The Breadmaker Thread

Planet X · 10-08-2008 10:08am #1

Recommend me a good one please. About to take the plunge and buy one. Browned (excuse pun) off with shop sliced pans etc.
Some threads recommend Panasonic ones. Want a good one.
Cheers.

Alun · 10-08-2008 10:11am

Definitely Panasonic .. I have an SD-253 which is now obsolete, replaced by the SD-254 I believe. It's been used at least twice a week since we bought it (2 years?) and is still going strong.

Planet X · 10-08-2008 10:19am

Read a few reviews on the Review Centre about this one and a couple of people have had theirs pack up after two and a half years. Maybe a minority. Are they good quality? They seem to be the best ones around.
Generally, they seem to be the best.
Arnotts then?

Alun · 10-08-2008 10:47am

I hadn't read anything negative about mine when I bought it TBH, but at least if it does go wrong they've a decent after sales service and spare parts are readily available unlike some of the lesser makes. If anything does go then usually it's either the drive belt (easy to replace) or the drive motor itself, and I've known people with much cheaper breadmakers (Morphy & Richards, Lidl's best) where their's has gone after only a few months use. they are

I got mine in Argos BTW.

Dizzyblonde · 10-08-2008 12:44pm

I used to make a lot of my own bread in the oven - does a breadmaker really make it easier? I'd be tempted to buy one of it makes a big difference.

Alun · 10-08-2008 1:09pm

Dizzyblonde wrote: »

I used to make a lot of my own bread in the oven - does a breadmaker really make it easier? I'd be tempted to buy one of it makes a big difference.

Place all ingredients in bread maker, switch on, come back 4-5 hours later to freshly baked bread. How much easier can it get?

Planet X · 10-08-2008 1:28pm

I'll go for it I think. Saw one in Debenhams this morning, Panasonic 255. Euro 155. Seems the latest edition.
Thanks for the recommendations Alun.

Alun · 10-08-2008 2:41pm

Planet X wrote: »

I'll go for it I think. Saw one in Debenhams this morning, Panasonic 255. Euro 155. Seems the latest edition.
Thanks for the recommendations Alun.

If you look here

http://www.panasonic.co.uk/html/en_GB/287749/module/general/compare/products/displayResult.html?p=SD-255WXC&p=SD-254WXC

on the Panasonic web page you can see the differences between the two current models, the SD-254 and the SD-255. The SD-255 has a timer, which means you can delay the start and have fresh bread, say, in the mornings, and also the nut/raisin dispenser which is really handy. I have both on my older SD-253 and wouldn't want to be without them.

Planet X · 10-08-2008 3:06pm

Alun,

I've read on most reviews that the bread doesn't last as long as shop bought bread because of no preservatives.
So, wrap it up when cool then. Of course most reviewers say it doesn't last long either because it's eaten almost immediately.
You could freeze it aswell I suppose, like normal bread.

Might just pop down now and buy it. And have decent bread for lunch tomorrow.

Dizzyblonde · 10-08-2008 3:42pm

Alun wrote: »

Place all ingredients in bread maker, switch on, come back 4-5 hours later to freshly baked bread. How much easier can it get?

That's convinced me - I always thought they were a bit of a gimmick but now I think I'll have to get one - thanks

Planet X · 10-08-2008 3:51pm

We have lift off.
Wholewheat loaf is off and running.
:pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

Ponster · 10-08-2008 7:42pm

SD-251 here...and still going strong after seeveral years use.

Planet X · 10-08-2008 8:59pm

Sorted. Lunch bread ready for tomorrow. Came out really good. Will do a faster bake next time. Tomorrow, with a 50/50 mix.

Alun · 12-08-2008 3:15pm

Planet X wrote: »

Sorted. Lunch bread ready for tomorrow. Came out really good. Will do a faster bake next time. Tomorrow, with a 50/50 mix.

My experience (with my machine anyway) is that the rapid bake loaves don't usually turn out as well as the normal ones. For wholemeal, I generally either do the 70/30 or the 50/50 mix rather than 100% wholemeal, as it gives a better texture to my mind.

Some other ones out of the recipe book I got with mine (which I assume hasn't changed much!) that I really like are the 5-Seeded bread (I use a plastic tub of Jan's Five Seed Mix I got from Dunne's instead of mixing the individual seeds), the Tomato Foccacia (with sundried tomatoes and green olives), and the Cheese and Bacon loaf (especially nice toasted

).

