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Government Capital Spending on Roads: 2016-2022

12357…14

Comments

  • #202
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    marno21 wrote: »
    3 years til it starts or 3 years til its opened?

    Starts. Certainly won't be due to any help from Kenny when it does start.


  • #203
    Vilnian
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭Vilnian


    So, with a combination of 3 motorways and DC's u/c for now (M17/M18 Gort to Tuam, M11Gorey to Enniscorthy and N25 New Ross BP), what would most likely be the next big Motorway/DC project starting next?


  • #204
    Smoked Tuna
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 141 ✭✭Smoked Tuna


    Any further consideration for widening the M50 southbound to three lanes as far as the Bray South Exit of M11/N11?

    Traffic around Bray is very bad at busy times.


  • #205
    spacetweek
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,147 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    Smoked Tuna wrote: »
    Any further consideration for widening the M50 southbound to three lanes as far as the Bray South Exit of M11/N11?

    Traffic around Bray is very bad at busy times.
    Planned but no firm details.


  • #206
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,461 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    There are 4 projects in planning (at the very early stages of planning now mind) with the aim of improving traffic flow in the Greater Dublin Area:

    * N3 corridor upgrade
    * N4 widening/upgrade J1 M50 to J8 Kilcock
    * N7 upgrade J1 M50 to J9 Naas North
    * M50 South Eastern Motorway/M11/N11 upgrade J13/14 to Glen of the Downs

    It appears the M4 will be widened from Lucan to Kilcock, and the M50 from J13/14 to the M11 merge, with the M11 being widened as far as Glen of the Downs (N11).

    The rest of the N4, N7 and N11 under these schemes will be upgraded to motorway standard.

    The details surrounding the N3 upgrade are unclear at this point.


  • #207
    spacetweek
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,147 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    marno21 wrote: »
    It appears the M4 will be widened from Lucan to Kilcock, and the M50 from J13/14 to the M11 merge, with the M11 being widened as far as Glen of the Downs (N11).

    The rest of the N4, N7 and N11 under these schemes will be upgraded to motorway standard.
    I gotta say that some of that sounds a little optimistic. Not sure how you could turn the N4 Lucan Bypass into a motorway due to footpaths everywhere and it'd be very hard to widen the N11 as far as the Glen of the Downs without having to demolish a lot of houses around Kilmacanogue.


  • #208
    jd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,709 ✭✭✭jd


    Looks like Shane Ross found writing for the rag a bit easier

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/shane-ross-criticised-for-not-publishing-department-priorities-1.2815344
    ..
    Since July, the department’s website has stated that Mr Ross “will shortly be considering his key priorities for the coming term of office”.
    In early August, the department indicated Mr Ross would disclose his key priorities for his department in September. However, they have not been forthcoming to date.
    ..
    The website still highlights the priorities set out by his predecessor, Paschal Donohoe. These were the completion of the cross-city Luas; the Newlands Cross Junction upgrade; a campaign against drug-driving; the publication of a new tourism strategy and the completion of the National Sports Campus.
    ..

    “How can anyone invest in transport or tourism in this country without knowing what the Minister’s position is?” he asked.
    “He needs to spend a lot less time running around and focusing on non-department issues.”


  • #209
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,853 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    road funding should be massively diverted towards rail in the Dublin area at least, I would also argue that many schemes if they have to be put on hold, should be. Dublin the capital and the lifeblood to the rest of the economy, is grinding to a halt...


  • #210
    NiallBoo
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭NiallBoo


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    road funding should be massively diverted towards rail in the Dublin area at least, I would also argue that many schemes if they have to be put on hold, should be. Dublin the capital and the lifeblood to the rest of the economy, is grinding to a halt...

    Infrastructure funding on the whole is inadequate.

    I agree that putting all of the eggs in one tarmac basket is unsustainable.

    The best way of increasing road capacity is to give people other viable options.

    I think we're inclined to look for silver-bullet solutions where in reality there aren't any. The places that work best have take a multi-faceted approach where users have a variety of good options.


