Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12 (End of March 2012 onwards)

MD1990 · 27-04-2012 1:23pm

missingtime wrote: »

I'm a bit wary of Adam Johnson for some reason. Cant quite put my finger on it.

not a huge fan of him
he can beat a player now & again
but is tactically very poor
he wouldn't be much better than Downing

Kess73 · 27-04-2012 1:24pm

amiable wrote: »

Is that not gone?

Don't think so. Unless we are thinking of different spots.

amiable · 27-04-2012 1:26pm

Kess73 wrote: »

Don't think so. Unless we are thinking of different spots.

At the back of Dunnes Howleys Quay?
Behind the Franciscans

mormank · 27-04-2012 1:32pm

-Ade- wrote: »

Fiorentina were the latest club in Italy to be linked with Aquilani last weekend, pretty much a like for like replacement for Monolivio who will be a Milan player more than likely.

Said it before, but I just want a conclusion to this seemingly never ending saga as it is beyond tedious and ridiculous for that matter. Of course, I'd love to keep him but so long as he wanted to to stay and give 100%. But if he wants out, just get rid asap before we lose him for next to nothing.. which is what I also see happening if I'm honest. Again, I just want it concluded really no matter the outcome.

I think at his point to say you want a conclusion is to say you want him gone. If he is playing for us come the end of the transfer window in September it will not end anything. The rumours and speculation will still be flying around each window.

Kess73 · 27-04-2012 1:40pm

amiable wrote: »

At the back of Dunnes Howleys Quay?
Behind the Franciscans

Yeah same spot. That green area is still there. People feed the swans there during the day and in the evenings people stick needles into themselves there.

You looking forward to your trip next weekend? Is going to be a pretty rushed weekend for me. Have the cup final on the Saturday and have to be in Limerick the next day for the marathon.

mormank · 27-04-2012 1:47pm

MD1990 wrote: »

not a huge fan of him
he can beat a player now & again
but is tactically very poor
he wouldn't be much better than Downing

Personally I think that the right environment is most important for a player to flourish. So to say that Johnson wouldn't be better than Downing or vica versa is really hard to judge. Basically if a player finds the right club where they play the type of football he likes and even more importantly where he can get the gametime required to develop then he will progress and if not he won't. Obviously talent is required to succeed also. I would use the likes of Joe Cole and Shaun Wright Phillips as examples of two players who ten years ago or so seemed to have the world at their feet but made really poor choices for their career by moving to Chelsea when they did and for SWP his move back to City was a poor choice also. Johnson is now facing a similar fate imo if he decides to stay where he is.

Having said all that, I would love to see Johnson come to us. We won't know for sure if he would be a success with us til it's too late in terms of paying a fee but I think he has shown more than enough to suggest he could succeed with us in an areaof the field we have been sorely lacking in since Macca left 13 years ago.

amiable · 27-04-2012 1:51pm

Kess73 wrote: »

Yeah same spot. That green area is still there. People feed the swans there during the day and in the evenings people stick needles into themselves there.

You looking forward to your trip next weekend? Is going to be a pretty rushed weekend for me. Have the cup final on the Saturday and have to be in Limerick the next day for the marathon.

I thought the poor mans Kilkee was gone.
It was always a haven for that element(not the hardcore bird feeders)

I can't fcukin wait for it to be honest. I'm not sure where I'll be sitting yet as I only collect my tickets when I get there.
I got my weeks mixed up this morning and only realised that it's next week.

No beers in London so for you.
I'll make up for you

amiable · 27-04-2012 1:57pm

Is there many others heading over to the game next week?

Kess73 · 27-04-2012 2:03pm

amiable wrote: »

I thought the poor mans Kilkee was gone.
It was always a haven for that element(not the hardcore bird feeders)

I can't fcukin wait for it to be honest. I'm not sure where I'll be sitting yet as I only collect my tickets when I get there.
I got my weeks mixed up this morning and only realised that it's next week.
No beers in London so for you.
I'll make up for you

No drinkies at all for me

Mr Alan · 27-04-2012 2:11pm

From Twitter

Note that in 9 games Aquilani started for LFC from Jan '10, LFC went 6-2-1. Aquilani had 2 goals, 6 assists, hit post twice in those games

Leiva · 27-04-2012 2:14pm

Jen Chang ‏ @JenChang88 Aquilani's father tells TuttoMercatoWeb that he doesn't think Milan will buy Alberto & that the midfielder will return to England in summer

.

spockety · 27-04-2012 2:29pm

Leiva wrote: »

.

