Sky TV in apartments via microwave transmission

kevpatts · 17-08-2015 6:50pm #1

Hey,

Got a leaflet saying that Sky is now available in my apartment block without s dish. I know historically this was done by using a large common disk wired to all apartments, but there isn't one in our block.

When I called up Sky they checked my address and confirmed that it is available on the microwave network or something like that (we're near Three Rock mountain).

Has anyone used this service? They told me that all services are available over this and that it's the same set top box as normal.

Kevpatts

Kensington · 17-08-2015 8:31pm

It will be a dish on the roof of the apartment, normally out of sight from the ground. The dish will be linked to each apartment by fibre optic cable, about 2mm in diameter.

Sky don't do microwave - they'd need a horrendous amount of bandwidth and it just wouldn't make sense when you can see the south-eastern sky.

kevpatts · 17-08-2015 8:40pm

That's what I thought, and it definitely wouldn't be the same type of set top box if they did.

lawred2 · 19-08-2015 2:59pm

kevpatts wrote: »

Hey,

Got a leaflet saying that Sky is now available in my apartment block without s dish. I know historically this was done by using a large common disk wired to all apartments, but there isn't one in our block.

When I called up Sky they checked my address and confirmed that it is available on the microwave network or something like that (we're near Three Rock mountain).

Has anyone used this service? They told me that all services are available over this and that it's the same set top box as normal.

Kevpatts

that'll be done by a Limerick based crowd called KBO

lawred2 · 19-08-2015 3:00pm

kevpatts wrote: »

That's what I thought, and it definitely wouldn't be the same type of set top box if they did.

it is 100% the exact same box

in your apartment will be a 4 way splitter which takes in optical signal and splits it to 4 analog signals..

It's effectively the exact same as having your own dish with a Quad LNB.

alan.p22 · 19-08-2015 9:51pm

It's effectively the exact same as having your own dish with a Quad LNB.

If i got this in would i get the same servies as i do on satellite.eg red button

Thurston? · 19-08-2015 9:56pm

alan.p22 wrote: »

If i got this in would i get the same servies as i do on satellite.eg red button

It is satellite they're talking about here. Just that the signal from the dish is delivered to each dwelling over fibre cable.

ABC101 · 19-08-2015 9:59pm

Kensington wrote: »

It will be a dish on the roof of the apartment, normally out of sight from the ground. The dish will be linked to each apartment by fibre optic cable, about 2mm in diameter.

Sky don't do microwave - they'd need a horrendous amount of bandwidth and it just wouldn't make sense when you can see the south-eastern sky.

Just a query, why is fibre optic used from the dish to each apartment? I thought coax would be sufficient enough as it is.

Is it due to power / amplifier requirements?

alan.p22 · 19-08-2015 10:27pm

no dishes allowed in the apartment block i am in so would this discount me or am i missing something?

Thurston? · 19-08-2015 10:38pm

alan.p22 wrote: »

no dishes allowed in the apartment block i am in so would this discount me or am i missing something?

There obviously has to be a dish located somewhere, for reception from the satellite.

What's being discussed here is a communal system, with a single dish feeding multiple dwellings, in this case using fibre carrying optical signals rather than coaxial cable with metal conductors carrying electrical signals.

ABC101 · 20-08-2015 1:12am

Apartments come with strict conditions for private balconies etc.

No washing lines, no sat dishes etc.

However it is still possible to install a large dish on the top of a apartment block.

The dish is out of sight from the ground.

The dish then feeds the apartments which require the Sky service.

I don't see why Fibre Optic has to be used in this configuration, when Co Ax is perfectly suitable.

Where Sky would be supplied via Fibre is in conjunction with very high speed internet service provider which uses fibre to the home (FTTH), 300 Mbs + speeds etc. But there would be no sat dish used here, the sky signal would come via the Internet service provider Fibre cable.

Thurston? · 20-08-2015 7:50am

ABC101 wrote: »

I don't see why Fibre Optic has to be used in this configuration, when Co Ax is perfectly suitable.

My knowledge on this is limited to online reading & a couple of magazine articles from a few years back but, to the best of my knowledge, fibre has far greater bandwidth than coaxial cable: for trunk cables, to get the full satellite broadcast band between distribution points, a single fibre cable can do what is generally done by 4 coax cables. This saves on cable as well as being neater/more convenient: 1 x 3mm fibre v. 4 x 6 - 7mm coax.

Also, the optical signal suffers far less from attenuation than electrical signals in coaxial cable, so easier to maintain proper signal levels across the system, probably just needing attenuation of overly strong signals near the source, rather than amplification further along.

Really, I suppose it's up to the system designer to decide what suits best re. material costs, installation convenience etc.

afatbollix · 20-08-2015 7:54am

Would be to do with distance too.

Also best to future proof these kinds of things. If Sky want to use fibre let them.

lawred2 · 20-08-2015 9:03am

afatbollix wrote: »

Would be to do with distance too.

Also best to future proof these kinds of things. If Sky want to use fibre let them.

It has nothing to do with sky.

