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Faulty oven bought in Soundstore!

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  • 17-04-2015 10:52pm
    #1
    michael999999
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,771 ✭✭✭


    So I bought an oven in Soundstore in Tralee 16 months ago.

    My wife went to use it yesterday and it would not work. My neighbor is an electrician so he had a quick look at it, to check if there was power getting to it and there was.

    Rang Soundstore today, and they can't get someone to look at it till next Thursday. And want me to pay a 120 euro call out charge.

    What are my rights in this case?

    Can I just bring back the oven to the store and get them to fix it!


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    #2
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    Assuming that the oven was not misused, you have normal consumer rights. That means that they must repair it, replace it, or refund your money. No reasonable person would consider 16 months a reasonable product life for an oven.

    If delivery and fitting was part of the original deal, then they should deal with it where it is. If you collected it from them, then yes, you could be asked to bring it back to them for repair.


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    #3
    Dozer Dave
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 491 ✭✭Dozer Dave


    Most appliances only carry 12 months parts and labour warranty. This may be the case here. It may have a 2 year parts warranty. Check what your warranty says on your receipt/paperwork.


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    #4
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    Dozer Dave wrote: »
    Most appliances only carry 12 months parts and labour warranty. This may be the case here. It may have a 2 year parts warranty. Check what your warranty says on your receipt/paperwork.
    That's irrelevant. You are entitled to a reasonable product life: that's not a warranty issue.


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    #5
    bluemartin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 188 ✭✭bluemartin


    Is it not the same as a washing machine, many of the cheaper models only come with 12 month warranty and if they break down after that you have to pay full charges for repair, often its cheaper to throw it out and buy a new one


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    #6
    Dozer Dave
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 491 ✭✭Dozer Dave


    P. Breathnach wrote: »
    That's irrelevant. You are entitled to a reasonable product life: that's not a warranty issue.

    It is, the oven has failed within its warranty and labour is only a year he has to pay the labour. Parts will be free.
    Reasonable life is a thing of the past.


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    #7
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    Dozer Dave wrote: »
    It is, the oven has failed within its warranty and labour is only a year he has to pay the labour. Parts will be free.
    Reasonable life is a thing of the past.
    A manufacturer's warranty can not be used as a way for the retailer to avoid the consumer's statutory rights. See http://www.eccireland.ie/ecc-ireland-issues-advisory-on-consumer-warranties-and-statutory-rights/. Note in particular the following passage:
    Under Irish law, consumers have up to six years to seek redress for faulty or defective items
    Your statutory right is to claim against the retailer; a warranty is usually a claim against the manufacturer or distributor. See here for a summary: http://www.apple.com/ie/legal/statutory-warranty/.

    An oven typically costs several hundred euros. For that sort of money, you can reasonably expect that an item of domestic equipment in normal use should have a useful life of several years.


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    #8
    dudara
    Registered Users Posts: 33,519 ✭✭✭✭dudara


    Dozer Dave wrote: »
    It is, the oven has failed within its warranty and labour is only a year he has to pay the labour. Parts will be free.
    Reasonable life is a thing of the past.

    No it's not and I would advise consumers not to accept this line when it's trotted out by a retailer.

    Under Consumer Law you are entitled to expect a product to last a reasonable lifetime. For an oven, I would definitely assume multiple years.

    OP - assuming that there is no misuse on your part, you are entitled to seek a repair, replacement or refund. Any repair should be carried out in a reasonable timeframe. to be fair, within one week is reasonable enough IMO (but not longer).

    If the retailer refuses, I would write a registered letter to the store manager (and head office if applicable) stating that you would like the issue resolved within XX working days under the Sale of Goods act, or you will be commencing a Small Claims Court case.


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    #9
    slimjimmc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,787 ✭✭✭slimjimmc


    Dozer Dave wrote: »
    It is, the oven has failed within its warranty and labour is only a year he has to pay the labour. Parts will be free.
    Reasonable life is a thing of the past.
    Reasonable life is one of the fundamentals of consumer law in Ireland, UK and afaik some other jurisdictions. It is far from being a thing of the past.


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    #10
    Dozer Dave
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 491 ✭✭Dozer Dave


    slimjimmc wrote: »
    Reasonable life is one of the fundamentals of consumer law in Ireland, UK and afaik some other jurisdictions. It is far from being a thing of the past.

