Why do Luas drivers not use the 'bell' all the time at junctions?

MJohnston · 28-01-2013 2:43pm #1

As per thread title, I'm wondering why this is as it wasn't always the case, I remember most drivers used to constantly play it (the ding-ding-ding sound) when entering an area with lots of pedestrians. Nowadays though, more often than not, they play it once and that's it - was on one the other day that was crossing O'Connell Street and did this and the driver seemed to be surprised when there were pedestrians on the tracks at the other side. I understand that most Dublin folks are probably aware of the sound and the trams, but the Luas passes through a lot of tourist heavy areas and it seems like it'd be fairly easy for them to keep the dinging going as much as possible to avoid accidents. Are there rules around this either preventing or promoting it's use?

Victor · 28-01-2013 2:50pm

If it is used all the time it loses it's meaning.

I'm sure the drivers and other street users don't want to hear the noise all the time either.

As to why people cross the road in front of trams - humans are intelligent, people are stupid.

MJohnston · 28-01-2013 2:56pm

Victor wrote: »

If it is used all the time it loses it's meaning.

I'm sure the drivers and other street users don't want to hear the noise all the time either.

As to why people cross the road in front of trams - humans are intelligent, people are stupid.

I didn't say all the time, as in every second - I said whenever they are at junctions, particularly crowded ones. And I hear car engines all the time, but they've never lost the meaning of "they will crush you"

Mr Simpson · 28-01-2013 3:00pm

Do you use your horn every time you drive through a junction? No? Thats because if you did, then it would serve no purpose as an emergency warning

Captain Chaos · 28-01-2013 3:18pm

MarkMc wrote: »

Do you use your horn every time you drive through a junction? No? Thats because if you did, then it would serve no purpose as an emergency warning

That's not a like for like situation at all. This is light rail, it can't avoid anything, has alot of mass behind it and takes longer to stop.

But the luas have a bell and a horn. They save the horn for serious events or being blocked by traffic. They should use the bell more often. Like American trains leave their bell on when going through crossings, shunting and stations but give warnings with their horns first and then leave the bell on.

AlekSmart · 28-01-2013 3:37pm

MJohnston wrote: »

I didn't say all the time, as in every second - I said whenever they are at junctions, particularly crowded ones. And I hear car engines all the time, but they've never lost the meaning of "they will crush you"

Does nobody understand the meaning of "Mind Yourself" any more in this country ?

Just stand and observe the carry-on at O Connell St/Abbey St Luas crossing any day and tell me honestly if any form of warning device would make a difference.

How about using your basic sense of self-preservation,take the presence of tracks,and mobile 40 mtr long vehicles as warning in itself,or is that beyond what should be expected of us ?

If the Luas drivers adopt the procedure desired by the OP there is the added possibility of this.....

Train horn ban call

Irish Rail has been asked to ensure its drivers don't sound their train horns while travelling through a town.

The request came from Carrick-on-Suir Labour councillor Bobby Fitzgerald who said he had received "a number of calls from people who had been awoken by trains hooting" in the Tipperary town. He described the drivers' actions as "noise pollution'' and urged Irish Rail to "reprimand its drivers'', whom he described "as childish''.

For every sane reasonable human,there are a thousand (elected) Local Councillors....:o

MJohnston · 28-01-2013 4:14pm

Ah here lads, I wasn't looking for a sociological debate about why people are too lazy or stupid to look both ways before they cross the road - that is the unassailable tragedy of any modern society

Thread was simply to wonder why there has been a noticeable reduction in usage of this audio signal that previously was used a lot more regularly - wondering if there were complaints about noise or something. I always figured that the ding-ding was to counteract the fact that the electric-rail operation of the trams is relatively silent, at least in comparison to the actual size of the vehicle, whereas the horn was used as the emergency warning (otherwise, why bother with the ding-ding?)

Dravokivich · 28-01-2013 4:17pm

To be honest, I've never really noticed it, other than when people ran across O'Connell St in front of them.

People need to be more weary and cautious themselves. If the bell rings at every intersection, it becomes nothing more than background noise.

