Rangers FC lodge papers to go into administration

bobbysands81 · 24-05-2012 1:54am

This really needs to be read - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-18148818

Old Gill · 24-05-2012 7:58am

bobbysands81 wrote: »

This really needs to be read - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-18148818

Excellent.. plenty to bury them with there

lubo_moravcik · 24-05-2012 11:11am

Jelle1880 wrote: »

lubo_moravcik wrote: »

Why would Souness receive a payment of 30 grand 10 years after leaving Rangers??

Something to do with Tugay apparently :pac:

Or at least that's what they implied.

You can pull the wee funny face all day long man, am just wondering what genuine logical reason would there be for making that payment of 30k to someone who left the club 10 yr previously. Don't you think there's something a wee bit odd about it?

Jelle1880 · 24-05-2012 12:17pm

lubo_moravcik wrote: »

You can pull the wee funny face all day long man, am just wondering what genuine logical reason would there be for making that payment of 30k to someone who left the club 10 yr previously. Don't you think there's something a wee bit odd about it?

I'm saying that that's what they were alluding to, that it had to do with Tugay going to Blackburn.

Which I think makes no sense.

bobbysands81 · 24-05-2012 12:17pm

Rangers Tax Case gets slated here by the Rangers fans. Interestingly last night he won the 'Orwell Prize' which is 'regarded as the pre-eminent British prize for political writing' for his blogging on what's happening Rangers FC. This man should be thanked by Rangers fans, not slaughtered.

Not bad for an Internet bampot eh?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orwell_Prize

www.rangerstaxcase.com

cruiserweight · 24-05-2012 12:21pm

Jelle1880 wrote: »

I'm saying that that's what they were alluding to, that it had to do with Tugay going to Blackburn.

Which I think makes no sense.

In the documentary it was said that HMRC suspected it might be an illegal payment to do with the Tugay transfer, but that HMRC found no further evidence to support that suspicion

Dempsey · 24-05-2012 12:54pm

cruiserweight wrote: »

In the documentary it was said that HMRC suspected it might be an illegal payment to do with the Tugay transfer, but that HMRC found no further evidence to support that suspicion

Doesnt mean it didnt happen.

Martin Bain shredded the evidence to his EBT 'side letter', no doubt that others have done this where possible

EDIT

No surprise to see that Aberdeen fans have threatened to boycott their own season tickets if Aberdeen backs a Rangers newco. Its fair bad that fans have to resort to this in order to force their clubs to do the right thing! Kilmarnock still seem ready to sell their soul for Rangers away days.

lubo_moravcik · 24-05-2012 12:58pm

Jelle1880 wrote: »

I'm saying that that's what they were alluding to, that it had to do with Tugay going to Blackburn.

Which I think makes no sense.

Does a payment of such an amount make any sense at that time do you think??

Jelle1880 · 24-05-2012 1:11pm

lubo_moravcik wrote: »

Does a payment of such an amount make any sense at that time do you think??

Not really, but that also doesn't mean it was used for the Tugay transfer or whatever they claimed.

Savage Tyrant · 24-05-2012 1:32pm

Dempsey wrote: »

Doesnt mean it didnt happen.

Martin Bain shredded the evidence to his EBT 'side letter', no doubt that others have done this where possible

EDIT

No surprise to see that Aberdeen fans have threatened to boycott their own season tickets if Aberdeen backs a Rangers newco. Its fair bad that fans have to resort to this in order to force their clubs to do the right thing! Kilmarnock still seem ready to sell their soul for Rangers away days.

Well they should be without 2 of their major gate receipt days no matter what because Celtic fans should boycott them if they vote for no sanctions.

Eirebear · 24-05-2012 1:33pm

Dempsey wrote: »

Doesnt mean it didnt happen.

.

Lol - Sums up this whole process from a Celtic fans point of view, from certain "Award Winning" bloggers, and indeed from Neil "They're guilty" Doncaster.

bobbysands81 · 24-05-2012 1:43pm

Eirebear wrote: »

Lol - Sums up this whole process from a Celtic fans point of view, from certain "Award Winning" bloggers, and indeed from Neil "They're guilty" Doncaster.

Rangers Tax Case has been at the forefront of revealing goings on at your disgraceful club. You should be lauding him and his findings, instead you're attacking the messenger.

So what's your view on the whole thing then?

RoryMac · 24-05-2012 1:46pm

Eirebear wrote: »

Lol - Sums up this whole process from a Celtic fans point of view, from certain "Award Winning" bloggers, and indeed from Neil "They're guilty" Doncaster.

