M50 Toll Penalties.

frankmulveen · 27-02-2013 1:10pm #1

Hello,

Neglected to pay for 3 journeys. Long story, good reasons. Eventually got solicitors' letter demanding 439.50 euros or they will take me to court. I sent a postal order for 9 euros ( 3 journey original fee) to eFlow and they returned it to me saying it was out of their hands. I then sent it to their solicitors twice with letters defending my late payments and they returned it to me twice. They are now willing to accept payment of 238.50 euros or they will take me to court for the full amount. I have 3 questions:

1. Do I stand any chance of winning this case in court?
2. Have they the legal right to impose penalties this high?
3. Should I cut my losses and pay the 238.50 and be wiser in future?

Thank you.

listermint · 27-02-2013 1:11pm

Cut your loses and pay the lower figure they quoted.

You evaded a fare and got fined. Very simple really.

HeidiHeidi · 27-02-2013 1:13pm

What good reason could you have for not paying €9 in tolls to the point where the penalties escalated to that much?

Genuine question.

ETA - in answer to your specific questions -

1. I've no idea
2. I suppose that depends on your good reasons, but there's certainly no shortage of notifications of obligation to pay
3. Again, depends on your good reasons

seamus · 27-02-2013 1:18pm

1. No
2. Yes
3. Yes

"Good reasons" for not paying the toll and subsequent penalties would include long-term hospitalisation within the 24 hours after you passed through the toll or a sudden unexpected emergency which required you to leave the country for a few months.

No other excuses are really going to wash, especially in court.

sellerbarry · 27-02-2013 1:18pm

Open a tag account with them and they will drop all charges re solicitors etc. Did it myself with over 800 owed.

frankmulveen · 27-02-2013 1:33pm

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

What good reason could you have for not paying €9 in tolls to the point where the penalties escalated to that much?

Genuine question.

ETA - in answer to your specific questions -

1. I've no idea
2. I suppose that depends on your good reasons, but there's certainly no shortage of notifications of obligation to pay
3. Again, depends on your good reasons

Journey 1: Galway to Dublin airport. Missed flight.
Journey 2: Dublin to Galway.
Got notification for Journey 1 and paid it. (6 euros).
Journey 3:Galway to Dublin airport 2 days later.
Out of country for 1 week.
Returned and found notification for 46 euros for Journey 2.
Some time later received same for Journeys 3 & 4.
Left on 'long finger'.
Received notifications for 146 euros x3.
Received solicitors letter demanding 439 euros.
Sent postal order for 3 euros x3 to eFlow.
Postal order returned by eFlow.
Sent letter an p.o. for 9 euros to solicitors.
Solicitors returned p.o. rejecting reasons in letter.
Sent further letter and p.o. to solicitors.
Solicitors returned p.o. agreeing to accept 238 euros.
Sent p.o. and further letter to solicitors.
Received phone call from solicitors saying 238 euros must be paid and they would not accept installments.

Sorry it's so long winded but those are the facts.

Lapin · 27-02-2013 1:40pm

Why didn't you pay it at the airport ?

The most interesting thing I see in the op is that the solicitors cut the initial demand by over €200.

Thats a serious drop and shows how they'll try to get away with as much as they can to begin with.

Doesn't do much for their reputation in my opinion.

seamus · 27-02-2013 1:41pm

frankmulveen wrote: »

Left on 'long finger'.

You haven't a hope of challenging this in court, if this is your excuse for not paying.

I'm not being judgemental, just stating the facts. From your description you haven't really provided any reasons why you were unable to pay the toll before 8pm on the day after you incurred it.

HeidiHeidi · 27-02-2013 1:55pm

frankmulveen wrote: »

Journey 1: Galway to Dublin airport. Missed flight.
Journey 2: Dublin to Galway.
Got notification for Journey 1 and paid it. (6 euros).
Journey 3:Galway to Dublin airport 2 days later.
Out of country for 1 week.
Returned and found notification for 46 euros for Journey 2.
Some time later received same for Journeys 3 & 4.
Left on 'long finger'.
Received notifications for 146 euros x3.
Received solicitors letter demanding 439 euros.
Sent postal order for 3 euros x3 to eFlow.
Postal order returned by eFlow.
Sent letter an p.o. for 9 euros to solicitors.
Solicitors returned p.o. rejecting reasons in letter.
Sent further letter and p.o. to solicitors.
Solicitors returned p.o. agreeing to accept 238 euros.
Sent p.o. and further letter to solicitors.
Received phone call from solicitors saying 238 euros must be paid and they would not accept installments.

Sorry it's so long winded but those are the facts.

Agree that the "long finger" bit jumps out - that ain't a valid reason I'm afraid.

Also, did getting the notification for journey 1 not prompt you that you also owed for journey 2? (I assume these were on the same day). And also to have toll payment uppermost in your mind when you made journey 3 through the toll 2 days later?

I also don't mean to come across as judgemental - I'm the world's worst for forgetting to pay the toll as I use it so infrequently, don't think I ever only paid just €3 - so I eventually set up a video account which automatically deducts it and I now can't forget. I recommend you set one of these up asap!

frankmulveen · 27-02-2013 2:02pm

seamus wrote: »

You haven't a hope of challenging this in court, if this is your excuse for not paying.

I'm not being judgemental, just stating the facts. From your description you haven't really provided any reasons why you were unable to pay the toll before 8pm on the day after you incurred it.

I was so pissed off having missed the flight for our wedding overseas that it was the furthest thing from my mind. 2 days later we were out of the country after rescheduling flights and wedding plans. Came back and received the first penalties. Then the higher penalties. They don't waste time do they? I am self employed and usually have to wait 30 days to get paid. One customer kept me waiting 9 months! If I took the same approach with my customers as eFlow does I would not have any customers!

