The Griffin Surname

BarraOG · 07-07-2014 1:31pm #1

My family hail from Clare and we use "Ó Gríofa" in Irish. I know that this spelling is also used in Connemara. The surname Griffey, also very common in Clare, is also an anglicisation of "Ó Gríofa". So Griffins and Griffeys have the same common ancestor in Clare. "Ó Gríobhtha" is the old Irish spelling of Ó Gríofa.

I've also seen the surname "Ó Grifín", do they hail from Kerry?'

Looking at this map, Griffin is very common in such places as Dingle, Clare and the Aran Islands:

celticfamilymaps.com/?link=Griffin&q=node/2

Arthur Griffith used Ó Gríobhtha since it was the closest name to the non Irish name Griffith. And when Ó Gríobhtha was changed to Ó Gríofa, he became referred to as Art Ó Gríofa in Irish.

As well as Ó Gríofa and Ó Grifín, are there any other Irish language surnames in use today with the anglicisation Griffin?

Poll Dubh · 08-07-2014 12:17pm

The Irish Times has Ó Gríobhtháin as well.

dubhthach · 08-07-2014 1:54pm

Here's what Woulfe had in his 1923 book:

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Ó GRÍOBHTHA—I—O Greefa, O Griffy, O Grighie, Griffey, Griffy, Greehy, (Griffith, Griffiths, Griffin); 'descendant of Gríobhtha' (griffin-like, fierce warrior); the name of a Dalcassian family who were chiefs of Cinel Cuallachta, in the south-east of the barony of Inchiquin, and had their castle at Ballygriffy; common in Thomond, but usually anglicised Griffin.

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Ó GRÍOBHTHÁIN—I—O Greffane, O Grevan, Griffin, Greaven, Greven, (Griffith, Griffiths, Greaves, Grieves); 'descendant of Gríobhthán' (diminutive of Gríobhtha); a Connacht surname, found chiefly in Galway and Mayo.

Ó GRIABHÁIN, see Ó Gríobhtháin.

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Ó GRIALLUIS, Grealish, (Greally, Grealy, Greely, Griffin); a corruption, in the spoken language of Galway and Mayo, of Mag Niallghuis, which see.

Mag NIALLGHUIS, Mag NIALLGHUSA; variant of Mac Niallghuis, Mac Niallghusa. See Mag Riallghuis, Mag Riallghusa.

Mac NIALLGHUIS, Mac NIALLGHUSA—IV—M'Nellus, MacNelis, MacEneilis, MacEnealis, MacNeilage, Manelis, Nealis, Nelis; 'son of Niallghus' (champion-choice); the name of a West Ulster family, some of whom have settled in Mayo.

Mag RAILLGHUIS, Mag RIALLGHUSA—IV—Magriellassy, M'Grealis, MacGrillish, Grealish, (Greely, Grealy, Greally, Griffin); corrupt for Mac Niallghuis, Mac Niallghusa, which see; not uncommon in parts of Connacht.
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Ó GRÍBHTHÍN, Ó GRÍFÍN—II—O Griffine, Guffin; 'descendant of Gríbhthín' or 'Grifin'; a Munster surname; perhaps a variant of Ó Gríobhtha, which see.

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Mac GRÍFÍN—V—M'Griffine, MacGriffin; 'son of Griffin' (a personal name of Welsh origin, the same as the Latin Rufinus).

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dubhthach · 08-07-2014 1:56pm

-bhth- --> f is also a feature in for example:
Ó Dubhthaigh (Duffy), thence the newfangled Ó Dufaigh spelling (which I'd never use!)

BarraOG · 08-07-2014 6:19pm

Poll Dubh wrote: »

The Irish Times has Ó Gríobhtháin as well.

Ó Gríobhtháin - > Ó Gríofáin

"Ó Gríofáin" is in use according to Google.

AnLonDubh · 09-07-2014 9:00am

dubhthach wrote: »

-bhth- --> f is also a feature in for example:
Ó Dubhthaigh (Duffy), thence the newfangled Ó Dufaigh spelling (which I'd never use!)

Th (even if written f, such as in the future) next to any consonant devoices it:

Scuabfaidh sé => Scuapaidh sé
Ní chreidfidh sé => Ní chreitidh sé

Phrases or words like:

A thréad = His flock.
Bóithrín = Little road.
Cuirfidh sé = He will put

are mispronounced by virtually all learners, as the r is actually devoiced.

dubhthach · 09-07-2014 11:44am

Indeed I'm reminded of:

Uathbhás -> Uafás

Combination of Uath and Bás is quite elegant if we thinking in just etymological terms. (uath is the root for fuath)

1 úath
Meaning: Fear, horror, terror ; a horrible or terrible thing, horrible creature, spectre, phantom:; terrible, horrible:;
DIL 2012 U 40.74

