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POC's Red Card.++ Mod Warning. Read OP++

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Comments

  • #102
    suppafly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,055 ✭✭✭suppafly


    thehighground wrote: »
    What are your views on this incident? (Julian White on Mal O'Kelly 2008 HCup).

    White got a yellow card in the match and a 5 week suspension from the ERC!

    "Mr. White admitted he was guilty of foul play in that he had punched Malcolm O'Kelly.

    After considering the evidence available, the independent Disciplinary Committee determined that the offence was of mid-range in the level of seriousness. Having taken into account any mitigating and aggravating factors the Committee suspended the player for a period of five (5) weeks backdated from the week commencing Monday, 21 January, 2008, and running up to and including Sunday, 24 February, 2008."

    Go to about 1.40 secs for a close-up of what happened.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdNObgWW3jY



    Shows exactly that O'Connel should have only gotten a yellow. White lashing into big mal. Dunno who he was wasn't sent off.


    PS: thats me in the crowd shot shaking my head in disgust at the decision just after paul walks off the pitch


  • #103
    stevoslice
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,007 ✭✭✭stevoslice


    Up close footage of POC vs Thomas

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FyqwTFBH-3A


    but seriously, definitely at least a yellow, at most red and a weeks ban.


  • #104
    buck65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,969 ✭✭✭buck65


    2 weeks is the minimum here and most would be happy with that. Forget the Berdos has it in for him crap and all the other excuses - it is becoming embarassing at this stage. This is an open and shut case.


  • #105
    castie
    Hosted Moderators Posts: 3,807 ✭✭✭castie


    If its run like a court of law then he should be "charged" with an elbow to the face ( this is what he was accused of in the game ).

    However I doubt that will happen and they will realise Berdos's mistake and "charge" him with something else.


  • #106
    Paulw
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,381 ✭✭✭✭Paulw


    castie wrote: »
    If its run like a court of law then he should be "charged" with an elbow to the face ( this is what he was accused of in the game ).

    However I doubt that will happen and they will realise Berdos's mistake and "charge" him with something else.

    He has already been "charged" with "Striking an opponent with a hand, arm or fist", Law 10.4 (a).

    That is what he will be judged on.

    Berdos will not be the one who makes the decision, and will not be the one who decides on the penalty.

    Berdos will give his side, so will POC.

    After all the evidence is reviewed (testimony, video, photographs, etc), the citing commission will make their judgement known.


  • #107
    Webbs
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,645 ✭✭✭Webbs


    dermy wrote: »
    Precedence is everything, in this and in courts of law.

    For the above White incident and for the Cudmore incident- Whatever about how it started or who started it, PoC delivered multiple direct and forceful punches to the face of Cudmore while Cudmore was in a headlock. Every one of which was worse than this hit. What was the deliberation? a yellow card for Poc and no ban.

    and keep it in perspective- it was not an 'elbow smash'. It was a forearm, even wrist, smack on the jaw/neck. It was delivered above chest height, backwards, in about an 80 degree arc with no follow through and a limp elbow. He wasn't even properly looking at where the guy was.

    I'm not saying he tickled him, I'm just saying this was probably a fraction of what PoC could deliver if he felt like it. And Thomas made the most out of it, possibly knowing that he could take out a key player for not just one but two major fixtures between the two sides. Which, if true, is far more disgusting if you ask me.

    Also Berdos is a poor ref, just ask Brendan Venter (if he'll answer...) or even Joe Schmidt for their reactions to the same game he reffed.

    Oh come on, POC swung back hard and is looking at Thomas when the forearm hits him. Look at the way Thomas goes down he almost crumples to the floor, it certainly isnt 'making the most of it'. If anyone gets thumped like that when not expecting it you will go down like a sack of spuds.

    Do you genuinely think in that split second he was thinking ' I know if I go down on the floor I will get this player sent off' if you do then you can thank your stars you've never taking a smack in the mouth!

