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Ongoing religious scandals

1464749515275

Comments

  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,510 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    and so this **** begins in another country! We won't see the back of these stories for several decades!

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-28795897
    Chilean priest probed after 'stolen babies' scandal
    A judge in Chile has barred a Catholic priest from leaving the country over claims he had pressured single women to give up their babies for adoption.

    The ruling blocks a church recommendation that Father Gerardo Joannon, 77, go on retreat abroad.

    He allegedly belonged to a network of clerics and doctors who gave the babies to married couples under the rule of Augusto Pinochet in the 1970s and '80s.

    This was done to avoid the social stigma of unmarried motherhood.


    If the women resisted, they were told that their children had died during birth.

    'Fake funerals'

    Father Joannon is a senior cleric at the Congregation of the Sacred Hearts of Jesus and Mary in the Chilean capital, Santiago.

    Following the allegations, his archdiocese suspended him and launched its own internal investigation.

    This week, it concluded that he was involved in two "irregular adoptions".

    In both cases, the mothers were anaesthetised during labour and later told their babies had died.

    In actual fact, the children had been given to other families, according to the investigation.

    The church said Father Joannon knew they were alive but nevertheless conducted funeral masses for the children.

    The church recommended he apologise to his victims and go to Madrid, Spain, "to initiate a process of psychological and spiritual accompaniment".

    The case is being investigated by Chilean Judge Mario Carroza who ordered the cleric to stay in Chile for at least two months while a police investigation continues.

    seriously wtf is wrong with these people? :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,773 ✭✭✭eire4


    Cabaal wrote: »
    and so this **** begins in another country! We won't see the back of these stories for several decades!

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-28795897





    seriously wtf is wrong with these people? :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:


    To put it mildy. Criminal doesn't even come close to describing it.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    George Pell, high priest of all Australia, compares priests to truckers and denies that the institutional church has any responsibility for the abuse scandal.

    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/pell-compares-priests-to-truckers-as-victims-given-apologies-20140821-3e3mk.html
    Cardinal George Pell has strongly defended the so-called Melbourne Response as Australia's first comprehensive redress scheme for victims of clerical sexual abuse at the royal commission. Appearing at the commission via video link from the Vatican in Rome on Thursday night, Cardinal Pell likened the Catholic Church's responsibility for child abuse to that of a ''trucking company''. If a driver sexually assaulted a passenger they picked up along the way, he said, ''I don't think it appropriate for the … leadership of that company be held responsible.''

    Cardinal Pell, who established the Melbourne Response when he was Archbishop of the Melbourne Archdiocese in 1996, denied suggestions that any of its three arms - the Independent Commissioner, compensation panel and counselling arm Carelink - had stopped operating independently of the other. Sean Cash, a lawyer for abuse victim Paul Hersbach, challenged the trucking company analogy, saying that because the Catholic Church was an organisation of the ''highest integrity'' it owed victims a far greater legal and moral responsibility. He said it should not impede victims' ability to receive full and fair compensation.

    ''We were among the front-runners in Melbourne in addressing these scandals and I would suggest to you that that is entirely consistent with Catholic tradition and the teachings of Christ,'' Cardinal Pell replied. He also apologised to parents of abuse victims Emma and Katie, Christine and Anthony Foster, who won a $750,000 settlement from the Melbourne archdiocese after two of their three daughters were sexually abused by notorious abuser Father Kevin O'Donnell. Mr Foster said Cardinal Pell showed a ''sociopathic lack of empathy'' when they met to discuss the case in the 1990s.

    In his statement to the child abuse royal commission, Cardinal Pell said he had not tried to insult the Fosters. ''It was certainly not my intention to upset them. I wanted to help them. I regret deeply that I have been unable to bring them even a small amount of healing,'' he said. Earlier on Thursday, church lawyer Richard Leder told the commission that Melbourne Archbishop Denis Hart had ''strongly held views that every effort should be made to settle'' the Fosters' case. He said the church could have argued it could not be legally sued, but Archbishop Hart did not want to go down that route.