It's hard not to believe most of what is written about Rangers these days, the stuff we do know to be true would have seemed like lunacy just a few short years ago but now look at Rangers' position....but of course it's the Celtic fans that are to be mocked rather than the Rangers fans that stuck their heads in the sand as their club went to the wall.

Jelle1880 · 24-05-2012 1:49pm

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Rangers Tax Case has been at the forefront of revealing goings on at your disgraceful club. You should be lauding him and his findings, instead you're attacking the messenger.

So what's your view on the whole thing then?

There there bobby, the mask's slipping a wee bit.

I wonder who'll accept the award :pac:

cruiserweight · 24-05-2012 1:54pm

Dempsey wrote: »

Doesnt mean it didnt happen.

It doesn't mean that it did or didn't happen, could not find more evidence is hardly a vindication. My point was more that it was not the documentary alone that was making these implications, they were backed up as being view held by others or with evidence.

Alex Thomson has a new blog post, he seemed to like the BBC piece http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/rangers-resolution-hold-breath/1635

bobbysands81 · 24-05-2012 1:59pm

Jelle1880 wrote: »

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Rangers Tax Case has been at the forefront of revealing goings on at your disgraceful club. You should be lauding him and his findings, instead you're attacking the messenger.

So what's your view on the whole thing then?

There there bobby, the mask's slipping a wee bit.

I wonder who'll accept the award :pac:

You're actually taking umbrage with me for calling your club disgraceful???

I could have said a lot worse mo chara and every word of it would be true.

Old Gill · 24-05-2012 2:08pm

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Jelle1880 wrote: »

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Rangers Tax Case has been at the forefront of revealing goings on at your disgraceful club. You should be lauding him and his findings, instead you're attacking the messenger.

So what's your view on the whole thing then?

There there bobby, the mask's slipping a wee bit.

I wonder who'll accept the award :pac:

You're actually taking umbrage with me for calling your club disgraceful???

I could have said a lot worse mo chara and every word of it would be true.

Do a search on follow follow for loughinisland and disgusting doesn't even cover it the comments they were making. I'll dig up that thread the day they die to remind me what sort of club and followers they really are.

Eirebear · 24-05-2012 2:10pm

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Rangers Tax Case has been at the forefront of revealing goings on at your disgraceful club. You should be lauding him and his findings, instead you're attacking the messenger.

So what's your view on the whole thing then?

RoryMac wrote: »

It's hard not to believe most of what is written about Rangers these days, the stuff we do know to be true would have seemed like lunacy just a few short years ago but now look at Rangers' position....but of course it's the Celtic fans that are to be mocked rather than the Rangers fans that stuck their heads in the sand as their club went to the wall.

Funny - You great proclaimers of justice and order seem happy to not only let the "Doesn't mean it didnt happen" theory pass, but also defend it.

Eirebear · 24-05-2012 2:12pm

Old Gill wrote: »

Do a search on follow follow for loughinisland and disgusting doesn't even cover it the comments they were making. I'll dig up that thread the day they die to remind me what sort of club and followers they really are.

Ah yes of course.
A thread on an internet message forum is definetly the best way to come to a ludcirous generalisation about everyone involved with supporting, working for, playing for a football club.
:rolleyes:

Jelle1880 · 24-05-2012 2:21pm

FF is hardly representative of the general Rangers fanbase, on the contrary I would say.

Not only that, but I'm sure that thread was also full of people who couldn't care less if the ROI would wear a black armband or not.

Old Gill · 24-05-2012 2:28pm

Eirebear wrote: »

Old Gill wrote: »

Do a search on follow follow for loughinisland and disgusting doesn't even cover it the comments they were making. I'll dig up that thread the day they die to remind me what sort of club and followers they really are.

Ah yes of course.
A thread on an internet message forum is definetly the best way to come to a ludcirous generalisation about everyone involved with supporting, working for, playing for a football club.
:rolleyes:

On its own it would be. Added to my own experiences on ferries with them, songs from their support and their own history then it was very much in keeping with previous views about them

RoryMac · 24-05-2012 2:31pm

Jelle1880 wrote: »

FF is hardly representative of the general Rangers fanbase, on the contrary I would say.

Not often i'd agree with Jelle but i have to agree with the above.

bobbysands81 · 24-05-2012 2:36pm

Eirebear wrote: »

Funny - You great proclaimers of justice and order seem happy to not only let the "Doesn't mean it didnt happen" theory pass, but also defend it.

