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Someone to proof-read manuscript ?

  • 23-01-2015 9:04pm
    #1
    dandyelevan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 257 ✭✭


    I hope to have a book completed in about two weeks (or five thousand words, which ever comes first!)
    Genre: Historical Irish Crime, c 60,000 words.

    In the past I've asked relatives or friends to proof-read what I've written, but I'd prefer an honest outside opinion on this work, for many reasons.

    It's a lot to ask of someone, especially as it's unpaid, but maybe there is another writer in a similar position that would 'swap' manuscripts?

    This is my fifth book.


Comments

  • #2
    femur61
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,588 ✭✭✭femur61


    dandyelevan wrote: »
    I hope to have a book completed in about two weeks (or five thousand words, which ever comes first!)
    Genre: Historical Irish Crime, c 60,000 words.

    In the past I've asked relatives or friends to proof-read what I've written, but I'd prefer an honest outside opinion on this work, for many reasons.

    It's a lot to ask of someone, especially as it's unpaid, but maybe there is another writer in a similar position that would 'swap' manuscripts?

    This is my fifth book.

    Great idea but I am not finished my book yet, my second book, so I will check back with you to see if you got any offers. TBH I wouldn't have time to read your manuscript. Like you I would like honest feedback. Good luck. Mine is historical as well, Ireland 1918.


  • #3
    smcgiff
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,943 ✭✭✭smcgiff


    I wouldn't commit to reading an entire manuscript, but would read the first couple of thousand words and go from there.


  • #4
    dandyelevan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 257 ✭✭dandyelevan


    smcgiff wrote: »
    I wouldn't commit to reading an entire manuscript, but would read the first couple of thousand words and go from there.

    I can send a sample chapter, or two ?


  • #5
    smcgiff
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,943 ✭✭✭smcgiff


    dandyelevan wrote: »
    I can send a sample chapter, or two ?

    Hi, I'll PM you my email. Just send your first chapter. I used to do a lot of critiquing in the past. This might trigger my own writing again.


  • #6
    EileenG
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,775 ✭✭✭EileenG


    I won't read the whole thing, but I'll read a sample chapter and the synopsis. My speciality is reading a synopsis and ripping it apart.


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  • #7
    dandyelevan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 257 ✭✭dandyelevan


    femur61 wrote: »
    Great idea but I am not finished my book yet, my second book, so I will check back with you to see if you got any offers. TBH I wouldn't have time to read your manuscript. Like you I would like honest feedback. Good luck. Mine is historical as well, Ireland 1918.


    Let me know when you finish up and I'll 'cast an eye' over it if you wish.
    Retired now, so I've got rakes of time !


  • #8
    dandyelevan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 257 ✭✭dandyelevan


    Sent my chapters as requested, got confirmation they were received via email... and waited...and waited... am still waiting.
    My contact closed his account here soon afterwards.
    I emailed...but got no response!

    Ah well...the stuffs copyrighted.


  • #9
    femur61
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,588 ✭✭✭femur61


    Thats terrible. What do they hope to achieve?


  • #10
    hcass
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 628 ✭✭✭hcass


    That is so weird - he had posted thousands of times here too?? Very strange altogether...


  • #11
    Del.Monte
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Del.Monte


    What's so strange? A former moderator who closes his account due to not being on Boards much anymore: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=94101423&postcount=1

    It's poor form if he doesn't - eventually - come back to you but he's hardly quit Boards to steal the manuscript.

    ****



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  • #12
    hcass
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 628 ✭✭✭hcass


    I don't think anyone stole a manuscript - I just think it;s strange that he wouldn't just tell the author that he would be leaving Boards and would not be looking at his script. I mean would it really be that difficult to do?


  • #13
    dandyelevan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 257 ✭✭dandyelevan


    I'm not saying anyone 'stole' anything but it's a bit strange he never got back to me.
    Either the 'script really stank...or it was so brilliant he's stuck for words.

    Anyway, water under the bridge.
    Book is finished now, at last.


  • #14
    Das Kitty
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 17,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭Das Kitty


    dandyelevan wrote: »
    I'm not saying anyone 'stole' anything but it's a bit strange he never got back to me.
    Either the 'script really stank...or it was so brilliant he's stuck for words.

    Anyway, water under the bridge.
    Book is finished now, at last.

    There could be any number of reasons. Life gets in the way sometimes and we need to withdraw.

    Congrats on finishing the book. Great achievement!


  • #15
    dandyelevan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 257 ✭✭dandyelevan


    Das Kitty wrote: »
    There could be any number of reasons. Life gets in the way sometimes and we need to withdraw.

    Congrats on finishing the book. Great achievement!

    I know the feeling only too well.

    Thanks for that DK.


  • #16
    EileenG
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,775 ✭✭✭EileenG


    Reading a manuscript for someone is hard work. It's not like reading a book where you are just reading for fun. You are paying a lot of extra attention because you have to tell the author what worked and what didn't. He may just not have found the time or energy to read it. It's not that he is not going it, it's just at the end of a list of other stuff which has to get done.