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  • #211
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,461 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    MOD:

    I have moved all posts about the M11/N11/cyclists on the N11/Kilmacanogue to the M11/N11 upgrade thread:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057631449

    Please continue all discussion in that thread, and this thread for the general roads programme


  • #212
    serfboard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,720 ✭✭✭serfboard


    jd wrote: »
    Looks like Shane Ross found writing for the rag a bit easier
    Shane Ross does outrage. And that's it. Now that the windbag is actually expected to do something, he's been found out.

    Hopefully he'll be dumped at the next election but it looks like we're going to have a wait a while for that.


  • #213
    BoatMad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭BoatMad


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    road funding should be massively diverted towards rail in the Dublin area at least, I would also argue that many schemes if they have to be put on hold, should be. Dublin the capital and the lifeblood to the rest of the economy, is grinding to a halt...

    agreed


  • #214
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,461 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Fully agree with the above. The M50 between the N3, N4 and N7 junctions (eg the planned for upgrade roads) can't take any more cars. No point in upgrading the M4 east of Kilcock if it's just going to result in a longer queue at the N4/M50 junction


  • #215
    SeanW
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,879 ✭✭✭SeanW


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    road funding should be massively diverted towards rail in the Dublin area at least, I would also argue that many schemes if they have to be put on hold, should be. Dublin the capital and the lifeblood to the rest of the economy, is grinding to a halt...
    Agreed, Dart Underground and Metro North should be at the absolute top of the priority list, but the problem in my view is that capital spending is not sufficient. Transport is the life blood of a functioning economy and society, and ours is clogging to a halt. If funding is limited, Dublin rail should be at the top of the list, but other needs (such as the M20, and various local bypasses that would speed up long distance traffic and give towns back to their people) should also be funded as a matter of urgency.


  • #216
    BoatMad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭BoatMad


    SeanW wrote: »
    Agreed, Dart Underground and Metro North should be at the absolute top of the priority list, but the problem in my view is that capital spending is not sufficient. Transport is the life blood of a functioning economy and society, and ours is clogging to a halt. If funding is limited, Dublin rail should be at the top of the list, but other needs (such as the M20, and various local bypasses that would speed up long distance traffic and give towns back to their people) should also be funded as a matter of urgency.

    M20 is not as important as spending on the capitals infrastructure , if money is limited it should all be spent in the capital for a few years

    ( and I dont live anywhere near the capital )


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  • #217
    loyatemu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,109 ✭✭✭✭loyatemu


    BoatMad wrote: »
    M20 is not as important as spending on the capitals infrastructure , if money is limited it should all be spent in the capital for a few years

    ( and I dont live anywhere near the capital )

    people are dying on the N20 (and I don't live anywhere near Munster).


  • #218
    Shurwhynot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 561 ✭✭✭Shurwhynot


    BoatMad wrote: »
    M20 is not as important as spending on the capitals infrastructure , if money is limited it should all be spent in the capital for a few years

    ( and I dont live anywhere near the capital )

    Crazy theory :confused:


  • #219
    Mc Love
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,015 ✭✭✭✭Mc Love


    Is there a need for the DU though? I'd put the M20 and MN above it


  • #220
    Vanquished
    Registered Users Posts: 1,034 ✭✭✭Vanquished


    DU is a long overdue and critical piece of infrastructure linking the busiest intercity and suburban rail lines in the country. It's absolutely imperative for Dublin and the CBA is extremely favourable too.
    Mc Love wrote: »
    Is there a need for the DU though? I'd put the M20 and MN above it


  • #221
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,461 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Let's not forget DART Underground also links Metro North with the Heuston line meaning easy access to the airport from Waterford, Galway, Cork, Limerick, Tralee and Westport.

    People underestimate the importance of DART Underground, the current GDA rail network is a joke between issues such as Heuston not linking to the other lines or the city centre and the general congestion around Connolly and across the Loopline bridge


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  • #222
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,853 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    Metro North just brings commuters from North of the city into the city centre, vitally important. It doesn't link things together as well as DART Underground though.

    Are you joking?! The revised metro north is likely to hook up with current green line at ranelagh where it will surface from a tunnel. At that stage, the new extension from cherrywood to bray will likely be open or under construction. This line will run potentially from northern line to bray in south connecting mass population centres, business campus, an airport serving near 30,000,000 this yea and not to mention all the trip generators in city centre. It should take a lot of traffic off m50. I'd prefer it to start before dart underground...


