Reasons for driving children to school

Iwannahurl · 24-09-2014 11:39pm #1

I'm always interested in the reasons people give for driving their children to school, even over short distances.

One reason I've heard very often is that the parent is going on to work afterwards. Clearly that's a factor in some cases, but self-evidently not every family has both parents working.

I haven't seen definitive data on the subject, although I recall a position paper published by the National Heart Alliance in 2010 which claimed the following, supposedly based on the 2006 Census:

Findings from the 2006 Census echo the reduction in active travel modes to school. Between 1991 and 2006 walking and cycling decreased while travel by car increased. 25% travel less than 1km, 36% travel between 2-4km and 60% of parents who drop off by car don’t go to work.

I've never been able to confirm that 60% figure, and was always a bit unsure about it.

However, the results of a new survey have recently been published and suggest that only one in four parents doing the school run by car are going on to work afterwards.

92 per cent of those surveyed taking part in the school run took children to school via car with over 54 per cent travelling a distance of only 1-5km. A lowly eight per cent choose to walk children to the school gates.

Reasons cited for driving children to school included: 27 per cent - it’s on the way to work; 25 per cent - the distance between home and the school is quite far; 17 per cent - it is safer for children to be dropped at the school door; 16 per cent - there are no public transport services available; 15 per cent - are regularly running late in the morning.

Link: http://www.corkindependent.com/20140917/motors/school-run-increases-commute-times-S90738.html

Given the source of the data it's obviously a commercially-inspired survey intended to generate some publicity.

That said, the figure of 27% suggests that a substantial majority of parents using their car for the school run are not doing so because of work commitments or excessive distance.

The survey also includes encouraging results such as that 58% of respondents said 2 km should be the minimum distance for driving to school, while "an overwhelming majority" believed that 30 km/h zones should be mandatory around schools.

Zebra3 · 25-09-2014 8:40am

I'll give you a reason.

Laziness.

Call me Al · 25-09-2014 8:45am

We have a lot of primary school children dropped to school by car. We have a rural school and the roads, with no defined hard shoulder and overgrown ditches, are not safe for walking on whether you are 5 or 12 or 15. The children travel several kilometers with only a fraction of these eligible for a school bus.

corktina · 25-09-2014 9:16am

that was our reason too at the time, there was a bus for the National School but the stop was almost a mile away along an unsafe rural road and whilst we were driving them there, we may as well continue another two miles to the school. In our defence we had a local car poll arrangement between three families (illegally by modern standards with not enough seatbelts).

jaymcg91 · 25-09-2014 9:46am

Call me Al wrote: »

We have a lot of primary school children dropped to school by car. We have a rural school and the roads, with no defined hard shoulder and overgrown ditches, are not safe for walking on whether you are 5 or 12 or 15. The children travel several kilometers with only a fraction of these eligible for a school bus.

When people bitch about parents driving children to school, I don't think this is what they're bitching about, driving your kids to school in your case seems like it would be safe AND advisable

.

I think people are bitching about the "Chelsea Tractor brigade", bringing their children 0.5km down the road (with footpaths etc). In this case, it's definitely laziness.

SeanW · 25-09-2014 10:02am

jaymcg91 wrote: »

When people bitch about parents driving children to school, I don't think this is what they're bitching about, driving your kids to school in your case seems like it would be safe AND advisable .

I think people are bitching about the "Chelsea Tractor brigade", bringing their children 0.5km down the road (with footpaths etc). In this case, it's definitely laziness.

Problem: how do you filter out those who are driving their child long distances with no public transport, and those who are driving their children to school en-route to work (I assume for the sake of argument all accept these reasons) from the "Chelsea Tractor brigade"?

Macy0161 · 25-09-2014 10:12am

We'd usually drive the children to school. Around a km to the school gate. I do try to walk them when I'm on duty, but it isn't easy to marshall 4 of them (in fairness it is a car pool everyday between us and the inlaws) on the bit before we get to a footpath, especially the younger ones. And it doesn't feel particularly safe tbh.