He'll be like a new signing!!

machiavellianme · 27-04-2012 2:32pm

Mr Alan wrote: »

From Twitter

Since when did number of times the post was hit become part of a players form stats?

El Inho · 27-04-2012 2:34pm

spockety wrote: »

He'll be like a new signing!!

Mr Alan · 27-04-2012 2:38pm

machiavellianme wrote: »

Since when did number of times the post was hit become part of a players form stats?

Ignore that part so. I think the point being made was he offered a serious attacking threat from midfield.

Leiva · 27-04-2012 2:39pm

I wouldn't mind for one minute having him in the squad for the whole of next season, in fact he could be quite successful and extend his contract.

I am never usually this optimistic so leave me alone .

opr · 27-04-2012 2:39pm

machiavellianme wrote: »

Since when did number of times the post was hit become part of a players form stats?

Obviously it's a key statistic we have looked for in players. Have you not been watching this season?

Opr

OwaynOTT · 27-04-2012 2:50pm

Yeah he can put the ball in the back of the net but can he do well in the crossbar challenge?

klose · 27-04-2012 2:59pm

Coates might be shipped out on loan this summer apparently or so Twitter says, pretty ****ty means carra will be first preference on the bench if he does.

Then again more game time can only be good, would've preferred it for us tho..

Hopefully rumour

Leiva · 27-04-2012 3:02pm

whippedcream wrote: »

Coates might be shipped out on loan this summer apparently or so Twitter says, pretty ****ty means carra will be first preference on the bench if he does.

Then again more game time can only be good, would've preferred it for us tho..

Hopefully just Twitter crap.

Not a hope I would say .

If this ends up to be true I might just punch myself in the balls

Kess73 · 27-04-2012 3:05pm

Mr Alan wrote: »

Ignore that part so. I think the point being made was he offered a serious attacking threat from midfield.

He looked very good at times during his run outs that season. Was well able to recycle the ball, to spot runs and to spread the play. His assists showed that he was effective in a team that was not doing well.

Funny thing is that another player did pretty well that season in terms of assists and was either the second or third highest assist getting that season. Like Aquilani he was much maligned at times despite having far more decent to good games than he did poor games. Who was it? Our ex left back Insua.

Leiva · 27-04-2012 3:09pm

He was super during our pre-season Asia tour, and played with great attitude and like someone who was content .

That is why I was surprised when it looked like he was manoeuvring another loan move .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_DCxH6jU08

Aqua in front of Lucas could work very well

El Inho · 27-04-2012 3:33pm

heard today carroll is being shipped out on loan as part of a massive team overhaul...that coates rumour is what reminded me...

heard from a guy who likes his gossip, but often wrong.

anyone heard anything?

daithijjj · 27-04-2012 3:36pm

Anyone got a link to Comolli interview with FOX?

Edit......nevermind, theres a podcast up later.

djPSB · 27-04-2012 3:50pm

Leiva wrote: »

Seriously ? Really . Ok !

I just think Johnson would be a big upgrade on what we have today. Yes the price tag could be a big problem.

But to say Dzeko and Carroll are on a par is (IMO) very very wrong.

I would hope that in three years time, when Carroll is 26 that he would be at a similar level to what Dzeko is at now.

djPSB · 27-04-2012 3:55pm

Kess73 wrote: »

Totally agree. Dzeko has had far less minutes on the pitch this season for City than Carroll has had for us yet has more goals to his name. Dzeko is still close to a goal every two games he is involved with( and I am including the 8 games in which he came on after the 82 minute as games for arguements sake)

Carroll with more minutes played is looking at a goal every 8 or so games.

Dzeko has a striker's goals to game ratio, whereas Carroll has one that would not be outstanding for a midfielder.

Dzeko is playing in a team that has scored 86 League goals with gifted players like Silva around him.

Carroll is playing in a team that has a banjaxed attacking system with a bottom half of the table standard midfield for the most part of the season. And a pathetic 40 goals so far this season for the whole team. Even players like Suarez look average under such conditions.

