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caravan (trailer)

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  • 28-03-2014 1:27pm
    #1
    zane.z
    Registered Users Posts: 3 ✭


    Hello.
    I am planning to buy caravan/trailer to go France in summer. Can anyone explain me what paperwork I need etc.? never in my life own caravan or trailer, so I have no idea where to start.
    What documents i need to prof/change ownership when i buy second hand caravan (something like tax book for car)?
    Do i need tax, vrt, insurance for caravan?
    What documentation i need when going abroad with caravan?
    I have category B licence, so it will be caravan with combined weight car+caravan up to 3500kg
    Thank you all for answers!


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    #2
    zane.z
    Registered Users Posts: 3 ✭zane.z


    noone?


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    #3
    niloc1951
    Registered Users Posts: 2,039 ✭✭✭niloc1951


    zane.z wrote: »
    Hello.
    I am planning to buy caravan/trailer to go France in summer. Can anyone explain me what paperwork I need etc.? never in my life own caravan or trailer, so I have no idea where to start.
    What documents i need to prof/change ownership when i buy second hand caravan (something like tax book for car)?
    Do i need tax, vrt, insurance for caravan?
    What documentation i need when going abroad with caravan?
    I have category B licence, so it will be caravan with combined weight car+caravan up to 3500kg
    Thank you all for answers!

    Just make sure it's not a stolen caravan, check with https://www.cris.co.uk/secure quoting the number which should be etched on every window. However if the caravan was not registered with the scheme or has gone through a number of legitimate owners who did not keep the ownership record up to date it may not help that much.

    There are many sad stories out there of people buying a caravan only to have it taken from them as recovered stolen property and are left out of pocket for the money they handed over.


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    #4
    Betsy Og
    Registered Users Posts: 337 ✭✭Betsy Og


    First thing, you'll have to be patient as regards responses on here. Caravan owners are expected to ring a bell and shout 'unclean unclean' before making an appearance. :D

    Some of the plusses of caravan ownership are the points you mentioned - no VRT, no road tax. Do check on CRIS and ideally get transferred over from last owner on CRIS to yourself. I think I recall some suggestion that CRIS no longer register Irish persons but I could be wrong - I got added when last bought about in UK 2 years ago.

    A bit like 2nd hand cars, buying in the UK generally better in terms of choice, price and quality. That said if you are going "entry level" the savings mightnt cover the ferry cost. IN the UK there's an association of caravan/campervan technicians who do a pre-purchase inspection - well worth it for peace of mind. Buying in Ireland, try to get someone who knows caravans to help - damp is the main issue. There's also the traveller aspect of life... just sayin.

    Do a trawl on Donedeal and see how you go.

    In terms of licencing, this has been covered in detail here and on ICCC.ie. General guidance is better to go for the EB licence, you never know the full story until there's a "tip" - & it has been notoriously hard to get proper info.

    In terms of safety and driveability, check whattowcar.com to match your car and caravan and see how it looks - safety first.

    All in all its a doddle to import, compared to importing cars. Best of luck with it.


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    #5
    Moomat
    Registered Users Posts: 660 ✭✭✭Moomat


    Betsy Og wrote: »

    In terms of licencing, this has been covered in detail here and on ICCC.ie. General guidance is better to go for the EB licence, you never know the full story until there's a "tip" - & it has been notoriously hard to get proper info.

    The OP said the combined weight will not exceed 3500kg. They don't need an E+B licence if the maximum permissible weight of both car and trailer combined is less than 3500kg even if the trailer weighs more than 750kgs.

    Info is on this page: http://www.rsa.ie/en/RSA/Licensed-Drivers/Driving-licence/Cars-and-Trailers/


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    #6
    Betsy Og
    Registered Users Posts: 337 ✭✭Betsy Og


    That's fair enough Moomat but, in practice, how many of us regularly (ever?) drive onto a weighbridge?, you'd want to be comfortably below the limit or you'd always be 'chancing' it.


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    #7
    Moomat
    Registered Users Posts: 660 ✭✭✭Moomat


    Betsy Og wrote: »
    That's fair enough Moomat but, in practice, how many of us regularly (ever?) drive onto a weighbridge?, you'd want to be comfortably below the limit or you'd always be 'chancing' it.

    It's nothing to do with weighbridges. It's all about what the manufacturer states as the maximum authorised mass (MAM). These figures are just for example, if a Toyota Corrolla has a MAM of 1750KG and the caravan has a MAM of 1249KG you would be ok.


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    #8
    zane.z
    Registered Users Posts: 3 ✭zane.z


    Thank you all for replay. Finaly I know what I have to pay attention before buying!


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    #9
    CiniO
    Registered Users Posts: 16,089 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    Moomat wrote: »
    The OP said the combined weight will not exceed 3500kg. They don't need an E+B licence if the maximum permissible weight of both car and trailer combined is less than 3500kg even if the trailer weighs more than 750kgs.

    Info is on this page: http://www.rsa.ie/en/RSA/Licensed-Drivers/Driving-licence/Cars-and-Trailers/

    That's all correct, but question is if the same regulations apply in France?

    It might be the case, that OP will be road legal on B licence in Ireland, but not road legal in France unless he has BE.


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    #10
    niloc1951
    Registered Users Posts: 2,039 ✭✭✭niloc1951


    CiniO wrote: »
    That's all correct, but question is if the same regulations apply in France?