I'd normally make them walk a bit in the village though - I wouldn't have time for the parking on footpaths/ double yellows nonsense that goes on.

I have to say, this week I was put off a bit by the latest "numbers" RSA advert, which is obviously aimed at vehicle drivers taking care around school times, but had the effect of putting me off walking the roads with the chaps!

rushfan · 25-09-2014 10:43am

I don't see anything on that survey about the weight of the schoolbags. My daughter started secondary last year and to see her struggling to get the bag on her back was quite a source of stress.

foggy_lad · 25-09-2014 10:59am

Macy0161 wrote: »

We'd usually drive the children to school. Around a km to the school gate. I do try to walk them when I'm on duty, but it isn't easy to marshall 4 of them (in fairness it is a car pool everyday between us and the inlaws) on the bit before we get to a footpath, especially the younger ones. And it doesn't feel particularly safe tbh.

I'd normally make them walk a bit in the village though - I wouldn't have time for the parking on footpaths/ double yellows nonsense that goes on.

I have to say, this week I was put off a bit by the latest "numbers" RSA advert, which is obviously aimed at vehicle drivers taking care around school times, but had the effect of putting me off walking the roads with the chaps!

Get yourself a very loud whistle or a loud bell, Children always react to the shrill sound and just as they do in the schoolyard they will fall into line on hearing the bell/whistle.

whisky_galore · 25-09-2014 11:07am

foggy_lad wrote: »

Get yourself a very loud whistle or a loud bell, Children always react to the shrill sound and just as they do in the schoolyard they will fall into line on hearing the bell/whistle.

Reminds me a bit of the Von Trapp Family.:pac:

Macy0161 · 25-09-2014 11:21am

foggy_lad wrote: »

Get yourself a very loud whistle or a loud bell, Children always react to the shrill sound and just as they do in the schoolyard they will fall into line on hearing the bell/whistle.

Oh they behave fine, it's being in four places at once if someone in a vehicle doesn't look like they've seen us, or are passing too close. They do (on the road at least) what they're told.

Just on the weight of the bags - when I do walk them, I invariably have to carry the bags. The eldest of the 4's bag is ridiculously heavy.

what_traffic · 25-09-2014 11:26am

Macy0161 wrote: »

I have to say, this week I was put off a bit by the latest "numbers" RSA advert, which is obviously aimed at vehicle drivers taking care around school times, but had the effect of putting me off walking the roads with the chaps!

Not surprised by your reaction to this RSA campaign. Terrible stuff. Why don't we see the RSA campaigning to have a 30km/ph (or even 50km/ph on National Roads) zones within the proximity of every National and Secondary school in Ireland?

Iwannahurl · 25-09-2014 11:33am

Macy0161 wrote: »

I have to say, this week I was put off a bit by the latest "numbers" RSA advert, which is obviously aimed at vehicle drivers taking care around school times, but had the effect of putting me off walking the roads with the chaps!

what_traffic wrote: »

Not surprised by your reaction to this RSA campaign. Terrible stuff. Why don't we see the RSA campaigning to have a 30km/ph (or even 50km/ph on National Roads) zones within the proximity of every National and Secondary school in Ireland?

Do you know where I might find that ad?

I had a look at the RSA's YouTube channel but I didn't find anything matching that description.

Iwannahurl · 25-09-2014 11:36am

rushfan wrote: »

I don't see anything on that survey about the weight of the schoolbags. My daughter started secondary last year and to see her struggling to get the bag on her back was quite a source of stress.

I see lots of kids using 'wheelie bags' when walking.

http://www.lynchschooluniforms.com/category.php?id_cat=32

Cycling also gives the option of carrying gear on a rack or in panniers.

Macy0161 · 25-09-2014 11:41am

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Do you know where I might find that ad?

I had a look at the RSA's YouTube channel but I didn't find anything matching that description.

It's a radio ad. I hear it on Dublin City FM, on Livedrive. It's usually the list of penalty points, people killed etc for the preceeding week. The latest is about the number of children killed on the roads in the last year, read through the voicebox of someone who was hit walking to school and left paralysed.