This infrastructure is put in place by a company called KBO. They get kick backs from sky for reaching customers that sky traditionally never could. But how it's done has nothing to do with sky.

helimachoptor · 20-08-2015 1:49pm

lawred2 wrote: »

It has nothing to do with sky.

This infrastructure is put in place by a company called KBO. They get kick backs from sky for reaching customers that sky traditionally never could. But how it's done has nothing to do with sky.

Who do you think pays for the infrastructure?
Not true on the rest, Sky pays the bills, Sky says how its done.

lawred2 · 20-08-2015 2:09pm

helimachoptor wrote: »

Who do you think pays for the infrastructure?
Not true on the rest, Sky pays the bills, Sky says how its done.

KBO and Sky are partners in delivering tv via FTTH.. This is entirely KBO's infrastructure.

We have a KBO solution in our estate. Having Sky is not a prerequisite. We use the satellite feed for freesat.

helimachoptor · 20-08-2015 2:15pm

lawred2 wrote: »

KBO and Sky are partners in delivering tv via FTTH.. This is entirely KBO's infrastructure.

We have a KBO solution in our estate. Having Sky is not a prerequisite. We use the satellite feed for freesat.

It's development specific, in some developments the builder/MC will have put in the infrastructure in others Sky pay for it.

If Sky pay they wont want freesat going over it

lawred2 · 20-08-2015 2:23pm

helimachoptor wrote: »

It's development specific, in some developments the builder/MC will have put in the infrastructure in others Sky pay for it.

If Sky pay they wont want freesat going over it

Can they stop freesat going over it? Once it reaches the house/apartment it's the same as any direct connection to a dish.

Just depends what STB you hook up whether you get Sky or Freesat.

helimachoptor · 20-08-2015 2:28pm

lawred2 wrote: »

Can they stop freesat going over it? Once it reaches the house/apartment it's the same as any direct connection to a dish.

Just depends what STB you hook up whether you get Sky or Freesat.

nope is the answer

The Cush · 20-08-2015 3:00pm

In that circumstance I assume if an apartment cancels their Sky sub its feed from the communal dish gets disconnected as Freesat would be an easy swap over.

winston_1 · 20-08-2015 7:12pm

lawred2 wrote: »

in your apartment will be a 4 way splitter which takes in optical signal and splits it to 4 analog signals..

They are not analogue signals, they are four digital signals as you would as you would get off an LNB.

lawred2 · 21-08-2015 9:06am

winston_1 wrote: »

They are not analogue signals, they are four digital signals as you would as you would get off an LNB.

soz of course.. meant electrical signal

blue_blue · 21-08-2015 8:38pm

ABC101 wrote: »

Just a query, why is fibre optic used from the dish to each apartment? I thought coax would be sufficient enough as it is.

Fibre is used because it's discreet. A lot of places with Sky By Apartment opt-in after the complex was constructed so it's difficult to retrofit cables to every apartment. If co-ax had to be retrofitted, you'd need to pull in a few cables (Sky recording boxes use 2 feeds currently but there's nothing to stop them from adding more if they find any reason i.e. like UPC, watch 1 channel whilst recording a bajillion others). Fibre strands can be run alongside the outside of the building & feed into resident's balconies/windows with minimal visual intrusions and each strand can support 4 feeds (the fibre strand goes into a splitter that has 4 F connector outputs).

Mimikyu · 22-08-2015 12:01pm

This post has been deleted.

kevpatts · 30-08-2015 2:42pm

Hey all,

Turns out its a moot point cause when the installation engineer arrived he said I needed a dish, which the apartment block don't allow.

By the European Commissions bill of human rights though they have to facilitate me to receive a satellite signal, so I'm negotiating with them whats the best way. http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-01-913_en.htm?locale=en

Thurston? · 30-08-2015 5:06pm

blue_blue wrote: »

... each strand can support 4 feeds (the fibre strand goes into a splitter that has 4 F connector outputs).

It'll support more than 4 ...

It can be terminated with a quattro unit (4 fixed feeds, 1 of each band/polarity sub-band) that can feed a multiswitch or switches. (Or the quad unit, with its 4 switchable feeds, could feed a quad compatible switch, where the switch effectively turns the quad into a quattro by keeping each feed permanently switched to 1 of each sub-band.)

Graham · 30-08-2015 5:40pm

kevpatts wrote: »

Hey all,

Turns out its a moot point cause when the installation engineer arrived he said I needed a dish, which the apartment block don't allow.

By the European Commissions bill of human rights though they have to facilitate me to receive a satellite signal, so I'm negotiating with them whats the best way. http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-01-913_en.htm?locale=en

Many people aren’t aware that despite protestations from neighbours, you have a statutory right to erect a satellite broadband or satellite TV dish on your property providing that:-

You own it
The property isn’t located in a “designated area” (Areas of Outstanding Natural Beauty, within National Parks and the Broads, in conservation areas or World Heritage sites).
There are no restrictive covenants in the deeds or lease of the property which specifically prevent satellite antennas.

