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Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12

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Comments

  • #5202
    DB21
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,715 ✭✭✭DB21


    It's mad that we only had 3 of our first-choice 11 starting today. How we've gotten this far in the season with so many injuries is unreal.


  • #5203
    Hedman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 225 ✭✭Hedman


    Corvus Maximus wrote: »
    A myth, they have more time on the ball because it has a slower tempo. Resulting in more emphasis put on prancing around alright. The FA handicap clubs like United with restricted coaching hours for Youth development ect. So you have a young United lad getting 5 hours coaching per week and total of 2000 hours coaching between the ages of 9 - 16

    Continental teams don't have these restrictions imposed on them. A young lad with Barca gets 15 - 20 hours coaching per week and will get a total of 10000 hours coaching between the ages of 9 - 16. The results is self explanatory really.

    Have to disagree on this point with you. The differences in youth set ups between continental and in particular Spanish youth coaching is more than just a case of extra hours. It's fundamentally different and it goes a lot deeper than just when the lads arrive at a professional club, it begins when they first start kicking a ball about.

    There are 750 fully qualified Grade A UEFA coaches in Spain compared to 150 in the U.K, and of those 750, 450 coach children. All 150 in England coach to at least a semi-professional level.

    The Spanish kids under 14 don't play on full size pitches anymore and have a youth system dedicated to teaching kids the technical side of the game from the off. Compare that to the U.K and Irish grassroots where the kids are forced on to full size pitches and promotes the bigger, fitter lads over the more technically adept.

    The time restrictions definitely hinder the players when they arrive at a club alright but the Spanish kids are already light years ahead of them technically by the time they get to this stage.


  • #5204
    lordgoat
    Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 11,373 Mod ✭✭✭✭lordgoat


    PARKHEAD67 wrote: »
    Nothing at all about uniteds history? No I dont.And I dont want to.All the sheep suport "Manchester United". I feel sorry for the genuine united fans coz a lot of the hangers on are embarrassing

    i feel sorry for genuine celtic fans. Also i find alot more sheep support celtic.

    PARKHEAD67 wrote: »
    I have no grudge against genuine United fans.Its the glory hunters I cant stand.And there are many.

    I can't stand any of your posts. You haven't a clue about football in general and all you seem to do is post in this thread after united lose. Pathetic.


  • #5205
    onemorechance
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,078 ✭✭✭onemorechance


    nkay1985 wrote: »
    Yeah but like jump and be in the way. He didn't leave the ground.

    I realise this isn't a great topic of conversation but it's surely beet than the shite from the type of poster who some might say lives under a bridge.

    You're right, not much point him being there if he's not going to jump or get in the way.

    He has been doing very well lately. I am looking forward to seeing Carrick and Cleverley in the team together!
    Lindegaard

    Jones Smalling Rio Evra

    Valencia Carrick Cleverley Nani

    Rooney Wellbeck

    De Gea Rafael Evans Giggs Scholes Chico Berba


  • #5206
    Son Of A Vidic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,370 ✭✭✭✭Son Of A Vidic


    lordgoat wrote: »
    I can't stand any of your posts. You haven't a clue about football in general and all you seem to do is post in this thread after united lose. Pathetic.

    Which is a rarity thank god.


  • #5207
    Al Capwned
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,721 ✭✭✭Al Capwned


    cambo2008 wrote: »
    I counted 38,anyone else???
    Better way of passing time than reading some of the bull**** posted here in the last few pages.

    I got 38 too.... :D


  • #5208
    Patsy fyre
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,184 ✭✭✭Patsy fyre


    Nice little rant on twitter from Michael Owen this morning.
    How de gea was not at fault for the goals and he is only young and going to be a top keeper blah blah blah
    don't know why being too young is been given as his main excuse apart from his 'injury' excuse.


  • #5209
    amiable
    Registered Users Posts: 12,206 ✭✭✭✭amiable


    Patsy fyre wrote: »
    Nice little rant on twitter from Michael Owen this morning.
    How de gea was not at fault for the goals and he is only young and going to be a top keeper blah blah blah
    don't know why being too young is been given as his main excuse apart from his 'injury' excuse.

    He's the same age as Wojciech Szczęsny


  • #5210
    adox
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,018 ✭✭✭✭adox


    amiable wrote: »
    He's the same age as Wojciech Szczęsny

    And?