  • #17
    dandyelevan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 257 ✭✭dandyelevan


    That's fair enough Eileen, but I only sent a Synopsis, the Introduction and two opening chapters.


  • #18
    EileenG
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,775 ✭✭✭EileenG


    Send them to me if you want.


  • #19
    dandyelevan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 257 ✭✭dandyelevan


    EileenG wrote: »
    Send them to me if you want.

    Thanks EileenG,
    pm me your email.


  • #20
    Smidge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,541 ✭✭✭Smidge


    How does this actually work? Getting someone to read and critique something but without it being taken(if its any good :D)by the reader?
    Genuine question btw :)


  • #21
    Das Kitty
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 17,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭Das Kitty


    Smidge wrote: »
    How does this actually work? Getting someone to read and critique something but without it being taken(if its any good :D)by the reader?
    Genuine question btw :)

    Unless you're some sort of undiscovered literary genius, no one will take your manuscript. Even if you are.

    You'll have trouble enough hawking it to publishers and agents.

    And there's no money in short stories and poetry so trust me, no one will take it.

    If you want some open critique you could try posting something here or in Write Club.


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  • #22
    Smidge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,541 ✭✭✭Smidge


    Das Kitty wrote: »
    Unless you're some sort of undiscovered literary genius, no one will take your manuscript. Even if you are.

    You'll have trouble enough hawking it to publishers and agents.

    And there's no money in short stories and poetry so trust me, no one will take it.

    If you want some open critique you could try posting something here or in Write Club.

    I never mentioned anything about a manuscript/poetry/short stories and nothing about me having written anything to "hawk" around:confused:

    It was a general question on the above comments regarding someone sending some work to someone to read and not hearing back from them.
    It got me thinking as to what would happen if someone did take your ideas from the few chapters and synopsis that you sent them and use them as their own work.
    What rights has a person got over their work, would it need to be copyrighted before you would even send out a couple of chapters for a trial run?
    That was it basically, my curiosity was piqued by the thread.


  • #23
    Das Kitty
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 17,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭Das Kitty


    Smidge wrote: »
    I never mentioned anything about a manuscript/poetry/short stories and nothing about me having written anything to "hawk" around:confused:

    It was a general question on the above comments regarding someone sending some work to someone to read and not hearing back from them.
    It got me thinking as to what would happen if someone did take your ideas from the few chapters and synopsis that you sent them and use them as their own work.
    What rights has a person got over their work, would it need to be copyrighted before you would even send out a couple of chapters for a trial run?
    That was it basically, my curiosity was piqued by the thread.

    I was using the "royal" you. :P

    I meant any of us. Myself included.

    If you wrote something, and can prove when you did, the copyright is yours. But it's not a situation that arises because fiction is awful bloody hard to sell even when it's your own and you love it like a child.


  • #24
    Smidge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,541 ✭✭✭Smidge


    Das Kitty wrote: »
    I was using the "royal" you. :P

    I meant any of us. Myself included.

    If you wrote something, and can prove when you did, the copyright is yours. But it's not a situation that arises because fiction is awful bloody hard to sell even when it's your own and you love it like a child.

    What would be considered "proof" of ownership and therefore granting you copyright?

    Interesting thread btw :)


  • #25
    EileenG
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,775 ✭✭✭EileenG


    The email where you sent it is proof that you sent it. Your own computer will have timestamps on your file. And in a court case, where two people are claiming the same book, early drafts showing development of ideas are considered proof.

    There is no copyright on ideas. It's easy to write a story about, say, a vampire, let someone else read it and six months later they write a story about a vampire. "They stole my idea, I'm going to sue."

    Stop. Unless you invented a whole new type of vampire that no one in the history of literature has ever thought of, you haven't a chance. Someone else got there before you did, and many more will come up with the same idea after. Ideas are ten a penny. Not just ideas. Plots.

    I frequently give away entire plots, because plots are the easy bit of writing. Anyone can think of a plot. The hard work is writing it, and developing the characters and editing and editing and editing until it has some chance of being published.

    The hard bit is not protecting your precious idea from being stolen, it's getting someone who will actually read your story in the first place.

    It's not easy to steal unpublished books and do anything useful with them. Let's say you found a briefcase containing the only copy in existance of EL James' next opus. Do you think you can sell it to a publisher for a fortune? No, because without her name on the cover, it would not sell.


  • #26
    Smidge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,541 ✭✭✭Smidge


    EileenG wrote: »
    The email where you sent it is proof that you sent it. Your own computer will have timestamps on your file. And in a court case, where two people are claiming the same book, early drafts showing development of ideas are considered proof.

    There is no copyright on ideas. It's easy to write a story about, say, a vampire, let someone else read it and six months later they write a story about a vampire. "They stole my idea, I'm going to sue."

