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systemd

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Comments

  • #32
    limnam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭limnam


    Hotblack Desiato wrote: »
    Meh.
    Been using it exclusively for over two years now, only noticeable change is much faster and more reliable booting and shutdown.

    Considering the vast majority of *NIX users don't boot/shutdown very often. If that's the "only" noticeable change, it doesn't sound very beneficial.
    Hotblack Desiato wrote: »
    Ultimately, it's Free software and everything that depends on it is Free software, if you don't like it then nothing is stopping you from writing something better.

    This is a pretty weak straw-man argument. We generally want to attract as many people as possible into open/free software. Not start spouting people should learn to fork a branch of a distro if they're not happy.
    Hotblack Desiato wrote: »
    The stuff about how it's going to force proprietary software and open linux up to viruses is just guff. I've been using systemd for longer than some of the more voiciferous posters here have been using linux.

    I think there has been a lot of hype about viruses, but you're introducing a single point of failure which vastly increases the attack surface for all the services depending on that SPOF.

    The length of time you've been using systemd for brings nothing to the discussion.

    Personally I'm still on the fence until I learn more about it, which can be difficult with the vast majority of commentators on both side of the fences banging a lot of empty barrels.


  • #33
    Grudaire
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,620 ✭✭✭Grudaire


    excollier wrote: »
    "Trouble is, it allows one commercial distro, Red Hat, to dictate to everyone else, like it or not"

    I'll re-iterate this, because it is true, whether you like it or not.

    What is stopping forks of the systemd code if they do go down a bad direction though? :confused:


  • #34
    L.Jenkins
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,241 Mod ✭✭✭✭L.Jenkins


    Part of the devuan mailing list and the amount of bítching going on without any work being done is unreal.


  • #35
    jimgoose
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,180 ✭✭✭✭jimgoose




  • #36
    jimgoose
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,180 ✭✭✭✭jimgoose


    excollier wrote: »
    ..."Trouble is, it allows one commercial distro, Red Hat, to dictate to everyone else, like it or not"...

    IBM are in cahoots with RedHat for a long time, and began the process of turning Linux into AIX for x86 with AIX 5L. All your nerd are belong to us!! :D


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  • #37
    azzeretti
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,477 ✭✭✭azzeretti


    Tillotson wrote: »

    Structured, binary log. Better/faster querying. What's easier `journalctl -p err -u sshd --since=09:00 --until=12:30` or an awk/sed + grep regex nightmare. Check-sums detect tampering.

    This reason, is one reason why I won't like systemd. I don't like the notion of a binary log file. I DO like awk/sed/grep - they feel better to me, more "linux". I know that isn't tangible and sounds garbbage but I really don't see any need to change it.
    Biggest advantage, for me anyway, and probably the most controversial is standardization. I'm sick of each distro re-inventing the wheel, badly. Standardize paths, standardize api's, standardize tools and let me get on with it.

    I can see the benefits here, in some ways. But again, why distro-hop? Why not pick your distro an use it if you don't like the changes across?

    The biggest concern I have is choice. If I decide I want to use a system without systemd then that will have an effect on the software I want to install. Gnome is a prime example with logind. It requires systemd to function, this (may) mean that I won't be able to run Gnome on my systemd-less system. It won't stop there either, what if this is the trend, to depend on systemd. I don't like that. Maybe it's time to start another Irish distro!?


  • #38
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,458 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    limnam wrote: »
    This is a pretty weak straw-man argument. We generally want to attract as many people as possible into open/free software. Not start spouting people should learn to fork a branch of a distro if they're not happy.

    Given that there are so many distros out there though, it's not really necessary to set up your own just support one you like.
    IF there is enough support out there then non-systemd distros will prosper, and I hope they do.

    The length of time you've been using systemd for brings nothing to the discussion.

    Me personally, no, but lots of people have been using this for a couple of years now and have had no problems, or at least nothing bad enough to want to make them switch back to systemv.

    Scrap the cap!



  • #39
    Tillotson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 218 ✭✭Tillotson


    azzeretti wrote: »
    This reason, is one reason why I won't like systemd. I don't like the notion of a binary log file. I DO like awk/sed/grep - they feel better to me, more "linux". I know that isn't tangible and sounds garbbage but I really don't see any need to change it.



    I can see the benefits here, in some ways. But again, why distro-hop? Why not pick your distro an use it if you don't like the changes across?

    The biggest concern I have is choice. If I decide I want to use a system without systemd then that will have an effect on the software I want to install. Gnome is a prime example with logind. It requires systemd to function, this (may) mean that I won't be able to run Gnome on my systemd-less system. It won't stop there either, what if this is the trend, to depend on systemd. I don't like that. Maybe it's time to start another Irish distro!?


    You can always pipe the output of journalctl to whatever. You can also setup journald to forward to syslog.

    It's not that I'm distro hopping, most of the time I don't get to choose what distro is installed on a particular server.

    At this stage nearly all the major Linux distros have adopted systemd. I don't think it's fair to burden Gnome developers with maintaining workarounds and compatibility layers, especially for platforms which are more server orientated anyway. Honestly, I see systemd as providing low level services similar to how coreutils provides tools. But yeah, if you're that person running Gnome on your FreeBSD desktop, it sucks.


  • #40
    syklops
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,966 ✭✭✭✭syklops


    jimgoose wrote: »
    Oh FFS, they'll kill each other over anything going back centuries. BSD vs. SYS-V. Emacs vs. vi. Gnome vs. KDE. tin vs. rn. I remember getting into a right temper back in 2007 or so because I suddenly had to start writing XML files in /var/svc/manifest/ on my old UltraSPARC boxes to start/stop stuff. :pac:

    Whats your point?

    I'm still annoyed whenever I find a config file I need to edit in XML.


  • #41
    jimgoose
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,180 ✭✭✭✭jimgoose


    syklops wrote: »
    Whats your point?

    I'm still annoyed whenever I find a config file I need to edit in XML.

    My breakfast burrito is rapidly congealing. How 'bout you?? :)


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  • #42
    syklops
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,966 ✭✭✭✭syklops


    jimgoose wrote: »
    My breakfast burrito is rapidly congealing. How 'bout you?? :)

    :confused:


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