Where have I passed this theory and then defended it?!

I am very clear when giving an opinion that it's only an opinion. Rangers can only be found guilty of something when there is enough evidence to support the accusation. There is overwhelming evidence of much wrong-doing on the part of Rangers... but constantly the messenger is being blamed.

Eirebear · 24-05-2012 2:37pm

Old Gill wrote: »

On its own it would be. Added to my own experiences on ferries with them, songs from their support and their own history then it was very much in keeping with previous views about them

Very typical of the viewpoint of a fan who doesnt hail from the city, or indeed the country, of the club he is commenting on.
(I see Rory's post above though

)

How often do you actually mix with supporters of Rangers, have you ever?
When you travel to Scotland, do you go to the game, surround yourself with Celtic fans, maybe go to one or two boozers around the Gallowgate - or the Brazen?
I'm willing to bet you know very few, if any Rangers supporters tbh.

Hardly a basis for an educated estimation of your average fan.

Personally i've had some horrendous experiences with Celtic fans, including one which left a guy in my company with a broken pelvis. I'd never even think to generalise about the Celtic support in the way that you have just done.

Eirebear · 24-05-2012 2:38pm

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Where have I passed this theory and then defended it?!

I am very clear when giving an opinion that it's only an opinion. Rangers can only be found guilty of something when there is enough evidence to support the accusation. There is overwhelming evidence of much wrong-doing on the part of Rangers... but constantly the messenger is being blamed.

Are you telling me that the "Doesn't mean they didnt" attitude hasnt been prevalent in pretty much everything the likes of RTC have published?
It's the very basis for the whole blog at the end of the day.

RoryMac · 24-05-2012 2:42pm

Eirebear wrote: »

Funny - You great proclaimers of justice and order seem happy to not only let the "Doesn't mean it didnt happen" theory pass, but also defend it.

Probably due to Celtic fans being far more accurate than Rangers fans in how this whole situation would play out.

Does that mean every allegation made is true? Of course not but there is mounting evidence that Rangers are guilty of breaching a series of SFA rules and that evidence is coming from sources which have been proved right before.

Eirebear · 24-05-2012 2:43pm

RoryMac wrote: »

Probably due to Celtic fans being far more accurate than Rangers fans in how this whole situation would play out.

Does that mean every allegation made is true? Of course not but there is mounting evidence that Rangers are guilty of breaching a series of SFA rules and that evidence is coming from sources which have been proved right before.

No doubt about it - certain elements of your support are becoming slightly blinded in this feeding frenzy however.

lubo_moravcik · 24-05-2012 2:45pm

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Not really, but that also doesn't mean it was used for the Tugay transfer or whatever they claimed.

Taking Tugay out of it though, the payment is strange, there seems to be no outstanding reason that it was made. I don't mind how it's buttered up, but to me something stinks about it, where there's smoke there's fire.

Did Murray take out £6m in EBT's, yet actually put in no cash at all??

RoryMac · 24-05-2012 2:49pm

Eirebear wrote: »

No doubt about it - certain elements of your support are becoming slightly blinded in this feeding frenzy however.

I agree

Jelle1880 · 24-05-2012 2:56pm

lubo_moravcik wrote: »

Taking Tugay out of it though, the payment is strange, there seems to be no outstanding reason that it was made. I don't mind how it's buttered up, but to me something stinks about it, where there's smoke there's fire.

Did Murray take out £6m in EBT's, yet actually put in no cash at all??

Agreed about the Souness thing, it's weird to say the least.

Murray claims his 6m came from MIH's EBT scheme, not Rangers'.

Pompey Magnus · 24-05-2012 3:07pm

One thing the show last night has clarified to me is why Rangers fans anger at Murray is fair enough, I always respected him and found it unfair that he was getting so much abuse considering the amount of success his money brought the club and that he was just badly informed on the EBT scheme, last night has shown that all along he was basically another Craig Whyte but playing the long game.

lubo_moravcik · 24-05-2012 3:57pm

Pompey Magnus wrote: »

One thing the show last night has clarified to me is why Rangers fans anger at Murray is fair enough, I always respected him and found it unfair that he was getting so much abuse considering the amount of success his money brought the club and that he was just badly informed on the EBT scheme, last night has shown that all along he was basically another Craig Whyte but playing the long game.

Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems to me that in comparison to Whyte then there is little or no anger towards Murray.