Most Irish apartments have restrictive covenants.

kevpatts · 31-08-2015 8:26am

Graham wrote: »

Many people aren’t aware that despite protestations from neighbours, you have a statutory right to erect a satellite broadband or satellite TV dish on your property providing that:-
You own it

The property isn’t located in a “designated area” (Areas of Outstanding Natural Beauty, within National Parks and the Broads, in conservation areas or World Heritage sites).

There are no restrictive covenants in the deeds or lease of the property which specifically prevent satellite antennas.

Most Irish apartments have restrictive covenants.

Graham,

Surely a EC bill of human rights invalidates any covenant that would contradict it.

bk · 31-08-2015 9:05am

Just to point out that not all communal dishes use Fiber unfortunately.

In the case of my building they ran large ugly thick coax cables down the walls of the building. Very ugly job :mad:

When the UPC lads came out to my building to bring cable to it, they were shocked at the job Sky did and said they would never do that. They ended up spending a lot more money coming up the risers from the basement inside the building.

The Cush wrote: »

In that circumstance I assume if an apartment cancels their Sky sub its feed from the communal dish gets disconnected as Freesat would be an easy swap over.

Same here, happily on Freesat for the last few years from communal dish.

Graham · 31-08-2015 9:10am

kevpatts wrote: »

Graham,

Surely a EC bill of human rights invalidates any covenant that would contradict it.

I'm not sure it's ever been tested in Irish Courts, if anyone has links to specific cases I'd be interested to see them.

Looking at the planning documents from several of the Local Authorities would suggest they're of the opinion they can still control the installation of more than 1 dish on a building.

There's also anecdotal evidence of apartment management companies removing dishes after owners have ignored requests to remove them.

I'd certainly be curious to follow anyone the progress of anyone that's prepared to challenge this in Court.

Graham · 31-08-2015 9:11am

bk wrote: »

Just to point out that not all communal dishes use Fiber unfortunately.

There was an article about this just last month, I wonder if the use of fibre is relatively new:

http://www.independent.ie/business/commercial-property/sky-challenges-for-apartment-services-31310032.html

helimachoptor · 31-08-2015 10:05am

majority of sky apartments have a fibre infrastructure

Thegalwayman · 01-09-2015 9:07pm

How many subscriptions (on average) would Sky need to agree to add communal dish. Live in a 40 apartment block all currently UPC/Virgin Media.
I'd say only 10 apartments would opt for Sky at the moment

helimachoptor · 01-09-2015 9:16pm

Dublin or regional?

Thegalwayman · 01-09-2015 9:21pm

helimachoptor wrote: »

Dublin or regional?

Galway City

helimachoptor · 01-09-2015 9:33pm

if you post your development on the talk to sky forum they can answer if its on the plan

http://www.boards.ie/ttfthread/2057445097

kevpatts · 02-09-2015 9:22am

helimachoptor wrote: »

if you post your development on the talk to sky forum they can answer if its on the plan

http://www.boards.ie/ttfthread/2057445097

Thanks for that link

Turtle-TM · 03-09-2015 8:27pm

I just for sky installed in our apartment by KBO on Tuesday.

Basically there is a shared dish on the roof, a fibre cable comes down into the facilities room in the apartment, gets connected into the UPC infrastructure that is there, then a splitter is used in the apartment coming from the UPC connection to split the signal to the 2 connections on the sky+ box. Signal is perfect.

only issue is if you have your broadband through that connection too it will need to be moved to a different outlet, unless you can live with not having the record function on your box.

Thegalwayman · 03-09-2015 9:53pm

Turtle-TM wrote: »

I just for sky installed in our apartment by KBO on Tuesday.

Basically there is a shared dish on the roof, a fibre cable comes down into the facilities room in the apartment, gets connected into the UPC infrastructure that is there, then a splitter is used in the apartment coming from the UPC connection to split the signal to the 2 connections on the sky+ box. Signal is perfect.

only issue is if you have your broadband through that connection too it will need to be moved to a different outlet, unless you can live with not having the record function on your box.

Did sky pay for the install? Or did ye pay through the management company? Did every apartment sign up?

Turtle-TM · 04-09-2015 6:13pm

I didn't pay anything for installation. I had sent sky a request to tell me when it would be available as I tried to sign up a few months ago and they told me they were working on getting it to the apartments.

When mine was installed he was doing one other, and said he was out 3 times previously. It is 2 blocks of 16 apartments so not too many have signed up so far.

kevpatts · 09-09-2015 10:28am

Turns out we do have a shared dish in the apartment block, Sky just sent out the wrong installer!

winston_1 · 09-09-2015 11:18am

Turtle-TM wrote: »

I just for sky installed in our apartment by KBO on Tuesday.

Basically there is a shared dish on the roof, a fibre cable comes down into the facilities room in the apartment, gets connected into the UPC infrastructure that is there, then a splitter is used in the apartment coming from the UPC connection to split the signal to the 2 connections on the sky+ box.

It must be a bit more complicated than that as you cannot split satellite signals for sky.

Sky TV in apartments via microwave transmission

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