Just saying.

noodler · 27-04-2012 4:01pm

Dubit10 wrote: »

I don't rate Dzecko any higher than Carroll tbh.

Literally everything about Dzeko this season has been better.

Jayob10 · 27-04-2012 4:02pm

daithijjj wrote: »

Anyone got a link to Comolli interview with FOX?

Edit......nevermind, theres a podcast up later.

whats the title of that podcast?

I don't think there will be any dirty laundry aired publicly though, id imagine there'd be some sort of no disclosure clause as part of his "mutual consent" termination.

amiable · 27-04-2012 4:02pm

Daemonic · 27-04-2012 4:06pm

Thinking back to the video of them arguing in a hotel reception that was posted around the web at the start of the season, I wonder if Aquilani going out on loan was another blot on Comolli's copybook. Maybe some falling out between the 2 that resulted in Aquilani going from looking content in pre-season to being loaned out again.

Before anyone asks, absolutely nothing other than a boring Friday afternoon in work has led to the ramblings above.

El Inho · 27-04-2012 4:08pm

amiable wrote: »

kid'll love that photo in the future!

keeper in the making!

El Inho · 27-04-2012 4:09pm

Daemonic wrote: »

Thinking back to the video of them arguing in a hotel reception that was posted around the web at the start of the season, I wonder if Aquilani going out on loan was another blot on Comolli's copybook. Maybe some falling out between the 2 that resulted in Aquilani going from looking content in pre-season to being loaned out again.

Before anyone asks, absolutely nothing other than a boring Friday afternoon in work has led to the ramblings above.

fair point...

but...............

very possibly Aqua may be willing to return, but I doubt Comolli has much in the day to day running of the squad, and so his departure has little bearing on Aquas return.

daithijjj · 27-04-2012 4:09pm

Jayob10 wrote: »

whats the title of that podcast?

I don't think there will be any dirty laundry aired publicly though, id imagine there'd be some sort of no disclosure clause as part of his "mutual consent" termination.

Its not online yet but will put up a link asap or you can follow @BobbySoccerRep

I want to hear it before i make comment but apparently (and its no surprise to me) he talks about 'moneyball' not being right for soccer. Its basically a bit like what stats dont tell you. Motivation of players, their mentality etc. Apparently he says he made a mistake with one player. But will have to hear what is said first.

Sappy404 · 27-04-2012 4:10pm

eldwaro wrote: »

heard today carroll is being shipped out on loan as part of a massive team overhaul...that coates rumour is what reminded me...

heard from a guy who likes his gossip, but often wrong.

anyone heard anything?

Makes zero sense to loan him out.

Jayob10 · 27-04-2012 4:13pm

Daemonic wrote: »

Thinking back to the video of them arguing in a hotel reception that was posted around the web at the start of the season, I wonder if Aquilani going out on loan was another blot on Comolli's copybook. Maybe some falling out between the 2 that resulted in Aquilani going from looking content in pre-season to being loaned out again.

Before anyone asks, absolutely nothing other than a boring Friday afternoon in work has led to the ramblings above.

If anything i'd imagine it was Aquilani pushing for a move home, rather than being unhappy at being told he wasn't wanted.

I'd imagine he felt unwanted after his first loan move to Juventus. I think I remember reading stories about his family being very reluctant to move back to Liverpool last summer, his wife had given birth in Italy too.

The club needed to be firm though, hes our player. No point letting him go on a pointless (both financially and in a football sense) loan move where its win win for the recipient club, and lose lose for us.

El Inho · 27-04-2012 4:13pm

Sappy404 wrote: »

Makes zero sense to loan him out.

id be against it, but just saying ive heard it....

and if we were bringing a new striker, it would make sense really...

then try get some old fogie on free or cheap who can be back up.

Kess73 · 27-04-2012 4:14pm

djPSB wrote: »

I would hope that in three years time, when Carroll is 26 that he would be at a similar level to what Dzeko is at now.

If Carroll was even close to the player that Dzeko was when he was 21,22, or 23 then we would be laughing

At those ages Dzeko was getting 36 goals in 42 games and 29 goals in 48 games in the Bundesliga.

Dzeko showed great potential along with being able to consistently score goals against any opposition from a young age, and as he went up against better defences his goal getting seemed to step up a level as well.