All well intentioned I'm sure, but as well as putting that in drivers minds, it's also putting that in people who might walk their children's school minds too. Like is it worth the risk of that happening, just so I can feel better about making them walk, one less car journey etc. It wouldn't stop me, but it certainly played on my mind this week.

Iwannahurl wrote: »

I see lots of kids using 'wheelie bags' when walking.

http://www.lynchschooluniforms.com/category.php?id_cat=32

Cycling also gives the option of carrying gear on a rack or in panniers.

Our school specifically recommended against "wheelie bags", as the school is on multiple levels!

NIMAN · 25-09-2014 11:42am

Didn't you hear, there's a paedo on every corner these days.

Seaswimmer · 25-09-2014 12:09pm

rushfan wrote: »

I don't see anything on that survey about the weight of the schoolbags. My daughter started secondary last year and to see her struggling to get the bag on her back was quite a source of stress.

but if the kids were carrying their bags from a young age would this be a problem?

modern backpacks are very efficient and well designed so even junior and senior infants should be capable of carrying a light backpack. As the bags get heavier the kids get older and stronger!

however this presupposes that they always carried their bag but I agree that trying to suddenly force a 1st year student to carry a heavy bag without any previous "training" is a futile exercise.

SeanW · 25-09-2014 12:10pm

what_traffic wrote: »

Not surprised by your reaction to this RSA campaign. Terrible stuff. Why don't we see the RSA campaigning to have a 30km/ph (or even 50km/ph on National Roads) zones within the proximity of every National and Secondary school in Ireland?

Probably because the limit would be a joke when there are no children about because the school is out of use for the night/weekend/bank holiday/class is in session and all the children are inside, it would just be one more stupid speed limit that makes no sense and is not worthy of respect, between 5 and 10% of them are already.

Far better to have - as in many places they already have - flashing yellow lights at school whenever there are children about, perhaps complimented with a Variable Speed Limit if it is needed for the duration.

Iwannahurl · 25-09-2014 12:34pm

Macy0161 wrote: »

Our school specifically recommended against "wheelie bags", as the school is on multiple levels!

Wheelie bags have carrying handles, and some have shoulder straps also.

foggy_lad · 25-09-2014 12:55pm

Macy0161 wrote: »

Oh they behave fine, it's being in four places at once if someone in a vehicle doesn't look like they've seen us, or are passing too close. They do (on the road at least) what they're told.

Just on the weight of the bags - when I do walk them, I invariably have to carry the bags. The eldest of the 4's bag is ridiculously heavy.

Use the Whistle and the drivers should hear it, you should also walk them single file on the road and make sure they all have their high visibility covers for backpacks and stand out slightly further on the road yourself and drivers will see you.

what_traffic wrote: »

Not surprised by your reaction to this RSA campaign. Terrible stuff. Why don't we see the RSA campaigning to have a 30km/ph (or even 50km/ph on National Roads) zones within the proximity of every National and Secondary school in Ireland?

Most rural schools on national primary and secondary roads already have a lower speed limit and they also have the flashing lights morning and afternoon.

Tabnabs · 25-09-2014 12:58pm

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Wheelie bags have carrying handles, and some have shoulder straps also.

As well as school buildings being on multiple levels, they are also like a cattle stampede at certain times. Kids wheeling these bags behind them would create a real H&S hazard. School administration advise based on experience, not to make life difficult.

Call me Al · 25-09-2014 2:58pm

jaymcg91 wrote: »

When people bitch about parents driving children to school, I don't think this is what they're bitching about, driving your kids to school in your case seems like it would be safe AND advisable .

I think people are bitching about the "Chelsea Tractor brigade", bringing their children 0.5km down the road (with footpaths etc). In this case, it's definitely laziness.

I know they might not be bitching and moaning about families like ourselves, but I wonder what proportion of the stats quoted are made up of people who are in our position and have no alternative but to use a bus or a car.