  • #223
    NiallBoo
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭NiallBoo


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    I'd prefer it(metro north) to start before dart underground...

    I'd prefer them both to start yesterday.

    Which is more important is a moot point - they're good projects that are well worth the investment and both are needed urgently.

    I think we're guilty of just looking at a couple of things and thinking one or the other.
    We need x, y and z but by the time they get pushed through the sludge of moaning we're left with "we're doing x, sure that'll do", "isn't it great we're getting it, that'll solve all our problems".

    By the time x is finally built, we're left with the reality that in spite of all the blowing and panting, we haven't even kept up with where we were when we started.

    Rinse and repeat, with extra spin cycle.


  • #224
    sondagefaux
    Registered Users Posts: 1,443 ✭✭✭sondagefaux


    According to Paschal Donohue, there will be a Capital Spending Review and he will announce a new programme for capital spending next year.

    The only roads schemes he mentioned are the ongoing PPP schemes from Gort to Tuam (M18/M17), the Gorey to Enniscorthy M11 scheme and the New Ross bypass (N25).

    He hasn't announced any new spending on major road schemes today, although he mentioned an increase in spending on non-national roads.


  • #225
    MayoSalmon
    Registered Users Posts: 2,325 ✭✭✭MayoSalmon


    sondagefaux wrote: »
    According to Paschal Donohue, there will be a Capital Spending Review and he will announce a new programme for capital spending next year.

    The only roads schemes he mentioned are the ongoing PPP schemes from Gort to Tuam (M18/M17), the Gorey to Enniscorthy M11 scheme and the New Ross bypass (N25).

    He hasn't announced any new spending on major road schemes today, although he mentioned an increase in spending on non-national roads.

    So basically nothing new!


  • #226
    Shurwhynot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 561 ✭✭✭Shurwhynot


    MayoSalmon wrote: »
    So basically nothing new!

    To be fair, i don't think they were going to announce that they were building the M20 or anything like that today. They'd leave an announcement like that until the Mid Term Review, which Noonan has said will be early 2017 now


  • #227
    sondagefaux
    Registered Users Posts: 1,443 ✭✭✭sondagefaux


    Deedsie wrote: »
    He also mentioned DART Expansion and Metro North.
    I didn't realise they were roads.

    Note: see thread title...
    Government Roads Programme to be announced soon?


  • #228
    spacetweek
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,147 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    It's ok to talk about things that aren't roads for 5 seconds considering there is a single Minister for Transport and it's budget day.

    Dart Expansion, metro north, M17, Enniscorthy and New Ross are all in the bag. We want to hear about new things not reannouncements!


  • #229
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    Mc Love wrote: »
    Is there a need for the DU though? I'd put the M20 and MN above it

    DU is more important than MN. DU will benefit the entire rail network


  • #230
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    .

    Are you joking?! The revised metro north is likely to hook up with current green line at ranelagh where it will surface from a tunnel. At that stage, the new extension from cherrywood to bray will likely be open or under construction. This line will run potentially from northern line to bray in south connecting mass population centres, business campus, an airport serving near 30,000,000 this yea and not to mention all the trip generators in city centre. It should take a lot of traffic off m50. I'd prefer it to start before dart underground...

    First I'm hearing of these plans apart from the crayon threads elsewhere here. I have heard nothing official about mn surfacing in ranelagh or a new Luas extention


  • #231
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    Deedsie wrote: »
    Metro South will run from Stephens green and run along (parts if not all) of the Luas green line. How that makes Metro North a more important project to DART Expansion I am unsure.

    MS. Great I'd love a trip to Bray in 2060 on the opening day of MS to celebrate my 80th. I thought we were discussing semi realistic as in the next 15-20 years not a pipe dream's pipe dream


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  • #232
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,869 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Mod: Can we get back to Government Capital spending on ROADS, please.

    DU and MN have their own threads - also there have been no announcements of any substance on them for some time.