Carroll by 23 has not shown anything like the potential Dzeko had by the time he turned 23. Hell in the Bundesliga season where Dzeko was 21 when he started it and 22 when he finished it he scored almost as many goals as Carroll has scored for Newcastle, Preston and Liverpool in the EPL and Championship.

No comparison between the two players age for age or in terms of potential they have shown in their careers to date.

Dzeko has been a genuinely sought talent, whereas Carroll has been an example of the hype given to English players if they have a decent run in the EPL. The 11 goals he scored for Newcastle in the 10/11 season is pretty much what has made his name. Those 11 goals seems to be what qualified him to be called premiership proven.

His only other career highlight is scoring 19 goals in all comps in the Championship. But if people here write off the French league or the Portoguese league as being a marker of player quality, then the same can be done for the Championship as it is certainly a few levels below the second tier of European leagues.

I have to admit I was guilty of buying into the Carroll hype and before this season started I went as far as to say that I thought he would outscore Suarez this season and that the disinterested headless chicken player that I saw in the final months of the 10/11 season was one created by time out injured and lack of fitness. I think this season the real Andy Carroll stood up. One that is better suited to a team that will put players around him to do his running and his donkey work for him, as Newcastle were set up at one point.

But as we have seen with Newcastle, a team that sets itself up around Carroll is a team that scraps to get by and to survive, whereas a team that gets rid of Carroll and those that do his donkey work becomes a team that works together in the true sense of the word team, and that can play clever neat football and attack with pace.

Leiva · 27-04-2012 4:14pm

Comolli FOX Interview.

From another forum ..

"Just listened to the Comolli interview on Fox Soccer

1) Thinks that DoF role is still useful in England

2) Made a mistake on a player that was "mentally" not strong enough. Any guesses?

3) Every transfer, no matter how much effort is put in, can be a failure.

That's the interview in a nutshell

...it has to be Carroll, but IMO there is more than just lack of the proper mentality .

Kess73 · 27-04-2012 4:15pm

Sappy404 wrote: »

Makes zero sense to loan him out.

Agreed. Just like Aquilani I would say either play him or sell him. We gain nothiong by loaning him and no doubt picking uchunk of his wage bill at the same time should he be loaned out.p a

redzerdrog · 27-04-2012 4:17pm

iirc comolli came out with some strange comments after aquilani was loaned something along the lines that aqua is a good player but unfortunetly he plays in the same position as steven gerrard so we had to let him leave.

Cany remember the exact comment but that was the gist of it. Then Gerrard misses half the season with injury:mad::mad::mad:

Kess73 · 27-04-2012 4:18pm

Leiva wrote: »

Comolli FOX Interview.

From another forum ..

...it has to be Carroll, but IMO there is more than just lack of the proper mentality .

You could guess that he means Carroll, but in fairness the same could be said for the other pair of big money English signings as well.

Would tend to agree that he means Carroll, but Downing would run him a close second imho.

Leiva · 27-04-2012 4:19pm

Kess73 wrote: »

But as we have seen with Newcastle, a team that sets itself up around Carroll is a team that scraps to get by and to survive, whereas a team that gets rid of Carroll and those that do his donkey work becomes a team that works together in the true sense of the word team, and that can play clever neat football and attack with pace.

^^this, this, and this again . with cherries on top, dipped in chocolate, rolled in sugar and finger fed to a pack of hungry lesbians .

El Inho · 27-04-2012 4:21pm

just going to go ahead and ask...

but does anyone else feel this overhaul is actually just a little bit likely?

Handsome Bob · 27-04-2012 4:25pm

Kess73 wrote: »

You could guess that he means Carroll, but in fairness the same could be said for the other pair of big money English signings as well.

Would tend to agree that he means Carroll, but Downing would run him a close second imho.

From what I've heard, it is surely Carroll. He wouldn't be the first to insinuate that Carroll's head is all over the place.

Kess73 · 27-04-2012 4:28pm

eldwaro wrote: »

just going to go ahead and ask...

but does anyone else feel this overhaul is actually just a little bit likely?

Depends on what you mean by overhaul.