  • #5211
    counterlock
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,954 ✭✭✭counterlock


    Szczęsny didn't look to hot last year but is massively improved this season. Hopefully de gea will do the same


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  • #5212
    Leiva
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Leiva


    De Gea is quality but is lacking confidence big time .

    When he bulks up he will also have strength with his talent and that's when you will see his true worth.

    One thing but from yesterday's game which had me baffled was that Lindagard was sent out to warm up straight after Agger scored ? ..that's surely not gonna help De Geas confidence ?


  • #5213
    counterlock
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,954 ✭✭✭counterlock


    This happens quite a bit, sub keepers will always warm up and stretch at some point throughout a game. It may have been a coincidence


  • #5214
    Blatter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,832 ✭✭✭✭Blatter


    mixednuts wrote: »
    De Gea is quality but is lacking confidence big time .

    When he bulks up he will also have strength with his talent and that's when you will see his true worth.

    One thing but from yesterday's game which had me baffled was that Lindagard was sent out to warm up straight after Agger scored ? ..that's surely not gonna help De Geas confidence ?

    De Gea made some signal that he might have an injury, that's why Lindegaard was sent to warm up.

    There was probably nothing wrong with him! It's not that uncommon for players to blame something else when they make a mistake:pac:


  • #5215
    Leiva
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Leiva


    Blatter wrote: »
    De Gea made some signal that he might have an injury, that's why Lindegaard was sent to warm up.

    There was probably nothing wrong with him! It's not that uncommon for players to blame something else when they make a mistake:pac:

    Oh right didn't know that .

    My bad listening to the Setanta commentators .


  • #5216
    stumpypeeps
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,139 ✭✭✭stumpypeeps


    I doubt De Gea will make it at Utd.

    The one thing all top class keepers have is mental strength. They have that from an early age. I don't think he has that resolve. All keepers make mistakes, the best ones respond well after it. De Gea seems to surrender.

    Added to that is his lack of physical strength. He does not look like he will ever develop that either. He is very narrow and slight.


  • #5217
    G.K.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,704 ✭✭✭G.K.


    Did Schmeichael have mental strength at the start of his career?


  • #5218
    stumpypeeps
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,139 ✭✭✭stumpypeeps


    G.K. wrote: »
    Did Schmeichael have mental strength at the start of his career?

    I've no idea.
    Keepers like Reina, Buffon, Cassilas and even Joe Hart certainly had.


  • #5219
    SirDelboy18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭SirDelboy18


    stumpypeeps wrote: »
    I've no idea.
    Keepers like Reina, Buffon, Cassilas and even Joe Hart certainly had.

    Were each of those keepers playing in their home country? Yes.


  • #5220
    The_Kew_Tour
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,424 ✭✭✭✭The_Kew_Tour


    G.K. wrote: »
    Did Schmeichael have mental strength at the start of his career?

    Yes, he was nuts from the word go.

    I remember one game think it was against Sheff United in his first season and Paul Parker made a slight mistake, I honestly thought Schmiechael was going take his head off.


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  • #5221
    stumpypeeps
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,139 ✭✭✭stumpypeeps


    SirDelboy18 wrote: »
    Were each of those keepers playing in their home country? Yes.

    Reina joined Liverpool at 21/22. He was brilliant from the start.


  • #5222
    The Little Fella
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 455 ✭✭The Little Fella


    I defended De Gea at the start but starting to have my doubts about him now. Goalies have to have presence and he doesn't display any confidence that he is in charge. Lindegard is comparatively young for a goalie as well but yet he is willing to go and berate his defenders if they are not doing their job. Don't think De Gea will ever be capable of this. As for bulking up, there is only so much he can do, his natural frame is very slight and he will always be capable of getting bullied in the box. De Gea is also somewhat clumsy and cumbersome at diving at times and has led to mistakes. Fact of the matter is he should not have been signed last summer, United could have put an agreement in place with Athletico for him to sign this summer so he bulk up some bit in Spain and be in some way physically ready for the demands of English football.


  • #5223
    SirDelboy18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭SirDelboy18


    stumpypeeps wrote: »
    Reina joined Liverpool at 21/22. He was brilliant from the start.

    He was 23.


  • #5224
    amiable
    Registered Users Posts: 12,206 ✭✭✭✭amiable


    adox wrote: »
    And?

    And it's not rocket science


  • #5225
    stumpypeeps
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,139 ✭✭✭stumpypeeps


    SirDelboy18 wrote: »
    He was 23.