Jelle1880 · 24-05-2012 4:16pm

lubo_moravcik wrote: »

Maybe I'm wrong, but it seems to me that in comparison to Whyte then there is little or no anger towards Murray.

Most Rangers fans (If not all) are aware that Murray started this all.

It's just that Whyte's ****-ups were far more clear (Not paying PAYE and NI, for example, and the lies), nobody knows yet how exactly Murray is involved.

But I'm sure it'll all be clear at one point.

lubo_moravcik · 24-05-2012 5:01pm

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Most Rangers fans (If not all) are aware that Murray started this all.

It's just that Whyte's ****-ups were far more clear (Not paying PAYE and NI, for example, and the lies), nobody knows yet how exactly Murray is involved.

But I'm sure it'll all be clear at one point.

Maybe Murray duped Whyte

Eirebear · 24-05-2012 5:07pm

lubo_moravcik wrote: »

Maybe Murray duped Whyte

I don't think anyone truly believes that - if anyone duped Craig Whyte it was Lloyds TSB. I believe they were the ones pushing the sale through by the end.

Personally i think Whyte is a chancer, and thought he saw an opportunity - it backfired.
He's at best, a fool and out of his depths - at worst, a conman and out of his depths.

Savage Tyrant · 24-05-2012 5:11pm

Eirebear wrote: »

I don't think anyone truly believes that - if anyone duped Craig Whyte it was Lloyds TSB. I believe they were the ones pushing the sale through by the end.

Personally i think Whyte is a chancer, and thought he saw an opportunity - it backfired.
He's at best, a fool and out of his depths - at worst, a conman and out of his depths.

To be fair, that's my exact opinion on Whyte too.
He saw an opportunity to jump in at the helm of a footballing heavyweight team, make a few million for himself and get out again. He just hadn't a baldy notion of what he was doing and assumedly took bad advice and it epically backfired on him.

lubo_moravcik · 24-05-2012 5:24pm

Eirebear wrote: »

I don't think anyone truly believes that - if anyone duped Craig Whyte it was Lloyds TSB. I believe they were the ones pushing the sale through by the end.

Personally i think Whyte is a chancer, and thought he saw an opportunity - it backfired.
He's at best, a fool and out of his depths - at worst, a conman and out of his depths.

Do you think Murray knew what was coming down the line, ie the findings/talk/carry on with EBT's and BTC etc that's going on just now, and if so, do you think he told Craig Whyte what to expect? No doubt about it that Whyte's a chancer, but I'd wonder if he knew exactly what he was letting himself in for.

lubo_moravcik · 24-05-2012 5:34pm

Re: Dark Mingwall !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
the rst have released this press statement on last nights events

Thursday, 24 May 2012 13:02
"These are extremely serious allegations, and taken at face value, raise serious doubts concerning Duff & Phelps’ independence in the administration process. Roger Isaacs from the Institute of Chartered Accountants for England and Wales has claimed this is one of the starkest conflicts of interests he has ever seen means this now needs urgent investigation and the Rangers Supporters’ Trust will be writing to the appropriate agencies requesting a full investigation of Duff and Phelps’ role.

"The number one priority must still remain Rangers exit administration under new ownership and any action against Duff and Phelps should not destabilize this process.

“However, Duff & Phelps need to be independently investigated by the appropriate professional and regulatory bodies. The evidence presented so far suggests that Craig Whyte, Collyer Bristow and representatives of Duff & Phelps were possibly involved in constructing a financial arrangement that is potentially illegal and has done irreparable damage to Rangers FC - no stone should be left unturned in the investigation."

Dempsey · 24-05-2012 6:07pm

Eirebear wrote: »

Lol - Sums up this whole process from a Celtic fans point of view, from certain "Award Winning" bloggers, and indeed from Neil "They're guilty" Doncaster.

What are you blabbing on about or have you forgotten that evidence has been destroyed by sub trustees? :rolleyes:

cruiserweight wrote: »

It doesn't mean that it did or didn't happen, could not find more evidence is hardly a vindication. My point was more that it was not the documentary alone that was making these implications, they were backed up as being view held by others or with evidence.

Alex Thomson has a new blog post, he seemed to like the BBC piece http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/rangers-resolution-hold-breath/1635

I merely pointed out that no evidence doesnt mean that it didnt happen because evidence has been destroyed by people that dont want to be caught red handed although they have been named.