  • #233
    BoatMad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭BoatMad


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    Mod: Can we get back to Government Capital spending on ROADS, please.

    DU and MN have their own threads - also there have been no announcements of any substance on them for some time.


    Very little need at present to build more rural motorways. Most have spindrift blowing down them at times. All expenditure should concentrate on the GDA for the next 5-10 years.


  • #234
    serfboard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,720 ✭✭✭serfboard


    BoatMad wrote: »
    Very little need at present to build more rural motorways. Most have spindrift blowing down them at times. All expenditure should concentrate on the GDA for the next 5-10 years.
    You really think the M20 doesn't need to be built? You obviously don't travel Cork->Limerick very often ...


  • #235
    SeanW
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,879 ✭✭✭SeanW


    On roads the M20 is badly needed. There are also needs for small town bypasses, Slane being one I can think of off the top of my head, towns on the N4 and N5, numerous secondary roads.


  • #236
    sondagefaux
    Registered Users Posts: 1,443 ✭✭✭sondagefaux


    serfboard wrote: »
    BoatMad wrote: »
    Very little need at present to build more rural motorways. Most have spindrift blowing down them at times. All expenditure should concentrate on the GDA for the next 5-10 years.
    You really think the M20 doesn't need to be built? You obviously don't travel Cork->Limerick very often ...
    A certain type of Dub doesn't seem to realise that the Cork to Limerick route is the most important (and the most deficient) part of a route that connects, Cork, Limerick, Shannon, Ennis, Galway, Sligo, Co.Donegal (including Letterkenny) and Derry.

    The concept of 'rural motorways' is rather strange.

    What motorway in Ireland has been built primarily to connect the rural areas through which it passes to each other?

    It's like claiming that the M1 in England is a 'rural motorway' because it passes through rural areas for most of its length.

    Weird nonsense...


  • #237
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,461 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    SeanW wrote: »
    On roads the M20 is badly needed. There are also needs for small town bypasses, Slane being one I can think of off the top of my head, towns on the N4 and N5, numerous secondary roads.

    Slane, Adare, Macroom, New Ross (under construction), Borrisokane, the entire M20, Inishannon, Bandon, Charlestown (N17), Tobercurry, Ballybofey, Stranorlar, Carrick-on-Shannon, Castlemartyr, Killeagh, Virginia, Galway, along with relief roads for a few national secondaries.

    There's no bottlenecks left on the N5


  • #238
    irishgeo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,529 ✭✭✭irishgeo


    marno21 wrote: »
    Slane, Adare, Macroom, New Ross (under construction), Borrisokane, the entire M20, Inishannon, Bandon, Charlestown (N17), Tobercurry, Ballybofey, Stranorlar, Carrick-on-Shannon, Castlemartyr, Killeagh, Virginia, Galway, along with relief roads for a few national secondaries.

    There's no bottlenecks left on the N5

    the rest of the road through roscommon, it might not be a bottleneck but its not National primary route standard.


  • #239
    unit 1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 549 ✭✭✭unit 1


    I have a sneaky suspicion that shovel ready N5 will get the nod from EK;)


  • #240
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    sondagefaux wrote: »
    A certain type of Dub doesn't seem to realise that the Cork to Limerick route is the most important (and the most deficient) part of a route that connects, Cork, Limerick, Shannon, Ennis, Galway, Sligo, Co.Donegal (including Letterkenny) and Derry.
    Maybe there are a certain type of Dub but your real 'enemy' here is the 'we need to bypass every town and village and upgraded every road' brigade before we'll worry about those city slickers of Dublin, Cork, Limerick or Galway variety.


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  • #241
    sondagefaux
    Registered Users Posts: 1,443 ✭✭✭sondagefaux


    LeinsterDub wrote: »
    sondagefaux wrote: »
    A certain type of Dub doesn't seem to realise that the Cork to Limerick route is the most important (and the most deficient) part of a route that connects, Cork, Limerick, Shannon, Ennis, Galway, Sligo, Co.Donegal (including Letterkenny) and Derry.
    Maybe there are a certain type of Dub but your real 'enemy' here is the 'we need to bypass every town and village and upgraded every road' brigade before we'll worry about those city slickers of Dublin, Cork, Limerick or Galway variety.
    I don't know which roads you're talking about, but I was talking about the M20...


