Do most kids today have no manners?

GarIT · 26-06-2014 2:53pm

THEZAPPA wrote: »

I don't see how the child was right. Running, pushing me aside and almost knocking my food over as I go to put my food on the table and sitting there staking claim is right? That's what I mean by manners, it shouldn't be first come first serve especially when it comes to an elderly women with me suffering from arthritis and other health issues.

I assume you might be the type on the public transport to not give up your seat to someone else because as you said I was there first.. or what did we say when we were younger "Naw naw naw nawnawnaw".

If the child actually pushed you they were in the wrong. People exaggerate things though, if you were actually a foot from the table the child was wrong, any more than about 2-3 feet and you were wrong. You said yourself there were plenty more seats, there's no need to demand the one closest to you.
How is the child supposed to know about your mothers health issues.
Age is irrelevant and to say it matters is discrimination.

Of course I'd never give a seat to anybody unless they were disabled, why would I. I would accept arthritis as a disability but I'm not going to assume somebody has it based on their ag

Generic Dreadhead · 26-06-2014 2:55pm

tritium wrote: »

Well, given Elvis was scorned as corrupting the youth of his day, dungeons and dragons was leading youth to the devil and jive was seen as immoral influence to give just some relatively recent examples I'd suggest its not.

But you just keep spewing out trite little one line sound bites...

This isn't a broad, safe, sit-on-the-fence "youth of today" topic where we can slam culture, music, art, dance, education, economy, upbringing, class system, religion etc etc etc and how it is embodied in the youth.

It's "Are kids mannerly or are kids rude?"

What was seen as rude 100 years ago is not rude today. Whats rude today might not be rude in 100 years.

BUT critically, what is rude now, was still rude 15 years ago and will still be rude in 15 years time.

I would excuse a youth, born to a family 3 generations from now where society has broken down further and manners have slowly evaporated, being rude. I can understand that. It's ALL the know and ALL their parents know.

Rude kids have rude parents and their parents have rude friends and their kids friends are rude. They all think it's ok cause it's perceived in their small bubble of Irish society to be "ok" or even "cool".

You take that fish out of water? i.e. the kid trying to get a decent job in 20 years and they'll either fail or change to fit the society where manners are paramount (let's say the hospitality industry)

If you want to cast the WIDEST net in history and shrug and so forth grand, doesn't mean I, or anyone else, has to either agree or accept it.

Next we'll be having sentences such as "sure in cavemen times that child would have killed you for your food"... but seriously whats the point... :pac::pac::pac:

GarIT · 26-06-2014 2:55pm

Buzz Killington the third wrote: »

Elvis played music and had a talent. The kardashians are a bunch of self obsessed talentless morons.

And apparently the Kardashians are entertaining.

I don't think any one TV show or B-list celeb is the cause though.

Generic Dreadhead · 26-06-2014 3:00pm

GarIT wrote: »

If the child actually pushed you they were in the wrong. People exaggerate things though, if you were actually a foot from the table the child was wrong, any more than about 2-3 feet and you were wrong. You said yourself there were plenty more seats, there's no need to demand the one closest to you.
How is the child supposed to know about your mothers health issues.
Age is irrelevant and to say it does is discrimination.

Of course I'd never give a seat to anybody unless they were disabled, why would I. I would accept arthritis as a disability but I'm not going to assume somebody has it based on their ag

THIS... THIS RIGHT HERE is how we've ended up in the world we are in today :eek:

Look at that level of justification... talking about the inches from the table

Jesus wept

GarIT · 26-06-2014 3:03pm

Cormac... wrote: »

Look at that level of justification... talking about the inches from the table

So was the child, we are only hearing one side of the story. And if you read what I said you would see that I said if it was inches from the table the child was wrong, if the OP was close enough to have claimed the table the child was wrong.

Essentially if they was enough room for the other party to walk past the OP the OP was in the wrong while if the other party had to stand in front of the op to get to the table the other party was wrong.

Generic Dreadhead · 26-06-2014 3:08pm

GarIT wrote: »

So was the child, we are only hearing one side of the story.

I'm willing to throw my lot in with the OP given how they have tried to explain how it played out.

I could give less of a **** hearing a kids side of things.

And I could give even less of **** quantifying when a table is indeed in the ownership of the person sitting at it (is it when the trays down? is it 100cm? 30 inches?) to someone who doesn't give up their seat to an elderly person cause "sure you don't know if they are unwell, can't tell from looking at them, better I just sit on my hole and assume they are grand, my seat after all, i was hear 1st"

THEZAPPA · 26-06-2014 3:09pm

GarIT wrote: »

If the child actually pushed you they were in the wrong. People exaggerate things though, if you were actually a foot from the table the child was wrong, any more than about 2-3 feet and you were wrong. You said yourself there were plenty more seats, there's no need to demand the one closest to you.
How is the child supposed to know about your mothers health issues.
Age is irrelevant and to say it does is discrimination.

