Speeding notice after over month, plate picture illegible

redlik · 06-01-2014 4:04pm #1

HI
I've received a notice of speeding from 1st Dec (over a month!) and the picture of suppose to be my number plate is just one big black rectangle. Can I get this canceled on the basis of no proof it was actually me?
The spot that I was suppose be caught has no radar sign, just one tiny 50km limit sign beside the road
R.

Jamie2k9 · 06-01-2014 4:30pm

redlik wrote: »

HI
I've received a notice of speeding from 1st Dec (over a month!) and the picture of suppose to be my number plate is just one big black rectangle. Can I get this canceled on the basis of no proof it was actually me?
The spot that I was suppose be caught has no radar sign, just one tiny 50km limit sign beside the road
R.

Over a month would of being because of Christmas break. The Speed sign was there, doesn't matter if it was large or tiny. Clearly you saw it if you can recall the size. You plat number must be shown as how would they of know to send it to you.

No expert but can't see it being cancelled.

Victor · 06-01-2014 4:31pm

We can't give you legal advice.

Were you there? Were you speeding? Would you like a copy of the full photo, including your face? The answers to these questions should help inform your decision.

If this will be a problem for you, talk to a solicitor, preferably one familiar with that court.

redlik · 06-01-2014 4:40pm

Thnx for the all replies
First of all, I'm not sure it I was really there. I'm just checking because I might have been at work and this would make it even more weird than it is now.
The place notice says I was caught is not area I travel usually, it's a street in my town but I wouldn't go there regularly. It's over a month so I cannot recall if I drove there at that time.
It's not my first ticket but this one has just black rectangle instead of plate photo - so was it me?
R.

Zillah · 06-01-2014 4:50pm

redlik wrote: »

Thnx for the all replies
First of all, I'm not sure it I was really there. I'm just checking because I might have been at work and this would make it even more weird than it is now.
The place notice says I was caught is not area I travel usually, it's a street in my town but I wouldn't go there regularly. It's over a month so I cannot recall if I drove there at that time.
It's not my first ticket but this one has just black rectangle instead of plate photo - so was it me?
R.

Why on Earth would it have come to you if if wasn't you?

redlik · 06-01-2014 4:52pm

Zillah wrote: »

Why on Earth would it have come to you if if wasn't you?

I'm asking myself the same question, badly read reg no, fake no. Don't know...

Victor · 06-01-2014 4:52pm

redlik wrote: »

It's not my first ticket but this one has just black rectangle instead of plate photo - so was it me?

Ask for the full photo then.

Fred Swanson · 06-01-2014 8:11pm

This post has been deleted.

Five Lamps · 06-01-2014 10:27pm

redlik wrote: »

HI
I've received a notice of speeding from 1st Dec (over a month!) and the picture of suppose to be my number plate is just one big black rectangle. Can I get this canceled on the basis of no proof it was actually me?
The spot that I was suppose be caught has no radar sign, just one tiny 50km limit sign beside the road
R.

How fast were your going?

Other than the plate, does it look like you in your car? Y/N

If Y, save yourself the expense in the long run and pay up.

If it's one black rectangle it seems that it might be deliberately blocked out. Can't see why they would do this. Obviously there is sufficient evidence somewhere to identify your vehicle or you wouldn't have got the letter.

They don't need to put up a sign. Speed checks can take place anywhere by the Gardai.

corktina · 06-01-2014 10:38pm

also if it's in a town, there doesn't have to be a speed limit sign at all

Fred Swanson · 06-01-2014 10:52pm

This post has been deleted.

Victor · 06-01-2014 10:56pm

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

The speed limit stems from the Road Traffic Act and any relevant regulations and bye-laws.

While it is important to have the signs, the absence of a sign is a poor defence.

Fred Swanson · 06-01-2014 11:03pm

This post has been deleted.

Victor · 07-01-2014 12:52am

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2010/en/act/pub/0025/sec0076.html#sec76

Amendment of section 47 of Principal Act — offence of exceeding speed limit.

76.— Section 47 (inserted by section 11 of the Act of 2004) of the Principal Act is amended by inserting after subsection (2) the following:

“(2A) In a prosecution for an offence under this section, it is presumed, until the contrary is shown by the defendant, that the speed limit indicated on a traffic sign is the speed limit that has been applied under this Act to the road when the offence is alleged to have been committed.”.

So, one can give perfectly good evidence that the speed limit is X based on a sign. However, that evidence can be trumped by proving otherwise (Road Traffic Act and any relevant regulations and bye-laws).

It's basically there to stop people stealing or altering signs.

Carawaystick · 07-01-2014 1:41am

Victor wrote: »

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2010/en/act/pub/0025/sec0076.html#sec76

So, one can give perfectly good evidence that the speed limit is X based on a sign. However, that evidence can be trumped by proving otherwise (Road Traffic Act and any relevant regulations and bye-laws).