Iwannahurl · 25-09-2014 3:29pm

Tabnabs wrote: »

As well as school buildings being on multiple levels, they are also like a cattle stampede at certain times. Kids wheeling these bags behind them would create a real H&S hazard. School administration advise based on experience, not to make life difficult.

Nothing compared to, and nowhere near as dangerous as, the traffic chaos and parking free-for-all outside many schools. Much of which is directly due to parents habitually driving relatively sort distances to school, instead of developing a school travel routine based on feasible alternatives.

Iwannahurl · 25-09-2014 3:41pm

Call me Al wrote: »

I wonder what proportion of the stats quoted are made up of people who are in our position and have no alternative but to use a bus or a car.

I made the point at the outset that the stats are from a commercially-inspired survey intended to generate some publicity for its sponsors.

I doubt that the methodology is scientifically rigorous but some of the findings are still interesting, such as the 27% minority who drive to school because it's on the way to work.

The Heart Alliance report I mentioned earlier, which was based on the 2006 census, indicated that just 40% of parents were going on to work after the school run.

2006 was in the Celtic Bubble era, so presumably a lot more people were in employment. Yet even then six in every ten parents on the school run were not heading to work afterwards.

My guess is that if you selected a group of urban families living 4 km or less from their school, and examined their transport choices in detail, you would find that they have more scope to avoid using the car than they imagine.

Fred Swanson · 25-09-2014 5:09pm

This post has been deleted.

monument · 25-09-2014 9:51pm

SeanW wrote: »

Probably because the limit would be a joke when there are no children about because the school is out of use for the night/weekend/bank holiday/class is in session and all the children are inside, it would just be one more stupid speed limit that makes no sense and is not worthy of respect, between 5 and 10% of them are already.

Far better to have - as in many places they already have - flashing yellow lights at school whenever there are children about, perhaps complimented with a Variable Speed Limit if it is needed for the duration.

From the Rules of the Road:

The 30km/h part is illuminated when on -- which should be usually only at school hours in term.

There are 50km/h and 60km/h versions of these on N-roads.

Grandeeod · 25-09-2014 10:11pm

Our local school in Spain. (Primary) Great school bus service. Lots of kids walked to school. Nice big carpark in front of the school for those that are driven. No traffic jams. Wheeliebags are very popular and accepted. Books are left in the classroom. The only thing carried in the school bag is the lunch and pencil case.

ThisRegard · 25-09-2014 10:16pm

Iwannahurl wrote: »

I see lots of kids using 'wheelie bags' when walking.

http://www.lynchschooluniforms.com/category.php?id_cat=32

Cycling also gives the option of carrying gear on a rack or in panniers.

Most primary schools in my area have banned those wheelie bags on H&S grounds.

beauf · 25-09-2014 10:54pm

Iwannahurl wrote: »

...My guess is that if you selected a group of urban families living 4 km or less from their school, and examined their transport choices in detail, you would find that they have more scope to avoid using the car than they imagine....

They drive because they can, and its more attractive for the journey than the other options. I think you are fixated on a very narrow range of reasons to drive. People have other things to do than work. There's a whole range of journeys they might do, like shopping, or drop off pick ups from other schools, play schools, appointments of all types, ferry older family members around. It not just about going to work.

But at the root of it all, is if the car journey was less attractive than the other options then people would change. They'll take the path of least resistance. Unless of course they need the car for something else.

_Brian · 25-09-2014 10:58pm

Our kids go to a rural school, it's four miles away, there is no bus service from where we live to any local school.

Both myself and my wife pass the school, in separate vehicles on our way to work. We both work more than 20 miles away from where we live.

We have no option but drop our kids to school each day.

Dravokivich · 25-09-2014 11:01pm

As a young kid I remember my da driving my ma to work (As she didn't drive), then driving back, to drop us off to school.

So even if the parent not going to work is dropping the kids off in the car, it doesn't mean they aren't doing anything else before or after, that requires use of the car.

Cookie_Monster · 26-09-2014 1:58am

_Brian wrote: »

Our kids go to a rural school, it's four miles away, there is no bus service from where we live to any local school.

