ATC recruitment with IAA

So, has anyone actually gone to visit Ballygireen yet?[/quote]

see my comment up above...nobody has said anythin yet!!!

has anyone done their final interview yet??? jus revisin stuff for mine here now on friday!!!

Had mine, two guys I went very well with but one guy not so good. It wasn't a disaster but
I got the impression he was thinking I wasn't for the IAA. Pretty much blew it I think, I had
expected it but didn't give good responses or answers that I prepared. Gutted but it was
a great experience and I'll be on top of things for ATC process if it happens.

Results next Friday so best of luck to everyone. Its a great opportunity.

Totally agree with the thanks to the lovely lady from HR and indeed to all the HR staff who I've been in contact with.

I don't feel qualified to comment on the recruitment process so won't, but unfortunately no process is perfect and there will always be people who, perhaps rightly perhaps wrongly, feel short changed.

Concerning the training in one year, this process is not untested. I understand that it has been adopted from the training that is used in the facility in Iceland where non experienced radio officers have been employed.

Interesting to hear about the person who has already been accepted. IF (and that is a big "IF") that is a true senario, it does not say much for his general cop on to go advertising the fact before the e-mails are sent out!

I can't agree with this. For a start how do you know what the job entails these days? Do you have access to HR files in the IAA? How do you know there weren't ant ATCOs or pilots with a final interview? I heard there were.

If the IAA, airlines, maintenance companies and so on operating here were to go direct entry for every single ATC, radio officer position, technician and pilot position from now until the year 3000 what logic would that serve? Where would new recruits come from? How would you gain access to the aviation industry in Ireland? You wouldn't. Yes there are experienced radio operators out there but that doesn't mean you can walk into Ballygirreen, sit down and start doing the job. Your comment about having no "people of substance" is terribly arrogant imo. For example I spoke to a qualified solicitor who was doing the aptitude tests. I don't think having a sense of entitlement about the job just because you are a radio officer somewhere else is a good thing. They went this route for a reason imo. There are and have been other positions that the IAA have gone direct entry for. Including ATC afaik.

I didn't find the aptitude tests too hard. Maybe they want fresh, younger candidates with an eagerness to learn?

I will say 1 thing about the process though, it's probably a very bad sign as far as my final interview went but I was very disappointed they didn't ask me about anything outside of work/academic environment. I had lots of things I could have talked about which would reflect well on me but I never got the opportunity. Maybe others did but I thought they would have asked about these sort of things routinely.

The bad part of my interview I mentioned above was when they tried to suss out my general interest in the aviation industry and flying generally. I got the distinct impression from this part that they were looking for people who have a very strong interest (naturally enough and fair enough) in aviation and who were and would look for other positions in the industry such as pilot or ATC if they didn't get this. They were looking to root out carpetbaggers taking shelter in this position in bad economic times, I feel. That's fair enough imo and I had thought about this but I just didn't answer the questions properly.

It's because of this part I'm sure I didn't get it. I really didn't get my interest in aviation across well at all even though I had thought about this a lot and what I would say when it came up. Maybe I was caught off guard by his line of questions initially, he questioned me about ATC (what did they do - I was a little bit surprised at this as this is not an ATC job and I only knew the very, very basics about what an ATC actually does) - why I didn't go to the last ATC process, why I wouldn't do a PPL and so on. I went very well with the other 2 guys but very badly with this guy and this part. I messed up definitely. Ah well...I'll definitely be going for the ATC process if it happens and I'll be much more comfortable with everything next time around and hopefully nail a final interview if I get that far again.

Oxy1 wrote: »

Yeah, well don't let that surprise you, Poloman.. I think we all expected that one. :rolleyes:

Nothing about this process was fair. I think by now the IAA realise that the best people in this race were eliminated at an early stage, hence the lack of enthusiasm from some panel members at final interview.

Had they bothered to put *any* time into looking at individual applications, rather than simply filtering the majority out based on a generic aptitude test held by an outside company, they wouldn't have struggled with picking people from an unsuitable pool at the final interviews. And that's no-one's fault but the IAA.

The people at final interview may have known which shape was the odd one out, but there were numerous radio officers and air-traffic-controllers out there who applied, knowing this job quite literally inside-out. Many of those who had never seen an aptitude test before were without doubt the people for the job. Their unread applications said it all.

The skills of this job were never learnable in a one year course, and the IAA are probably realising that now, months after the rest of us. Too late boys!

Maybe it'll take a recruitment mess like this one for you to make a little more effort in future and actually view some applications, take more into consideration than a ridiculous generic aptitude test that tells you absolutely nothing about how well suited to this position an applicant was, and have some people of substance at the final interviews preventing you from hiring your own..?

Well, it's a nice thought... :rolleyes:

Poloman wrote: »

Ha ha.. looks like we all think we didn't blow them away to say the least like our first interviews! The panel must be thinking "Huh? How did these eejits even pass the aptitude test!!"

Im glad I'm not the only one that came out thinking he will never see Ballygireen again :pac:

Anyway fair play folks, it was nerve racking but we got through it. Now to relax until friday evening as I cant check my private mail in work. Will post back the final mail I receive.