    What is reasonable life on a washing machine?


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    #11
    slimjimmc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,787 ✭✭✭slimjimmc


    Dozer Dave wrote: »
    What is reasonable life on a washing machine?
    Essentially the reasonable life of any thing is what a reasonable person would expect given the nature of the product, the purpose for which the product was sold and a variety of other factors including expected usage, price paid, claims made manufacturer/seller. There's no set number.

    I doubt your average punter would expect anything less than 5 years for a domestic washing machine or 10 years for an oven, imo.


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    #12
    hdowney
    Registered Users Posts: 12,921 ✭✭✭✭hdowney


    Dozer Dave wrote: »
    What is reasonable life on a washing machine?

    What does the reasonable life of a washing machine have to do with it?


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    #13
    delahuntv
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,532 ✭✭✭delahuntv


    The OP would need to find out what has gone wrong first. It could be that the element is gone and needs replacing - and I doubt that would be covered under warranty.

    Spundstore and others will charge a clal out fee even if its thought to be a warranty issue. Once the issue is found, then if a warranty or manufactiring fault issue, no charge would apply, but if its something like an element, then the charge would apply.

    Another thing to look at is to google the make and model of the ovena nd see if there are any regular problems.

    Also, what is not working? - Is it main oven only or oven and hob? - If main oven only, then probably element needs replacing and any domestic appliance repair person can do that (and a lot cheaper)


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    #14
    delahuntv
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,532 ✭✭✭delahuntv


    Dozer Dave wrote: »
    What is reasonable life on a washing machine?

    How many washes a day/week?


    Same with any appliance or even motors.

    How often is the cooker used, how many km does the car engine do.


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    #15
    antoinolachtnai
    Registered Users Posts: 9,773 ✭✭✭antoinolachtnai


    delahuntv wrote: »
    Spundstore and others will charge a clal out fee even if its thought to be a warranty issue. Once the issue is found, then if a warranty or manufactiring fault issue, no charge would apply, but if its something like an element, then the charge would apply.

    Since when is an oven element a consumable?

    One thing for the OP to check is the timer. The timers on ovens can be awkward buggers and it is worth looking up the instructions to make sure the timer is set properly so that the oven will work.


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    #16
    delahuntv
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,532 ✭✭✭delahuntv


    antoinolachtnai wrote: »
    Since when is an oven element a consumable?


    Elements wear out over time (I'm on my third element - but oven is now 10 year old. 16 months would be sooner than expected, but most manufacturers have a 2 year parts warranty and they are very easy to replace yourself.

    The oven's handbook will give all the warranty details.


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    #17
    michael999999
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,771 ✭✭✭michael999999


    Its the switch panel that went on it. Still waiting to hear from Sound store Tralee, as to what there going to do about it!


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    #18
    rock22
    Registered Users Posts: 1,547 ✭✭✭rock22


    delahuntv wrote: »
    Elements wear out over time (I'm on my third element - but oven is now 10 year old. 16 months would be sooner than expected, but most manufacturers have a 2 year parts warranty and they are very easy to replace yourself.

    The oven's handbook will give all the warranty details.

    As has been pointed out, the warranty is in addition to and not a restriction on the OP's consumer rights.

    Large domestic appliances are generally expected to have 8 yr life. The seller would need to explain why this expectation does not apply to this oven


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    #19
    delahuntv
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,532 ✭✭✭delahuntv


    rock22 wrote: »
    As has been pointed out, the warranty is in addition to and not a restriction on the OP's consumer rights.

    Large domestic appliances are generally expected to have 8 yr life. The seller would need to explain why this expectation does not apply to this oven

    d'oh - and sometimes the manufacturers warranty will cover items that would not normally be guaranteed and sometimes maufacturers warranty will give you a far better service.

    Hence, check the handbook. In many cases the maufacturer will have a number to call and they send out their own service person and do it all for free especially in first 2 years.

    btw- where do you get "generally expected to have 8 year life" I've never ever heard of that.

    As with any appliance, it will depend on use.


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    #20
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    delahuntv wrote: »
    d'oh - and sometimes the manufacturers warranty will cover items that would not normally be guaranteed
    It's unlikely that a manufacturer's warranty gives better cover that your rights under law.
    and sometimes maufacturers warranty will give you a far better service.
    That is true, because a good manufacturer or distributor has the right setup in terms of people familiar with the product, stocks of parts, and a wish to protect their reputation.
    Hence, check the handbook. In many cases the maufacturer will have a number to call and they send out their own service person and do it all for free especially in first 2 years.
    Worth looking into.
    btw- where do you get "generally expected to have 8 year life" I've never ever heard of that.

