Striking train drivers in Cork

Pineapple stu · 29-05-2008 6:29am

They have before.

pigeonbutler · 29-05-2008 10:12am

pithater1 wrote: »

Just a hypothetical folks, seeing as these train drivers are in all probability, going to strike again at some stage. Would it be worthwhile to train some army engineers and have them step into the breech and drive the trains the next time a strike like this happens?

Who'd train them though? If the drivers won't train railway lads what hope have they of training in potential scabs*!

Trade Union language, rather than a term I'm fond of.

thomasj · 29-05-2008 3:00pm

Looks like good news!

http://http://www.irishrail.ie/news_centre/travel_alerts.asp?action=view&news_id=379

Update: 14.15hrs Cork & Kerry, service disruptions, Thursday 29th May by Corporate Communications

UPDATE: 14.15hrs, Thursday 29th May

Iarnród Éireann is pleased to announce that Cork & Kerry services are expected to resume on Friday 30th May.
Regrettably,the following services will remain disrupted today, as follows (evening service arrangements will be confirmed later today on this website)

Service disruption, Thursday 29th May

The following services are expected to be cancelled on Thursday 29th May:

13.30 Cork - Heuston

14.30 Cork - Heuston

15.30 Cork - Heuston

16.30 Cork - Heuston

15.30 Cork - Heuston

18.30 Heuston - Tralee

Afternoon Cork/Cobh and Cork/Mallow services

Afternoon Cork/Tralee services

Services operating on Cork and Kerry routes are:

11.30 Cork to Heuston (with bus transfers between Cork and Mallow)

12.30 Cork to Heuston (with bus transfers between Cork and Mallow, and between Tralee and Mallow)

14.00 Heuston - Cork (with bus transfers between Mallow and Cork)

15.00 Heuston -Cork (with bus transfers between Mallow and Cork, and Mallow and Tralee)

16.00 Heuston-Cork (with bus transfers between Mallow and Cork)

17.00 Heuston - Cork (with bus transfers between Mallow and Cork, and Mallow and Tralee)

Limerick Customers should note:

Some Services to and from Limerick that connect with Cork services at Limerick Junction may be affected by the cancellations, outlined above. Limerick customers are advised to ring 1850 366 222 or contact their local station before travelling. All direct Limerick services are operating as normal.

Please note bus transfers from Cork and from Tralee depart 30 minutes earlier than scheduled train time.

All other routes will operate normally.

Iarnród Éireann apologises for the inconvience caused to customer during these disruptions.

Snickers Man · 29-05-2008 4:46pm

pithater1 wrote: »

Just a hypothetical folks, seeing as these train drivers are in all probability, going to strike again at some stage. Would it be worthwhile to train some army engineers and have them step into the breech and drive the trains the next time a strike like this happens?

The army's core competency is shooting people not driving trains.

Just saying.

Actually maybe that needs a comma.

The army's core competency is shooting people, not driving trains.

Or was it better first time?

PRND · 29-05-2008 5:11pm

Semi-colon?

E92 · 29-05-2008 11:15pm

More incompetence. The lazy f***ers could have gone back working this afternoon, when they had agreed that they would make themselves available for work.

shltter · 30-05-2008 12:22am

ixoy wrote: »

All we've heard really is that the task the driver was struck down for last week was something he was obliged to do under his contract - hence he didn't get the official union backing because it wasn't a valid claim.

No it is unofficial not because the union disagree with the drivers in the dispute over the terms of the deal but because in order to be an official strike it has to follow particular rules laid down in law involving balloting and giving a period of notice.
However the individual drivers given the immediate removal from the payroll of a colleague ( also a breach of correct procedure) decided to take immediate action and not to wait for a ballot and give notice.

shltter · 30-05-2008 12:29am

This just points to what I said earlier the only people who did not suffer at all were IE management.

They allowed this to drag on till Friday when it should have been all over by Monday ( thats ignoring the fact that it should never have happened at all) and the letter that was so vital on Monday has been withdrawn so what was the last week of disruption all about the only people who suffered are the travelling public and the Drivers who lost wages. These gob****es that insisted on this letter that is now not needed will be paid for their incompetence.

Padraig Mor · 30-05-2008 8:23am

shltter wrote: »

the only people who suffered are the travelling public and the Drivers who lost wages..