Eirebear · 24-05-2012 6:10pm

Dempsey wrote: »

Eirebear wrote: »

Lol - Sums up this whole process from a Celtic fans point of view, from certain "Award Winning" bloggers, and indeed from Neil "They're guilty" Doncaster.

What are you blabbing on about or have you forgotten that evidence has been destroyed by sub trustees? :rolleyes:

cruiserweight wrote: »

It doesn't mean that it did or didn't happen, could not find more evidence is hardly a vindication. My point was more that it was not the documentary alone that was making these implications, they were backed up as being view held by others or with evidence.

Alex Thomson has a new blog post, he seemed to like the BBC piece http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/rangers-resolution-hold-breath/1635

I merely pointed out that no evidence doesnt mean that it didnt happen because evidence has been destroyed by people that dont want to be caught red handed although they have been named.

I have no proof of that, of course..."that doesn't mean it didn't happen...."

Dempsey · 24-05-2012 6:11pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18188174

Rangers fans have no faith in administrators Duff & Phelps, according to a supporters' spokesman.

The warnings were there on the day that they were appointed to the club. :rolleyes:

EDIT

Eirebear wrote: »

I have no proof of that, of course..."that doesn't mean it didn't happen...."

Taking things at face value seems to be Rangers strong point, look where its taken ye.

Jelle1880 · 24-05-2012 7:32pm

Do you lot just have a Word document with things in it like 'Heads buried in sand', and then just randomly copy paste from it ?

Because I have yet to see any Rangers fan these days who still believes everything is a-ok.

Or do we only 'bury our heads YADDA YADDA YADDA' when we don't agree with you ?

bobbysands81 · 24-05-2012 8:35pm

A query regarding the EBTs.

If they really were discretionary loans paid to staff then why (when the club is about to go down the pan) have none of the 111 people (who include such proud Rangers men as John Greig, Souness, Barry Ferguson, Nacho Novo) offered to pay these 'loans' back?

RoryMac · 24-05-2012 9:20pm

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Do you lot just have a Word document with things in it like 'Heads buried in sand', and then just randomly copy paste from it ?

Because I have yet to see any Rangers fan these days who still believes everything is a-ok.
Or do we only 'bury our heads YADDA YADDA YADDA' when we don't agree with you ?

I think some Celtic fans(myself included) find it hard to understand why Rangers fans haven't put more pressure on the parties involved to find the truth or to have them release control of the club. There has been little in the way of a show of strength from the Rangers fans and most of the questions in relation to owners and their plans for Rangers have come from Celtic fans and blogs.

These issues have been known for years now and for the early part of that Celtic fans posing the questions have been dismissed as having an unfounded agenda, I'd be the first to admit there is an obvious agenda from these people but the facts are they have pushed this story when nobody else was interested.

I'm open to correction on the above but I haven't come across any similar type of Rangers sites etc that have been pushing for the truth on these issues, maybe they do exist?? On here there does seem to be a tendency from Rangers fans to dismiss every news story as something already known or to seize on minor detail to dismiss the story rather than discussing the general situation and where it is heading.

bobmalooka · 24-05-2012 9:42pm

Exactly, I dont understand the resistance to discussing the matters and the obsession with trying to discredit everyone pushing the Rangers story.

The best example was when news of the ticketus deal broke, a few fans on here really scrutinised the tiny details of what was being reported rather than scrutinise what was actually happening.

Their energy would have been better focused into putting pressure on the people at the helm, 3 months ago it was pointed out here that the actions of Duff and Phelps were not consistent with saving the club. All the rangers fans argued against it, dug up loads of evidence to suggest D&P were legit and now with about a week to go are asking questions.

The sheer refusal to agree or listen with anyone 'celtic minded' has taken away rangers fans ability to save their club themselves......and they'll argue im wrong till the day the club dies.

Jelle1880 · 24-05-2012 10:06pm

RoryMac wrote: »

I think some Celtic fans(myself included) find it hard to understand why Rangers fans haven't put more pressure on the parties involved to find the truth or to have them release control of the club. There has been little in the way of a show of strength from the Rangers fans and most of the questions in relation to owners and their plans for Rangers have come from Celtic fans and blogs.

These issues have been known for years now and for the early part of that Celtic fans posing the questions have been dismissed as having an unfounded agenda, I'd be the first to admit there is an obvious agenda from these people but the facts are they have pushed this story when nobody else was interested.