    As with any appliance, it will depend on use.
    I doubt if eight years is set down anywhere, but neither is any other time period. Personally, I think it is a fair suggestion as a starting point for discussion.


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    #21
    rock22
    Registered Users Posts: 1,547 ✭✭✭rock22


    delahuntv wrote: »
    d'oh -

    btw- where do you get "generally expected to have 8 year life" I've never ever heard of that.

    ....

    You need to read more - see these links for examples
    http://www.thisoldhouse.com/toh/article/0,,216991-4,00.html
    http://www.improvementcenter.com/appliances/when-is-your-older-appliance-over-the-hill.html


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    #22
    michael999999
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,771 ✭✭✭michael999999


    The Crown Rep finally called to replace the switch pack today, after weeks of having to chase and harry them to do it!

    I'd be slow enough to but anything from them again.


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    #23
    Gormal
    Registered Users Posts: 4,497 ✭✭✭Gormal


    michael999999 wrote: »
    The Crown Rep finally called to replace the switch pack today, after weeks of having to chase and harry them to do it!

    I'd be slow enough to but anything from them again.

    I hope they did that free of charge! You have the right under consumer law to get a refund, repair or replacement (your choice) free of charge if the item does not last for a resonable length of time.
    See ECC
    I know this because, I had a sony blu ray home cinema system fail on me at 18 months. I bought it online through a reputable site, came from France. Cost €280 new.
    I contacted the site and ended up having to get an engineers report (€30 which they said they would refund)in a format as stated by them, which they then said wasn't good enough. I got the ECC involved and let them deal with it after that.
    I then got an email to return the item (at no cost to me) with all the details. Stating I would get €250 refund (no breakdown). I forwarded this to the ECC, who queried it and ended up getting that plus the €30, so €280 altogether. :D
    Important to note that my item would have cost more to repair than worth, I asked straight away for a refund.


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    #24
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    Gormal wrote: »
    I hope they did that free of charge! You have the right under consumer law to get a refund, repair or replacement (your choice) free of charge if the item does not last for a resonable length of time.
    See ECC
    I know this because, I had a sony blu ray home cinema system fail on me at 18 months. I bought it online through a reputable site, came from France. Cost €280 new.
    I contacted the site and ended up having to get an engineers report (€30 which they said they would refund)in a format as stated by them, which they then said wasn't good enough. I got the ECC involved and let them deal with it after that.
    I then got an email to return the item (at no cost to me) with all the details. Stating I would get €250 refund (no breakdown). I forwarded this to the ECC, who queried it and ended up getting that plus the €30, so €280 altogether. :D
    Important to note that my item would have cost more to repair than worth, I asked straight away for a refund.

    Just for correctness: the repair, replace, refund is not your choice.


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    #25
    pleasant Co.
    Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 7,377 Mod ✭✭✭✭pleasant Co.


    Karson Steep Vine wrote: »
    Just for correctness: the repair, replace, refund is not your choice.

    ...and to expand on that, it's not the shops choice either, it's supposed to be a mutual agreement between both parties - that doesn't mean you can dig your heals in when a fair remedy is being offered though.


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    #26
    Gormal
    Registered Users Posts: 4,497 ✭✭✭Gormal


    Ok.

    Op should have had it repaired free of charge though, regardless.


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    #27
    dudara
    Registered Users Posts: 33,519 ✭✭✭✭dudara


    Gormal wrote: »
    Ok.

    Op should have had it repaired free of charge though, regardless.

    Yes, if it's a true fault and not due to any misuse or user damage.


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    #28
    michael999999
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,771 ✭✭✭michael999999


    Ya it was fixed free of charge last Tuesday.

    But only after up to 20 phone calls over 3 weeks, lots of promises from the candy Rep to call and then never show up.

    I still believe that the only reason it was finally fixed was by me calling into the store on the Saturday, speaking to the manager and informing him I would be back to the store with the oven on Tuesday evening if it wasn't fixed in the meantime!

    Remember that they knew that it was a faulty switchpack at fault from the start, so they knew it wasn't from misuse.


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