Planet X · 12-08-2008 7:54pm

The menu index is very comprehensive alright. Great selection. Baked three loaves since Sunday afternoon when I got it. Will never buy a sliced pan again I reckon.

Kids even like the bread. My son says that brown sliced pans you buy in the stores are........ "Michael Jackson Bread" ...neither brown nor white.
Baked 100% wholemeal. White loaf. 70/30 wholemeal. All very good. Want to do an olive / sundried tomatoe loaf.
:pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

Alun · 12-08-2008 8:04pm

Glad it worked out for you, PlanetX .. I wouldn't be without mine now, and I reckon it's paid for itself already. I once worked out the cost of a medium loaf to be about 45 cent (including electricity usage)!

The Sweeper · 12-08-2008 10:31pm

...how easy are these to clean?

Alun · 12-08-2008 10:40pm

Minesajackdaniels wrote: »

...how easy are these to clean?

Pretty easy.

The mixing bowl / cooking container has a wire handle and just lifts out and is non-stick. There's a kneading paddle in the bottom that slots onto a shaft in the bottom of the mixing bowl that comes off also for cleaning as a tiny bit of dough gets caught underneath it.

So when you pop the loaf out, just fill it with water to cool it down, remove the paddle and clean around there, and give it a quick wash in warm soapy water. 2 minutes work really.

The inside of the machine that the mixing bowl sits in, where the heating element is located, can get a bit grubby after a while, but that's not in contact with the bread anyway, so doesn't matter too much. If you use the raisin/nut dispenser a lot, bits of whatever you put in there can miss the mixing bowl sometimes and land on the heating element in the bottom and burn, but that just means waiting until it all cools down and giving it a bit of a wipe inside.

paddyblue · 14-08-2008 8:09pm

I'm shopping for one at the moment - it was a toss-up between the Panasonic SD 255 & The Anthony Worral Thompson - both €150 in Argos.... think i'll go with the SD 255 after reading the above reviews

I read somewhere that the recepies that come with the machine usually require 'dry milk powder' to be used. Is this true and is it necessary to use the powder? I would rather not use it tbh. Anyone know where you can get recepies with all natural ingredients?

Alun · 14-08-2008 8:27pm

paddyblue wrote: »

I read somewhere that the recepies that come with the machine usually require 'dry milk powder' to be used. Is this true and is it necessary to use the powder? I would rather not use it tbh. Anyone know where you can get recepies with all natural ingredients?

Most of the recipes in my book use dried milk powder, yes. I'm not sure why they use that instead of just using normal milk to be honest, but any dried milk powder I've used has been just that, dried milk, sometimes with added vitamin A and D, so I don't really understand the objection. It does say though in the recipe book never to use fresh milk in the machine if you use the timer and set it to run overnight, otherwise it would sour which makes sense I suppose.

Anyway I googled a bit and found this book ...

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0716021544/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top

which might be of interest to you, but reading the reader comments I still don't get the 'anti milk powder' thing, I have to say, unless the comments were put there by the author herself

EDIT: it says in one of the reviews in this review for the SD-255 that the recipes don't need milk, so maybe they've changed it? PlanetX .. can you confirm this, as you've recently bought one?

paddyblue · 14-08-2008 11:27pm

I personally do not like the idea of milk powder because milk is a liquid, not a powder. What process does it go through to become solidified?

For me the whole point of baking your own bread is so you can control the ingrtedients that go into your loaf.....using only natural ingredients....milk powder isn't natural so it kind of defeats the purpose in a very small & pedantic way.....maybe milk powder is fine and even nutritious but i'm a bit of a sceptic when it comes to convenient food processing (i'm aware flour is processed but at least you can go for wholewheat or spelt grains, giving some control over the quality)

P. Breathnach · 15-08-2008 12:44am

paddyblue wrote: »

I personally do not like the idea of milk powder because milk is a liquid, not a powder. What process does it go through to become solidified?

The water is removed!

I don't use either milk or milk powder when making yeast bread. There is no need for it.

Planet X · 15-08-2008 1:05am

Made Pizza Dough tonight. Pizza was OK.
Thin crust.......

Then again, my pizza dough is always better.
Machine dough......was too thin.

Pizza dough/ never a prob. Just interested how it would pan out. I'll do my own.