    Stop. Unless you invented a whole new type of vampire that no one in the history of literature has ever thought of, you haven't a chance. Someone else got there before you did, and many more will come up with the same idea after. Ideas are ten a penny. Not just ideas. Plots.

    I frequently give away entire plots, because plots are the easy bit of writing. Anyone can think of a plot. The hard work is writing it, and developing the characters and editing and editing and editing until it has some chance of being published.

    The hard bit is not protecting your precious idea from being stolen, it's getting someone who will actually read your story in the first place.

    It's not easy to steal unpublished books and do anything useful with them. Let's say you found a briefcase containing the only copy in existance of EL James' next opus. Do you think you can sell it to a publisher for a fortune? No, because without her name on the cover, it would not sell.

    Its funny that you mentioned El James! Was just talking about that the other day. I had read it and was floored like so many others how bad it was. I was coerced(:D)into watching it with a friend the other day and I got about a third/halfway through before I couldnt watch anymore. It was that bad.
    I find it hard to believe that she was an relatively unknown, first time published author and she got famous and wealthy with that type of trump.
    My point, I suppose?
    She was unknown when it was published so if you did indeed find a first copy if 50 shades in a briefcase, would you have the same luck as she did with it?


  • #27
    Das Kitty
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 17,231 Mod ✭✭✭✭Das Kitty


    Smidge wrote: »
    Its funny that you mentioned El James! Was just talking about that the other day. I had read it and was floored like so many others how bad it was. I was coerced(:D)into watching it with a friend the other day and I got about a third/halfway through before I couldnt watch anymore. It was that bad.
    I find it hard to believe that she was an relatively unknown, first time published author and she got famous and wealthy with that type of trump.
    My point, I suppose?
    She was unknown when it was published so if you did indeed find a first copy if 50 shades in a briefcase, would you have the same luck as she did with it?

    She wasn't unknown. She had the most popular fan-fiction of all time.


  • #28
    Smidge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,541 ✭✭✭Smidge


    Das Kitty wrote: »
    She wasn't unknown. She had the most popular fan-fiction of all time.

    She was well know before she wrote 50 shades?
    (I dont know anything much about her at all tbh, that was just what I had read that she was an unknown before 50 shades)


  • #29
    EileenG
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,775 ✭✭✭EileenG


    She was not traditionally published, but she had written an incredibly popular fanfic (replace Christian and Ana with Edward and Bella and you'll get it) which went on to be an incredibly successful self-pub. When it got bought by Random House, they built on the hype until people who never bought books bought it just to see what the fuss was about.

    But there are literally millions of Twilight fanfics out there which did not go on to outsell Harry Potter.

    EL James did the literary equivelent of winning the lotto with a ticket she found lying in the gutter. But, let's not lose sight of the fact that she had written a book and put it out there. A lot of the people bashing her have not actually got to the point of finishing a book or trying to sell it.


  • #30
    Smidge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,541 ✭✭✭Smidge


    EileenG wrote: »
    She was not traditionally published, but she had written an incredibly popular fanfic (replace Christian and Ana with Edward and Bella and you'll get it) which went on to be an incredibly successful self-pub. When it got bought by Random House, they built on the hype until people who never bought books bought it just to see what the fuss was about.

    But there are literally millions of Twilight fanfics out there which did not go on to outsell Harry Potter.

    EL James did the literary equivelent of winning the lotto with a ticket she found lying in the gutter. But, let's not lose sight of the fact that she had written a book and put it out there. A lot of the people bashing her have not actually got to the point of finishing a book or trying to sell it.


    Thats very interesting!
    As I said I know hardly nothing about her as an author and absolutely nothing about her fanfic past.
    She seems to know how to jockey back to her own advantage(and fair play I suppose if you can get away with it :D)
    Thanks for the info :)


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  • #31
    Livvie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 714 ✭✭✭Livvie


    Fifty Shades didn't appear to be well edited (or edited at all) but if you could get past that, there actually was a story there, and although there were things that really annoyed me - mainly the repetition - I did become involved with the characters and wanted to know what motivated Christian, what his back story was etc.

    Millions read it and enjoyed it - and if it encouraged just a few to read more, it did some good.

    A lot of people said it demeaned women. I'm sure there are books that do exactly that. I thought that in FSOG, the woman was most definitely the one in control, especially the further into the story you got.


  • #32
    EileenG
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,775 ✭✭✭EileenG


    Livvie wrote: »
    Fifty Shades didn't appear to be well edited (or edited at all) but if you could get past that, there actually was a story there, and although there were things that really annoyed me - mainly the repetition - I did become involved with the characters and wanted to know what motivated Christian, what his back story was etc.

    Millions read it and enjoyed it - and if it encouraged just a few to read more, it did some good.

    A lot of people said it demeaned women. I'm sure there are books that do exactly that. I thought that in FSOG, the woman was most definitely the one in control, especially the further into the story you got.

    Yes, I would go further and say she was a passive aggressive manipulator. Of couurse, he was a psycho stalker.


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