If you mean that we still need to fill the exact same positions in the first team as we did going into last summer, and that we have to buy for those positions again. Then yes I think there will be another attempt at an overhaul of the first team, with maybe three players bought to step straight into the first team.

If you mean overhaul in terms of a new manager, backroom staff etc., then I still believe that is going to happen and I think that it might be interesting to watch Kenny when the final whistle goes after the final home game of the season (against Chelsea).

I'm not in the Kenny out camp, and would be happy to see him stay and and see if he can learn from some of this seasons mistakes, and also to see if he can be ruthless with the current squad. But for some months now I have been singing from only one sheet with regards to this summer, and it is still the same rumour/gossip that I brought up in here last Febuary or so.

Leiva · 27-04-2012 4:28pm

eldwaro wrote: »

just going to go ahead and ask...

but does anyone else feel this overhaul is actually just a little bit likely?

That is the biggest thing that hurts out of all the crap flying around . When I look at the squad and compare it to any team currently above us I get a little pang of concern in my chest, as it obvious to see that we are static and have the potential to slip further backwards unless there is wholesale changes to our squad . which includes moving some players that got bought in the last two windows .

But its not only changes of personnel as I would like to see players like Gerrard , Carra (obviously) and others weaned out of the squad quickly.
Then I think of Gerrards performance against Everton and it makes me rethink, but those performances are too few and far between to rely on him to any extent, and I also think we play better without him .

So to summarise - I think there is massive changes required !

Nuri Sahin · 27-04-2012 4:29pm

I'm a Dzeko fan as anyone who knows me can testify to. Was delighted but not surprised seeing him do well when given a run of games at the start of the season for Man City, but just looking back at his time at Wolfsburg. He was a very good goalscorer for a couple of seasons but he also had a strike partner in Grafite who was an absolute machine in front of goal as well. At the time, they were up there with the best strike partnerships in world football IMO for the games to goals ratio.

They also had the very underrated Misimovic and Hasebe at the time providing assist after assist. Would have been hard not to be scoring in that team.

Would I have Dzeko at Liverpool though? Damn right I would. If he started regularly for City he'd be scoring goals again, and with the amount of chances we've created this season and given a run of games I say he could easily do the same for us.

Kess73 · 27-04-2012 4:29pm

Handsome Bob wrote: »

From what I've heard, it is surely Carroll. He wouldn't be the first to insinuate that Carroll's head is all over the place.

He certainly would not. Pundits and locals have been saying this for quite some time about the guy.

daithijjj · 27-04-2012 4:34pm

I think people are a little harsh on Downing, ultimately, he was bought to provide chances, he has 'provided' quite well. The price we paid is not his problem, its Comolli's, or was. Comolli's remit, which came from the owners, was, "we have to be smart in the market". We were not, and he lost his job.

In recent enough times Downing has done quite well, you can put it on Carroll's head all day, its he who has to score or not miss sitters like the start of the second half of the semi final. Downing was great at home to city in the semi, got motm in the final, arguably our best player at QPR. He has done better than some, but he will never win people over if the price is brought into it. He would have a dozen assists minimum imho if we had a Fowler up front, we dont.

Kess73 · 27-04-2012 4:37pm

-Ade- wrote: »

I'm a Dzeko fan as anyone who knows me can testify to. Was delighted but not surprised seeing him do well when given a run of games at the start of the season for Man City, but just looking back at his time at Wolfsburg. He was a very good goalscorer for a couple of seasons but he also had a strike partner in Grafite who was an absolute machine in front of goal as well. At the time, they were up there with the best strike partnerships in world football IMO for the games to goals ratio.

They also had the very underrated Misimovic and Hasebe at the time providing assist after assist. Would have been hard not to be scoring in that team.

Would I have Dzeko at Liverpool though? Damn right I would. If he started regularly for City he'd be scoring goals again, and with the amount of chances we've created this season and given a run of games I say he could easily do the same for us.

The simplest way I can describe the difference between Dzeko and Carroll is something you just touched on in this post.

Dzeko in a team that creates chances means goals

Carroll in a team that creates chances does not mean goals.

I have no doubt that if Carroll was at City this season and Dzeko was at Liverpool that Dzeko would have hoovered up a hell of a lot of the chances that were created and would be ahead of Carroll in terms of goals.

Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12 (End of March 2012 onwards)

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