Driver not stopping due to bus full.

Trampas · 30-09-2013 8:21pm #1

Waiting on the bus today along with many others.

Bus was coming to stop and about 50 yards away from stop he changes the destination to bus full.

He rather drive past everyone than stop to let a few people on and have the hassle to tell people no more can get on.

I know people will say that it could have been full but it stinked of couldn't be bothered to let a handful with the such late change to bus full.

coylemj · 30-09-2013 10:03pm

Having been on dozens of full buses, I can tell you why he didn't pull up at the stop - it's because there are people who refuse to accept that they cannot get on. There are certain categories of people who start getting on a bus even before others get off, let alone that they might heed a driver telling them that he's full and only letting people off.

Think old dears with free passes who think they can do what they bloody well like, that's why drivers pull the bus over before or after the stop to let people off when they're full. Try telling a granny with a wheelie shopping bag to get off the bus!

Beer Assistant · 30-09-2013 10:19pm

I dont see a problem here if the bus is full its full,

get the next one.

cson · 30-09-2013 10:32pm

Don't need the bus anymore but I did for a period of 3 months this time last year and you could see the effect that 'Network Direct' (i.e. the cutbacks in services) was having on rush hour traffic - streamlining routes into one service means that buses get fuller faster and if you live nearer the City Centre you're fairly goosed for getting on from about 8.20am - 9.10am. Its basically touch and go for getting on at those times and you can absolutely forget about it if its raining or looks anyway inclement out there.

One thing that does bother me if its 'full' is if the passengers have just crowded into as far as the wheelchair bay - you can fit another ~4ish people beyond the bay. But drivers may not see this so carry on. I always make a point of going back as far as I can. I'd apportion blame for this as being 50/50 - passengers too ignorant to be good commuters and drivers not giving a ****e. Some drivers are very good in this regard though - shouting at folks to move down and make room or letting you know if there's seats upstairs.

Incidentally I had my own not stopping experience last Thursday; waited specifically for a #1 and noticed that the RTPI was fairly inaccurate - i.e. it was 'due 2 mins' for about 10 mins. Bus comes, I stick out my hand clearly and the driver just flat out ignores it. He gets stopped by reds about 20 yards away so I walk up and bang on the door - knows I'm there but doesn't acknowledge it. Didn't get the bus number and tbh I got over my initial annoyance a little while after so didn't complain (and I won't here either!) but it was the most blatant ignoring of a passenger I've ever encountered. To any of the bus drivers here - are you under pressure to keep to RTPI times? Cos that's the only reason I can think of for him ignoring my stop. Two of my mates were on board and hit the stop button for the next stop after he didn't stop for me but he ignored that too. We were meeting in town anyway so they left it.

I've rationalised it as I just happened upon a wanker of a driver. And tbf you get them type of people in every walk of life from time to time.

n97 mini · 30-09-2013 11:55pm

Gretts_40oz wrote: »

I dont see a problem here if the bus is full its full,

get the next one.

And what if there are 2 hour gaps in the timetable?

Dravokivich · 01-10-2013 12:01am

n97 mini wrote: »

And what if there are 2 hour gaps in the timetable?

The 239 is lucky to have anyone other than the driver on it in fairness.

LXFlyer · 01-10-2013 8:38am

Dravokivich wrote: »

The 239 is lucky to have anyone other than the driver on it in fairness.

It's not that bad - it does carry people generally for short hops along different portions of the route, but it's unlikely to ever be completely full.

Dravokivich · 01-10-2013 9:25am

lxflyer wrote: »

It's not that bad - it does carry people generally for short hops along different portions of the route, but it's unlikely to ever be completely full.

I know, it goes by my way. I was just pointing out how extreme his example was.

Daemonic · 01-10-2013 9:44am

cson wrote: »

....
One thing that does bother me if its 'full' is if the passengers have just crowded into as far as the wheelchair bay - you can fit another ~4ish people beyond the bay. But drivers may not see this so carry on. I always make a point of going back as far as I can. I'd apportion blame for this as being 50/50 - passengers too ignorant to be good commuters and drivers not giving a ****e. Some drivers are very good in this regard though - shouting at folks to move down and make room or letting you know if there's seats upstairs.
...