    ''While that would be a legal victory, that would not be a victory that the Archbishop would have enjoyed,'' Mr Leder said. His answer drew jeers from the public gallery. Mr Leder also apologised before the Royal Commission over incorrect statements made in correspondence between himself and senior figures from the archdiocese and the Melbourne Response. The comments were made regarding an application for church funding by the Foster family, who requested the church pay for special accommodation for Emma. She suffered from depression, anorexia and drug addiction.

    But Mr Leder accused the Fosters of kicking their eldest daughter out of home, and the church rejected the funding request. Royal commission chairman Justice Peter McClellan asked for an explanation. Mr Leder could not recall why he had made the comment and apologised to the Fosters, who have attended all of the commission hearings in Melbourne.


  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,510 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    robindch wrote: »
    George Pell, high priest of all Australia, compares priests to truckers and denies that the institutional church has any responsibility for the abuse scandal.

    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/pell-compares-priests-to-truckers-as-victims-given-apologies-20140821-3e3mk.html

    His comparison is deeply flawed,

    If a trucking company had internal policy's to cover up employee sexual abuse and they knowingly moved the drivers to other areas so they could abuse again then you'd very much so hold the truck company liable for the abuses.

    This is what the Vatican did so they are very much so liable,

    Seems he doesn't even know the church's own policy;s
    :rolleyes:


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Cabaal wrote: »
    His comparison is deeply flawed[...]
    It's also annoyed a lot of truckers:

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/22/truckers-outraged-by-cardinal-george-pells-sex-abuse-comparison


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,624 ✭✭✭SebBerkovich


    robindch wrote: »
    George Pell, high priest of all Australia, compares priests to truckers and denies that the institutional church has any responsibility for the abuse scandal.

    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/pell-compares-priests-to-truckers-as-victims-given-apologies-20140821-3e3mk.html

    I think it would be better for the RCC to compares itself to wall street bankers, in that both groups have done horrible things to society and have somehow avoided any responsibility for their actions.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,533 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    robindch wrote: »
    It's also annoyed a lot of truckers:

    Truckers - grand bunch of lads.

    Scrap the cap!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,773 ✭✭✭eire4


    I think it would be better for the RCC to compares itself to wall street bankers, in that both groups have done horrible things to society and have somehow avoided any responsibility for their actions.





    Sadly that comparison on both counts is much more apt.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,971 ✭✭✭✭PopePalpatine


    Both groups also want less oversight over their actions. ;)


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    The Australian abuse enquiry continues to rumble on. Archbishop Denis Hart mentioned that the church was too lenient on priests and that he probably sent out identical apology letters to victims, while at the same time, not wanting to appear to fob victims off.

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/26/church-sided-with-paedophile-priests-archbishop-admits


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  • Moderators Posts: 51,860 ✭✭✭✭Delirium


    The rehab centres that lock up addicts against their will
    In Guatemala, behind barred and locked doors, thousands of drug addicts are offered treatment by Protestant churches. Christianity offers salvation for some but many are held against their will, and some are swept off the street by "hunting" parties.

    "They grabbed me. They found me completely out of it on the streets, and they just grabbed me."

    Marcos is a big guy. With closely cropped hair, and a huge expanse of chest, he is not the kind of man to tackle lightly. But Marcos was accosted by a group of men in Guatemala City and forcibly taken to a private, Christian rehabilitation centre.

    "I was there for about a month and a half, and nobody knew anything about me. People thought I was killed or something, because that's what happens in Guatemala."

    "I saw terrible things in that rehab - the owner used to beat up the girls. He would tie up the guys and roll them up like a taco in a piece of carpet, and leave them there for hours," he says.

    If you can read this, you're too close!



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,971 ✭✭✭✭PopePalpatine


    I wasn't surprised when I saw that headline TBH, fundamentalist Christians have run prison camps for children in the USA so it's not too much of a leap to assume that their brethren in Guatemala would imprison drug addicts.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,533 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    http://www.atheist.ie/2014/08/another-school-year-and-another-nine-million-of-state-funding-to-pay-for-chaplains-in-schools/#more-6844

    9 million of state funding to pay for chaplains in schools. This is a scandal as the endowment of religion is unconstitutional.