I'm open to correction on the above but I haven't come across any similar type of Rangers sites etc that have been pushing for the truth on these issues, maybe they do exist?? On here there does seem to be a tendency from Rangers fans to dismiss every news story as something already known or to seize on minor detail to dismiss the story rather than discussing the general situation and where it is heading.

No idea why it didn't happen before, but the reason for silence from the fans at this point is clear:

Anything that disrupts the CVA process will most likely result in the end of the club.

If you would read some Rangers forums you'd see that what happened with Whyte means that absolutely nobody is trusted anymore, it's extremely black and white now.

The administrators, Green, the BBC, RTC blog,... are all seen as suspicious at best.

I've never refused to discuss these issues with anyone here, but I've been getting fed up with some of the Celtic fans who keep using the same things over and over again (as I said, the 'heads buried in the sand' line trotted out at random, whenever a Rangers fan disagrees with Celtic fans).

The fact that a lot of the information of RTC, Celtic fans, Celtic-minded people in general,... has been proven true doesn't mean that we should just accept everything else they say without proof, right ?

Take those side letters for example.
We're constantly being told 'they exist'.
Should I just accept they exist, because the people that say they have them were right on certain points in the past ?
Or should I stay skeptic until someone actually shows them ?

I choose the latter, and I don't see any problem with that.

RoryMac · 24-05-2012 10:29pm

Jelle1880 wrote: »

No idea why it didn't happen before, but the reason for silence from the fans at this point is clear:

Anything that disrupts the CVA process will most likely result in the end of the club.

If you would read some Rangers forums you'd see that what happened with Whyte means that absolutely nobody is trusted anymore, it's extremely black and white now.

As I said I was open to correction on that, all I have to go on is News Now Rangers and the blogs/articles I see there which don't seem to be discussing the issues in any great detail.

Jelle1880 wrote: »

The administrators, Green, the BBC, RTC blog,... are all seen as suspicious at best.

I've never refused to discuss these issues with anyone here, but I've been getting fed up with some of the Celtic fans who keep using the same things over and over again (as I said, the 'heads buried in the sand' line trotted out at random, whenever a Rangers fan disagrees with Celtic fans).

They may be suspicious but they've got a lot of things right and the RTC for instance have been predicting for a long time that the outcome of this situation would be a Newco way before anyone thought that was possible.

That of course doesn't mean it's always right but it is without doubt one of the most reliable sources of information in the proceedings, no matter what their agenda is.

Respect where it's due you have been on here every time news has broken be it good or bad.

Jelle1880 wrote: »

The fact that a lot of the information of RTC, Celtic fans, Celtic-minded people in general,... has been proven true doesn't mean that we should just accept everything else they say without proof, right ?

Take those side letters for example.
We're constantly being told 'they exist'.
Should I just accept they exist, because the people that say they have them were right on certain points in the past ?
Or should I stay skeptic until someone actually shows them ?

I choose the latter, and I don't see any problem with that.

Again of course you or anyone else shouldn't take everything said as being the truth but in the case of last nights program where the BBC named a lot of players who benefited from EBT's and had side letters you have to take into account that the BBC would have cleared all of this info with lawyers prior to airing and they name some wealthy and influential people, maybe I'm naive but in cases like this I tend to believe they have enough info to back up their claims.

Jelle1880 · 24-05-2012 10:33pm

That's also why I haven't flatly said the BBC is at it, you can't make those claims without backing them up.

And a Celtic fan I know told me that, in his opinion, the BBC haven't shown these letters because they are awaiting the BTC verdict, which may very well be true.

But I hate journalism like that, it's telling half stories, making claims and then not backing them up.

RoryMac · 24-05-2012 10:48pm

It could well be that the documents they have or saw a part of an ongoing investigation so could not be shown, i have no idea but i'd guess the BBC's lawyers are happy they have their facts straight. That doesn't mean whatever that investigation is finds there was anything wrong of course but it doesn't look good.

It seems everyone is waiting for the findings of the BTC and until then we'll have to live off the scraps of the story

Savage Tyrant · 24-05-2012 10:51pm

Jelle1880 wrote: »

That's also why I haven't flatly said the BBC is at it, you can't make those claims without backing them up.

And a Celtic fan I know told me that, in his opinion, the BBC haven't shown these letters because they are awaiting the BTC verdict, which may very well be true.

But I hate journalism like that, it's telling half stories, making claims and then not backing them up.

Surely the BTC hinges on the existence of these side letters though?
I was under the assumption that if the BBC had seen them, they would also have been seen by the relevant authorities?

Rangers FC lodge papers to go into administration

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