Boo ****ing hoo for the poor drivers. Maybe if they had done the job they were being paid for, and had already agreed to do, they mighn't be down a few days wages. They're hardly on the breadline either...

paulm17781 · 30-05-2008 9:24am

shltter wrote:

the only people who suffered are the travelling public and the Drivers who lost wages..

I'm going to start a fund for the drivers so they can strike whenever suits them at no loss of wage to them. :rolleyes:

shltter · 30-05-2008 10:13am

Padraig Mor wrote: »

Boo ****ing hoo for the poor drivers. Maybe if they had done the job they were being paid for, and had already agreed to do, they mighn't be down a few days wages. They're hardly on the breadline either...

paulm17781 wrote: »

I'm going to start a fund for the drivers so they can strike whenever suits them at no loss of wage to them. :rolleyes:

Congratulations both of you on completely missing the point

I never asked you to feel sorry for them just to consider that this was provoked and then dragged on unnecessarily and the people responsible for that are the only ones who have not been in anyway discommoded.

Whether you like it or not drivers have been without wages for a week, passengers have been without a service but IE management are unaffected in anyway

Stark · 30-05-2008 10:22am

shltter wrote: »

However the individual drivers given the immediate removal from the payroll of a colleague ( also a breach of correct procedure) decided to take immediate action and not to wait for a ballot and give notice.

Was he given previous warnings though? It would have been breach of correct procedure if it was an isolated incident, but if he had been insubordinate on previous occasions, then they'd be well within their rights to drop him from the payroll.

shltter wrote:

I never asked you to feel sorry for them just to consider that this was provoked and then dragged on unnecessarily and the people responsible for that are the only ones who have not been in anyway discommoded.

Whether you like it or not drivers have been without wages for a week, passengers have been without a service but IE management are unaffected in anyway

They didn't really need much provocation now did they. They mustn't have needed the money that much if "please do your jobs" was enough to make them take an extra few days off.

paulm17781 · 30-05-2008 10:34am

shltter wrote: »

Whether you like it or not drivers have been without wages for a week, passengers have been without a service but IE management are unaffected in anyway

Were they provoked by management? Most likely.

Did they choose to go on strike without even a ballot? Yes.

Did their actions affect the public? Yes.

Do I (or anyone else) give a toss they went a week with no wages after the disruption they caused? Absolutely not.

Would I like to see them fined next time they pull a stunt like this? Yes.

Padraig Mor · 30-05-2008 10:46am

shltter wrote: »

Congratulations both of you on completely missing the point

I never asked you to feel sorry for them just to consider that this was provoked and then dragged on unnecessarily and the people responsible for that are the only ones who have not been in anyway discommoded.

Whether you like it or not drivers have been without wages for a week, passengers have been without a service but IE management are unaffected in anyway

I'm afraid you miss the point. We don't consider management are to blame for "provoking" someone to do a job they are meant to do anyway. The incident was deliberately started and "dragged on" by a bunch of lazy, overpaid, good for nothing waster train drivers - whose actions are so ridiculous even their colleagues up the country won't support them.

ixoy · 30-05-2008 11:54am

Introduce the system they have in NYC - drivers were penalised for striking in 2005, fined $2.5m, and the union leader shoved in jail for ten days

Ham'nd'egger · 30-05-2008 12:18pm

Padraig Mor wrote: »

I'm afraid you miss the point. We don't consider management are to blame for "provoking" someone to do a job they are meant to do anyway. The incident was deliberately started and "dragged on" by a bunch of lazy, overpaid, good for nothing waster train drivers - whose actions are so ridiculous even their colleagues up the country won't support them.

In spite of 12 pages here about this strike and the pages and pages of national media coverage, you (And Stark and Ioxy) don't appear to even know the first thing what the strike was about or how it came to in making your comments.

Stark · 30-05-2008 12:21pm

Why don't you enlighten us in that case.

Ham'nd'egger · 30-05-2008 1:16pm

Stark wrote: »

Why don't you enlighten us in that case.

Ok, in order to defend your streak of lazy ignorance, I will. There was a train driver strike on in Cork. It's over now.

paulm17781 · 30-05-2008 1:33pm

I was today asked to be one of three people (out of 50) who would join a rota to clean the office coffee machines weekly. This is not in my job description. I want all who are in support of being lazy and doing nothing for company good to come on strike with me. I reckon a week off work and refusing to do anything that isn't exactly specified in our contracts is the way to go. Who's with me?