    Scrap the cap!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,773 ✭✭✭eire4


    http://www.atheist.ie/2014/08/another-school-year-and-another-nine-million-of-state-funding-to-pay-for-chaplains-in-schools/#more-6844

    9 million of state funding to pay for chaplains in schools. This is a scandal as the endowment of religion is unconstitutional.



    This really is awful. Not one penny should be spent by the state never mind 9m. That is a lot of money that could actually be used to imrpve our schools not help a church which has done so much harm to our country indoctrinate children.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,788 ✭✭✭MrPudding


    eire4 wrote: »
    This really is awful. Not one penny should be spent by the state never mind 9m. That is a lot of money that could actually be used to imrpve our schools not help a church which has done so much harm to our country indoctrinate children.

    Similar problems here in the uk, the NHS is paying 10s of millions on chaplains on the one hand, and laying off nurses due to lack of funds on the other. Disgusting.

    MrP


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    "Religious congregations have paid less than a quarter of the €352.6 million which they had agreed to contribute to redress for victims of institutional abuse, internal documents in the Department of Education reveal.
    The documents, published yesterday under the Freedom of Information Act, give an overview of the payments made by 18 congregations to date. "
    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/religious-orders-still-owe-75-of-redress-payments-for-abuse-1.1919582

    A dirty shower, it has to be said. They got off lightly in that deal and still don't have the decency to pay up.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,773 ✭✭✭eire4


    Nodin wrote: »
    "Religious congregations have paid less than a quarter of the €352.6 million which they had agreed to contribute to redress for victims of institutional abuse, internal documents in the Department of Education reveal.
    The documents, published yesterday under the Freedom of Information Act, give an overview of the payments made by 18 congregations to date. "
    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/religious-orders-still-owe-75-of-redress-payments-for-abuse-1.1919582

    A dirty shower, it has to be said. They got off lightly in that deal and still don't have the decency to pay up.



    Thats what blows me away. First the government once again rolls over and screws its own citizens by agreeing to this disgusting deal in the first place. But even then the religious orders show that all their words and apologies were just for the cameras with this response.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,971 ✭✭✭✭PopePalpatine


    I wonder, if you posted that on T'Udder Forum, who would be first to come in screeching about "ANTI-CATHOLIC BIGOTRY!!1!!"


  • Subscribers Posts: 1,911 ✭✭✭Draco


    Mrs McAleese said when she was president a senior cleric laughed at her when she said the church should open up its files on child abuse or the State would force it to do so. The State would never cross that line, he said to her. “A week later, the State crossed that line,” she told the audience.
    She added that “stories came out thanks to the courage of the victims” and the media, not thanks to the church.
    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/mcaleese-says-catholic-church-s-old-boys-club-has-to-go-1.1920947

    The cleric should have been named and shamed. No surprise that church comes before raped children for him though.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Nodin wrote: »
    They got off lightly in that deal and still don't have the decency to pay up.
    Ah, well - you see - after they asset-stripped their organizations into compliant trusts run by sympathetic individuals (or themselves), the orders just don't have any money any more.

    Dreadful pity.


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  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,510 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/mcaleese-says-catholic-church-s-old-boys-club-has-to-go-1.1920947
    Speaking in Sydney yesterday, former president Mary McAleese argued for a greatly increased role for women in the Catholic Church, saying: “The old boys’ club are going to have to go.”

    About 1,000 people came to Sydney Town Hall to see Mrs McAleese interviewed by ABC radio presenter Andrew West.

    In a reference to an Australian Catholic newspaper refusing to run an advertisement for the event because of Mrs McAleese’s views on homosexuality and the ordination of women, Mr West said: “We have to thank the Catholic Weekly for a full house today.”

    A screengrab from the Catholic Weekly newspaper which refused the ad. Catholic paper refuses ad for McAleese event
    Praying for change: Mary McAleese at Mass with her husband, Martin, in 2008. Photograph: Eric LukeMary McAleese: a thorn in the church’s side?
    Former president Mary McAleese said there was just something profoundly wrong and skewed” about asking “150 male celibates” to review the Catholic Church’s teaching on family life. Photograph: Eric Luke/The Irish TimesMcAleese: asking bishops’ advice on family life ‘bonkers’

    Mrs McAleese said after the advert ban was reported by The Irish Times and other media “I had emails from friends in America and Japan saying ‘what’s going on in Sydney’?”