    It might be the case, that OP will be road legal on B licence in Ireland, but not road legal in France unless he has BE.

    Driving Licences are harmonised across the EU, What you get in Ireland is legal in all EU countries. In fact the licence is the same, just different languages.


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    #11
    CiniO
    Registered Users Posts: 16,089 ✭✭✭✭CiniO


    niloc1951 wrote: »
    Driving Licences are harmonised across the EU, What you get in Ireland is legal in all EU countries. In fact the licence is the same, just different languages.

    I'm aware that licences are unified. The same categories apply.

    But there definitely are some differences in details between countries.
    And this can make huge difference in this example of towing a caravan.

    I'm unfortunately not familiar with French law.
    But I'm familiar with Irish and Polish law (both countries are EU member states).
    In Ireland you can tow a trailer (caravan) on B licence, when sum of DGVW of both car and caravan is less than 3500kg.
    In Poland in addition to this, DGVW (design gross vehicle weight) of trailer (caravan) can not be greater than unladen weight of towing vehicle. Ireland had the same requirement, but this does not apply anymore. In Poland it does.

    Other difference is that every car is rated by manufacturer for maximum trailer (caravan) weight. In Ireland this applies to actual weight of the trailer (caravan). In Poland this applied to DGVW of trailer (caravan).
    So f.e. car rated to tow 1500kg. Caravan with actual real weight of 1450kg, but with DGVW 1600kg. In Ireland it can be towed. In Poland it can't.

    Something not related to caravans, but still related to trailers.
    In Ireland to ride a moped, you need AM category on your licence.
    In Poland you don't.

    Now not related to licences, but towing.
    In many EU countries, it's obligatory to have tachograph, once DGVW of set (car + caravan) excees 3500kg. In Ireland it's not needed. But might be needed in France. In Germany limit for tachograph is even lower AFAIK, and some sets below 3500kg must have one.

    In Poland anything above 3500kg (so f.e a set of car and caravan with sum of DGVWs greater than 3500kg) is liable for road tolls the same as trucks and buses.


    In general, there's millions of little law, which are hard to get together.

    But assuming that because you are allowed to tow a certain set of car and trailer in Ireland, you can do it the same way anywhere is the EU, is just silly.


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    #12
    moodrater
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,638 ✭✭✭moodrater


    CiniO wrote: »
    Now not related to licences, but towing.
    In many EU countries, it's obligatory to have tachograph, once DGVW of set (car + caravan) excees 3500kg. In Ireland it's not needed. But might be needed in France. In Germany limit for tachograph is even lower AFAIK, and some sets below 3500kg must have one.

    In Poland anything above 3500kg (so f.e a set of car and caravan with sum of DGVWs greater than 3500kg) is liable for road tolls the same as trucks and buses.

    Sounds like they are encouraging people to tow with small vehicles. But I guess you don't see many idiots with brand new landrover/range rovers pulling brand new twin axle caravans at 130km/h down the motorway heading off on the most expensive camping trip known to mankind :pac:


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    #13
    niloc1951
    Registered Users Posts: 2,039 ✭✭✭niloc1951


    Towing:
    With a B category licence permits:

    Towing a trailer
    (a) where the MAM of the trailer is not greater than 750 kg
    or
    (b) where the MAM of the trailer exceeds 750kg the combined MAM of the towing vehicle and the trailer is not greater than 3,500 kg.

    The above are EU regulations applicable to EU countries.

    Good practice recommends that in the case of (b) the weight of trailer/caravan should be no more than 80% the kerb weight of the towing vehicle.

    Tachographs are not required in vehicles fulfilling the description of private passenger vehicles not exceeding 8 passenger seats, no matter what the weight of the vehicle.
    Which is why motor caravans up to the size of an American RV (17 tonnes or more) are not fitted with tachographs.
    The tachograph regulations in relation to vehicles towing trailers only applies to the carriage of goods and the total weight exceeds 3.5 tonne.

    Click HERE for the complete up-to-date licence regulations.
    Click HERE for the full low-down on tachograph regulations


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    #14
    Moomat
    Registered Users Posts: 660 ✭✭✭Moomat


    niloc1951 wrote: »
    Towing:
    With a B category licence permits:

    Towing a trailer
    (a) where the MAM of the trailer is not greater than 750 kg
    or
    (b) where the MAM of the trailer exceeds 750kg the combined MAM of the towing vehicle and the trailer is not greater than 3,500 kg.

    The above are EU regulations applicable to EU countries.

    Good practice recommends that in the case of (b) the weight of trailer/caravan should be no more than 80% the kerb weight of the towing vehicle.

    Tachographs are not required in vehicles fulfilling the description of private passenger vehicles not exceeding 8 passenger seats, no matter what the weight of the vehicle.
    Which is why motor caravans up to the size of an American RV (17 tonnes or more) are not fitted with tachographs.
    The tachograph regulations in relation to vehicles towing trailers only applies to the carriage of goods and the total weight exceeds 3.5 tonne.

    Click HERE for the complete up-to-date licence regulations.
    Click HERE for the full low-down on tachograph regulations

    Maybe Poland hasn't caught up with the EU Regulations and I certainly wouldn't like to be the test case! :D
    I'm sure there's loads of cases where national goverments are slow to adopt the EU regulations, like those manky truck markings we used to have to use!


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