Stark · 30-05-2008 1:38pm

I had a meeting rescheduled today. I had to do work that I wasn't rostered to do instead. Who will walk out with me in sympathy strike?

ixoy · 30-05-2008 1:49pm

Hamndegger wrote: »

In spite of 12 pages here about this strike and the pages and pages of national media coverage, you (And Stark and Ioxy) don't appear to even know the first thing what the strike was about or how it came to in making your comments.

In spite of responding to our posts outlining the details of the strike, you stil ldon't appear to realise that we do know what the "strike" is about but believe their claims are pretty pathetic and that their approach to resolution was a joke.

Padraig Mor · 30-05-2008 1:55pm

Hamndegger wrote: »

In spite of 12 pages here about this strike and the pages and pages of national media coverage, you (And Stark and Ioxy) don't appear to even know the first thing what the strike was about or how it came to in making your comments.

Y'see I take the view that we know damn well what the strike was about. As has previously been posted, the strike began when one driver decided he didn't want to do the job he had agreed to for no good reason other than he thought he could decide when and where he worked. This escalated before drivers around the country saw how pathetic it was and abandoned their lazy "colleagues". The Cork boyos saw that they were getting nowhere so decided to go back to work before sodding off again when asked to sign a clause stating they would do work they had already agreed to do. The Cork drivers have once again shown total disdain for their customers and that they have absolutely no time for anyone other than themselves (believe me I know - I live in Cobh). There is obviously a rotten element in Cork who will use any excuse to strike (as mentioned earlier, they even walked off in support of a thieving ticket inspector). I, along with the majority of people, have absolutely no sympathy for the drivers.

Pineapple stu · 30-05-2008 2:53pm

"I, along with the majority of people, have absolutely no sympathy for the drivers."

Neither do i and i work for the company. After saying that, there is one or two Train driver inspectors who are right ignorant feckers and has no consideration for others. One tried to tell me how to do my job and he doesnt even have nothing to do with me. I just told him to stick to his trains and i will do mine

.
Irish Rail are a good company to work for but some of the lads in the Traffic department just take the piss sometimes and think they have a right for everything. There is no giving in some of them its all Take.

penexpers · 30-05-2008 2:54pm

What's interesting is according to RUI (who are usually well up on these things), Irish Rail didn't have an agreement in place for the supervision of trainee drivers which is why the original driver was taken off the payroll. If this is the case, then Irish Rail management have alot to answer for.

Incidentally, the 2008 Sunday Dublin-Cork timetable is still not being operated, so seems like the "agreement" achieved very little and drivers are still not working rest days.

paulm17781 · 30-05-2008 3:34pm

penexpers wrote: »

What's interesting is according to RUI (who are usually well up on these things), Irish Rail didn't have an agreement in place for the supervision of trainee drivers which is why the original driver was taken off the payroll. If this is the case, then Irish Rail management have alot to answer for.

I know from my RUI days (some time ago now) that we were in communication with a Cork driver who made out it was genuine concerns. I can't remember what these were or if they were even true or valid. Elements of RUI are also IE fan boys so I'm often wary of what I hear from there.

Either way, disrupting customers for a week is unacceptable.

I just cleaned the coffee machine, not part of my job, the coffee tastes better now. I'm still going to strike though I benefited from my actions.

Stark, that's an absolute disgrace. Your employer has no right...

shltter · 30-05-2008 9:17pm

paulm17781 wrote: »

Were they provoked by management? Most likely.

Did they choose to go on strike without even a ballot? Yes.

Did their actions affect the public? Yes.

Do I (or anyone else) give a toss they went a week with no wages after the disruption they caused? Absolutely not.

Would I like to see them fined next time they pull a stunt like this? Yes.

I couldn't care less whether you give a toss or not and I'm certain the train drivers in Cork won't lose any sleep over it if you want to take a blinkered view where management can provoke and prolong the withdrawal of train services but in your blinkered view only the drivers are responsible go ahead knock yourself out.