    She said trying to be heard by the Catholic Church hierarchy was comparable to shouting at children: “If I’m yelling it’s because you didn’t listen to me when I said it nicely . . . I look at the curia and I don’t know too many of them who have gone through equal opportunity training.”

    Mrs McAleese said the governance of the church “and the structure of church government needs to change”.

    “The church is not terribly happy with criticism,” she said to laughter from the audience. “I’m saying that as gently as possible ... The church which will not listen to people who speak out of love has a very big problem.”

    Speaking about Ireland, Mrs McAleese said though 90 per cent of the population of the Republic were nominally Catholic “regrettably fewer and fewer” were interested in the church.

    She said child abuse revelations greatly affected people’s view of the church. “Everything you thought you had, everything you thought you were, becomes a lie.”

    Mrs McAleese said when she was president a senior cleric laughed at her when she said the church should open up its files on child abuse or the State would force it to do so. The State would never cross that line, he said to her. “A week later, the State crossed that line,” she told the audience.

    She added that “stories came out thanks to the courage of the victims” and the media, not thanks to the church.

    She certainly got the last laugh on that one, more power to her!


  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,510 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    don't let the door slap you in the f*cken face as you leave you bollox

    Pope Francis accepts Cardinal Seán Brady’s resignation

    http://www.thejournal.ie/sean-brady-resignation-1660485-Sep2014/
    POPE FRANCIS HAS accepted the resignation of Cardinal Seán Brady.

    The Archbishop of Armagh and Primate of All Ireland to Pope Francis offered his resignation in July in accordance with the requirement under Canon Law that he retire at the age of 75.

    In a statement today, Cardinal Brady said he was pleased that the pontiff had accepted his resignation. In the past, diocesan bishops have been allowed to remain on in their positions past the age of 75.

    He also congratulated Archbishop Eamon Martin who becomes the new Archbishop of Armagh and Primate of All Ireland from 11am today.

    Cardinal Brady says he will continue to live near Armagh and “help out pastorally” when he can and when he is needed.

    “I am looking forward to retirement and, no doubt, it will take me some time to get used to it, but it will be good to have more time for family, friends and to follow the football!” he added.

    Controversy

    Cardinal Brady has been the subject of much criticism following allegations that he failed to protect children from the abuse of paedophile priest Father Brendan Smyth.

    A BBC This World documentary revealed that an abuse survivor had furnished the Catholic Church with the names and addresses of children who were at risk. Despite the information, their parents were never warned about the danger facing their children from Smyth.

    Cardinal Brady acted as a notary during the 1975 inquiry.

    The revelations sparked a spate of calls for Brady’s resignation from victims of clerical abuse, from other priests in Ireland, and from members of government back in 2012.

    Brady subsequently apologised to victims, stating that parents should have been warned.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,190 ✭✭✭✭Pherekydes


    Cabaal wrote: »
    She certainly got the last laugh on that one, more power to her!

    Instead of the Old Boys leaving the Old Boys' club, why doesn't she leave? Seems the most sensible option.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,070 ✭✭✭Birroc


    That creep Brady should be in jail for aiding and abetting. How he remained leader of the Roman church in Ireland is testament to the weak sheep that flock to mass every week despite the criminal actions of their organisation.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Birroc wrote: »
    That creep Brady should be in jail for aiding and abetting. How he remained leader of the Roman church in Ireland is testament to the weak sheep that flock to mass every week despite the criminal actions of their organisation.


    I can't imagine an action that would have made them remove him. The decision seems to have been to keep him on, possibly to show they were not going to be pressured into anything and afaik, they wouldn't let him resign.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,773 ✭✭✭eire4


    Cabaal wrote: »
    don't let the door slap you in the f*cken face as you leave you bollox

    Pope Francis accepts Cardinal Seán Brady’s resignation

    http://www.thejournal.ie/sean-brady-resignation-1660485-Sep2014/



    Another fake hollow half hearted apology done purely for the PR.


