s/w (chip design).


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