  • #242
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    sondagefaux wrote: »
    I don't know which roads you're talking about, but I was talking about the M20...
    marno21 wrote: »
    Slane, Adare, Macroom, New Ross (under construction), Borrisokane, the entire M20, Inishannon, Bandon, Charlestown (N17), Tobercurry, Ballybofey, Stranorlar, Carrick-on-Shannon, Castlemartyr, Killeagh, Virginia, Galway, along with relief roads for a few national secondaries.

    There's no bottlenecks left on the N5

    These kind of projects. Excluding the M20 and Galway


  • #243
    sondagefaux
    Registered Users Posts: 1,443 ✭✭✭sondagefaux


    LeinsterDub wrote: »
    sondagefaux wrote: »
    I don't know which roads you're talking about, but I was talking about the M20...
    marno21 wrote: »
    Slane, Adare, Macroom, New Ross (under construction), Borrisokane, the entire M20, Inishannon, Bandon, Charlestown (N17), Tobercurry, Ballybofey, Stranorlar, Carrick-on-Shannon, Castlemartyr, Killeagh, Virginia, Galway, along with relief roads for a few national secondaries.

    There's no bottlenecks left on the N5

    These kind of projects. Excluding the M20 and Galway
    Charlestown (N17), Tobercurry, Ballybofey, Stranorlar are towns and villages along the Atlantic Corridor, part of the route connecting Cork to Letterkenny and Derry via Limerick, Ennis, Galway and Sligo. They will by bypassed as part of improvements to that route...
    New Ross, Castlemartyr and Killeagh are all on the N25 route, connecting Cork to Waterford, Wexford and Rosslare. It's a route of major importance as it connects the entire southern area to one of the state's only ports with regular ro/ro ferry services to the UK.
    If you're not familiar with Adare, Macroom, Inishannon, Bandon, Carrick-on-Shannon and Virginia, you won't know that they're major bottlenecks on national primary and important tourist routes. All need bypasses.
    Borrisokane is a bottleneck on the N52 especially, which is gradually being improved and, when improved along its entire length, will provide a very good route connecting the north-east with the mid-west and south-west via the midlands, helping to reduce congestion on the M7/M50/M1 routes.
    Not one of these proposed bypass or improvement schemes is unjustifiable.


  • #244
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,461 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    The reason I mention Borrisokane is because all the heavy vehicles going through the town are making absolute horse****e of the surface and bar a complete relay, it needs bypassing. Of course there's also the complication of the N65.

    Between Letterkenny and Waterford, you have:

    Ballybofey/Stranorlar - N13/N15 Ballybofey/Stranorlar bypass
    Cliffony/Grange/Drumcliffe/Rathcormac - all to be bypassed as part of N15 Sligo to County Boundary
    Sligo - N4 Sligo bypass
    Tobercurry - N17 Tobercurry BP
    Charlestown - N17 Knock - Tobercurry
    Milltown & Ballindine - N17 Tuam - Claremorris
    Tuam - N17 Tuam BP (under construction)
    Claregalway/Oranmore/Clarinbridge - M17/M18 Gort-Tuam (under construction)
    Charleville/Buttevant/Mallow - M20 Cork - Limerick
    Cork - N40 Cork North Ring Road
    Castlemartyr/Killeagh - N25 Midleton - Youghal
    Dungarvan - N25 Dungarvan Outer Bypass

    This is the Atlantic Corridor. Connecting all the counter-balances to Dublin along the west coast. How in a developed economy are we supposed to move people and goods around if they have to trapse through all these towns?

    Then you have the extremely busy N21/N22, connecting Cork and Limerick to Kerry. Both have higher volumes along their length than stretches of the M7, M8 and M9, and will likely have higher volumes than the M17. On the N21, you have Adare, Newcastlewest and Adare, and on the N22 Macroom and Killarney. Both cause 15 min+ delays at peak times per town meaning 45 minutes on the N21 and 30 minutes on the N22 looking at the car in front of you stopped.