    22 actually.


  • #5226
    Blatter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,832 ✭✭✭✭Blatter


    De Gea is renowned for his mental strength, that's one of the reasons he was bought!

    In the games earlier in the season when he made mistakes, they didn't affect at all really. He kept on doing the things he normally does, he rarely panics.

    Yesterday and the West Brom away game are the only times he's looked dodgy throughout the 90 mins. Bar those games and a few other mistakes, he has looked very impressive.

    A years experience in English football will do him the world of good, he'll be much better next season.


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  • #5227
    amiable
    Registered Users Posts: 12,206 ✭✭✭✭amiable


    stumpypeeps wrote: »
    22 actually.

    Correct. Reina signed in July 2005 aged 22.

    He turned 23 on August 30th that year.


  • #5228
    SirDelboy18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭SirDelboy18


    stumpypeeps wrote: »
    22 actually.

    His date of birth is 30th of August 1982. He joined in 2005. Now you can be picky and say he made an appearance when he was 22 but for all intents and purposes he was 23 when he joined.

    De Gea was 20.


  • #5229
    Mars Bar
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,946 ✭✭✭✭Mars Bar


    The_Kew_Tour wrote: »
    Yes, he was nuts from the word go.

    I remember one game think it was against Sheff United in his first season and Paul Parker made a slight mistake, I honestly thought Schmiechael was going take his head off.

    But Schmeichel was what, 28 when he joined United? He was well matured when he got to United.


  • #5230
    Blatter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,832 ✭✭✭✭Blatter


    stumpypeeps wrote: »
    Reina joined Liverpool at 21/22. He was brilliant from the start.

    That isn't true. He had a fair few problems on crosses at the start and dropped a few clangers. His mistakes weren't highlighted as much as they would have been had he played for United because the media have a thing for United and their goalkeepers since Schmeichel. He still isn't the best keeper on crosses, although he's not the tallest so you can never expect him to be as good on them as say VDS.

    Reina was 23 in his first season at Liverpool for all intents and purposes. Birthday is the end of August.


  • #5231
    stumpypeeps
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,139 ✭✭✭stumpypeeps


    SirDelboy18 wrote: »
    His date of birth is 30th of August 1982. He joined in 2005. Now you can be picky and say he made an appearance when he was 22 but for all intents and purposes he was 23 when he joined.

    De Gea was 20.

    Well we're getting a little bogged down in semantics. The general thrust of my argument remains the same. I'd be very surprised if De Gea develops both the physical and mental strength required over the next year or two years to be a success at United. It may well happen but I have my doubts.


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  • #5232
    DM_7
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,407 Mod ✭✭✭✭DM_7


    This physical size "issue" made no difference to either goal yesterday. The problem yesterday for the first was he was too busy fighting with Carroll to mind his goal line. He will learn from that.

    Also comparing a goal keepers age to another keeper is pointless. Its like saying Zidane was really **** as he was in his mid 20's winning the Fifa World player of the year award while Messi was only 22.


  • #5233
    stumpypeeps
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,139 ✭✭✭stumpypeeps


    Blatter wrote: »
    That isn't true. He had a fair few problems on crosses at the start and dropped a few clangers. His mistakes weren't highlighted as much as they would have been had he played for United because the media have a thing for United and their goalkeepers since Schmeichel. He still isn't the best keeper on crosses, although he's not the tallest so you can never expect him to be as good on them as say VDS.

    Reina was 23 in his first season at Liverpool for all intents and purposes. Birthday is the end of August.

    Reina, much the same as every other keeper in the world has made mistakes. Not as many as you believe. The point I was making was that whenever he has made mistakes he has responded well to them. Thats what I mean by mental strength.


  • #5234
    SirDelboy18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭SirDelboy18


    stumpypeeps wrote: »
    Well we're getting a little bogged down in semantics. The general thrust of my argument remains the same. I'd be very surprised if De Gea develops both the physical and mental strength required over the next year or two years to be a success at United. It may well happen but I have my doubts.

    All of those keepers has at least 2 and a half to 3 years on De Gea to develop mentally in their home country. I think De Gea should have been played regularly and have said this a few times in this thread as I believe he has been badly mismanaged. He should never have been rotated with Lindegaard. Even when De Gea was playing fine, Lindegaard got the odd game.