CJhaughey · 15-08-2008 10:03am

I have the Bifinett that Lidl sold for €30 about a year ago, it has been brilliant.
I use it all the time to make dough for pizza, just recently I ordered some additional baking tins to make 2 small loaves instead of one big 2.5lb loaf.
I have not had any problems with the machine at all and for €30 It has more than paid for itself at this point.
Usually we bake a 2.5lb loaf twice a week.
The timer works well to have fresh bread in the morning.

Alun · 15-08-2008 10:08am

paddyblue wrote: »

I personally do not like the idea of milk powder because milk is a liquid, not a powder. What process does it go through to become solidified?

Don't you eat butter or cheese either

?Seriously, I don't go a bundle on processed foods either, but powdered milk is just milk with the water removed, nothing too sinister I'd have thought.

Anyway I have no idea why the milk is there in the recipes .. maybe it's not necessary, I don't know.

paddyblue · 15-08-2008 2:18pm

I would just be worried that there are a few other 'nasties' thrown in there when powdering the milk...maybe not....
I can always see what the difference is when using the powder and when leaving it out - a bit of good old 'trial & error'

P. Breathnach · 15-08-2008 3:21pm

paddyblue wrote: »

I would just be worried that there are a few other 'nasties' thrown in there when powdering the milk...maybe not....
I can always see what the difference is when using the powder and when leaving it out - a bit of good old 'trial & error'

Here is what I find for Dawn Milk Made: Skimmed milk powder; hydrogenated vegetable oil; dried glucose syrup; lachtin; anti-caking agent; silica; vitamin C, A and D; colour B carotene.

It's about to go into the bin, not because I think any of there are nasties, but because it is out of date (I already told you that I don't use the stuff).

Alun · 15-08-2008 3:30pm

P. Breathnach wrote: »

Here is what I find for Dawn Milk Made: Skimmed milk powder; hydrogenated vegetable oil; dried glucose syrup; lachtin; anti-caking agent; silica; vitamin C, A and D; colour B carotene

On the ingredients list for my tin of Marvel ...

Dried skimmed milk, Vitamins A&D. That's it.

paddyblue · 18-08-2008 1:43pm

P. Breathnach wrote: »

Here is what I find for Dawn Milk Made: Skimmed milk powder; hydrogenated vegetable oil; dried glucose syrup; lachtin; anti-caking agent; silica; vitamin C, A and D; colour B carotene.

It's about to go into the bin, not because I think any of there are nasties, but because it is out of date (I already told you that I don't use the stuff).

Hydrogenated vegetable oil is definetly something you should try to avoid - ye old trans fats....a big no no

P. Breathnach · 18-08-2008 2:07pm

paddyblue wrote: »

Hydrogenated vegetable oil is definetly something you should try to avoid - ye old trans fats....a big no no

In the tiny quantities you would get it in a product like Dawn Milk Made, I don't think there is much to worry about.

Animal fats and milk fats are also bad for you if you take too much of them, but it is not really feasible for people to eliminate them from their diets without becoming vegan.

paddyblue · 18-08-2008 2:22pm

Yes these animal saturated fats are not the best and consumtion of them should be relatively low....but these fats are not nearly as bad as trans fats. I'm aware that the quantity in question would not be great, and given the fact that there are trans fats in most processed foods we eat today you could even say i'm being pedantic about the whole 'dried milk powder' thing. But for me the whole point of making your own bread is that you can choose exactly what ingredients goes into your loaf.....and if bread recepies say to put in milk powder this kind of defeats the purpose...

anyhow, if you say you don't use milk, dried or liquid, then i will take it that i can bake my bread without....ta

Ponster · 18-08-2008 2:48pm

The whole milk thing is really all up to to the person making the bread. If you're hoping to replace a white loaf then you'll have to add milk (IMHO) to obtain the expected result. The milk will ensure that you end up with a more tender loaf that you'll be more familiar with.

Here in France milk is never added to the mix so when I'm trying to produce a loaf like I'd get in the local bakery I don't add any.

A Yahoo! Answers page said that fresh milk used in baking needs first to be scalded before added to the mix. The whole point of using powered milk means that you don't need to go through this stage. Using UHT milk also avoids the need to scald the milk first.

So if you want bread that Irish people are used to eating than you need milk. You use either fresh milk that you scald first or for no other reason then to save time, you use powered milk.