    I'm all for debating whether this is an incident that deserves a 2week ban or a 10 week ban but don't question another players integrity for getting a smack in the head when all he did was tug a jersey that happens a hundred times in a game.
    Berdos while I agree he had an awful game (but for reasons you would not like) went and consulted his linesman and was left with no alternative in this case.


  • #108
    PhatPiggins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,881 ✭✭✭PhatPiggins


    Webbs wrote: »
    Oh come on, POC swung back hard and is looking at Thomas when the forearm hits him. Look at the way Thomas goes down he almost crumples to the floor, it certainly isnt 'making the most of it'. If anyone gets thumped like that when not expecting it you will go down like a sack of spuds.

    Do you genuinely think in that split second he was thinking ' I know if I go down on the floor I will get this player sent off' if you do then you can thank your stars you've never taking a smack in the mouth!

    I'm all for debating whether this is an incident that deserves a 2week ban or a 10 week ban but don't question another players integrity for getting a smack in the head when all he did was tug a jersey that happens a hundred times in a game.
    Berdos while I agree he had an awful game (but for reasons you would not like) went and consulted his linesman and was left with no alternative in this case.

    Watch more sport, you'd be suprised how many players can make this decision in such a short time frame.


  • #109
    tommy57
    Registered Users Posts: 224 ✭✭tommy57


    He knew what he was at I'm a fan of paul o connell but i'm not backing him on this one. he struck the player pure and simple ,he went straight down no acting. if this was any Irish player we'd all be in uproar.just because its Paul o connell peoples views are diffrent.


  • #110
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    :pac:

    Some of the stuff being said in here is ridiculous! You can see the force of the blow in the way it impacts on Thomas, his head in knocked back by it.

    It wasn't an elbow, as the ref said, but it was still pretty vicious. I certainly wouldn't back myself keeping my consciousness after taking a blow like that.

    The ERC are very harsh with their bans, but I can't see POC ending up with anything more than 3 weeks


  • #111
    The_Kew_Tour
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,424 ✭✭✭✭The_Kew_Tour


    If it was Welsh lad who did it to POC people would be saying how dirty they are.


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  • #112
    Riskymove
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,899 ✭✭✭✭Riskymove


    I was at the game and clearly saw the incident

    POC lamped him completely...there is no question of that...and no chance that it was a 'dive'......maybe he then milked it and made more of it, I dont know, but certainly he was knocked down by it

    However, its also clear that POC did not elbow him which is what the ref said and motioned he was giving him a red card for. if what POC actually did is also a red card offence then there is no argument, if it is not, then there is a question that being given the red card was harsh.

    I expect a couple of weeks ban


  • #113
    calvin_zola
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,028 ✭✭✭calvin_zola


    premierstone wrote: »
    Yeah your dead right POC is so unprofessional :rolleyes: cop yourself on lad, your were on here all last week spouting how Ospreys were definitely going to beat Munster, you called that fairly right too :p

    I know I'm dead right, all you have to do is look at the video evidence and I feel justified in my statement. Think he should stick to the Milk ads to be honest now lads, bout all hes gonna be good for after that injury :(


  • #114
    buck65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,969 ✭✭✭buck65


    A red card regardless of what part of the arm is the law. Berdos saying elbow will have little significance on the outcome. It will be judged as it appeared on TV I think.


  • #115
    calvin_zola
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,028 ✭✭✭calvin_zola


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Ridiculous thing to say about a guy who's spent so long on the sidelines. Obviously let the blood go to his head. It happens. he'll do his time.

    No not ridiculous, quite true as it happens


  • #116
    d'Oracle
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,025 ✭✭✭d'Oracle


    calvin_zola wrote: »
    No not ridiculous, quite true as it happens

    Hilarious.

    Show a shred of proof.
    Its not true, its complete speculation.