I think it is unfair and wondered if it was unconstitutional to penalise people in this manner and to such an extent. However I guess there is no point in challenging the system. Will just be smarter in future. Will make sure I have a process set up to pay the 3 euros or avoid the M50 altogether.

Thanks to everyone for their inputs.

HeidiHeidi · 27-02-2013 2:08pm

frankmulveen wrote: »

I was so pissed off having missed the flight for our wedding overseas that it was the furthest thing from my mind. 2 days later we were out of the country after rescheduling flights and wedding plans. Came back and received the first penalties. Then the higher penalties. They don't waste time do they? I am self employed and usually have to wait 30 days to get paid. One customer kept me waiting 9 months! If I took the same approach with my customers as eFlow does I would not have any customers!

I think it is unfair and wondered if it was unconstitutional to penalise people in this manner and to such an extent. However I guess there is no point in challenging the system. Will just be smarter in future. Will make sure I have a process set up to pay the 3 euros or avoid the M50 altogether.

Thanks to everyone for their inputs.

There's no charge for the video account, takes all the hassle out of it. And it's only 2.50 (I think!) for the toll, so a bit cheaper as well. http://www.eflow.ie/payment

frankmulveen · 27-02-2013 2:10pm

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

Agree that the "long finger" bit jumps out - that ain't a valid reason I'm afraid.

Also, did getting the notification for journey 1 not prompt you that you also owed for journey 2? (I assume these were on the same day). And also to have toll payment uppermost in your mind when you made journey 3 through the toll 2 days later?

I also don't mean to come across as judgemental - I'm the world's worst for forgetting to pay the toll as I use it so infrequently, don't think I ever only paid just €3 - so I eventually set up a video account which automatically deducts it and I now can't forget. I recommend you set one of these up asap!

Thanks HeidiHeidi, I didn't know about the video account. Will set it up even though I only use the M50 once in a blue moon it will stop this situation arising again.

Alun · 27-02-2013 2:12pm

I think it's €2.60 after the latest increases. Still cheaper than the €3.10 cash payment though.

lil5 · 27-02-2013 2:16pm

I also second the video account for occassional use. Got stung with paying toll+penalty a few times in the past.

Think current price is 2.60 for the video account.

I also don't agree with their penalty procedures -
http://www.eflow.ie/tolls/

If you’re not registered with eFlow or any other tag provider, use of the M50 toll road requires you to make your toll payment before 8:00pm the following day. If you do not make payment by this time, an extra penalty charge of €3.00 will be incurred.

If you haven’t paid the toll and the penalty within a further 14 days, an additional late penalty of €41.00 (formerly €40.00) will be incurred.

Failure to pay this outstanding amount after a further 56 days will result in an additional late penalty charge of €102.50 (formerly €100.50). If you have still not paid the amount due, legal proceedings may be initiated.

monkeypants · 27-02-2013 2:17pm

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

set up a video account which automatically deducts it and I now can't forget. I recommend you set one of these up asap!

+1

I did this last year as I'm an infrequent M50 user. Costs me nothing, in fact it saves me money on the toll (50c cheaper per journey) and because the cost is deducted automatically each month, I cannot forget to pay. An email is sent to me each month detailing the deduction. Some months there is nothing to pay. Got another car now and added it in less than thirty seconds. Well worth it just to avoid the hassle.

Another option is to pay in advance for the journey, but you'll still have to remember to do that.

Technoprisoner · 27-02-2013 2:22pm

you should check the m50 bylaws in the road traffic act. I think from memory its says something about as long as the fee is paid there will be no court action and i dont think there is any mention of penalty's. Confirm this yourself and if it is the case just go into a shop and pay the fees. That should cover them accepting payment

eFlow: Reps · 28-02-2013 11:42am

Hi all,

The best way to avoid unfortunate situations such as this occurring is to setup a Video Registered a/c with eFlow. The advantages are:

Its free. No setup, monthly, annual fees of any kind. If you don't use the M50 toll, you pay nothing.
Instant cover for up to 6 vehicles (more for business a/c's)
M50 tolls discounted by €0.50
No 'before 8pm' payment deadlines
No penalties
Automatic payments
Online a/c management and statements
Online a/c setup at www.eflow.ie

If you are the occasional M50 user (once or twice a year) then this is the best solution for your M50 Tolls. If you use the M50 more than 2 time a month, an eFlow Tag a/c is best (€1.00 M50 Toll discount applies to Tags). eFlow Tags allow you to use the express lanes with every toll in the ROI.

If anyone would like to contact me directly, please use a PM.

Hope this helps,

John and the eFlow Team

BanTheEflow · 24-10-2014 1:54pm

Hi Frank,

your reasons seem very reasonable to me. what are we becoming, we are like sheep. You miss a flight and it costs you €439. For driving on a road we have already paid for. It is just bad law. Their is no justification for this sort of cost, you could commit a crime and have a smaller penalty. We need to stand up to these bureaucratic thugs.

km991148 · 24-10-2014 2:03pm

BanTheEflow wrote: »

Hi Frank,

your reasons seem very reasonable to me. what are we becoming, we are like sheep. You miss a flight and it costs you €439. For driving on a road we have already paid for. It is just bad law. Their is no justification for this sort of cost, you could commit a crime and have a smaller penalty. We need to stand up to these bureaucratic thugs.

The reason for it going to 439 is because the op put the repayment on the long finger. There were various other stages before it got this bad - i.e. soon after the journey it was only at 46eur.

I don't mean to sound harsh - but a phone call would have sorted this way sooner. I have forgotten tolls various times and phoning within a week or two normally gets the 6eur price.

BuffyBot · 24-10-2014 2:13pm

Zombie thread

M50 Toll Penalties.

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