My own pet hate around bus etiquette are the people who sit on the stairs. Quite often I'll ask to get past, they mumble about 'no seats upstairs' and when I say I'll take a peek anyway, there are often half a dozen or more free seats near the back. :mad:

Cookie_Monster · 01-10-2013 9:57am

Daemonic wrote: »

My own pet hate around bus etiquette are the people who sit on the stairs. Quite often I'll ask to get past, they mumble about 'no seats upstairs' and when I say I'll take a peek anyway, there are often half a dozen or more free seats near the back. :mad:

There are always seats upstairs

Peppa Pig · 01-10-2013 11:29am

coylemj wrote: »

Having been on dozens of full buses, I can tell you why he didn't pull up at the stop - it's because there are people who refuse to accept that they cannot get on. There are certain categories of people who start getting on a bus even before others get off, let alone that they might heed a driver telling them that he's full and only letting people off.

Think old dears with free passes who think they can do what they bloody well like, that's why drivers pull the bus over before or after the stop to let people off when they're full. Try telling a granny with a wheelie shopping bag to get off the bus!

So if there are no grannies with shopping trollies at the stop will he pull over and tell everyone else that it is full.

Or are their other groups of people who like to get on, not just an ageist sexist stereotype?

n97 mini · 01-10-2013 11:53am

239 was an example of a bus with 2 hour gaps in the timetable, to illustrate how flippant a comment like "get the next bus" can be.

GTE · 01-10-2013 11:55am

n97 mini wrote: »

And what if there are 2 hour gaps in the timetable?

What's that posts point? It's either condoning the overloading of a vehicle or saying that the timetable needs work. The former is dumb and the latter is off topic.

01-10-2013 12:18pm

Maybe he was waiting to see if anyone rang the bell to get off and with 50yards to go he knew that wasn't going to happen?

AlekSmart · 01-10-2013 12:58pm

Peppa Pig wrote: »

So if there are no grannies with shopping trollies at the stop will he pull over and tell everyone else that it is full.

Or are their other groups of people who like to get on, not just an ageist sexist stereotype?

One of the problems with dismissing Coylemj's opinion is that in many cases it tends to be accurate.

Cross-City journeys particularly,tend to present these issues in extremis,with very little hope of it being addressed UNLESS the Busdriver becomes assertive,an approach which will GUARANTEE complaints from other non-involved passengers.

I speak from daily personal experience of selfishness on an often Mind-Boggling scale,whereby the basic traits of human nature take precedence and regard for other peoples requirements or entitlements count for nothing.

In approximately 70% of these contentious space-hogging cases the non-conformist will be a "Senior",and will simply ignore any and all attempts to dislodge them from their chosen location.

This approach,sadly,is usually successful,as most Busdrivers,do not have any interest in being hauled up before their Manager on foot of a complaint from some other passenger/observer who heard/saw a fraction of the full incident.

The one major benefit of the double-door GT class,which is now beginning to percolate down is that the Luggage Rail Clamper can be actively and positively discommoded by insisting on their using the Centre Door to Exit,a process usually resulting in much muttering,grumbling and accusations of ill-intent.

This is one issue where Passengers themselves can play a big part in helping things along.

I have one regular gentleman who sits downstairs and monitors the loading situation,loudly telling people that there are seats available and not to be blocking the aisle etc etc....It's quite instructional to see the difference in response to a similar request made by the Driver.....;)

It IS a signficant issue,and a worsening one,which at a guess I'd estimate is resulting in c.5% of our Cross-City Peak Capacity being unutilized.

My suggestion to peak-time passengers is to always glance at the upper saloon and try to assess it's loading as the Bus approaches and DON'T be afraid to inform the Driver AND those passengers loitering about the stairs of this !!.

Time to get Germanic about it !!! :eek:

Daemonic · 01-10-2013 1:27pm

I'm not sure if it was made official policy not to stop unless the driver feels they can allow everyone waiting to board, but I have noticed that change in the last few years. Having seen the abuse when they had to turn people away, I can't say I blame them.
It should also be mentioned, I've been on a bus a few times that drove straight past a stop with a large crowd waiting because the bus could only handle a few more but as soon as we came to a stop where the number waiting matched the remaining capacity, the driver stopped to allow people on.

LXFlyer · 01-10-2013 1:40pm

n97 mini wrote: »

239 was an example of a bus with 2 hour gaps in the timetable, to illustrate how flippant a comment like "get the next bus" can be.

A city bus route with a 2 hour gap in service is unlikely to be one that is full - if it was the frequency would be increased to match demand.

n97 mini · 01-10-2013 1:49pm

Again: less frequent buses can be full. "Get the next bus" is flippant. Also OP never said it was a city bus.

Vic_08 · 01-10-2013 3:12pm

n97 mini wrote: »

Again: less frequent buses can be full. "Get the next bus" is flippant.

Then what do you suggest is said?

Fact is that if the bus is full then waiting for the next one is the only option a driver can offer. That is equally true for a 2 minute wait or a 2 hour wait.

