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Wind and solar coming back into fashion

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  • 06-04-2014 8:26pm
    #1
    Impetus
    Registered Users Posts: 1,667 ✭✭✭


    An article in Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung about wind and solar energy coming back into fashion.



    http://www.faz.net/aktuell/finanzen/aktien/wind-und-solarindustrie-die-rueckkehr-der-erneuerbaren-12881775.html


    While IRL doesn’t depend on Russian natural gas, any withdrawal of Russian gas supplies to the EU in general could cause disruption in the overall gas market – which could affect IRL. IRL has extremely limited gas storage capacity at Kinsale (about 50 days), compared with Austria which has storage for 7.5 billion M3 of storage capacity. On top of that IRL has the ejit factor (eg the Corrib gas field – “natives” –v- Shell GB incompetents) who do everything possible to obstruct gas prospecting (unlike Kinsale Head which had zero delay in implementation back in the day, and has exposed the residents of East Cork to no problems over the lifetime of the wells).


    Ireland spends over €8 billion a year on energy imports, which is money down the drain to a large extent, in a country with the capacity to produce over 20GW of energy from natural renewable resources. The EU / OECD are doing their best to decimate the Irish economy on the corporate income tax front. The alternative is for the country to become an energy exporter, par excellence. (Aside from the development of agri/food exports etc. Nestle is the largest food processor in Europe, based in CH-1800 Vevey, in a country which has, due to its mountainous and climatic nature has less growing power than Co Cork.)


    All we see is cluelessness from Government in many areas. People screaming for underground high tension cabling (an expensive technology which creates a far higher EMF force in the vicinity of the cable over ground) compared with German style T shaped pylons.


    Russia has a far larger foreign exchange surplus than the value of the EU’s natural gas imports from that country. IRL has to increase its independence from the EU and become more like Norway or Switzerland…..


    http://www.seai.ie/Publications/Statistics_Publications/EPSSU_Publications/Energy_Security_in_Ireland/Energy_Security_in_Ireland_A_Statistical_Overview.pdf


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    #2
    Birdnuts
    Registered Users Posts: 9,645 ✭✭✭Birdnuts


    Its more likely they will tap new Gas providers in North Africa and elsewhere via LNG etc.. Nuclear and fracking will have a big role to play with the UK in particular looking to go down those routes as poltical and public resistance grows with regards to the environmental and economic costs of reneweables like wind. Germany already has invested vast amounts in wind and other reneweables with little to show for it apart from rising bills and emmissions in stark contrast to the US which has gone down the fracking route. Indeed Obama pointed this out to the EU in his recent visit.

    PS: I wouldn't pay too much attention to anything the SEI comes out with. There credablilty in this debate has been damaged by ongoing vested interest issues in relation to the wind industry via the Brendan Halligan issue that has been highlighted in the media and the Dail/Senade by Senator Whelan among others. No matter how much wind is added to the Irish Grid it still fails badly during the extensive periods of low wind conditions - something that really jumps out if one looks at some of Eirgrids figures 4 last month during that week of cold, HP conditions.


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    #3
    Macha
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 6,376 Mod ✭✭✭✭Macha


    Birdnuts wrote: »
    Its more likely they will tap new Gas providers in North Africa and elsewhere via LNG etc.. Nuclear and fracking will have a big role to play with the UK in particular looking to go down those routes as poltical and public resistance grows with regards to the environmental and economic costs of reneweables like wind. Germany already has invested vast amounts in wind and other reneweables with little to show for it apart from rising bills and emmissions in stark contrast to the US which has gone down the fracking route. Indeed Obama pointed this out to the EU in his recent visit.
    Where to start with this piece of fantasy fiction? The US has simply been exporting its emissions via coal to Europe. US wholesale gas prices are artificially low for a number of reasons including severe restrictions on gas exports, joint venture contracts that can't be ignored, property rights obligations etc. It can't and won't last, and coal is already coming back into the system while shale gas producers are, in the words of Exxon Mobil 'losing their shirts' as the glut of gas keeps wholesale prices below production cost.