1 úath I Fear, horror, terror ; a horrible or terrible thing, horrible creature, spectre, phantom: úath .i. omhan, no eagla, O´Cl. banadh gnuisi .i. uath, ar is ban gnuis in duine in tan doberar uat[h] no uamun uimi. uad-side for fid in ogaim ar aentaid anma aturu fen .i. uath cechtar de, Auraic. 5628 -30 (see 3 úath ). audacht .i. ūath fri feacht .i. antan tēte in duine fri fecht n-ūatha .i. bāis, Corm. Y 38 . measam ūath i[m]gabāil, Arch. iii 230.156 . Corm. Y 1242 . tarathar quasi dair-uath-air .i. fuath na darach bīs fair .i. ar a sice-si ém, (uath na darach `horror quercus,´ Zeuss 260 ). ūath for ascaib niad `ein Schrecken für ...´ (of a hero), Aelt. Ir. Dicht. ii 22 § 2 (BB, LL). dóig ní ḟaccéga in mac bec sain uath na húamain ga bhar slaidi-si, TBC 5581 . nā tuinithe aidc[h]e ūath | i lleircc eter lectaibh cūan `do not wait for the terror of night,´ Fianaig. 12 § 23 . brissid úath n-adarccna, LU 8354 (FB 24 ). imsoi cusna húathaib LU 8880. úatha aidcill Urmuman ´horrible creatures´ Mifologiya prostranstva drevney Irlandii 125.29 . asnidet-side ... inna delmann ticfet in mbith la uath mbratha, Ériu ii 128 § 95 . co ngliaid bireóil úatha (v.l. fuatha) `with strife of dreadful lance,´ Met. Dinds. iii 216.14 . In chevilles: ba hord úatha `a path of terror,´ 406.25. d´ḟuatuch Étáine co n-úath `in dreadful wise,´ 350.27. cf. inund aisti ar uáth dúinn, TBC 4172 . mór n-uath adnaigethar, IT i 68.8 (L. mac n-U.). dp. .i. fil co nanbthib ┐ co nuathaib, Thes. ii 352.44 . As npr.m.: Úath na sealg (name of a fian- warrior), Duan. F. i 76.34 . II As an adj. terrible, horrible: uáth .i. uathmhar, O´Cl. edhadh .i. ed uath `horrible grief,´ Auraic. 1195 . dp. co nainbthib hūathaib with awful storms , Thes. ii 352.6 (see supra). See 2 fúath .

The iceland population of Dubhthach is interesting as the name was borrowed into Old-Norse before "th" lost it's original value in Irish.

deirdremf · 27-09-2014 12:19pm

dubhthach wrote: »

The iceland population of Dubhthach is interesting as the name was borrowed into Old-Norse before "th" lost it's original value in Irish.

Cé mar a deireann siad é?

dubhthach · 27-09-2014 2:14pm

Dufþakur

http://www.forvo.com/word/duf%C3%BEakur/

Gortaleen · 17-11-2021 1:34pm

Now that we know, due to Y DNA testing, that County Kerry Griffins are relative "newcomers" to Ireland from the Scottish Highlands, the Griffins in County Kerry do not have a historical gaelicized form of their surname. The oldest records of that can be associated to these "newcomers" are the late 16th century Clan Carthy Survey and early 17th century Tudor fiant number 6555 where the name is recorded as either Griffin, OGriffin, Griffen, or Grifen. The gaelicized forms of Ó Gríbhthín / Ó Grífín etc., appear to have been retconned during the 19th century Gaelic Revival and they do not reflect the actual pronunciation of the name in County Kerry.

A better gaelicized surname for County Kerry Griffins would be something like: Ó Gribhein. That form includes both Irish and Scottish characteristics and, most importantly, reflects the actual pronunciation of the name in County Kerry since the 16th century.

BarraOG · 22-11-2021 10:04am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118180270#Comment_118180270

Yes the Kerry Griffins were Gallowglasses who fought in the Desmond uprisings. DNA testing associates the Co. Clare Griffins, Ó Gríofa, with the Dalcassians. The surname Griffey is another anglicisation still found in Clare, but my ancestors were Griffy before they were Griffin. There are a number of other Griffin clusters in the West of Ireland as shown here on my maps:

https://www.barrygriffin.com/surname-maps/irish/Griffin/

There is a big cluster in Connemara and they also use the spelling Ó Gríofa. I'm not sure if they are also Dalcassian but I don't think so. Griffy was common on the Aran Islands in the 1821 census:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/search/results.jsp?census_year=1821&surname=Griffy&exact=&firstname=&county19011911=&county1821=Galway&pageSize=100&search=Search

Would be interesting to know the history of this family.

Also a big cluster on the Galway/Mayo/Roscommon border.

The Griffin Surname

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