    De Gea needs games. Continually being dropped will do nothing for his confidence. Mistakes were always likely to happen with such a young keeper. Its a joke how he is dropped for a month and brought back into an environment like Anfield after having any confidence which he might have had already shattered through continually being dropped.


  • #5235
    SirDelboy18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭SirDelboy18


    DM-ICE wrote: »
    This physical size "issue" made no difference to either goal yesterday. The problem yesterday for the first was he was too busy fighting with Carroll to mind his goal line. He will learn from that.

    Also comparing a goal keepers age to another keeper is pointless. Its like saying Zidane was really **** as he was in his mid 20's winning the Fifa World player of the year award while Messi was only 22.

    Its not pointless. Goalkeepers get better with age, this, while can never be proven, is a universally recognised statement. 3 extra years spent in his home country would have meant a lot for such a player in such a position.


  • #5236
    Blatter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,832 ✭✭✭✭Blatter


    stumpypeeps wrote: »
    Reina, much the same as every other keeper in the world has made mistakes. Not as many as you believe. The point I was making was that whenever he has made mistakes he has responded well to them. Thats what I mean by mental strength.

    And de Gea has responded well by and large to his mistakes this season.


    He made two mistakes in his first two games for United and then went on to be very good for the next few months bar a couple of errors here and there.

    Other goalkeepers would have folded after such a disastrous start.


  • #5237
    SirDelboy18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭SirDelboy18


    Blatter wrote: »
    And de Gea has responded well by and large to his mistakes this season.


    He made two mistakes in his first two games for United and then went on to be very good for the next few months bar a couple of errors here and there.

    Other goalkeepers would have folded after such a disastrous start.

    He has barely had the chance to respond to mistakes because he gets put in the bold boy corner for a few games after each one these days. Which is stupid.


  • #5238
    Patsy fyre
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,184 ✭✭✭Patsy fyre


    Lindegaard needs to be starting as our number 1 from now on afterall he is not just there to pick his nose!
    Dea Gea looked like a little schoolboy yesterday and has done previously.
    At the start of the season his mistakes were not costing us points but that was always likely to change.
    He may be a better keeper next season and he may not, but should the fans and the team suffer while we wait to find out?


  • #5239
    SirDelboy18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭SirDelboy18


    Patsy fyre wrote: »
    Lindegaard needs to be starting as our number 1 from now on afterall he is not just there to pick his nose!
    Dea Gea looked like a little schoolboy yesterday and has done previously.
    At the start of the season his mistakes were not costing us points but that was always likely to change.
    He may be a better keeper next season and he may not, but should the fans and the team suffer while we wait to find out?

    If anybody thought that there would be no mistakes with De Gea then they were living on a different planet. If Sir Alex was overly worried about this then he shouldn't have been bought. For that amount of money nearly any keeper in the world would have been available. He needs regular games.


  • #5240
    stumpypeeps
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,139 ✭✭✭stumpypeeps


    Blatter wrote: »
    And de Gea has responded well by and large to his mistakes this season.


    He made two mistakes in his first two games for United and then went on to be very good for the next few months bar a couple of errors here and there.

    Other goalkeepers would have folded after such a disastrous start.

    I think that's a very sympathetic appraisal of him. He made a mistake yesterday for the goal and was an utter liability all game long after that.


  • #5241
    Blatter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,832 ✭✭✭✭Blatter


    SirDelboy18 wrote: »
    He has barely had the chance to respond to mistakes because he gets put in the bold boy corner for a few games after each one these days. Which is stupid.

    Made a mistake v Man City in the CS - played the next game.

    Made a mistake v West Brom - played the next game

    Made a mistake v Arsenal - played the next game.


    He responded well by putting in great performances v Bolton, Liverpool(league), Stoke and Everton away from home.

    I do agree with you though, I don't like the rotation of Keepers. We should have played de Gea in all PL and CL games this season and given Lindegaard FA cup and League cup games.


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  • #5242
    Blatter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,832 ✭✭✭✭Blatter


    stumpypeeps wrote: »
    I think that's a very sympathetic appraisal of him. He made a mistake yesterday for the goal and was an utter liability all game long after that.

    Yes he was. It was also the same for the West Brom game. The other games he made mistakes in, he responded very well.

    Those were two games. It is ridiculous to offer a judgement on his United career based on being a total liability in two games whilst ignoring all the positives he has shown.


  • #5243
    SirDelboy18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭SirDelboy18


    Blatter wrote: »
    Made a mistake v Man City in the CS - played the next game.

