The End of CIE Thread

With the proposed removal of Dr Lynch (if it happens) now being touted, I think this is a good time to begin a debate on the pros and cons of CIE. It's legacy and how it will be remembered.

As you know, I consider CIE to be a disaster in terms of public transport provision on this island mainly due to one fact: CIE was never founded as a public transport company and never run that way. It was simply an employment agency for political hasbeens and to pay union people to drive buses and trains.

Anything else which came out from that in terms of real public transport was completely accidental and was implemented by public pressure, an/or social and demographic changes which CIE companies were ALWAYS unwillingly forced to adapt to.

As my own interest is with railways I would like to lay down a clear example which proves in my opinion that CIE relationship with railways was always to close the passenger network down while doing so in such a way there would be minimum political backlash.

As an example of this, by end of the 1950's with the final amalgamation of the Great Northern Railway into CIE - the Irish Republic for the first time had a fully unified complete and comprehensive rail network which could finally be operated and streamlined into a fine-tuned transport machine.

Naturally many branches had to be closed and this was understandable. But what was to be left was open to being fine-tuned with minimal infrastructure investment to provide a pontentially superb national rail network. All the CIE management and unions had to do was to arrange the final pieces of the jigsaw in front of them.

What Happened:

Junctions which were facing the wrong way (due to the nature of the independent rail companies that built them) in terms of travel potential were either never reverse, or in the case of Ballybrophy were flipped away from the direction of most passenger travel creating pointless changes and reversals. (still going on: Athenry and Docklands)

Trains were timetabled not to connect with ferries arriving their their own CIE ports in order to discourage train/ship passenger connectivity.

The Harcourt Street line was closed at a time when the population along it was being massively incresed.

Suburban stations all around Dublin such as Maynooth were closed when they should of had increases in service

The entire West Cork system was closed when a single line to could of been saved as a busy suburban service terminating at Albert Quay

and I could go on - but more depressing the short list above from 1960 on is still going on.

CIE had also have previously downgraded and fully closed the Dublin Tram System completely which was considered one of the best in the world when CIE took it over. The Howth Branch should of remained and the howth rail ine closed. The reverse happened.

On the plus side, I do have to give CIE some credit for their rail freight work over the years. They generally kept up with demand and at times even seemed like they were looking for business. Especially in the 1960's as the road system began improving. However, they showed their mentality when Rosslare Port was undergowing massive expansion in the late 80's early 90's when they refused to provide rail freight facilities at the location which would of allowed them to expand their railfreight business into the European Union via container transfer. Yet they openly refused to do this and there was also the unions who demanded no jobs be lost at Dublin Port also contributed to this.

It is also worth pointing out that the biggest promoter of rail freight in Ireland and who have done the most feed it and keep it alive was the Dublin Port Authority. That statement alone is pretty damning of CIE.

I would like to hear anymore pros and cons on the history of the CIE organisation in terms of the tenure and how it should be remembered and what we can learn from the experience moving forward. We are standing on the cusp of history here.