Both myself and my wife pass the school, in separate vehicles on our way to work. We both work more than 20 miles away from where we live.

We have no option but drop our kids to school each day.

of course you do, you could let them cycle. 6km is easily done in 15 or 20 mins

paddyland · 26-09-2014 7:41am

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

of course you do, you could let them cycle. 6km is easily done in 15 or 20 mins

Many rural roads are entirely unsuitable to let children cycle on, young children anyway.

The urban and rural situations are two entirely different things.

_Brian · 26-09-2014 7:45am

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

of course you do, you could let them cycle. 6km is easily done in 15 or 20 mins

My. Youngest is 6, she just learned to wobble along in a straight line just this week. Are you suggesting I turn her out on the main road now with her bag on her back !! Presumably I just blow the horn if my car as I speed past, just to encourage her along.

I think it has to be accepted that some kids will need to be dropped to school. Or taxes raised to put on more free busses.

foggy_lad · 26-09-2014 10:00am

_Brian wrote: »

My. Youngest is 6, she just learned to wobble along in a straight line just this week. Are you suggesting I turn her out on the main road now with her bag on her back !! Presumably I just blow the horn if my car as I speed past, just to encourage her along.

I think it has to be accepted that some kids will need to be dropped to school. Or taxes raised to put on more free busses.

I won't be paying for your choice to live in hillbilly heaven where there are no local schools or buses! If you want a bus for your child then you pay for it!

ThisRegard · 26-09-2014 10:32am

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

of course you do, you could let them cycle. 6km is easily done in 15 or 20 mins

paddyland wrote: »

Many rural roads are entirely unsuitable to let children cycle on, young children anyway.

Normally I'm one to agree with Cookie_,Monster, particularly in Dublin but what Paddyland says is true in many cases, even in Dublin.

My sons crèche is only about 3.5k from the house, and it's the collection point for my daughters primary school also but I won't bring them on their, or my, bikes. It's pretty much a narrow country road that's a continuous series of S bends with cars hugging the ditch on their left. You'll often find car bumpers or glass, sometimes with the cars still attached, in the hedges on one of the bends, the road condition is very poor and the cars drive quite fast given the condtion. Ironically many of them bringing kids to the same school.

When I'm out for a spin myself I'll get through that section as quick as possible.

beauf · 26-09-2014 10:55am

All of mine cycle a lot of the time. But I would also say its often not suitable even in Dublin. Its not just the distance or time. Its mainly the route.

corktina · 26-09-2014 11:45am

foggy_lad wrote: »

I won't be paying for your choice to live in hillbilly heaven where there are no local schools or buses! If you want a bus for your child then you pay for it!

are you unaware that you do have to pay for school buses?

NIMAN · 26-09-2014 11:50am

ThisRegard wrote: »

Most primary schools in my area have banned those wheelie bags on H&S grounds.

Sums up how the world is going, how is God's name are they a H&S issue?

Iwannahurl · 26-09-2014 11:53am

beauf wrote: »

They drive because they can, and its more attractive for the journey than the other options. I think you are fixated on a very narrow range of reasons to drive. People have other things to do than work. There's a whole range of journeys they might do, like shopping, or drop off pick ups from other schools, play schools, appointments of all types, ferry older family members around. It not just about going to work.

But at the root of it all, is if the car journey was less attractive than the other options then people would change. They'll take the path of least resistance. Unless of course they need the car for something else.

No, I'm just quoting the survey. Which is probably not scientific, as I've pointed out already.

Perhaps it could be said that there are macro and micro reasons.

Macro: because they can they will, and using the car is more attractive.

Micro: the myriad of individual reasons/excuses that people use to justify using the car even for short journeys (going to work afterwards, no time, 2 km is actually too far to walk/cycle, too dangerous, schoolbags too heavy, it's "always" raining blah blah etc).

The macro reasons can be addressed by making proper provision for walking, cycling and using the bus, and by using enforcement, engineering and education to keep prevent people from driving as close as they can to schools.

The micro reasons probably need unpicking on a case by case basis.

