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Making an Argument to Standardize Languages Used.

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  • 11-08-2014 12:53pm
    #1
    L.Jenkins
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,240 Mod ✭✭✭✭


    I've discussed the migration of an application from one Server to RHEL v6 in another thread. This I want to keep as a separate issue as I don't have experience swaying Management or Project Managers to use one technology over a group of others. The current system has been developed over time using a mix of different languages such as C++, JavaScript, Perl and Shell Scripting with a dependency of some aspects of Java.

    What I have suggested is, to port the entire language to one standard language. It was met with some skepticism and I was urged to maintain the project as is, providing improvements where necessary unless I could state an advantage of one single solitary language over a handful of others. The obvious advantage to me at the moment would be maintainability without the added stress of having to pour through source code in several languages, when one could do the same job.

    Since the Server is running RHEL, I'm leaning towards Python. I have no earthly notion why someone would use Java to interact with a Manufacturing System, when all you want to do is pump data into a DB. The reason as to why Python is an attractive option for me is its flexibility to do what I need and want without getting too technical and blowing someones mind with an unnecessary amount of code.

    So does anyone have any opinions on the use of Python to interact with a Manufacturing Process first and foremost? Secondly, how best would I bring this to my PM/Manager without pissing anyone off or stepping on toes in the process? (Mind you, I have requested if I can bring it up in the next Scrum Meeting, time permitting of course)


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    #2
    IRLConor
    Subscribers Posts: 4,075 ✭✭✭IRLConor


    I've never worked on a non-trivial piece of software that was entirely one language, so I'm skeptical about any effort to force a "one language to rule them all" approach. Having said that, I think anyone introducing an extra language into a system should be required to justify it properly.

    If you're currently dealing with a mix of C++, Java, JavaScript, Perl and shell, then I would recommend against moving it all to Python. That smells like a ground-up rewrite and that's almost always a bad idea.

    On top of that, if your current productivity is suffering from multiple languages then switching everything to another language is likely to cause similar productivity issues. If your developers are smart and flexible enough to switch all of their work to Python with little or no impact then they're smart and flexible enough to work in multiple languages all day long.


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    #3
    ChRoMe
    Registered Users Posts: 2,021 ✭✭✭ChRoMe


    The contractor wants to change the whole stack? Awesome this always works out well.

    *grabs popcorn*


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    #4
    L.Jenkins
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 19,240 Mod ✭✭✭✭L.Jenkins


    No I just thought, if standardizing things made life easier, then why not. If it's easier to leave things as is, then I won't go and put extra work on myself. They do in time want to phase out the use of multiple languages in favor of Java as they want to use some Service tool or manager to handle data from the Manufacturing machinery. So porting everything to Python would not only mean extra work, but a waste of time. Thanks for making a few valid points as I may need to curb my enthusiasm and focus on what I need to get done now instead of fusing about what I could do later.


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    #5
    CreepingDeath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,016 ✭✭✭CreepingDeath


    Itzy wrote: »
    What I have suggested is, to port the entire language to one standard language. It was met with some skepticism and I was urged to maintain the project as is

    You only presented technical reasons/opinions, but no business reasons to refactor the existing code. They're not going to spend thousands of Euro just to make something technically cleaner, unless it doesn't cost much and has no extra development risk/testing required,
    something you cannot guarantee.
    Itzy wrote: »
    I have no earthly notion why someone would use Java to interact with a Manufacturing System, when all you want to do is pump data into a DB.

    Java is a robust enterprise language with JDBC drivers, transaction management, connection pooling, access to database & resultset metadata and the compiler/JIT compiler has been heavily optimised over the years. And that's just the standalone applications, under an application server there's clustering, load balancing, security etc too.

    Python is a beginners language in comparison, okay for little utilities but not for any heavy lifting.


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    #6
    Colonel Panic
    Registered Users Posts: 2,018 ✭✭✭Colonel Panic


    CreepingDeath wrote: »
    Python is a beginners language in comparison, okay for little utilities but not for any heavy lifting.

    While I won't dispute your comments about Java's suitability, I think this statement is a little unfair.

    Python's a mature language, fast, great for interop (which as another poster said, is something you see on big systems) and has a huge amount of 3rd party libraries out there and more than just designed for utilities.


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    #7
    Jim2007
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,026 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    CreepingDeath wrote: »
    Java is a robust enterprise language with JDBC drivers, transaction management, connection pooling, access to database & resultset metadata and the compiler/JIT compiler has been heavily optimized over the years. And that's just the standalone applications, under an application server there's clustering, load balancing, security etc too.

    Kinda reminds me of James Gosling's ramblings on Ruby On Rails some years ago where he actually spends most of his time going on about enterprise infrastructure and design patterns rather than the Java language!!!

    There are several languages including Python that are well capable of delivering enterprise level solutions in a more productive manner than Java is today. When we started out doing distributed style applications we used the tools we had available to us: Java, .Net, C++ etc... but we've nearly pushed them as far as they can go and new alternatives need to be considered...


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    #8
    Talisman
    Registered Users Posts: 6,027 ✭✭✭Talisman


    CreepingDeath wrote: »
    Python is a beginners language in comparison, okay for little utilities but not for any heavy lifting.
    :D

    I'm not sure Amazon or Google would agree.


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