  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,510 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    eire4 wrote: »
    Another fake hollow half hearted apology done purely for the PR.

    I don't believe they have any other type in stock in the Vatican/Catholic church,


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    N Ireland children shipped to Australia painted black 'for entertainment'

    http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/sep/09/northern-ireland-children-shipped-australia-painted-black-aborigines
    Children abused in Northern Ireland's children's homes and orphanages who were shipped to Australia were painted black in order to entertain passengers on their voyages, a victim told an inquiry on Tuesday.

    A former child migrant who was transported from a care home in Derry to western Australia revealed at the historical institutional abuse inquiry that "our faces were painted black to make us look like [Indigenous Australians]" as part of on board "entertainment" for paying passengers.

    The man is now in his 70s and asked for anonymity when he gave evidence to the inquiry at Banbridge courthouse in County Down. He had to wipe away tears as he described the humiliation on board the ship and later the abuse he suffered in an Australian care home. After being abused in the Termonbacca care home run by the Catholic church in Derry he was sent to Australia in 1953.

    Describing the impact of the abuse both in the Derry home and later in Australia, he said: "I had no idea how to parent my children, or even how to cuddle and love them. I really don't know what love is."

    Another witness to the long-running tribunal into decades of abuse in the region's care homes and orphanages told the courthouse that the abuse he had endured in the Bindoon home in Australia was even worse than what he had suffered in Termonbacca. The ex-Australian Air Force recruit said: "After Bindoon, Termonbacca turned out to be a holiday camp."

    This part of the largest public investigation into the abuse of children in state- and church-run homes is focusing on the treatment of 130 orphans and young people in care who were sent to Australia between 1946 and 1956.

    Sixty-six former residents of these institutions have given evidence of how they were transported across the world without their consent. Many of those who have come forward will give evidence via video link over what happened to them under the scheme.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,070 ✭✭✭Birroc


    http://www.independent.ie/tablet/news/mcaleese-has-a-duty-to-name-and-shame-catholic-cleric-30586678.html

    The former President had said the cleric, who she would not name, had come "looking for advice" when he visited her at Aras an Uachtarain.

    The incident occurred at a time when Church authorities were under increasing pressure to investigate a variety of abuse allegations. She suggested to him that the Church should "open up the diocesan archives" and having carried out a relevant audit relating to the allegations "tell the people of God what's going on".

    But the cleric only "laughed" at her, she recalled.

    "I said if you don't, the State will intervene. And his last words to me, getting into the car, were 'the state would never cross that line'. A week later, the state crossed that line," she said.
    .
    .
    .
    Do we know who this was?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,773 ✭✭✭eire4


    Birroc wrote: »
    http://www.independent.ie/tablet/news/mcaleese-has-a-duty-to-name-and-shame-catholic-cleric-30586678.html

    The former President had said the cleric, who she would not name, had come "looking for advice" when he visited her at Aras an Uachtarain.

    The incident occurred at a time when Church authorities were under increasing pressure to investigate a variety of abuse allegations. She suggested to him that the Church should "open up the diocesan archives" and having carried out a relevant audit relating to the allegations "tell the people of God what's going on".

    But the cleric only "laughed" at her, she recalled.

    "I said if you don't, the State will intervene. And his last words to me, getting into the car, were 'the state would never cross that line'. A week later, the state crossed that line," she said.
    .
    .
    .
    Do we know who this was?


    The contempt shown by that cleric while not a shock is so vile and disgusting. We are talking about disgusting crimes and he is laughing and only concerned about keeping these crimes hidden. Do we know who this vile human being is?


  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 28,510 Mod ✭✭✭✭Cabaal


    Technically about adoptions,
    But the documentary also covers priests sexually abusing as well.

    The world doc that was on BBC lastnight...its upsetting to watch

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2y6KZEUHx_s&feature=youtu.be


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,533 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/church-paid-up-to-50m-in-wake-of-sean-brady-revelations-30585232.html
    The Catholic Church is believed to have paid out up to €50m in compensation to abuse victims since former Cardinal Sean Brady's direct involvement in the swearing to secrecy of two of the victims of the paedophile priest Fr Brendan Smyth was revealed by the Sunday Independent.