    Made a mistake v West Brom - played the next game

    Made a mistake v Arsenal - played the next game.


    He responded well by putting in great performances v Bolton, Liverpool(league), Stoke and Everton away from home.

    I do agree with you though, I don't like the rotation of Keepers. We should have played de Gea in all PL and CL games this season and given Lindegaard FA cup and League cup games.

    I'm just thinking of the long period he was out before the Blackburn game and after the Blackburn game. The rotation of keepers is a joke. The boy won't learn if he doesn't play.


  • #5244
    Sgt Pepper 64
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,627 ✭✭✭Sgt Pepper 64


    Any one watching Sky, footballs greatest?

    Young lad on there looks good - sign him up! ;)


  • #5245
    DM_7
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,407 Mod ✭✭✭✭DM_7


    SirDelboy18 wrote: »
    Its not pointless. Goalkeepers get better with age, this, while can never be proven, is a universally recognised statement. 3 extra years spent in his home country would have meant a lot for such a player in such a position.

    De Gea's age and more importantly his experience level are relevant.

    What another keeper did is not. Simply because they are different people.

    You can make the point you made well in your own post without saying another keepers name.


  • #5246
    stumpypeeps
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,139 ✭✭✭stumpypeeps


    Blatter wrote: »
    Yes he was. It was also the same for the West Brom game. The other games he made mistakes in, he responded very well.

    Those were two games. It is ridiculous to offer a judgement on his United career based on being a total liability in two games whilst ignoring all the positives he has shown.

    Its not a judgement on his Utd career. Its just a personal view on whether or not he will make it. I may of course be wrong but all the evidence so far is that he will struggle.

    I got the feeling he was very reluctant to leave A Madrid in the first place.


  • #5247
    Blatter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,832 ✭✭✭✭Blatter


    SirDelboy18 wrote: »
    I'm just thinking of the long period he was out before the Blackburn game and after the Blackburn game. The rotation of keepers is a joke. The boy won't learn if he doesn't play.

    I agree that I would prefer to see him play regularly, but I'm sure he has learnt plenty from his 20 appearances already this season. As much as I don't like it, I don't think sitting on the bench for a few games here and there will stunt his development that much.

    I hope he plays on Tuesday, but I'm not sure if he will.


  • #5248
    SirDelboy18
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭SirDelboy18


    Blatter wrote: »
    I agree that I would prefer to see him play regularly, but I'm sure he has learnt plenty from his 20 appearances already this season. As much as I don't like it, I don't think sitting on the bench for a few games here and there will stunt his development that much.

    I hope he plays on Tuesday, but I'm not sure if he will.

    Its his confidence which that'll destroy. Because it does appear currently (IMO) like Lindegaard is the obvious first choice and De Gea is getting the odd game because he cost so much. That is a bad state of affairs, and De Gea is obviously suffering with confidence.

    Having one game here and one game here also increases the spotlight on those individual games, increasing the pressure ten-fold because he knows that journalists and some sections of the support are baying for blood.


  • #5249
    Blatter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,832 ✭✭✭✭Blatter


    stumpypeeps wrote: »
    Its not a judgement on his Utd career. Its just a personal view on whether or not he will make it. I may of course be wrong but all the evidence so far is that he will struggle.

    I got the feeling he was very reluctant to leave A Madrid in the first place.

    The evidence you're using is very selective though. He has showed plenty of positives so far as well as negatives. The same as any 20 year old talented player that has just moved country really.

    I haven't read any stories of him struggling to settle into Manchester, so it's impossible to tell how much of an issue leaving Madrid was for him.


  • #5250
    The_Kew_Tour
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,424 ✭✭✭✭The_Kew_Tour


    Mars Bar wrote: »
    But Schmeichel was what, 28 when he joined United? He was well matured when he got to United.

    Your right he was about that age when he signed, but was answering a question about his presence on debut season.

    I still give DDG some time, people expect players just to come in and be world class straight away.

    Patience in football fans seems to be gone, just look at Wolves and the crap Mick took from some fans after few poor results, forgetting where he got them in first place when he took over.


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  • #5251
    3hn2givr7mx1sc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,838 ✭✭✭✭3hn2givr7mx1sc


    Eriksen is playing for Ajax on ESPN atm, if anyone's interested! Scored a peach of a goal in the first half.


This discussion has been closed.
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