Tabnabs · 26-09-2014 11:54am

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Nothing compared to, and nowhere near as dangerous as, the traffic chaos and parking free-for-all outside many schools. Much of which is directly due to parents habitually driving relatively sort distances to school, instead of developing a school travel routine based on feasible alternatives.

I salute you for your ability to completely ignore my point and the straw man argument you so neatly inserted instead...

Iwannahurl · 26-09-2014 11:56am

NIMAN wrote: »

Sums up how the world is going, how is God's name are they a H&S issue?

Nuts, isn't it?

Maybe they're the same schools that reportedly ban children from running in the playground?

Arbiter of Good Taste · 26-09-2014 12:00pm

rushfan wrote: »

I don't see anything on that survey about the weight of the schoolbags. My daughter started secondary last year and to see her struggling to get the bag on her back was quite a source of stress.

I don't have children, but what I do have is a crummy back which has just culminated in nearly a year of agony and a back operation. If I ever do have children, unless the DoE/schools get their acts together and figures a way how not to turn our young people into pack mules, then mine will be driven to the school gate.

Tabnabs · 26-09-2014 12:01pm

NIMAN wrote: »

Sums up how the world is going, how is God's name are they a H&S issue?

Stand in a narrow corridor when 60+ kids aged 4-8 are all bustling past each other to get from the yard to their classroom. Now give those kids a wheelie-bag and handle to trail behind them...

Until you've experienced the chaos that small children thrive in, you can't understand the logic and sense of the ban.

beauf · 26-09-2014 12:05pm

Iwannahurl wrote: »

No, I'm just quoting the survey. Which is probably not scientific, as I've pointed out already...

To focus on a narrow band of the survey when you suspect its flawed seems counter productive to me.

Iwannahurl wrote: »

The macro reasons can be addressed by making proper provision for walking, cycling and using the bus, and by using enforcement, engineering and education to keep prevent people from driving as close as they can to schools.

The micro reasons probably need unpicking on a case by case basis.

To suggest there isn't proper provision and that there are a myriad micro reasons, indicates you know the reasons already. Rather than raking old ground perhaps it would be more useful to look at the solutions.

For example building schools not in the middle of their catchment, and in a location that dictated not by the best location for non car use, but by the developers whim on the ground they see as least profitable, causes a lot of problems. How about turning roads with schools into rat runs due to poor traffic and housing planning.

Iwannahurl · 26-09-2014 12:11pm

Tabnabs wrote: »

I salute you for your ability to completely ignore my point and the straw man argument you so neatly inserted instead...

I think you need to reconsider your definition of "straw man argument".

The topic of this thread is "reasons for driving children to school".

One of the reasons regularly trotted out is that schoolbags are too heavy.

I suggested that wheelie bags could be used instead.

Some posters said that some schools ban wheelie bags on alleged health and safety grounds.

My perspective is that worrying about the alleged hazards of wheelie bags is needless angst in the context of the genuine safety issues visible every day during school pick-up and drop-off times.

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Nothing compared to, and nowhere near as dangerous as, the traffic chaos and parking free-for-all outside many schools. Much of which is directly due to parents habitually driving relatively sort distances to school, instead of developing a school travel routine based on feasible alternatives.

The same goes for bans on running in the playground and fear-mongering about walking and cycling to school. The bigger picture is children's healthy development, but unfortunately we have developed a culture in this country in which it appears to be preferable to have children as inactive as possible on the way to school and while in it.

niallb · 26-09-2014 12:12pm

foggy_lad wrote: »

I won't be paying for your choice to live in hillbilly heaven where there are no local schools or buses! If you want a bus for your child then you pay for it!

Most of us do.
In two years I'll have three kids in the same secondary school, which will bring the bus cost to about €1,000 a year. We'll be driving them then!

_Brian · 26-09-2014 12:12pm

foggy_lad wrote: »

I won't be paying for your choice to live in hillbilly heaven where there are no local schools or buses! If you want a bus for your child then you pay for it!