These links explain it well :

http://www.ochef.com/1078.htm

http://kitchensavvy.typepad.com/journal/2005/05/scalding_milk.html

Alun · 18-08-2008 2:56pm

Yes, from what I've read the effect of adding milk is down to the proteins (casein) in the milk apparently. Anyway, note that not all the recipes in the book delivered with my Panasonic contain milk .. none of the French or Italian style loaves contain it for example which would tie in with what Ponster said about it making the bread more "tender". It's noteworthy also that what the recipe book calls a "sandwich loaf" has more milk powder than the normal recipes, 1.5 tbsp as opposed to 1 tbsp, and the book describes this loaf as having a "soft crust and close texture", so maybe that's it, I don't know.

paddyblue · 11-09-2008 1:59pm

Planet X wrote: »

I'll go for it I think. Saw one in Debenhams this morning, Panasonic 255. Euro 155. Seems the latest edition.
Thanks for the recommendations Alun.

Does anyone know where you can buy this besides Argos? I've been trying in my local store for the past few weeks to no avail, then I checked every store in Ireland online - none of them have this in stock. I called the customer line and they said they don't know when it will be back in....
They do have the SD253 in stock and it is €30 cheaper but I want the nut/fruit dispenser which is only in the newer model (SD255).

Any help appreciated.

Dizzyblonde · 11-09-2008 2:59pm

Have you tried here?

http://www.electricshopping.com/shop/ie/en-ie/electric-shopping/kitchen-cooking/bread-makers/panasonic-sd255-breadmaker-with-nut-dispenser/index.html

Only €5 delivery charge

paddyblue · 11-09-2008 11:41pm

Thanks for that, just ordered it....and it is €20 cheaper than in argos, even with delivery cost:D

franontheedge · 21-09-2008 3:09pm

Alun wrote: »

My experience (with my machine anyway) is that the rapid bake loaves don't usually turn out as well as the normal ones. For wholemeal, I generally either do the 70/30 or the 50/50 mix rather than 100% wholemeal, as it gives a better texture to my mind.

Some other ones out of the recipe book I got with mine (which I assume hasn't changed much!) that I really like are the 5-Seeded bread (I use a plastic tub of Jan's Five Seed Mix I got from Dunne's instead of mixing the individual seeds), the Tomato Foccacia (with sundried tomatoes and green olives), and the Cheese and Bacon loaf (especially nice toasted ).

Dear Alun,

I too feel the same about the 5-seeded bread recipe. Unfortunately I have lost my recipe book, and I can't find it online anywhere.

Is there any chance you could let me have the recipe for it?

I've got no money until at least the end of the week but I have got my bread oven and all the ingredients.

It's just typical that I haven't got the recipe book.

Please?

xxdilemmaxx · 21-09-2008 9:08pm

I just ordered one too!!!

Paddyblue has yours arrived yet, and if so have you made any nice bread??

Dying to get mine

franontheedge · 21-09-2008 11:39pm

I meant no money to buy bread, or even butter!

I'd buy a new breadmaker if I could afford it... but that may be going too far, just to get the recipes back.

paddyblue · 30-09-2008 1:48pm

xxdilemmaxx wrote: »

I just ordered one too!!!

Paddyblue has yours arrived yet, and if so have you made any nice bread??

Dying to get mine

Mine arrived after a few days - even sooner than I expected, in perfect nick too so have to say I was impressed with their service.

So far I've been making only rye/spelt bread (one of the main reasons I bought this particular machine was because of the Rye function, which is also used for baking Spelt bread btw).
The first time I used 100% Rye flour and the loaf collapsed and was very wet, so it went into the bin.
The second & third times I used 60% wholegrain spelt flour & 40% white spelt flour - the bread turned out perfectly both times, much better than how I baked Spelt bread the old fashioned way (oven) - which wasn't very often cos it took so mch time & effort.

I've been away for the last two weeks so not had the chance to try any of the other recepies yet. But have to say so far so good......

Alun · 30-09-2008 1:56pm

franontheedge wrote: »

Dear Alun,

I too feel the same about the 5-seeded bread recipe. Unfortunately I have lost my recipe book, and I can't find it online anywhere.

Is there any chance you could let me have the recipe for it?

I've got no money until at least the end of the week but I have got my bread oven and all the ingredients.

It's just typical that I haven't got the recipe book.

Please?

Sorry, only just seen this ...

xxdilemmaxx · 30-09-2008 5:23pm

Glad to hear the bread is turning out nicely, my first loaf rose then totally collapsed but I realised I had put in 3 to 4 teaspoons of yeast rather than 3/4 of a teaspoon...