Tow · 28-01-2013 5:46pm

Once you've seen a large pool of blood at the corner of O Connell St/Abbey St, you will never forget to check before crossing...

monument · 29-01-2013 12:36am

MJohnston wrote: »

Ah here lads, I wasn't looking for a sociological debate about why people are too lazy or stupid to look both ways before they cross the road - that is the unassailable tragedy of any modern society

Thread was simply to wonder why there has been a noticeable reduction in usage of this audio signal that previously was used a lot more regularly - wondering if there were complaints about noise or something. I always figured that the ding-ding was to counteract the fact that the electric-rail operation of the trams is relatively silent, at least in comparison to the actual size of the vehicle, whereas the horn was used as the emergency warning (otherwise, why bother with the ding-ding?)

It could be the case that they found it was been used too much and was losing its usefulness.

MJohnston · 29-01-2013 12:04pm

I still don't buy that reasoning to be honest. Even if you stood at the intersection of Abbey and O'Connell Streets all day, you'd still only hear that bell sound for about 30 seconds out of every 8 or so minutes. And you aren't likely to be in a place where you hear it with that sort of regularity (unless you're a Luas driver), so I can't imagine how you'd grow used to it with such a small exposure.

Victor · 29-01-2013 12:11pm

MJohnston wrote: »

I still don't buy that reasoning to be honest. Even if you stood at the intersection of Abbey and O'Connell Streets all day, you'd still only hear that bell sound for about 30 seconds out of every 8 or so minutes. And you aren't likely to be in a place where you hear it with that sort of regularity (unless you're a Luas driver), so I can't imagine how you'd grow used to it with such a small exposure.

Potentially a tram in either direction every 3 minutes at rush hour - that would be your 30 seconds in every 90 seconds.

Some enforcement might not go astray.

markpb · 29-01-2013 12:39pm

MJohnston wrote: »

Even if you stood at the intersection of Abbey and O'Connell Streets all day, you'd still only hear that bell sound for about 30 seconds out of every 8 or so minutes.

It's funny how so many people underestimate the frequency of the Luas system even though it's been around for almost a decade. Perhaps years of the mundane a DART service has convinced people that we can't do train systems at reasonable frequency? In the next 10 minutes, six trams will pass through Abbey St with a headway of 4 minutes in each direction.

MJohnston · 29-01-2013 12:57pm

markpb wrote: »

It's funny how so many people underestimate the frequency of the Luas system even though it's been around for almost a decade. Perhaps years of the mundane a DART service has convinced people that we can't do train systems at reasonable frequency? In the next 10 minutes, six trams will pass through Abbey St with a headway of 4 minutes in each direction.

Fair enough, 60 seconds out of every 10 minutes then - presuming that a Luas tram takes around 10 seconds to cross the street.

The whole example is extremely liberal anyway though, most people won't be on that part of the street for anywhere near that amount of time.

AlekSmart · 29-01-2013 1:34pm

MJohnston wrote: »

Fair enough, 60 seconds out of every 10 minutes then - presuming that a Luas tram takes around 10 seconds to cross the street.

The whole example is extremely liberal anyway though, most people won't be on that part of the street for anywhere near that amount of time.

I think the reality is that many posters do not agree with the insinuation behind the OP's assertion that "Luas Drivers do not use the bell all the time at junctions".

The clue is perhaps in the fact that the Trams have a Driver in the first place,who can and does assess on the spot whether or not the bell would be of assistance.

MOST folks are compos-mentis enough to excercise reasonable caution around places such as OCS/Abbey St,and those that do not tend to have the Bell rung at them,followed swiftly by the horn...yet quite often it matters not,as the individuals concerned tend to be away with the chemical fairies and impervious to such stimuli as bells n whistles....:(

The rest of us just excercise that bit of caution,which usually is enough to preserve life n limb,for me anyway....;)

Cookie_Monster · 30-01-2013 8:15am

Tow wrote: »

Once you've seen a large pool of blood at the corner of O Connell St/Abbey St, you will never forget to check before crossing...

what, in case you get stabbed by one of the local knackerspeople of lower socio-economic class

Why do Luas drivers not use the 'bell' all the time at junctions?

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