Of course I'd never give a seat to anybody unless they were disabled, why would I. I would accept arthritis as a disability but I'm not going to assume somebody has it based on their ag

We never demanded the seat, my mom simple told the child "we were going to sit there and that she obviously knew that and to have some manners".

Yes she pushed me as stated she almost knocked the tray right out of my hand as I was putting it down.

Not saying she was suppose to know but damn it's pretty obvious with her health issues.

I never said anything about age?

See that's where we differ, I would always give up a seat for someone older than me even if they had clear or un-clear signs of disability, pregnant women or whatever. Why would I? Because they probably need it more than I do and if they don't, so what I have respect for others to be mannerly towards them and at least offer.

It's how I was brought up and will continue on and bring my children up with too.

the_monkey · 26-06-2014 3:10pm

THEZAPPA wrote: »

Fantastic taste! Frank Zappa ftw :P

Maybe that's what these darn kids need :pac:

Damn right, I always think of what Zappa said about the most abundant element in the Universe ...

Apply it to these parents and kids ...

GarIT · 26-06-2014 3:13pm

Cormac... wrote: »

I could give less of a **** hearing a kids side of things.

And you think this is ok? Ignore what somebody has to say because of their age? This is what is wrong with society.

Generic Dreadhead · 26-06-2014 3:17pm

GarIT wrote: »

And you think this is ok? Ignore what somebody has to say because of their age? This is what is wrong with society.

:pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

I actually didn't realise you were trolling there for a while, you got me.

THEZAPPA · 26-06-2014 3:17pm

the_monkey wrote: »

Damn right, I always think of what Zappa said about the most abundant element in the Universe ...

Apply it to these parents and kids ...

That quote is my Signature

"Some scientists claim that hydrogen, because it is so plentiful, is the basic building block of the universe. I dispute that. I say there is more stupidity than hydrogen, and that is the basic building block of the universe" - Frank Zappa

GarIT · 26-06-2014 3:20pm

THEZAPPA wrote: »

We never demanded the seat, my mom simple told the child "we were going to sit there and that she obviously knew that and to have some manners".

Yes she pushed me as stated she almost knocked the tray right out of my hand as I was putting it down.

Not saying she was suppose to know but damn it's pretty obvious with her health issues.

I never said anything about age?

See that's where we differ, I would always give up a seat for someone older than me even if they had clear or un-clear signs of disability, pregnant women or whatever. Why would I? Because they probably need it more than I do and if they don't, so what I have respect for others to be mannerly towards them and at least offer.

It's how I was brought up and will continue on and bring my children up with too.

If what you say is true you were in the right, but look at what your mother said. If that was a child speaking we would expect them to start that sentence with sorry or excuse me, did your mother? Does she have no manners?

You said that she shouldn't have done it because your mother is elderly, that's what you said about age.

Most people don't need a seat, if someone visibly needed a seat I would give it to them or if they said they needed a seat I would give it to them. Other than that a seat is a luxury, it's just as much a luxury to me as it is to anybody else so they're not getting it.

GarIT · 26-06-2014 3:23pm

Cormac... wrote: »

:pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

I actually didn't realise you were trolling there for a while, you got me.

I don't get you, you ignore someone's thoughts/feelings because they are a child and yet you expect them to have manners towards you and they are wrong if they treat you the same way you treat them? Right.

THEZAPPA · 26-06-2014 3:29pm

GarIT wrote: »

If what you say is true you were in the right, but look at what your mother said. If that was a child speaking we would expect them to start that sentence with sorry or excuse me, did your mother? Does she have no manners?

You said that she shouldn't have done it because your mother is elderly, that's what you said about age.

Most people don't need a seat, if someone visibly needed a seat I would give it to them or if they said they needed a seat I would give it to them. Other than that a seat is a luxury, it's just as much a luxury to me as it is to anybody else so they're not getting it.

I never said she didn't say excuse me or sorry but I gave the gist.

Well the child shouldn't have done it in the first place to anyone, basic etiquette.

I'll agree to disagree on what each others views on etiquette are

Generic Dreadhead · 26-06-2014 3:30pm

GarIT wrote: »

I don't get you, you ignore someone thoughts/feelings because they are a child and yet you expect them to have manners towards you and they are wrong if they ignore you? Right.

No..... but you do realise that there's a decent chance of that 10 year old girl believing in things like Santa Claus right?

So if I'm gonna go full CSI on it and sit her down for her to recount exactly how it played out, I'm sure there will be some embellishment.