Daemonic · 01-10-2013 3:12pm

n97 mini wrote: »

Again: less frequent buses can be full. "Get the next bus" is flippant. Also OP never said it was a city bus.

Only buses I see with a "Bus Full" on the route display are BE so most likely not DB.

n97 mini · 01-10-2013 3:49pm

Vic_08 wrote: »

Then what do you suggest is said?

Fact is that if the bus is full then waiting for the next one is the only option a driver can offer. That is equally true for a 2 minute wait or a 2 hour wait.

Or it might be an overnight wait.

I would suggest not frivolously saying anything until the facts are established.

GTE · 01-10-2013 5:16pm

n97 mini wrote: »

Or it might be an overnight wait.

I would suggest not frivolously saying anything until the facts are established.

I think this line of posting should be dropped as there is no real basis of logic for it. There could be one bus every year for all I care, it is not a flippant to say that the only course of action from a drivers point of view is to tell people wait for the next bus. Additionally, if that is not convenient, arrange a different method. Whatever happens though, make sure the company knows that there is a capacity issue.

N97, someone should not board or be given a chance to board a fully loaded vehicle. From what your posts suggest, you support vehicle overloading when there is a very infrequent service. An overloaded vehicle is not a function of bus frequency, a full bus is just a full bus. Not enough services? Deal with it. If we do it right, an extra service or bigger vehicle would at least be considered.

dowlingm · 01-10-2013 6:04pm

short of someone inventing a Harry Potter style magic bus, and taking into account various ways to get door donkeys and other idlers to move into available space, sometimes buses get full. If drivers were letting people on beyond the rated maximum capacity of the bus people here would be moaning about unsafe practices. Moving to a set down mode until the bus is safe to load more keeps the bus moving and prevents it being late at its terminus and thus for its return journey.

n97 mini · 01-10-2013 10:32pm

bbk wrote: »

N97, someone should not board or be given a chance to board a fully loaded vehicle. From what your posts suggest, you support vehicle overloading when there is a very infrequent service.

I suggested nothing of the sort. Read my posts again. I am of the opinion people should not make flippant remarks like "get the next bus" without knowing when the next bus is, where it is going, what the alternative options are etc.

0ph0rce0 · 01-10-2013 10:37pm

Those buses are never full, like someone said there are always seats upstairs.

Its the cúnts who stand downstairs and stay downstairs even when the driver tells them there are seats up there, go use them, they still refuse to listen and make the bus look like its full.

CúNTS

GTE · 01-10-2013 11:34pm

n97 mini wrote: »

I suggested nothing of the sort. Read my posts again. I am of the opinion people should not make flippant remarks like "get the next bus" without knowing when the next bus is, where it is going, what the alternative options are etc.

So what is your contribution to the conversation besides giving out about the suggestion that someone get alternative transport when the bus they initially planned is unsafe to travel in (overloaded if he/she gets on)?

Since waiting for the next bus is not something you support, what is your advice regarding:
A) What the driver should say to the person

What the person should do

Answer those and the post at least contribute to the thread instead of giving off about about a perfectly valid piece of advice. I do not see how it is not a serious suggestion or how it shows a disrespectful attitude towards the poor fellow who gets stuck.

Victor · 02-10-2013 1:24am

0ph0rce0 wrote: »

Those buses are never full, like someone said there are always seats upstairs.

Its the cúnts who stand downstairs and stay downstairs even when the driver tells them there are seats up there, go use them, they still refuse to listen and make the bus look like its full.

CúNTS

Tone it down

Moderator

02-10-2013 1:26pm

I remember a few months back waiting on a 16 northbound from beside the Rotunda hospital...

16 comes, drives straight past. Absolutely livid, I notice he's stopped in traffic ahead. Proceed to shout blue murder at him about the people left behind, only then notice the bus load of Spanish students blocking up the aisles. Felt rather sheepish.

I can understand, just wish he'd put up "bus full".

SandyfordGuy · 04-10-2013 8:07am

just saw some driver go crazy on the bus I am on which his many standing on the 7 when he refused to open middle doors..about ten got off the front doors and least a couple missed their stop expecting middle doors to open did not let anyone on the bu. Cue a polite question to let the passengers off as they expected middle doors to open driver sighs and passenger asks him why not.using them and he says they are not allowed to use them at all In a very aggressive tone

I woukd.complain but it's.pointless since this driver never uses the doors and there was always going to be a confrontation sooner or later. This is the kind of.driver we can do without.

devnull · 04-10-2013 9:25am

To be fair from a few friends who use the bus reguarly, I've heard that the middle doors are being used a bit more now than they were a few weeks back, but the fact this was on the 7 does not surprise me, when I was commuting to Ballsbridge for 18 months I often had run ins with drivers on there about their lack of customer care and customer service, although never experienced any problems getting the 4!

