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Origin of the Dublin Small City Mythology?

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    #32
    strandroad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,676 ✭✭✭strandroad


    Aard wrote: »
    While I do not know nearly as much about Munich as I do about Amsterdam/Randstad, it would appear that Munich has more in common with Dublin than not. Yes, it is more populous. But if population alone is the criteria for city comparisons then I worry we are entering "unique little snowflake" territory!

    It's not only the size, it's inland as well - Dublin feels much more like Copenhagen or indeed Amsterdam than Munich to me. It's the size plus the coast combo.


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    #33
    Aard
    Registered Users Posts: 4,905 ✭✭✭Aard


    There are many reasons why a pair of cities might not be comparable. Topography can often be an important one. Coastal and port cities certainly have different development patterns than inland/non-port cities do. That said, there's always a reason to rule out a pairing so it's wise not to try and find an exact match -- it doesn't exist! At any rate, finding just one perfect city to compare Dublin with isn't entirely useful. Copenhagen fits the bill in many regards, yes. But learning from other cities whether a bit bigger or a bit smaller is also important.


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    #34
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,072 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    jayobray wrote: »
    The Dublin Metro population (Greater Dublin Area) of 1.8m includes the counties of Wicklow, Kildare and Meath and is 6,986km2. The density of this is 258/km2. The population of the Amsterdam Urban area of 1.6m has a density of 1,400/km2. The city centres may have a similar density, but the areas surrounding the cities making up the Metro areas is vastly different in terms of density.

    But this shouldn't alter the fact that a bike infrastructure network should be in place.

    Sorry for the late reply, but it's very strange to compare a region with an urban area.

    First if you want to compare Amsterdam Urban to Dublin urban please do so, but comparing Amsterdam Urban to the region around Dublin is not right.

    "The city centres may have a similar density" -- no, it's not just city centres, both Amsterdam and Dublin city council areas are largely comparable in both size and density.

    As for "...includes the counties of Wicklow, Kildare and Meath and is 6,986km2. The density of this is 258/km2" -- do other countries follow this model of including agriculture land in population density measures? For example, I know the Randstad area looks only at urban population.


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    #35
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    I know they don't count any mountains in the Randstaadt....


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    #36
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,072 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    Carawaystick wrote: »
    I know they don't count any mountains in the Randstaadt....

    No, but the Randstaadt has hilly sand banks, woodland, farmland, tons of flower warehouses, rural housing etc.


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    #37
    newacc2015
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,379 ✭✭✭newacc2015


    Is anyone surprised?Most people that I know who moved from the country to Dublin City still "go home to vote". I have a friend who has lived in Dublin for 15 years and still goes home to vote. Are you surprised that Dublin has horrific public transport when a sizeable minority of its population still votes in anti-Dublin TDs? Not all rural TDs are anti-Dublin. But a lot of them refuse to decently fund Dublin transport as their ultra-low density town doesnt have public transport either


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    #38
    Eugene Norman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,191 ✭✭✭Eugene Norman


    newacc2015 wrote: »
    Is anyone surprised?Most people that I know who moved from the country to Dublin City still "go home to vote". I have a friend who has lived in Dublin for 15 years and still goes home to vote. Are you surprised that Dublin has horrific public transport when a sizeable minority of its population still votes in anti-Dublin TDs? Not all rural TDs are anti-Dublin. But a lot of them refuse to decently fund Dublin transport as their ultra-low density town doesnt have public transport either

    The problem here is the idea that TDs run Dublin rather than Ireland.

    If we want to fund Dublin we need the city to be able to tax, and then get extra money from the state or the EU. But we dubliners are the first to complain about property taxes.


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    #39
    newacc2015
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,379 ✭✭✭newacc2015


    Eugene Norman wrote: »
    The problem here is the idea that TDs run Dublin rather than Ireland.

    If we want to fund Dublin we need the city to be able to tax, and then get extra money from the state or the EU. But we dubliners are the first to complain about property taxes.

    It doesnt help than 20% of our LPT goes into a common pot for redistribution aka support other CoCos. One of the reason why DCC voted for a 15% reduction was its residents were paying all this money on their modest homes, while people living in rural areas where its far more expensive to provide services were paying a fraction in LPT

    I dont think Dubliners would mind LPT if all of it was staying in Dublin. But its not


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    #40
    John_Rambo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,536 ✭✭✭John_Rambo


    Eugene Norman wrote: »
    The problem here is the idea that TDs run Dublin rather than Ireland.

    If we want to fund Dublin we need the city to be able to tax, and then get extra money from the state or the EU. But we dubliners are the first to complain about property taxes.

    I think Dublin's the most compliant when it comes to property tax, we're also paying about 80% more than everyone else, and a lot of it's been spent outside of Dublin, probably in Donegal, the most subsidised county in the country, that has the lowest rate of compliance when it comes to property tax!


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    #41
    Eugene Norman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,191 ✭✭✭Eugene Norman


    John_Rambo wrote: »
    I think Dublin's the most compliant when it comes to property tax, we're also paying about 80% more than everyone else, and a lot of it's been spent outside of Dublin, probably in Donegal, the most subsidised county in the country, that has the lowest rate of compliance when it comes to property tax!

    Yes. But the city needs more revenue. I'd like to see sales taxes (vat) go to Dublin. But we need an elected mayor first.


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    #42
    murphaph
    Registered Users Posts: 19,018 ✭✭✭✭murphaph


    Elected mayor (for the entire metropolitan area and the satellite towns in close proximity, eg Leixlip) to push things on is quite simply the only way Dublin will ever progress as a city. Dublin is not a large town as so many people, even those living there, seem to think. It has totally different needs to the other cities. The old county boundaries should only be used for GAA like they are used for Cricket over in England....but not for administrative purposes. They're past their sell by date and especially so where metropolitan areas span across the existing city and county boundaries. It goes without saying that destroying Dublin County Council was an act of sabotage by Dail Eireann's rural politicians to curtail the power of the only body that could rival the lower house.


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