    Germany is leading the way in building out renewables and they're doing a very good job of replacing nuclear. They now make up 25% of the power sector and are growing rapidly. Emissions are increasing in Germany for the same reason they are increasing across Europe - coal is cheaper than natural gas because of fracking in the US and the ETS is doing nothing to keep it out.

    If you think renewables have environmental and economic impacts, try looking into nuclear and fracking. Seriously annoying to read statements like that.

    And if everyone starts trying to tap into new LNG gas providers, their production will go down even faster. Indonesia's exports are already peaking.

    Here's a better analysis: http://raandreaskraemer.blogspot.de/2014/03/european-energy-policy-after-crimean.html
    Birdnuts wrote: »
    PS: I wouldn't pay too much attention to anything the SEI comes out with. There credablilty in this debate has been damaged by ongoing vested interest issues in relation to the wind industry via the Brendan Halligan issue that has been highlighted in the media and the Dail/Senade by Senator Whelan among others. No matter how much wind is added to the Irish Grid it still fails badly during the extensive periods of low wind conditions - something that really jumps out if one looks at some of Eirgrids figures 4 last month during that week of cold, HP conditions.
    First of all it's the SEAI, not the SEI. And it's ridiculous tp expect an organisation like that to have people on its board who know nothing about the issue of sustainable energy, and how do you gain practical knowledge of the issue? You work in the industry. Senator Whelan is well known at this stage for his anti-wind energy rants - he is not an unbiased voice in this debate.


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    #4
    Greensleeves
    Registered Users Posts: 337 ✭✭Greensleeves


    Macha wrote: »
    First of all it's the SEAI, not the SEI. And it's ridiculous tp expect an organisation like that to have people on its board who know nothing about the issue of sustainable energy, and how do you gain practical knowledge of the issue? You work in the industry. Senator Whelan is well known at this stage for his anti-wind energy rants - he is not an unbiased voice in this debate.

    Brendan Halligan appears to have no background in sustainable energy; his involvement in tobacco lobbying seems to be an odd fit with the SEAI. Does anyone know why he was appointed chairman of the SEAI by Eamon Ryan?

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/adviser-denies-leaving-campaign-due-to-tobacco-links-26780360.html


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    #5
    Macha
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 6,376 Mod ✭✭✭✭Macha


    Greensleeves wrote: »
    Brendan Halligan appears to have no background in sustainable energy; his involvement in tobacco lobbying seems to be an odd fit with the SEAI. Does anyone know why he was appointed chairman of the SEAI by Eamon Ryan?

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/adviser-denies-leaving-campaign-due-to-tobacco-links-26780360.html

    Uh, so one minute he has a vested interest with the sustainable energy industry, the next minute he has no background in sustainable energy? Make your minds up please.


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    #6
    Impetus
    Registered Users Posts: 1,667 ✭✭✭Impetus


    Macha wrote: »
    Germany is leading the way in building out renewables and they're doing a very good job of replacing nuclear. They now make up 25% of the power sector and are growing rapidly. Emissions are increasing in Germany for the same reason they are increasing across Europe - coal is cheaper than natural gas because of fracking in the US and the ETS is doing nothing to keep it out.

    Germany has largely paid for the world learning curve cost (in terms of technology development of solar, and to a lesser extent wind). German householders are paying about 27c per kWh for electricity compared with 10,5c in France (the most committed country to the nuclear never-never land of forcing future generations to pay for the real energy consumption costs of the past.)

    The cost of solar is falling faster than Moore's law, thanks in no small extent to China. Fracing is a typical Anglo Saxon short-termist approach to easy energy money. Create explosions in shale rock to extract the last nm3 of gas from each cubbyhole - and to hell with the implications for water quality etc. The least sustainable energy source on the planet.

    Norway (hydro), Switzerland (hydro) and Germany (solar, wind and hydro) are leaders in Europe in terms of sustainable energy. Iceland (geothermal) is playing its part. So is Andorra (hydro). And Monaco (incineration > heating and air conditioning). Much of the rest of the planet needs to attend sustainability class, given by a committed teacher...