I would like to see the people who provoked this and the people who prolonged it on monday held to some kind of account but I live in the real world

shltter · 30-05-2008 9:18pm

Padraig Mor wrote: »

I, along with the majority of people, have absolutely no sympathy for the drivers.

asked them all did you

shltter · 30-05-2008 9:19pm

Stark wrote: »

I had a meeting rescheduled today. I had to do work that I wasn't rostered to do instead. Who will walk out with me in sympathy strike?

I suggest you seek the support of your work colleagues secondary picketing is illegal

paulm17781 · 30-05-2008 9:54pm

shltter wrote: »

I couldn't care less whether you give a toss or not and I'm certain the train drivers in Cork won't lose any sleep over it if you want to take a blinkered view where management can provoke and prolong the withdrawal of train services but in your blinkered view only the drivers are responsible go ahead knock yourself out.

I would like to see the people who provoked this and the people who prolonged it on monday held to some kind of account but I live in the real world

You claim I don't live in the real world yet you are claiming that management are totally accountable for the drivers' actions?

DWCommuter · 30-05-2008 10:41pm

I posted this on the RUI board. I know my way around IE and its workings and have been at the coalface. I don't say things lightly. Anyway have a read of it and I hope its read by actual ordinary rail users here, because RUI has few of them at this stage.

Having followed this issue very closely, I find the comments of the Minister to be naieve and even shocking. Feargus O'Dowds comments are even more shocking and are a mere attempt to make him appealing to the electorate. But the Minister has displayed the greatest ignorance and almost contemptuous stance towards the issue. IE is rotting away in terms of its Human Resources dept. For example, look at May 2006 and the way Cork drivers were hoodwinked into a dispute. The person in charge is not fit to run it and has a history of provoking staff in order to get his way. Unofficial action in that company is happening because the unions are weak, staff have genuine grievances and management are hopelessly inadequate when it comes to dealing with them and reinventing the company.

Unions only act when unofficial action is called. Management then react in a hardline fashion (which usually includes provocation) and then we end up with a mediator. Inevitably the company end up withdrawing their provocative hardline approach and fresh talks begin to progress matters, until IE start provoking staff again. Believe me this strike ended, when IE got wind of a planned nationwide walkout last Tuesday. However they brought it that far by demanding that drivers sign a letter. After LRC intervention that letter has been binned. This is all a sign of very poor management in IE. The Minister hasn't a clue and I'd rather communicate with a turnip that waste my time writing to him. His response was dissapointing. If he really cares about the travelling public then an immediate inquiry needs to carried out into IE management and staff. We know that their customer service is poor and the public blame staff. But Ive said this many many times. Good customer service starts at the top. Good human resources starts at the top. Leadership starts at the top. The top is the management and the role of management is to lead, inspire, encourage, praise, organise and "manage". All roads lead back to its basic function. Looking at another example, some members of staff are reluctant to wear name badges. What do management do? Dig their heels in, let the matter fester until eventually it becomes a big issue. But at no point were they prepared to wear name badges in public areas of the rail network. Slide on down to Heuston any day and I can pick out "managers" that are invisible to their customers. But behind the scenes treat staff like dirt. I don't dispute that CIE companies have a large amount of poor staff with equally poor attitudes. But this attitude emanates from the sucessive dinosaurs like John Lynch that have been paid huge sums and offer nothing but a nod and a wink to the Minister that put them in there. Historically there have been some funny practises on the railway and when CIE was formed, Government appointed goons were never going to be capable of creating change and dynamism.If we are to be honest with ourselves and examine the history of this company, management have a lot more to answer for than any strike or dispute.

shltter · 31-05-2008 8:57am

paulm17781 wrote: »

You claim I don't live in the real world yet you are claiming that management are totally accountable for the drivers' actions?

No im saying address the disease not the symptom what happened last week is a direct symptom of the much wider disease within IE focussing on the symptom as the cause of the problems is blinkered.

paulm17781 · 31-05-2008 11:57am

shltter wrote: »

No im saying address the disease not the symptom what happened last week is a direct symptom of the much wider disease within IE focussing on the symptom as the cause of the problems is blinkered.

I already said it was no doubt provoked. My point is drivers walking out unofficially is not the way to deal with these situations. It does nothing to get them any support and they are always seen as the villains. Yet you say I have the blinkered view. :rolleyes:

Snickers Man · 31-05-2008 6:03pm

DWCommuter wrote: »

I posted this on the RUI board. I know my way around IE and its workings and have been at the coalface. I don't say things lightly. Anyway have a read of it and I hope its read by actual ordinary rail users here, because RUI has few of them at this stage.