If it's safe to do so, the doors should be opened, and it's no wonder people will instinctively go to the front door when they see things like that. DB saying that they are not opening the middle doors because passengers are not going to them, is a poor excuse, ang neglects to mention the fact that actions by their drivers is encouraging that practice.

foggy_lad · 04-10-2013 9:42am

"If it is safe to do so" but the driver can just say it was not safe to suit his/her mood.

Losty Dublin · 04-10-2013 10:58am

devnull wrote: »

To be fair from a few friends who use the bus reguarly, I've heard that the middle doors are being used a bit more now than they were a few weeks back, but the fact this was on the 7 does not surprise me, when I was commuting to Ballsbridge for 18 months I often had run ins with drivers on there about their lack of customer care and customer service, although never experienced any problems getting the 4!

If it's safe to do so, the doors should be opened, and it's no wonder people will instinctively go to the front door when they see things like that. DB saying that they are not opening the middle doors because passengers are not going to them, is a poor excuse, ang neglects to mention the fact that actions by their drivers is encouraging that practice.

Most runs of the 7 that I've been on have seen the middle doors being used. Mind you, many of the the stops on the 7 around the D 4 and Merrion Road area are such that a driver knows his passengers can alight safely; not every route has this luxury.

devnull · 04-10-2013 12:21pm

I don't use the bus reguarly anymore, so I can't comment on a lot of experiences, I just comment when I traveled to Ballsbridge every day for around 18 months a year or two back, and I found the drivers on the 7 far less polite than their counterparts on the 4.

I've never disagreed that the doors shouldn't be opened when it is unsafe, but some drivers will refuse to open them at any stops, I walked down O'Connell Street only a few nights ago and saw two buses packed to the rafters during evening peak, one pulled up, people exited both doors, the second one, stopped in exactly the same place, didn't open them. That isn/t down to safety, that is down to drivers who simply won't use them.

lil5 · 04-10-2013 12:23pm

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Most runs of the 7 that I've been on have seen the middle doors being used. ...

I'd see the opposite on the 4/7 corridor ...

Early morning inbound to CC - around 7:00 - the centre door isn't used at all.

In the afternoon outbound - around 16:15 - the centre door is used by a few drivers or not at all. Seems to be purely depending on the driver as there is also no notable difference between the 4 or the 7.

Eponymous · 04-10-2013 4:53pm

AlekSmart wrote:

My suggestion to peak-time passengers is to always glance at the upper saloon and try to assess it's loading as the Bus approaches and DON'T be afraid to inform the Driver AND those passengers loitering about the stairs of this !!.

I tried this last weekend, and got abuse from the driver for my troubles. Not to worry though, a complaint has gone in, complete with a photo of the driver.

What annoyed me most was that if the downstairs of the bus was full, where on earth did he think the half dozen passengers who got off the bus came from?

Tickityboo · 04-10-2013 5:53pm

Eponymous wrote: »

I tried this last weekend, and got abuse from the driver for my troubles. Not to worry though, a complaint has gone in, complete with a photo of the driver.

What annoyed me most was that if the downstairs of the bus was full, where on earth did he think the half dozen passengers who got off the bus came from?

Bit over the top to take a photograph of the driver!!
Complain by all means but a photograph ffs.

hmmm · 04-10-2013 7:19pm

There's one excellent bus driver on my route driving a big tri axle who is always telling people as they get on (very politely) that there is seats upstairs. The extra 20 or so people he can get on his bus makes a massive difference at that time of hour. We need more drivers doing this and encouraging the gobdaws to stop hanging around downstairs.

PucaMama · 04-10-2013 7:29pm

hmmm wrote: »

There's one excellent bus driver on my route driving a big tri axle who is always telling people as they get on (very politely) that there is seats upstairs. The extra 20 or so people he can get on his bus makes a massive difference at that time of hour. We need more drivers doing this and encouraging the gobdaws to stop hanging around downstairs.

not everyone can make it upstairs.

Tickityboo · 04-10-2013 7:42pm

PucaMama wrote: »

not everyone can make it upstairs.

Nothing to stop them moving to the back of the bus!!

Gatling · 04-10-2013 7:42pm

PucaMama wrote: »

not everyone can make it upstairs.