If you stretch the "every is correct, everyone is special, everyone is right" logic you are trying to apply to enough of a degree you could have a toddler as the Taoiseach (jokes on a postcard folks about how we may not be any worse off).

Some people are wrong.
Some people are rude (for example NOT GIVING YOUR SEAT TO SOMEONE ELDERLY)
Some people are not that special
Some people are average
Some people are below average intelligence (the word "average" being the big give away)
^ This is the real world

You can't in the same thread complain people should listen to children like a wailing Maude Flanders and then say you'd let an old person go without the "luxury" of a seat when they aren't VISIBLY DISABLED

I'm not feeding the troll anymore

spurious · 26-06-2014 3:33pm

I'm a big fan of the way old ladies on buses in Eastern Europe deal with unruly, rude, loud, or 'not giving up my seat' young folk.

Anyone who has ever seen them knows what I mean.

GarIT · 26-06-2014 3:45pm

Cormac... wrote: »

No..... but you do realise that there's a decent chance of that 10 year old girl believing in things like Santa Claus right?

So if I'm gonna go full CSI on it and sit her down for her to recount exactly how it played out, I'm sure there will be some embellishment.

If you stretch the "every is correct, everyone is special, everyone is right" logic you are trying to apply to enough of a degree you could have a toddler as the Taoiseach (jokes on a postcard folks about how we may not be any worse off).

Some people are wrong.
Some people are rude (for example NOT GIVING YOUR SEAT TO SOMEONE ELDERLY)
Some people are not that special
Some people are average
Some people are below average intelligence (the word "average" being the big give away)
^ This is the real world

You can't in the same thread complain people should listen to children like a wailing Maude Flanders and then say you'd let an old person go without the "luxury" of a seat when they aren't VISIBLY DISABLED

I'm not feeding the troll anymore

I never one said take everything they say as fact, yeah kids might believe in Santa, adults lie to them about Santa, I'd at least listen to what everybody has to say, if you listen to every side of the story you are a lot more aware of a situation than you are when you only listen to one side of the the story because you decided who was right before you started listening.

You can keep going with the over exaggerated examples and name calling, it adds nothing to your argument as far as I'm concerned.

Also define old, if I saw someone had trouble standing or walking to a further away seat they could have mine, generally that is a lot of but not all older people, my granddad is pushing 80 and still playing local. And on the other hand I've heard middle aged (50-ish) women giving out to people in their late 20s for not giving them their seat, and I've seen adults of all ages give out to children for not giving up their seat.

Generic Dreadhead · 26-06-2014 3:49pm

GarIT wrote: »

I never one said take everything they say as fact, yeah kids might believe in Santa, adults lie to them about Santa, I'd at least listen to what everybody has to say, if you listen to every side of the story you are a lot more aware of a situation than you are when you only listen to one side of the the story because you decided who was right before you started listening.

You can keep going with the over exaggerated examples and name calling, it adds nothing to your argument as far as I'm concerned.

For someone who's doing a lot of talking about listening you're not very good at it cause I never said either party was correct or incorrect in this instance, I also never said the child was rude or not. I also never said a LOT of other things you're welcome to use in your debate, such as the names you apparently being called. (unless you count Maude Flanders, which was intended to be tounge-in cheek, or trolling, which I genuinely thought you were doing, so far removed from the real world I believe you opinions to be and all that)

GarIT · 26-06-2014 3:51pm

Cormac... wrote: »

For someone who's doing a lot of talking about listening you're not very good at it cause I never said either party was correct or incorrect in this instance, I also never said the child was rude or not. I also never said a LOT of other things you're welcome to use in your debate, such as the names you apparently being called.

Yes you didn't say the child was wrong in as few words what you did say is you wouldn't listen to what they have to say because of their age, assuming the other party is right.

You say children will embellish the story, I'm willing to bet adults would do that much more.

You have called me a troll twice now when I am clearly not.

Generic Dreadhead · 26-06-2014 3:54pm

GarIT wrote: »

Yes you didn't say the child was wrong in as few words what you did say is you wouldn't listen to what they have to say because of their age, assuming the other party is right.

You have called me a troll twice now when I am clearly not.

Ugh..... The child stuck out her tounge as they left. I'd be wary of her credibility as a witness to the events the occurred.

Have you ever turned to someone and said:
"Stop talking ****"
"Stop Lying"
"I understand that's you opinion but your opinion is wrong?"

GarIT · 26-06-2014 4:01pm

Cormac... wrote: »

Ugh..... The child stuck out her tounge as they left. I'd be wary of her credibility as a witness to the events the occurred.

Have you ever turned to someone and said:
"Stop talking ****"
"Stop Lying"
"I understand that's you opinion but your opinion is wrong?"