What you posted:
Having followed this issue very closely, I find the comments of the Minister to be naieve and even shocking. Feargus O'Dowds comments are even more shocking and are a mere attempt to make him appealing to the electorate. But the Minister has displayed the greatest ignorance and almost contemptuous stance towards the issue. IE is rotting away in terms of its Human Resources dept. For example, look at May 2006 and the way Cork drivers were hoodwinked into a dispute. The person in charge is not fit to run it and has a history of provoking staff in order to get his way. Unofficial action in that company is happening because the unions are weak, staff have genuine grievances and management are hopelessly inadequate when it comes to dealing with them and reinventing the company.

Unions only act when unofficial action is called. Management then react in a hardline fashion (which usually includes provocation) and then we end up with a mediator. Inevitably the company end up withdrawing their provocative hardline approach and fresh talks begin to progress matters, until IE start provoking staff again. Believe me this strike ended, when IE got wind of a planned nationwide walkout last Tuesday. However they brought it that far by demanding that drivers sign a letter. After LRC intervention that letter has been binned. This is all a sign of very poor management in IE. The Minister hasn't a clue and I'd rather communicate with a turnip that waste my time writing to him. His response was dissapointing. If he really cares about the travelling public then an immediate inquiry needs to carried out into IE management and staff. We know that their customer service is poor and the public blame staff. But Ive said this many many times. Good customer service starts at the top. Good human resources starts at the top. Leadership starts at the top. The top is the management and the role of management is to lead, inspire, encourage, praise, organise and "manage". All roads lead back to its basic function. Looking at another example, some members of staff are reluctant to wear name badges. What do management do? Dig their heels in, let the matter fester until eventually it becomes a big issue. But at no point were they prepared to wear name badges in public areas of the rail network. Slide on down to Heuston any day and I can pick out "managers" that are invisible to their customers. But behind the scenes treat staff like dirt. I don't dispute that CIE companies have a large amount of poor staff with equally poor attitudes. But this attitude emanates from the sucessive dinosaurs like John Lynch that have been paid huge sums and offer nothing but a nod and a wink to the Minister that put them in there. Historically there have been some funny practises on the railway and when CIE was formed, Government appointed goons were never going to be capable of creating change and dynamism.If we are to be honest with ourselves and examine the history of this company, management have a lot more to answer for than any strike or dispute.

What a load of self-absorbed piffle! And you hope that this "will be read by the ordinary rail users here"?? Why??

Where are they mentioned? Where are their concerns addressed? How did their actions contribute to this strike?

You have utterly ignored them, apart from asking them to consider the internal dynamics of relations within the company which is none of their damned business.

Why should any passenger give a rat's ass about the petty vanities of people within IE and how they may be affected by such mundane issues as whether or not they are happy to wear name badges?

All they (we) want is to be able to buy a ticket to travel on a train on a given advertised route at a given advertised time and expect that CIE's side of the bargain be honoured.

"Ah now here!" you say. "Management are being provocative asking a driver to do something he didn't expect to do on a given day."

Big swinging mickey. He was given a reasonable request; he should have carried it out. And they called in the Labour Relations Commission??
Labour Exchange, more like. In the real world he would have been sacked (following proper procedure, of course)

All this illustrates to me, and which may be the nub of the problem, is that IE is such a bloated overmanned uncommercial monstrosity that each employee's conception of reality is based around the internal relationships within various sections of the company. It's HR's fault! It's the ticket inspector's fault! It's the training officer's fault! It's the fault of the "provocative" guy who asked me to wear a name badge!!

Away and ****E!!!!

At the end of the day it's passengers who pay their wages and passengers should not have been left high and dry like they were.

All it takes to sort out the train drivers is some body with the balls to sack the next self-important prat who walks off the job because he doesn't feel like doing what he's told by his managers.

What's the worst that could happen? that all the other drivers would come out in sympathy? Bring it on.