  • #117
    Lisa Slow Vibraphone
    Posts: 0 ✭✭✭✭ Lisa Slow Vibraphone


    calvin_zola wrote: »
    No not ridiculous, quite true as it happens

    Your original quote is
    ity POC just couldn't play the game instead of demonstrating his level of or lack of professionalism yesterday

    yup, still ridiculous.


  • #118
    premierstone
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,706 ✭✭✭premierstone


    calvin_zola wrote: »
    I know I'm dead right, all you have to do is look at the video evidence and I feel justified in my statement. Think he should stick to the Milk ads to be honest now lads, bout all hes gonna be good for after that injury :(

    So you still stand by your claim that POC is unprofessional on the back of this one rash out of character act??

    And your attempt at humor there has failed miserably, why do you think that a company such as that choose POC to front there campaign is it cos he's unprofessional or because he is an iconic figure within Irish sport??


  • #119
    OldRio
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,142 ✭✭✭OldRio


    Originally Posted by calvin_zola viewpost.gif
    I know I'm dead right, all you have to do is look at the video evidence and I feel justified in my statement. Think he should stick to the Milk ads to be honest now lads, bout all hes gonna be good for after that injury frown.gif

    Very silly or a look at me type of post.:rolleyes:


  • #120
    toomevara
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    Handbags away and down a notch please folks, thanks.


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  • #121
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    *lowers handbag*


  • #122
    trackguy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,246 ✭✭✭trackguy


    calvin_zola wrote: »
    I know I'm dead right, all you have to do is look at the video evidence and I feel justified in my statement. Think he should stick to the Milk ads to be honest now lads, bout all hes gonna be good for after that injury :(

    Sensationalist rubbish - You able to tell that from all the time he has spent on the pitch since the injury yeah? :rolleyes:


  • #123
    Cpt_Blackbeard
    Registered Users Posts: 2,456 ✭✭✭Cpt_Blackbeard


    calvin_zola wrote: »
    I know I'm dead right, all you have to do is look at the video evidence and I feel justified in my statement. Think he should stick to the Milk ads to be honest now lads, bout all hes gonna be good for after that injury :(

    I think you're right actually, he was almost non-existent in the first 60 and last 10 minutes of the game on Sunday.

    He might as well have been sitting on the subs bench from what I saw of him. :rolleyes:


  • #124
    Sundy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭Sundy


    Never realised until today that O'Connell once punched Ryan Caldwell in an irish squad training match, knocking him out and putting him into spasm.
    He obviously has a fierce temper that he mostly manages to keep control of but snaps the odd time, ie Cudmore (justified) and Sidoli incidents.


  • #125
    PhatPiggins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,881 ✭✭✭PhatPiggins


    Sundy wrote: »
    Never realised until today that O'Connell once punched Ryan Caldwell in an irish squad training match, knocking him out and putting him into spasm.
    He obviously has a fierce temper that he mostly manages to keep control of but snaps the odd time, ie Cudmore (justified) and Sidoli incidents.

    Rumour started by Ryan Caldwell and still used as an excuse to why he never fullfilled his potential.

    Was quickly followed by rumour that Caldwell tried to have him cited and banned in an attempt to get a starting place.

    Fierce temper my hole, I don't no one decent international second row who doesn't have a hard edge.


  • #126
    Monty Burnz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,455 ✭✭✭✭Monty Burnz


    PhatPiggins wrote: »
    Rumour started by Ryan Caldwell and still used as an excuse to why he never fullfilled his potential.

    Was quickly followed by rumour that Caldwell tried to have him cited and banned in an attempt to get a starting place.

    Fierce temper my hole, I don't no one decent international second row who doesn't have a hard edge.
    I heard that Superman wears POC pyjamas...:pac::pac::pac:


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  • #127
    Cpt_Blackbeard
    Registered Users Posts: 2,456 ✭✭✭Cpt_Blackbeard


    Monty Burnz wrote: »
    I heard that Superman wears POC pyjamas...:pac::pac::pac:

    You heard wrong...Its Chuck Norris who wears POC pyjamas. I hear that he recently got a red pair too :D


  • #128
    Sundy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,512 ✭✭✭Sundy


    PhatPiggins wrote: »
    Rumour started by Ryan Caldwell and still used as an excuse to why he never fullfilled his potential.