I actually don't want a school bus, we drop our kids to the school on the way to work and my wife picks them up on the way back.. We often pick up other families kids on way so its not just ours in the car.. No extra journeys being made and actually often less journeys as we double up..

It is impractical for our kids to cycle to school.. We'd both have to drive past them on the way, and the road is much too dangerous to cycle, I hate cycling on it and it would be irresponsible to let children out on it. This is the case for many, many rural and indeed urban schools, our infrastructure just isn't suitable to facilitate it.

Another poster said that buses are not free and are paid for, actually quite a few runs are indeed free. In the past when country schools were amalgamated and smaller schools closed all families in the area served by the school are entitled to free transport by DOE to the new expanded school.

People need to live in rural areas, its very hard to run a farm and live in the town. Calling it "hilbilly heaven" just shows you have no idea how to have a constructive conversation.

doolox · 26-09-2014 12:18pm

Yes these two things were done in my daughters school. Very stupid policies. She has a very heavy bag load in the morning as she finds it hard to organise things and insists on bringing the full load of books to and from school every day in case she forgets something and gets given out to by the teachers.

In national school we drove her to within 200 meters of the school across from a very busy junction and hoofed it the rest of the way. She walked home, on rainy days if we were available we would pick her up from school as well.

Secondary school is in the next town as she did not qualify for admission to the nearby secondary school and we had to make arrangements with the neighbouring towns school to get her in. I find this a major bugbear as it is an extra cost imposed on us by bad planning and poor school capacity planning and forecasting typical of this country. On the upside the school is very well run and has great support from local businesses and workplaces and a very good demography more like where me and my wife went to school than where we now live ( very little hassle, drugs or scumbaggery) so it is probably worth driving to.

I notice that the main roads are clogged in the mornings and evenings by school traffic primarily by bad planning and siting of schools, bad traffic management, no carparks or proper letdown areas and poor enforcement at school times preventing people stopping to drop or pick up on the main road blocking through traffic. Overuse of crossings and over use of buttons on crossings when no one is actually needing to cross, I have seen several people pushing buttons and they do not cross at the crossings, this holds up traffic.

I have noticed several do not stop here signs and turn left only signs around our local national school and church that are completely ignored leading to a build up of traffic because people do not obey the rules. The school has taken to erecting a chain across the yard to allow only the teachers into the yard to park and stop parents driving up to the school doors with their kids delaying and causing danger to everyone else.

Seaswimmer · 26-09-2014 12:28pm

niallb wrote: »

Most of us do.
In two years I'll have three kids in the same secondary school, which will bring the bus cost to about €1,000 a year. We'll be driving them then!

Is it not capped at €650 per year per family??

Iwannahurl · 26-09-2014 12:29pm

beauf wrote: »

To focus on a narrow band of the survey when you suspect its flawed seems counter productive to me.

To suggest there isn't proper provision and that there are a myriad micro reasons, indicates you know the reasons already. Rather than raking old ground perhaps it would be more useful to look at the solutions.

For example building schools not in the middle of their catchment, and in a location that dictated not by the best location for non car use, but by the developers whim on the ground they see as least profitable, causes a lot of problems. How about turning roads with schools into rat runs due to poor traffic and housing planning.

It's just a Boards thread, and the "on my way to work" excuse is of particular interest to me.

In fact I was speaking to someone just this morning about the car-clogged school run in a certain area, and I quoted the 27% figure to him. His view was that at the particular school we were discussing it would be more like 72% going on to work.

I very much doubt that, but he was claiming it as the #1 reason for doing the school run by car. More excuses, imo, intended to justify motorists taking over not just all the roads near the school but also the footpaths as well.

In other words, because most people drive, the greater good is being served by allowing motorists to do what they want, leaving pedestrians, cyclists and bus users to fend for themselves. I would argue that the exact opposite should be the case.

There are of course major systemic reasons for Ireland's ludicrous car dependence, such as egregiously incompetent spatial "planning" and road design.

However, I live in the same neighbourhood as hundreds of others whose children travel to the same schools in the same area. Except that we (and a handful of others) choose to cycle.

Reasons for driving children to school

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