It's basically there to stop people stealing or altering signs.

Does that not say only the defence can trump a posted sign, not the prosecution?

redlik · 16-01-2014 12:23pm

Hi folks,
I've sent the letter to npo@... explaining my situation, attached the letter from my company stating that I was at work at that time.
3 days later I've got a reply that they want me to send them a picture of my car "with lights included" and a warning that my time (28 days to pay) is ticking.
Why would they want me to send shoot a pic of my car and pass it to them, don't they have it already?
R.

Carawaystick · 16-01-2014 12:27pm

Send them a picture of your car with an invoice for 80 euros.
split the invoice into
Photograph taking
Photograph Printing
P&P

redlik · 16-01-2014 12:30pm

Carawaystick wrote: »

Send them a picture of your car with an invoice for 80 euros.
split the invoice into
Photograph taking
Photograph Printing
P&P

Yeah, they would find it hilarious, sure and I'd become someone's girlfriend in jail.
But thnx for the suggestion

Losty Dublin · 16-01-2014 12:40pm

redlik wrote: »

Hi folks,
I've sent the letter to npo@... explaining my situation, attached the letter from my company stating that I was at work at that time.
3 days later I've got a reply that they want me to send them a picture of my car "with lights included" and a warning that my time (28 days to pay) is ticking.
Why would they want me to send shoot a pic of my car and pass it to them, don't they have it already?
R.

If you were definitely in work at the time then either somebody else was driving your car at the time, somebody has cloned your plates or else their photography/recording system has made an error.

If somebody has cloned your plates or if there there is some clerical error then it's in your interest to send them a photo of your car front and a copy of your log book ASAP as this will be the primary way to prove you right. If somebody else was driving your car then you need to pass on their details ASAP in order to clear yourself.

Either way, (Legal) speed is of the essence here for you.

redlik · 16-01-2014 1:15pm

Losty Dublin wrote: »

If you were definitely in work at the time then either somebody else was driving your car at the time, somebody has cloned your plates or else their photography/recording system has made an error.

If somebody has cloned your plates or if there there is some clerical error then it's in your interest to send them a photo of your car front and a copy of your log book ASAP as this will be the primary way to prove you right. If somebody else was driving your car then you need to pass on their details ASAP in order to clear yourself.

Either way, (Legal) speed is of the essence here for you.

Thnx for the reply, I don't have any logbooks, It's my own private car so other than a letter that I was at work I cannot prove it wasn't me. So, I need to cooperate, I guess, to resolve it...

R.

Losty Dublin · 16-01-2014 1:16pm

redlik wrote: »

Thnx for the reply, I don't have any logbooks, It's my own private car so other than a letter that I was at work I cannot prove it wasn't me. So, I need to cooperate, I guess, to resolve it...

R.

Your logbook is your ownership cert you get after purchase.

You did buy the car, didn't you? :pac:

omega666 · 16-01-2014 1:20pm

Losty Dublin wrote: »

If you were definitely in work at the time then either somebody else was driving your car at the time, somebody has cloned your plates or else their photography/recording system has made an error.

If somebody has cloned your plates or if there there is some clerical error then it's in your interest to send them a photo of your car front and a copy of your log book ASAP as this will be the primary way to prove you right. If somebody else was driving your car then you need to pass on their details ASAP in order to clear yourself.

Either way, (Legal) speed is of the essence here for you.

Well the chances of someone with an identical car using cloned plates
driving around the same town as the OP is fairly slim being realistic!

So either the OP was driving or someone borrowed his car, surely the OP would remember if someone took his car for a drive.

redlik · 16-01-2014 1:33pm

omega666 wrote: »

Well the chances of someone with an identical car using cloned plates
driving around the same town as the OP is fairly slim being realistic!

So either the OP was driving or someone borrowed his car, surely the OP would remember if someone took his car for a drive.

The thing is I can't say if it was same car as mine because the picture on the notice I've received is just a black rectangle, nothing else.

R.

Losty Dublin · 16-01-2014 1:35pm

omega666 wrote: »

Well the chances of someone with an identical car using cloned plates
driving around the same town as the OP is fairly slim being realistic!

True but if it genuinely did happen then any sort fine or Garda reports based on your plates go to you first off. Either way it is in his interest to sort it out ASAP.

Hilly Bill · 16-01-2014 4:56pm

why would they send a pic of a black rectangle and no pic of a car?????

redlik · 16-01-2014 5:28pm

Hilly Bill wrote: »

why would they send a pic of a black rectangle and no pic of a car?????

Not a clue - that makes two of us wondering

R.