Btw you can forward your email from Gmail and probably a lot of other private email services.

I've said before I was talking to a qualified solicitor who sat the aptitude test and another few who I would regard as being very highly educated and able people, in any profession, technical or otherwise. There is at least 1 candidate who is a qualified aircraft technician who couldn't get a job in his field and decided to apply, he got a final interview and will probably get the job given what I learned from my final interview. I can't understand this unwillingness to accept "green" candidates as genuine or able or the suggestion that by virtue of the fact you passed the aptitude test you are somehow unworthy. It's a "closed shop" mentality. A radio officer working somewhere else would never be doing an identical job to the one in Ballygirreen, and so though it would be a huge advantage and a lot of knowledge would transfer it surely doesn't necessarily mean you are "perfect" for Ballygirreen. I can't see how anybody would be in a position to say so.
Most young people today are very versatile and quick to learn not to mention university educated, something, with all due respect, others may not be. Perhaps they would have a greater appreciation for certain elements of the job and life in general and would apply themselves to the job in a better way to those with long established routines and habits, who knows? I couldn't say either way generally, it would probably depend on the individual. One process hasn't found both sets of candidates, perhaps they could have had 2 parallel processes.

I have some issues with the process, some computer tests would be a good idea and the final interview in particular I have some specific issues with, I don't feel it was nearly long enough for a start, but I'm not complaining really. It's my own fault I didn't get it. I could have done a much better interview and I left a lot of what I wanted to say at home.

EI573 wrote: »

I suppose I'll pipe in here again as the process is now at an end.

One thing I want to anonymously say as I know the IAA are reading this; there were a lot more people pre-aptitude test who were absolutely perfect for this job than there were in the final interviews.

I have no doubt in my mind (and I'm not alone in thinking this) that the test took out several people who were absolutely ideal for the position. I can't comment on how they scored on the day of the aptitude test (though I'd be willing to bet they came within a hair of passing the mark), all I know for certain is that the applications they submitted said it all. And they never got the chance to have any of this seen to.

I know it's often necessary to use an aptitude test to filter out a huge amount of people (the ESB have to do this, with thousands upon thousands of applicants), but I know for a fact that in (at least some) other industries, people who score well but not quite well enough, still have their application reviewed, and a type of 'wild card' is put in place where a certain amount of these people will be called forward to the next stage, providing they tick all of the other boxes.

Had the aptitude test had anything to do with this position (for example in the way that the ATC test is a very good indication of how one will handle the job itself), that'd be one thing, but I don't think the Radio Officer aptitude test was a fair way of ruling some amazing people out. And I'm not just talking about the radio officers who applied, who have already been mentioned.

I'm gauging my evidence from people who have personally approach me, to ask about the job. There were people who knew the job better than most who have 25 years of employment at Ballygirreen who didn't make it through the aptitude test stage, and there were people who had no idea in the world about HF, propagation, aviation or co-ordinates who made it to the final interview.
Sure, you can learn this stuff, but I think it's a great help to already have a good understanding of and interest in the topics. A year is a very short amount of time to start from scratch.

I guess I'd love to have seen a slightly larger amount of people interviewed in person, and less emphasis placed upon a generalised aptitude test.
This would have made the final interviewing process much easier for the IAA, and perhaps prevented some of the unfair decisions which have been made (some of you will know what I'm referring to here).

In reference to the issue that both Poloman and Oxy1 have referred to;
I won't get into it apart from saying that I think it's completely wrong, but it was known and completely expected by all from the offset.
Pity they didn't implement some of the rules that are usually enforced by radio and TV stations when entering competitions.
I think all it does is further stress what I've said above. But then, all processes are unfair.

No I mean I thought they are looking for people with an aviation
background. Given its an intensive education process for aircraft
technician he would have a great chance. I could be wrong, just
a friend of a friend heard there was somebody with that background
going for it. Probably shouldn't have mentioned it for privacys sake
so apologies if he's reading this.

Well done. Best of luck with it.

I'd say they have contacted everyone due a position
already via phone in that case, so that's it for me I
would think.

There's always any prospective ATCO position you can go for. I've never been involved in a process like this before to this stage so I've learned a lot. Looking back I'm absolutely gutted with the interview I did, could have been so much better and I reckon I would have had a much better chance. I was going really well until the last guy too. Looking back I overthought a lot of aspects and lost sight of some others and they turned out to be incredibly important.

I'll sign out here so best of luck to Jess and others who got it, it's an incredible opportunity so make the best of it.

Hi there Jess, i just signed on to boards. Only found it recently! Congratulations on the offer. Just to let ya know I got through pending medical and security clearance too. Cmere presuming that all goes ok what do you plan on doing about accommodation?

Thanks. Just PM'd you back.

Did anyone get called as part of the new intake recently?

If anyone is interested in sorting out accomodation etc PM me.

Yes I received the contract yesterday, I didn't want to tempt fate by saying anything before then. Roll on the 23rd.