    But of course we have to upgrade one of the quietest national primaries in a roundabout fashion through a heritage site.


  • #245
    NiallBoo
    Registered Users Posts: 1,504 ✭✭✭NiallBoo


    sondagefaux wrote: »
    Virginia...major bottlenecks on national primary and important tourist routes. All need bypasses.
    This one at least will require major rerouting and won't happen until/unless there's funding to do from the Cavan/Meath border to Cavan town (earlier plans suggested 2+2).

    I.e. not in the next 15+ years, if ever...rightly down the list of priorities given the scale


  • #246
    LeinsterDub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,229 ✭✭✭LeinsterDub


    sondagefaux wrote: »
    Not one of these proposed bypass or improvement schemes is unjustifiable.

    I'm sure they are justifiable, most things are the issue is whether they should have been prioritised over the likes of the M20 and other non road projects


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  • #247
    BoatMad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭BoatMad


    sondagefaux wrote: »
    A certain type of Dub doesn't seem to realise that the Cork to Limerick route is the most important (and the most deficient) part of a route that connects, Cork, Limerick, Shannon, Ennis, Galway, Sligo, Co.Donegal (including Letterkenny) and Derry.

    The concept of 'rural motorways' is rather strange.

    What motorway in Ireland has been built primarily to connect the rural areas through which it passes to each other?

    It's like claiming that the M1 in England is a 'rural motorway' because it passes through rural areas for most of its length.

    Weird nonsense...


    I'm not a Dub and I live 80 miles from Dublin, thanks

    I can plainly see the transport chaos that exists in Dublin and I do not see that chaos anywhere else to the same extent and I certainly dont see it on the Cork to Limerick road

    it would be " nice" to have the M20 , but Dublin " needs " more transport spending

    Needs before nice IMHO


  • #248
    Calina
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Calina


    BoatMad wrote: »
    I'm not a Dub and I live 80 miles from Dublin, thanks

    I can plainly see the transport chaos that exists in Dublin and I do not see that chaos anywhere else to the same extent and I certainly dont see it on the Cork to Limerick road

    it would be " nice" to have the M20 , but Dublin " needs " more transport spending

    Needs before nice IMHO

    Depends. N20 has seen a few fatal accidents in the past year. I'd argue that a dangerous road needs to be looked at.


  • #249
    Chris_5339762
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,963 ✭✭✭Chris_5339762


    Fatal accident rate should trump traffic jams, certainly in the case of M20 vs MN/DU. But all are needed in any case, just none of them seem to be moving.


  • #250
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,461 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Both are needed.

    Limerick and Cork are the two biggest cities in Ireland outside of Dublin. Both have lots of major enterprise centres, two airports, two TEN-T core ports, two universities, two ITs, and are the biggest alternative to Dublin for business and investment. They are 100km apart. Outer suburbs of Cork and Limerick are 90km apart. It currently takes 2 hours to travel between the two at peak times. That's 45-50km/h. That is just ridiculous for 2016. Why anyone thinks the M20 isn't absolutely desperately needed I don't get.

    Dublin also needs DART Underground and Metro North. Not in 2035. Now. The M20 and DU/MN are both equally needed in different places for different reasons. They are equally important to their respective locations. (I'd argue that the M28 and Dunkettle are as important for Cork. Both are obscenely underpowered for their respective purposes and why the Government are ****ing about with them is beyond me considering the benefits of each. Dunkettle has a cost benefit ratio of 10:1. I'd love to see how that compares with the N5 especially considering Dunkettle is CHEAPER and READY TO GO).


  • #251
    BoatMad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,702 ✭✭✭✭BoatMad


    Chris_5339762 wrote: »
    Fatal accident rate should trump traffic jams, certainly in the case of M20 vs MN/DU. But all are needed in any case, just none of them seem to be moving.

    fatal accidents should result in increased Garda activity, as the primary cause of accidents is statisically speed and drink driving

    accidents in them selves are not a good reason to build a motorway

    The congestion evident every day in moving around the capital is a goo reason to invest in transport spending and to prioritise that spending in an era of limited " fiscal space" into the area where it benefits the most people and that is clearly the capital and its environs


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