Let them strike themselves into redundancy. Maybe we can bring in a horde of new drivers who don't need 48 ****ing weeks to learn how to push a few buttons. Who will take a pride in their work. And who will encourage more people to take the train over the car, or even the aeroplane. (Tip: want to go from Dublin to Kerry? Fly Aer Arann. Quicker, cheaper (yes cheaper sometimes) and WAY more reliable than IR)

Think a government wouldn't dare? Ask an English miner. If you can find one.

DWCommuter · 01-06-2008 12:00am

Snickers Man wrote: »

What you posted:
Having followed this issue very closely, I find the comments of the Minister to be naieve and even shocking. Feargus O'Dowds comments are even more shocking and are a mere attempt to make him appealing to the electorate. But the Minister has displayed the greatest ignorance and almost contemptuous stance towards the issue. IE is rotting away in terms of its Human Resources dept. For example, look at May 2006 and the way Cork drivers were hoodwinked into a dispute. The person in charge is not fit to run it and has a history of provoking staff in order to get his way. Unofficial action in that company is happening because the unions are weak, staff have genuine grievances and management are hopelessly inadequate when it comes to dealing with them and reinventing the company.

Unions only act when unofficial action is called. Management then react in a hardline fashion (which usually includes provocation) and then we end up with a mediator. Inevitably the company end up withdrawing their provocative hardline approach and fresh talks begin to progress matters, until IE start provoking staff again. Believe me this strike ended, when IE got wind of a planned nationwide walkout last Tuesday. However they brought it that far by demanding that drivers sign a letter. After LRC intervention that letter has been binned. This is all a sign of very poor management in IE. The Minister hasn't a clue and I'd rather communicate with a turnip that waste my time writing to him. His response was dissapointing. If he really cares about the travelling public then an immediate inquiry needs to carried out into IE management and staff. We know that their customer service is poor and the public blame staff. But Ive said this many many times. Good customer service starts at the top. Good human resources starts at the top. Leadership starts at the top. The top is the management and the role of management is to lead, inspire, encourage, praise, organise and "manage". All roads lead back to its basic function. Looking at another example, some members of staff are reluctant to wear name badges. What do management do? Dig their heels in, let the matter fester until eventually it becomes a big issue. But at no point were they prepared to wear name badges in public areas of the rail network. Slide on down to Heuston any day and I can pick out "managers" that are invisible to their customers. But behind the scenes treat staff like dirt. I don't dispute that CIE companies have a large amount of poor staff with equally poor attitudes. But this attitude emanates from the sucessive dinosaurs like John Lynch that have been paid huge sums and offer nothing but a nod and a wink to the Minister that put them in there. Historically there have been some funny practises on the railway and when CIE was formed, Government appointed goons were never going to be capable of creating change and dynamism.If we are to be honest with ourselves and examine the history of this company, management have a lot more to answer for than any strike or dispute.

What a load of self-absorbed piffle! And you hope that this "will be read by the ordinary rail users here"?? Why??

Where are they mentioned? Where are their concerns addressed? How did their actions contribute to this strike?

You have utterly ignored them, apart from asking them to consider the internal dynamics of relations within the company which is none of their damned business.

Why should any passenger give a rat's ass about the petty vanities of people within IE and how they may be affected by such mundane issues as whether or not they are happy to wear name badges?

All they (we) want is to be able to buy a ticket to travel on a train on a given advertised route at a given advertised time and expect that CIE's side of the bargain be honoured.

"Ah now here!" you say. "Management are being provocative asking a driver to do something he didn't expect to do on a given day."

Big swinging mickey. He was given a reasonable request; he should have carried it out. And they called in the Labour Relations Commission??
Labour Exchange, more like. In the real world he would have been sacked (following proper procedure, of course)

All this illustrates to me, and which may be the nub of the problem, is that IE is such a bloated overmanned uncommercial monstrosity that each employee's conception of reality is based around the internal relationships within various sections of the company. It's HR's fault! It's the ticket inspector's fault! It's the training officer's fault! It's the fault of the "provocative" guy who asked me to wear a name badge!!

Away and ****E!!!!

At the end of the day it's passengers who pay their wages and passengers should not have been left high and dry like they were.

All it takes to sort out the train drivers is some body with the balls to sack the next self-important prat who walks off the job because he doesn't feel like doing what he's told by his managers.

What's the worst that could happen? that all the other drivers would come out in sympathy? Bring it on.