    Senior legal sources said there was a rush to settle the bulk of up to 300 High Court cases in which Brady was nominally named as lead defendant on behalf of the Church.

    Many of the cases had been before the court for more than a decade - some for up to 16 years - as the Church stonewalled the plaintiffs.

    The case that exposed Brady's direct involvement, where he was the "note-taker" in a case involving the boys raped by Smyth, had been before the High Court for 13 years.

    However, Since Brady's involvement came to light in March 2010, a considerable number of the cases that had been before the courts for years have been reported on official records as ending with "no orders made in this case".

    Legal sources say this is the usual sign that a case has been settled out of court. Such settlements are also usually contingent on the plaintiffs accepting confidentiality clauses, legally preventing them from speaking publicly about their abuse.

    One senior legal source involved in some of the cases said it was likely the total amount in settlements was between "€40m to €50m".

    Scrap the cap!



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    The Vatican finally gets serious about clerical pedophiles and arrests, I believe, its first alleged senior-level pedophile since the scandal started to break just over twenty years ago:

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/24/vatican-ambassador-child-sex-catholic-paedophilia
    A former Vatican ambassador has been placed under house arrest and will face a criminal trial on child sex charges, the Holy See said on Tuesday night. The action against Józef Wesołowski, 66, is the first time that the Vatican has charged a high-ranking official with paedophilia. If found guilty he could face up to 12 years in prison.

    The Polish-born cleric was recalled from the Dominican Republic in August 2013 after the archbishop of Santo Domingo told Pope Francis about rumours that Wesołowski had sexually abused teenage boys in the Caribbean country. Prosecutors there say he allegedly paid boys as young as 13 to masturbate.

    In June a Vatican tribunal found Wesołowski guilty of abuse and imposed its toughest penalty under church law: laicisation, or returning to life as a layman. Being defrocked meant that he lost his diplomatic immunity and the Dominican Republic has opened an investigation into accusations that he paid boys to perform sexual acts.

    The Vatican had been criticised for protecting Wesołowski from legal action by the Dominican authorities by recalling him last year. The case has also been a test of whether Francis is willing to prosecute a crime that the Vatican has long sought to blame on priests, rather than direct representatives of the pope himself.

    The Vatican said the arrest reflected the wishes of the Pope that “such a grave and delicate case be handled without delay, with the just and necessary rigour”. Francis has said that no Catholic clerics who sexually abused children would escape punishment and has described paedophilia as an “ugly crime” and likened it to a “satanic mass”.

    Wesołowski is the most prominent church figure to be arrested since Paolo Gabriele, a former papal butler convicted in 2012 of stealing and leaking private papers of the former pope Benedict XVI. The Pole was granted house arrest in a Vatican apartment on medical grounds rather than being detained in its prison - a small number of rooms attached to a courthouse.

    It is unclear whether Wesołowski would be jailed inside the Vatican, or in an Italian prison, if convicted.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,533 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    BBC article about the McAleese whitewash report

    Demanding justice for women and children abused by Irish nuns
    So the Magdalene laundry survivors are asking for this latest inquiry to have a wide remit, and to investigate the laundries again.

    "I would love them to get to the real truth, but they won't," says Coppin. "They won't inquire properly because I know what the government are like."


    Will be on Newsnight tonight on BBC2 from 10:30pm

    Scrap the cap!



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Pope Francis fires bishop who promoted priest accused of sexual abuse

    http://www.thejournal.ie/pope-francis-fires-bishop-1692003-Sep2014
    TheJournal wrote:
    POPE FRANCIS HAS forcibly removed a conservative Paraguayan bishop who had clashed with his fellow bishops on ideological grounds and promoted a priest accused of inappropriate sexual behaviour.

    The removal of Bishop Rogelio Ricardo Livieres Plano, a member of the conservative Opus Dei movement, marks the second time Francis has kicked out a conservative bishop for the sake of keeping peace among the faithful and unity among bishops. In March, he ousted the “bling bishop” of Limburg, Germany, whose €31 million ($43-million) new residence complex caused an uproar among the faithful.