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    #7
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 90,827 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-26923260
    Global investment in renewables fell by 14% during 2013, but the percentage of electricity generated by renewable sources still grew, a report shows.

    It said investment fell for the second year in a row because of cheaper technology, but also as a result of uncertainty surrounding energy policy.

    However, falling costs meant renewables accounted for 8.5% of the global electricity mix, up from 7.8% in 2012.

    Renewables accounted for 43.6% of newly installed generation capacity in 2013.


    ....

    Mr Usher observed that there were a number of positive signs during 2013, including the fact that the renewable energy sectors in a number of nations, particularly in Latin America, were able to grow completely free of government subsidies.

    He added: "For the first time in 2013, China installed more new generation capacity using renewables than fossil fuels.


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    #8
    Greensleeves
    Registered Users Posts: 337 ✭✭Greensleeves


    Macha wrote: »
    Uh, so one minute he has a vested interest with the sustainable energy industry, the next minute he has no background in sustainable energy? Make your minds up please.

    Brendan Halligan is a shareholder/director of Mainstream Renewable Power so he has a vested interest in wind energy. Brendan Halligan appears to have no background in sustainable energy yet he was appointed chairman of the board of the SEAI by Eamon Ryan. Why?


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    #9
    Macha
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 6,376 Mod ✭✭✭✭Macha


    Greensleeves wrote: »
    Brendan Halligan is a shareholder/director of Mainstream Renewable Power so he has a vested interest in wind energy. Brendan Halligan appears to have no background in sustainable energy yet he was appointed chairman of the board of the SEAI by Eamon Ryan. Why?
    I'm not trying to close the debate down but this is off-topic for this thread (said as a Mod)


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    #10
    Greensleeves
    Registered Users Posts: 337 ✭✭Greensleeves


    According to this article from yesterday's New York Times Germany is putting the brakes on the expansion of solar and wind energy in an effort to hold down spiraling prices.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/09/business/international/germany-moves-forward-on-renewable-energy-plan.html?_r=0


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    #11
    Rucking_Fetard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,260 ✭✭✭Rucking_Fetard


    Chemist in CaliFORnia have devised a way to increase solar cell efficiency by as much as 30%.

    Current photovoltaic cells are unable to surpass 33% due to the Shockley-Queisser limit (the Shockley-Queisser limit states that a single photon can only create a singlet (single) exciton, with any extra energy dissipated as heat. Without getting into the physics of it, this results in a max efficiency of just 33%), now, however, four chemists at UCR have found a way of turning a single photon into two excitons, by a process known as singlet fission.


    singlet-fission-diagram.jpg
    Mad looking JuJitsu Diagram

    http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/186176-solar-singlet-fission-bends-the-laws-of-physics-to-boost-solar-power-efficiency-by-30


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    #12
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 90,827 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Rucking_Fetard wrote: »
    Chemist in CaliFORnia have devised a way to increase solar cell efficiency by as much as 30%.

    Current photovoltaic cells are unable to surpass 33% due to the Shockley-Queisser limit (the Shockley-Queisser limit states that a single photon can only create a singlet (single) exciton, with any extra energy dissipated as heat. Without getting into the physics of it, this results in a max efficiency of just 33%), now, however, four chemists at UCR have found a way of turning a single photon into two excitons, by a process known as singlet fission.

    Just in case anyone didn't know a Violet (400nm) photon has twice the energy of a Red (800nm) photon.

    At present a panel that can harvest red photons will only get the same amount of energy from a violet one, the rest of the energy goes off as heat. ( IBM claimed an 80% efficient solar panel on the basis they could use this heat too )

    If they can get this working efficiently and cheaply then it's just one of a number of technologies in the pipeline to drastically reduce the costs of solar.


    One I liked was that if you could get a material heated up to about 800C then you can in theory get 80% solar conversion with a matched infra-red solar panel.


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