Let them strike themselves into redundancy. Maybe we can bring in a horde of new drivers who don't need 48 ****ing weeks to learn how to push a few buttons. Who will take a pride in their work. And who will encourage more people to take the train over the car, or even the aeroplane. (Tip: want to go from Dublin to Kerry? Fly Aer Arann. Quicker, cheaper (yes cheaper sometimes) and WAY more reliable than IR)

Think a government wouldn't dare? Ask an English miner. If you can find one.

Cheers dude! I've had a brilliant day and you have capped it off for me. Thank you very much, I'll be laughing in my sleep.
People like you don't deserve anything from anyone as YOU are the one talking ****e. One only has to read your posts in other forums to know that you are truely a natural comedian. But hey its funny ****e. You should be in Kilkenny this weekend. (if you can find your way out of D4) There's lots of jokers down there and getting paid. If inaccurate rants like that are representative of rail users, then I suggest the cause of the passenger is ****ed. Hopefully, the ones with brains will be a little more swayed towards finding out facts about why these strikes happen.

As for you...can I book you for a stand up gig in my living room, so I can throw bowling balls at you when the jokes don't quite hit the spot? Although, judging by the above, you are funny when it comes to transport.

Whats your material like on the subject of diplomacy? I think you know mine now.

Cryos · 01-06-2008 12:31am

@DW i would agree with snickers man

This dispute was blown out of all proportion, im not going to play the blame game here but if IE was any other company HR would have a set of balls and that goon in cork would of got the chop.

Im a communter i have no sympathy for the train drivers, why you may ask ? Ill tell you why, they have no loyalty to the company. They couldnt give a crap about the avarage Joe Soap who has been caused this inconvenience; I suppose that train driver would be highly sympathetic to the ESB if they went on strike and held the country to randsom ? He is employed to provide a key National Infrastructure Service to the Public, if he refuses to do his job he is working against the public.

Im a IT Support Specialist (Windows) i support and install IT Systems for HP for our Large Enterprise Customers Simple, if i turned around to my manager and said "No im not installing that server because im suppose to be looking at backups today" id be Hauled into HR and be warned or suspended.

The only reason why they have any barganing power in this whole sick perverted situation is that Its a state owned company that provides a key infrastructure service to the country. Its bad for the Economy and its bad for all of our pockets at the end of the day.

Snickers Man · 01-06-2008 12:35am

DWCommuter wrote: »

If inaccurate rants like that are representative of rail users, then I suggest the cause of the passenger is ****ed. Hopefully, the ones with brains will be a little more swayed towards finding out facts about why these strikes happen.

Well if they try to "find out facts" based upon your posts, as someone who claims to "know his way around IE" they might infer that it's all about totally dysfunctional relationships between petty minded prats who think that what people say to them at work determines whether they have a duty to do what they are paid to do. Read your post again and try to imagine you are NOT an IE insider. See how it must sound.

We the outside travelling public don't give a flying **** about how nicely management asked somebody to take some trainees on a spin. We just want the trains we catch to go where they're supposed to when they're supposed to.

If you want a cautionary tale for the drivers, have a look at what is happening in SR Technics, the aircraft maintenance company. This is the lot that used to be called TEAM Aer Lingus. Some years ago they tried to hold the airline and the government to ransom, demanding that they remain lifelong members of Aer Lingus, because that was where they started working. There was major disruption at the airport. Threats to ministers that nobody in North Dublin would ever vote for them ever again. Etc Etc.

Aer Lingus managed to get rid of them to SR Technics and now a few short years later, their customers seem hell bent on getting rid of SR Technics. There's going to be a lot of former Team Aer Lingus people hitting the jobs market fairly soon.

So the lesson should be, if you are hell bent on industrial action as the first resort of problem resolution, do try not to piss off your customers too much. Because ultimately, they hold the power to decide whether to continue to employ your services or to seek alternatives.

Calina · 01-06-2008 1:05am

I am absolutely sick to the teeth of rail related threads descending into puerile nonsense. This thread is closing until sometime Monday to give you lot a chance to cool off. I am sick of reading posts that are asterisk strewn. I fail to understand why it is you have to resort to swearing at each other just because you don't agree.

When the thread re-opens, anyone who acts the muppet will get banned for two weeks, no ifs, no buts.

Striking train drivers in Cork

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