BowWow · 16-01-2014 6:05pm

omega666 wrote: »

Well the chances of someone with an identical car using cloned plates driving around the same town as the OP is fairly slim being realistic!

Speaking as a former Fleet Manager, managing over 5,000 vehicles, this is not as unusual as you think.

OP, take the photo and send it in - I suspect you might be ok here.

Did you ask for the full image?

Hilly Bill · 16-01-2014 7:16pm

redlik wrote: »

Not a clue - that makes two of us wondering
R.

Maybe they did and its just a spoiler

.

Five Lamps · 17-01-2014 12:39am

redlik wrote: »

Hi folks,
I've sent the letter to npo@... explaining my situation, attached the letter from my company stating that I was at work at that time.
3 days later I've got a reply that they want me to send them a picture of my car "with lights included" and a warning that my time (28 days to pay) is ticking.
Why would they want me to send shoot a pic of my car and pass it to them, don't they have it already?
R.

Are you sure that this is genuine?

I would have thought that there are 2 options - pay up or go to court and prove otherwise (unless you happen to have access to a someone who sorts these things out).

I can't see why they would go down this avenue at all.

omega666 · 17-01-2014 12:52am

redlik wrote: »

Not a clue - that makes two of us wondering
R.

Hold on. In the pic they sent you is the whole car blacked out or just the number plate?

Hilly Bill · 17-01-2014 1:12am

Have you got tinted windows?

redlik · 17-01-2014 10:10am

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Have you got tinted windows?

Nope, normal see-thru windows

Victor · 18-01-2014 4:48am

They ask for a photo of the vehicle so they can ascertain if it is a genuinely different vehicle. Someone on boards.ie said they had a similar situation. Same registration number, same colour, same make and model, but one had sun roof, spoilers, etc., the other didn't

Hilly Bill wrote: »

why would they send a pic of a black rectangle and no pic of a car?????

I get the impression they normally only send an image of the registration, not the car. You wouldn't want your other half or your boss opening your post (inadvertently) only to see a Garda photo of you arranging their surprise birthday party, would you?

If you doubt that the vehicle is yours, you can then ask for the full photo.

sawdoubters · 18-01-2014 5:43am

is there a photo of you

should be something on the back to appeal it

ask for a calibration certificate for the speed camera

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2002/en/act/pub/0012/sec0021.html

Hilly Bill · 19-01-2014 12:36am

Victor wrote: »

They ask for a photo of the vehicle so they can ascertain if it is a genuinely different vehicle. Someone on boards.ie said they had a similar situation. Same registration number, same colour, same make and model, but one had sun roof, spoilers, etc., the other didn't

I get the impression they normally only send an image of the registration, not the car. You wouldn't want your other half or your boss opening your post (inadvertently) only to see a Garda photo of you arranging their surprise birthday party, would you?

If you doubt that the vehicle is yours, you can then ask for the full photo.

They dont always do that either.

Del2005 · 19-01-2014 1:26pm

sawdoubters wrote: »

ask for a calibration certificate for the speed camera

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2002/en/act/pub/0012/sec0021.html

Did you even read the Statute you posted?

OP why didn't you ask for the full photo when you replied instead of writing a letter? When you get the full photo you can quickly see if it's you, your car or a completely different car. Your wasting your 28 days for the lesser fine if it was you.

redlik · 20-01-2014 1:38pm

Del2005 wrote: »

Did you even read the Statute you posted?

OP why didn't you ask for the full photo when you replied instead of writing a letter? When you get the full photo you can quickly see if it's you, your car or a completely different car. Your wasting your 28 days for the lesser fine if it was you.

I didn't asked for a full photo, didn't know I should have. I've rang the 1890 number and was told to send the letter from work and wait for them to get back to me, which they have but they ask the other way around (me to shoot and send the pic of my own car).
R.

Tarabuses · 20-01-2014 2:49pm

Chances are that, if they send you their photo and you claim it is not your car, they will ask for a photo of your car to prove this. Why not short circuit the process and just send a photo of your car?

Five Lamps · 23-01-2014 12:50am

Tarabuses wrote: »

Chances are that, if they send you their photo and you claim it is not your car, they will ask for a photo of your car to prove this. Why not short circuit the process and just send a photo of your car?

I would have thought this would be a matter for the courts? I didn't think that the Go Safe folks entered into dialogue on these matters.

slimjimmc · 27-01-2014 4:07pm

Five Lamps wrote: »

I would have thought this would be a matter for the courts? I didn't think that the Go Safe folks entered into dialogue on these matters.

GoSafe folks only detect the speeding offence and forward your photo and reg details to the Gardaí. They don't issue fines, that's for the Garda Fixed Charge Processing Office who do consider any evidence you provide.

http://www.garda.ie/Controller.aspx?Page=348&Lang=1

Speeding notice after over month, plate picture illegible

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