    Livieres was named bishop of Paraguay’s second city, Ciudad del Este, in 2004 and immediately disturbed other more progressive Paraguayan bishops by opening his own seminary that followed a much more orthodox line than the main seminary in the capital, Asuncion. Paraguay’s bishops are known for their progressive bent in a poor country where liberation theology found fertile ground.

    Relations between Livieres and the rest of Paraguay’s bishops worsened when he got into a public spat with the then-archbishop of Asuncion, whom he accused of being gay. Livieres also infuriated advocates for victims of sexual abuse by taking in and promoting an Argentine priest, the Rev. Carlos Urrutigoity, whose former superior in the U.S. had said was a “serious threat to young people.”

    Urrutigoity has denied allegations of sexual impropriety, has never been charged and hasn’t been accused of sexually abusing minors. In 2004, though, the diocese of Scranton, Pennsylvania, settled a lawsuit against him, another priest and the diocese for $400,000. The suit had alleged the two men engaged in a pattern of sexual misconduct, the Global Post has reported. Earlier this year, the Vatican sent a cardinal to investigate problems in Livieres’ diocese, particularly concerning the seminary. The investigator reported back to Francis, and Livieres was summoned to Rome this week to discuss his future.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,533 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/free-up-institutional-abuse-fund-to-help-asylum-seekers-says-bishop-1.1952873
    Catholic Bishop of Dromore John McAreavey has said it would be helpful if resources offered by religious orders to help pay the redress bill for survivors of institutional abuse could be released to help asylum seekers.

    The bishop likened the direct provision system to industrial schools and reformatories in the past.

    What? Asylum seekers are being systematically illegally detained, raped, beaten and psychologically abused by the people running these centres, and there is a vast criminal conspiracy to cover it all up? Really??

    The meagre resources offered by the religious orders are far from what is required for the institutional abuse survivors, never mind being able to provide for an entirely separate issue as well.

    Asked on RTÉ Radio’s This Week programme whether resources offered by 18 religious congregations as part of the redress settlement could be released to help asylum seekers, he said: “It’s probably part of the spirit in which the contribution was made and certainly if some of those resources which have been made available could be used to help with this problem, that would be helpful.

    “But at the end of the day this is a State-created issue. The State is responsible for those people who come to the State seeking citizenship.”

    Tell you what. Let the state pay in full for the problems it has created and let your church pay in full for the issues it has created. That'd be fair...

    Scrap the cap!



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,037 ✭✭✭Banbh


    Under the new not-blasphemy laws, that would be incitement to 'religious hatred'. In fact any criticism of the Catholic Church's crimes and its refusal to pay for those crimes is clearly motivated by religious hatred.


  • Moderators Posts: 51,860 ✭✭✭✭Delirium


    Boy restrained in cattle equipment while raped by priest, abuse inquiry told
    A MAN has given harrowing evidence to the north's child abuse inquiry of being held in a cattle crush while being raped.

    The witness said a religious brother at Rubane House in Co Down put him in the farm equipment, used to hold animals while veterinary work is carried out, before abusing him.

    He said he reported the attack to a priest, but claimed the cleric told his abuser.

    He was then beaten with a walking stick and locked in a cupboard over-night, the man told the Historical Institutional Abuse (HIA) inquiry.

    The victim was a resident at the boys' home, run by the De La Salle order, which is the subject of a government-ordered investigation into allegations of historical physical and sexual attacks on boys.

    Claims of bestiality and children going missing were also made by witnesses.

    If you can read this, you're too close!