    Was quickly followed by rumour that Caldwell tried to have him cited and banned in an attempt to get a starting place.

    Fierce temper my hole, I don't no one decent international second row who doesn't have a hard edge.
    I read in one of todays papers. Nothing to suggest it was just a rumour.

    I seem to remember O'Connell having a reputation as having a temper in his younger days.


  • #129
    Quint2010
    Registered Users Posts: 5,178 ✭✭✭Quint2010


    Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »
    Of course it would floor me but I'm not 6ft5 and 17.5 Stone either though and I'm pretty sure that the arm would have sailed over my head :D.

    If they send out a message that all the "cute whoreness" of holding players off the ball will result in a penalty we will get a quicker game of players showcasing their actual talents. If the refs just started giving out penalties for it, like what happened DOC, we would get a better spectacle.

    The lashing out was only bad because of POC's size, if Stringer did the same and hit Thomas in the nuts, we would be in for a fantastic Youtube video rather than a red card. If Paulie hit Thomas in the chest it would have been fine and a fair attempt at freeing himself. POC was stupid but there was nothing less, he doesn't really deserve a ban but 2 weeks would be fair for an act of stupidity.

    Contact and Intent are completely relevant, if he had telegraphed a hit woth his elbow and it resulted in the same incident, nobody would be protesting POC's innocence.

    Keane didn't end Haland's (spelling) career because of hot-headedness, it was revenge :cool:

    Keane should have been sent to prison for that tackle.


  • #130
    The_Kew_Tour
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,424 ✭✭✭✭The_Kew_Tour


    Quint2010 wrote: »
    Keane should have been sent to prison for that tackle.

    So your saying that O Connell should go to jail also?


    Because if anybody did what he did at 3am in morning in any city centre across country he be in jail for it too


  • #131
    Cpt_Blackbeard
    Registered Users Posts: 2,456 ✭✭✭Cpt_Blackbeard


    adrian280582 wrote: »
    So your saying that O Connell should go to jail also?


    Because if anybody did what he did at 3am in morning in any city centre across country he be in jail for it too

    Same would happen if you rugby tackled a person in town...


    So whats your point exactly? :rolleyes:
    Thomas would have deserved a smack for f*ck acting on a night out just like he deserved what happened in the match.


    Edit: Just because he deserved it doesn't mean that it was POC's right to try shrug him off and knock him out with a flailing arm the size of a leg though.


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  • #132
    Cpt_Blackbeard
    Registered Users Posts: 2,456 ✭✭✭Cpt_Blackbeard


    Oh and here's an interesting and impartial read on the subject: Link







    :rolleyes:


  • #133
    corny
    Registered Users Posts: 7,806 ✭✭✭corny


    A flick in the face is all it was. From start to finish J Thomas knew the score, the referee was looking right at him and he knew it. Initially look for the reaction, make the most of the swing and hopefully we'll get a man up. 10 mins in the bin for stupidity was enough for POC.

    If he'd elbowed him and knocked his nose all over the place maybe the red card and a hefty a ban would be justified but a slap in the face? Please. J Cudmore took POC's close fisted best a while back and got up looking for more. These boys mean business and a slap in the face doesn't make them go down like a sack of spuds unless they really want it to. He did, he played the situation perfectly and was rewarded. Not happy with that myself.


  • #134
    toomevara
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,772 ✭✭✭toomevara


    Right that's quite enough of that...done to death, getting circular and now we've sunk to alluding to alleged incidents which may or may not have happened in a training session a numbers of year back...hmmm...quality. Locked.


This discussion has been closed.
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