Then made a loaf od sundried tomato and parmesan bread which turned out beautifully, made a nice homemade soup with it. It's so nice cos it makes the whole house smell like freshly baked bread, yummmmmm

One question though, none of my recipes include milk powder? Even the recipe for the 5 seed bread is exactly the same but with no milk powder, is there a reason for this? Do the newer models exclude milk powder in the recipes?

paddyblue · 01-10-2008 1:54pm

xxdilemmaxx wrote: »

Glad to hear the bread is turning out nicely, my first loaf rose then totally collapsed but I realised I had put in 3 to 4 teaspoons of yeast rather than 3/4 of a teaspoon...

Then made a loaf od sundried tomato and parmesan bread which turned out beautifully, made a nice homemade soup with it. It's so nice cos it makes the whole house smell like freshly baked bread, yummmmmm

One question though, none of my recipes include milk powder? Even the recipe for the 5 seed bread is exactly the same but with no milk powder, is there a reason for this? Do the newer models exclude milk powder in the recipes?

None of the ingredients in my recepie book (that came with the bread machine) contain milk powder

Alun · 01-10-2008 2:05pm

paddyblue wrote: »

None of the ingredients in my recepie book (that came with the bread machine) contain milk powder

I just had a look on the Panasonic website, and you can download the user manuals for both the older SD-253 that I have, and the newer SD-254 and -255 models.

Indeed, in the newer manual no mention is made of the use of milk powder, but there is a mention in the earlier part of the manual that states that you can replace some of the water in the recipes with milk (i.e. fresh milk, not powder) if you want.

However that's not all .. some of the other quantities are quite different as well.

Take the medium sized 70% wholemeal recipe which is the one I make the most. For my machine, it says to use 1/2 tsp yeast, 1 tbsp sugar and 300 ml water, whereas the SD-255 recipe uses 3/4 tsp yeast, 1 tsp sugar (i.e. 1/3 as much!) and 280ml water.

Odd.

franontheedge · 01-10-2008 5:02pm

I wonder if that is because of the way each different version of breadmachine makes bread differently - or did the Panasonic kitchen only recently discover that milk powder isn't necessary?

P.S. - you can even get the manuals and recipe book all in one for my SD251, which is probably even older - and has no nut & seed dispenser - you need a beep!

P.P.S. Made the bread, thanks for the help.

Alun · 01-10-2008 5:05pm

franontheedge wrote: »

I wonder if that is because of the way each different version of breadmachine makes bread differently - or did the Panasonic kitchen only recently discover that milk powder isn't necessary?

I've no idea .. I'm considering penning an email to Panasonic to ask them if I get around to it.

franontheedge · 01-10-2008 5:10pm

It would certainly be interesting to know because I have a feeling that at one time someone at the Panasonic Kitchen said that the recipes for the different machines were interchangeable, i.e. I could use a recipe from the 255 in my 251.

But I could be mistaken about that, it was about a year ago...

kmick · 01-10-2008 5:15pm

I have a bread maker but have a question.
You put in all the ingredients and it does it all and that's great.
But one major downside with mine is that when the bread is ready you have to remove the metal mixer out of the bread leaving a large hole. Does anyone find that this is a total downside to these machines.

franontheedge · 01-10-2008 5:20pm

I think that for the convenience of not having to kneed the dough or remember to go back and kneed it again after waiting for it to rise, then leaving it to rise again and then having to remember to pop it into the oven at the right time..... I think that little slit is a small enough price to pay for all that taken off your hands.

That doesn't mean I wouldn't dash out and buy a new one if they managed to make one with a retractable blade.

Alun · 01-10-2008 5:21pm

kmick wrote: »

I have a bread maker but have a question.
You put in all the ingredients and it does it all and that's great.
But one major downside with mine is that when the bread is ready you have to remove the metal mixer out of the bread leaving a large hole. Does anyone find that this is a total downside to these machines.

Not on mine, really. It's relatively small, and it only really affects one or two slices out of the middle. A small price to pay for cheap, freshly made bread, I'd say.

Alun · 01-10-2008 5:24pm

franontheedge wrote: »

That doesn't mean I wouldn't dash out and buy a new one if they managed to make one with a retractable blade.

I seem to remember that there was one breadmaker that had a kind-of retractable blade. It was actually hinged and only rotated in one direction when mixing. Just before the baking cycle started it just did a quick little turn in the opposite direction, and so lay flat during the baking. No idea now which one it was.

The Breadmaker Thread

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