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Sick stuff.
    As this is a "historical abuse" inquiry, most of the perpetrators are probably dead and buried by now. But it will interesting to see what compensation is offered to the victims, and who pays it. I can't see the RCC in N. Ireland getting the same sweet indemnity deal they got in the ROI.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,037 ✭✭✭Banbh


    Is this terror gang - the La Salle association - still in existence? If it is, it is a great shame on us all.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    De La Salle are selling a school in Ballyfermot, and the locals are protesting.
    They had two schools, one for boys with big GAA pitches, and one for girls with hardly any space. So they are selling off the one with the GAA pitches, which should fetch a pretty penny, being so close to Dublin city centre.
    Its the school whose corridors were stalked by the notorious paedohile Tony Walsh.
    But now that the paedophiles are back in their box for a while, all the parents want to do is to keep the local school with its spacious surroundings. I can see their point. People have short memories.
    I'd like to see it commandeered by the State and turned into a secular school, but as the State is unwilling to seize church property, I'll be glad to see it concreted over with new apartment blocks. I hope those abuse victims in NI can sue the religious order for all the money they get from the sale. It wouldn't surprise me though if they claimed that De La Salle as incorporated in NI were not the same as those in ROI.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,773 ✭✭✭eire4


    recedite wrote: »
    De La Salle are selling a school in Ballyfermot, and the locals are protesting.
    They had two schools, one for boys with big GAA pitches, and one for girls with hardly any space. So they are selling off the one with the GAA pitches, which should fetch a pretty penny, being so close to Dublin city centre.
    Its the school whose corridors were stalked by the notorious paedohile Tony Walsh.
    But now that the paedophiles are back in their box for a while, all the parents want to do is to keep the local school with its spacious surroundings. I can see their point. People have short memories.
    I'd like to see it commandeered by the State and turned into a secular school, but as the State is unwilling to seize church property, I'll be glad to see it concreted over with new apartment blocks. I hope those abuse victims in NI can sue the religious order for all the money they get from the sale. It wouldn't surprise me though if they claimed that De La Salle as incorporated in NI were not the same as those in ROI.




    Are the De La Salle order still involved in running St Benildus in Stillorgan? There used to be both a primary and secondary school but I am pretty sure the primary school is closed and its only a secondary school now. Not sure if the De La Salle order are still running it though.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,182 ✭✭✭Genghiz Cohen


    recedite wrote: »
    De La Salle are selling a school in Ballyfermot, and the locals are protesting.
    They had two schools, one for boys with big GAA pitches, and one for girls with hardly any space. So they are selling off the one with the GAA pitches, which should fetch a pretty penny, being so close to Dublin city centre.

    Educate Together fundraiser to buy the school?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    eire4 wrote: »
    Are the De La Salle order still involved in running St Benildus in Stillorgan?
    Not sure tbh, but in general the religious orders do not have enough personnel these days to staff their schools. They prefer to control the "ethos" via the BOM and by controlling recruitment policies, while the State pays these lay teachers. Priests can still wander in whenever they feel like it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,533 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    ^ Maximum control for minimal effort and next to no cost. You'd think the people who pay to run the damn place would have an input??

    Scrap the cap!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,773 ✭✭✭eire4


    recedite wrote: »
    Not sure tbh, but in general the religious orders do not have enough personnel these days to staff their schools. They prefer to control the "ethos" via the BOM and by controlling recruitment policies, while the State pays these lay teachers. Priests can still wander in whenever they feel like it.



    Your probably right. I wonder why the primary school was closed. Its not like the area is short on population.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    eire4 wrote: »
    I wonder why the primary school was closed. Its not like the area is short on population.
    The same reasons a factory closes; its a combination of two things. Demand for the product falls due it becoming outdated and some of the market switching to new competition which appears. The facility owner then decides to cash in their capital, and do something else with it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,773 ✭✭✭eire4


    recedite wrote: »
    The same reasons a factory closes; its a combination of two things. Demand for the product falls due it becoming outdated and some of the market switching to new competition which appears. The facility owner then decides to cash in their capital, and do something else with it.



    You might be correct but equally there may have been other reasons that the De La Salle order closed the primary school. Some not so shall we same mundane.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Over to our jewish friends this morning with the peculiar story of an orthodox rabbi caught with his video camera in a changing room.

    http://mobile.nytimes.com/2014/10/15/us/prominent-rabbi-arrested-on-a-charge-of-voyeurism.html


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,037 ✭✭✭Banbh


    That rabbi thought it was a necessary procedure to convert to Catholicism.


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