Wheelchair users excused can't see why perfect able people can't walk a few steps ,

Its even worse trying to get off a bus with a buggy when lazy ignorant's refuses to move a few inches and force you to push through them ,

** full bus rant* while waiting on a bus in tallaght to day in the pissing rain with a child in a buggy bus pulls up too my stop had my hand out ,bus slows and pulls into the stop but doesn't actually stop instead driver holds 2 fingers up to say 2 buggys on board ,now I could clearly see the 2 buggy's in the bay both of which were empty driver then proceeds down the road next bus didn't arrive for 27 mins later ,
Would have been nice to actually get the choice to fold down my buggy ,

instead all I got was wet very wet

PucaMama · 04-10-2013 8:25pm

Gatling wrote: »

Wheelchair users excused can't see why perfect able people can't walk a few steps ,

Its even worse trying to get off a bus with a buggy when lazy ignorant's refuses to move a few inches and force you to push through them ,

** full bus rant* while waiting on a bus in tallaght to day in the pissing rain with a child in a buggy bus pulls up too my stop had my hand out ,bus slows and pulls into the stop but doesn't actually stop instead driver holds 2 fingers up to say 2 buggys on board ,now I could clearly see the 2 buggy's in the bay both of which were empty driver then proceeds down the road next bus didn't arrive for 27 mins later ,
Would have been nice to actually get the choice to fold down my buggy ,

instead all I got was wet very wet

not everyone thats not in a wheelchair is able for the stairs. i wouldnt go upstairs with my unstable knee.

hmmm · 04-10-2013 8:32pm

PucaMama wrote: »

not everyone thats not in a wheelchair is able for the stairs. i wouldnt go upstairs with my unstable knee.

No-one expects everyone to go upstairs. But there is no good reason for able bodied people to be blocking up the standing room downstairs and preventing others getting on the bus if there are seats upstairs.

LXFlyer · 04-10-2013 8:56pm

PucaMama wrote: »

not everyone thats not in a wheelchair is able for the stairs. i wouldnt go upstairs with my unstable knee.

No one would expect you to either.

However, there are a large number of people who simply don't bother to look upstairs out of sheer laziness and selfishness, and as a result people get left behind unnecessarily.

Joshycat · 04-10-2013 8:57pm

PucaMama wrote: »

not everyone thats not in a wheelchair is able for the stairs. i wouldnt go upstairs with my unstable knee.

Yes but the vast majority of people who aren't in wheelchairs can make it upstairs.It's very unlikely that every single person standing downstairs blocking the door has a medical disability

thomasj · 05-10-2013 1:58pm

I remember a year or two ago when I was on a bus, downstairs was packed but plenty of seats upstairs.

Anyway despite the driver highlighting that people wouldn't be able to get on because there was no room to move downstairs, people wouldn't go upstairs.

Anyway, it got to the stage that the driver turned off the engine and refused to move unless people went upstairs. That made such a huge difference in that half of people standing went up and it meant more people were able to get on.

Joshycat · 05-10-2013 5:53pm

thomasj wrote: »

I remember a year or two ago when I was on a bus, downstairs was packed but plenty of seats upstairs.

Anyway despite the driver highlighting that people wouldn't be able to get on because there was no room to move downstairs, people wouldn't go upstairs.

Anyway, it got to the stage that the driver turned off the engine and refused to move unless people went upstairs. That made such a huge difference in that half of people standing went up and it meant more people were able to get on.

Yes exactly!!! Why can't all drivers do this?This should also be done with mothers who refuse to fold up buggies for wheelchair users

Gatling · 05-10-2013 6:02pm

Joshycat wrote: »

Yes exactly!!! Why can't all drivers do this?This should also be done with mothers who refuse to fold up buggies for wheelchair users

Unfortunately thanks to court action taken by one such mother a few years back its now a case of first come first served ,
They can be asked to fold but are not obliged

Eponymous · 06-10-2013 9:41pm

Tickityboo wrote: »

Bit over the top to take a photograph of the driver!!
Complain by all means but a photograph ffs.

Wouldn't need to take a photo if the driver wasn't being a dick.

Losty Dublin · 06-10-2013 10:06pm

Eponymous wrote: »

Wouldn't need to take a photo if the driver wasn't being a dick.

What did he say to you in the line of "abuse"?

sdanseo · 07-10-2013 1:24am

n97 mini wrote: »

And what if there are 2 hour gaps in the timetable?

That's the sort of pointless route Network Direct was meant to eliminate.

Alas, this is Ireland.

n97 mini · 07-10-2013 9:39am

sdeire wrote: »

That's the sort of pointless route Network Direct was meant to eliminate.

Alas, this is Ireland.

Au contraire, no orbital routes through west Dublin apart from this half baked service. We need proper orbital routes.

Driver not stopping due to bus full.

Comments