In this situation you're probably right. We have only heard one side of the story about the child sticking out it's tongue though, it might not have happened. (I don't think this is likely at all but it is possible). However you said you wouldn't listen to what a kid had to say, the way you said it implies at all rather than in this situation.

I'm pretty sure I have why?

Generic Dreadhead · 26-06-2014 4:03pm

GarIT wrote: »

I'm pretty sure I have why?

Cause i'm 90% positive if I had to ask that 10yo girl what had happened that that would be one of the next 3 sentences out of my mouth

GarIT · 26-06-2014 4:08pm

Cormac... wrote: »

Cause i'm 90% positive if I had to ask that 10yo girl what had happened that that would be one of the next 3 sentences out of my mouth

I disagree that it is that likely, and I would still listen to what they have to say. I would assume there is an equal chance that either party is lying and work from there. I know of a case where an elderly woman lied to a child's parents to get the child in trouble for some trivial reason, it's unlikely but possible.

Lyaiera · 26-06-2014 4:25pm

With their jazz music and marihuana cigarettes...

Tilly · 26-06-2014 4:38pm

We get complemented on my 12yr nephews manners all the time. Totally depends on the way you are brought up. He isn’t a little street rat that was dragged up.

strobe · 26-06-2014 5:03pm

"Oh,oh-oh! You see, the kids these days, they listen to the rap music, which gives them the brain damage. With the hippin' and the hoppin' and the bippin' and the boppin', they don't know what the jazz is all about. Y'see, jazz is like Jello pudding... no, that's not it. Jazz is like Kodak film... no, that's not right neither. I've got it, jazz is like the new Coke - it'll be around forever."

- Socrates circa 400BC

jjbrien · 26-06-2014 7:22pm

Theres a bunch of kids where we live who are really annoying. There is this one boy who must be around 8 years when anyone comes or goes from the building he will stand there and stare at them. We live in an apartment complex which has an underground car park which a very tight ramp going down into it so you cant see who or what is at the bottom of the ramp when you drive down it. This little boy and his brother like to play down there and i have seen him almost get run over a few times by people trying to come and go. theres a park next door and they really should go play in it. They also go with some other kids who live here screaming and shouting in the hallways and out the back of the building all day and night with no manners or respect for others who live there. Their parents don't seem to care either. My neighbor works nights in a hospital and she cant get any sleep due to them. She goes to bed around 9 in the morning after getting off work at 6am and thats when these kids when they are off from school start to scream in the hallways.

Amirani · 26-06-2014 7:57pm

A lot of people do have strange definitions of manners though, particularly with regard to children. Many adults have a problem with children trying debate a point with them or "talking back" to them, and consider it bad manners. If your point is in anyway good enough in the first place, you really shouldn't have much problem out-debating a child.

Everyone deserves a certain level of respect, not just older people.

Wompa1 · 26-06-2014 8:46pm

kids? I'd say it's everybody

Awkward Badger · 26-06-2014 8:54pm

I think a lot of people have no manners. They are just self centred assholes.

Two things happened in the last few weeks to back me up on this. I was leaving the bank and stopped to hold the door open for a guy, he walks on in without even looking at me. You're welcome dickhead. Few days later I was sitting in a pub and notice keys left on a seat after two women got up and were leaving. Ran to catch up with them and asked if they were theirs, "Yes they are" she said and turned back to her conversation with her friend. You're welcome cúnt.

Two last nice things I done for randomers and they were too ignorant to even say thank you. Bastards.

Chancer3001 · 26-06-2014 8:55pm

90% of kids are sound.

Sam Kade · 26-06-2014 8:55pm

Wompa1 wrote: »

kids? I'd say it's everybody

How true, my wife and I were coming out of an aib bank one day after going through the first security door and as we opened the second door this gowl of a woman in her 30's barged in before we could get out :mad: no common courtesy what so ever.

anncoates · 26-06-2014 9:42pm

Pugsly wrote: »

I think a lot of people have no manners. They are just self centred assholes.

Two things happened in the last few weeks to back me up on this. I was leaving the bank and stopped to hold the door open for a guy, he walks on in without even looking at me. You're welcome dickhead. Few days later I was sitting in a pub and notice keys left on a seat after two women got up and were leaving. Ran to catch up with them and asked if they were theirs, "Yes they are" she said and turned back to get conversation with her friend. You're welcome cúnt.

Two last nice things I done for randomers and they were too ignorant to say even say thank you. Bastards.

They can't hear you.

Awkward Badger · 26-06-2014 10:01pm

anncoates wrote: »

They can't hear you.

They might see this though. And then the guilt and shame of what they have done might dawn on them and coupled with my scathing insults it could be the catalyst for them to change their ignorant ways.

One can live in hope...

Do most kids today have no manners?

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