The sad thing about the election . .

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Carey?? Humility??

He threw in a snide dig about how anyone who lied in the last 3 weeks would be exposed before then acknowledging that that "didn't really happen" - if it didn't, why say it? And what about all FF's lies last time around?

As for the jobs - if a government actually requires them then the new government will be hiring.

Ah, the opposition apologist . . It doesnt actually matter what the opposition do in your eyes, you will just find something FF did and compare it as if it absolves them of blame . . For all the insults you gave to FF supporters for blindly following the party, you were advocating everybody to follow anybody but FF, which is an extension of the same ignorant principle that you protested against.

Carey was telling the truth (for once some might say). There were lies by the opposition parties, just because it was coming from a hypocrite doesnt make him wrong . . Some of the Sh*t spun by Lab and FG is ridiculous. Your insistance on justifying everything the opposition parties have done up to now by benchmarking it against the mistakes/damage of FF has been remarkably ignorant at best.

I dont support any party as they are all in need of radical reform. You are happy that that reform will simply involve them not being FF, well good luck with that . . A step up from what you consider to be the worlds worst party, in the history of life itself. Yes, you hate Crap, but you are satisfied with a step above crap. Congradulations, lower the bar enough and you will be easily pleased . . What is consistant is that oppositioon parties will do and say anything to get into power and once they get into power, they forget half their promises and get the same arrogance that your much hated FF have shown. I will be interested to see what kind of political reform we get from your beloved anybody but FF . . Odds are, very little, but sure thats enough for you .

murphaph wrote: »

Shame on Ireland. I'm one of those 30% who is still on the electoral register (Dublin West in my case) but who is denied the vote having left Ireland in 2009 to work abroad. I want to vote. I still pay some taxes in Ireland so I should have the vote, but I don't because if there's one thing the political class in Ireland fear above all else, it's the votes of those forced to emigrate.

A person who loses their job and then just goes on the dole and stays on it gets a vote. Why can't someone whose lost their job and gone abroad so as not to be a burden on the state have one?!

My mum didnt vote as she has been in hospital for the last two weeks after 2 operations!

Of course certain people have good reason not to vote (living abroad and not feeling like you should have a say on the oncoming economic austerity measures is a very good reason), but most people do not . . "I dont know who to vote for ", well vote and spoil your vote. If everybody who didnt know who to vote for at least voted and spoiled it , parties would want to get these votes and find out what they can do to convince these voters to vote for them.

What is absolute is that if you dont vote, you dont have a say in who leads the country . .

Laminations wrote: »

I'll have to reinterpret all your previous 'pleas' using this new source for possible bias.

I have no tears for people who'll lose their jobs trying to foist the policies of FF on this country. It you stuck it out with FF it tells me your standards. Plus its the nature of politics related jobs, they cant last forever. I'd be more concerned about the hundreds of thousands who lost their jobs as a result of FF policies.

Yes, people who took jobs with FF should be lashed aswell . . Ah Empathy, a long lost quality in so many people . .

People who are absolute in their beliefs are often just ignorant/uneducated to the variables surrounding a topic and the damage they can do is far worse then those willing to debate . . People like this are doing the same kind of damage that they say FF did during the boom. FF were abosolute in their belief that the bubble should rise. They were absolute (and ignorant) in their belief that nobody else was right and they were absolute that there was nothing to debate in terms of what they thought was fact. . Sound familiar ?

Yes, I am absolutely sure that the same ignorance shown by FF during the Bertie years is being show by people on boards who are incapable of debating with anybody who thinks something to the contrary to their beliefs.

Liam Byrne wrote: »

@Drumpot : you make it sound like ABFF is an unjustified, uninformed default position.

As everyone knows, it's not.

It's simply an objection to corruption and incompetence on a scale never before seen in this country.

And since that's what FF's whip represents, there's no point in even voting for a good FF candidate, if such a thing exists (which I presume they do, but I just don't know any, only being familiar with the local ones and the ministers)

So my stance is purely logical.

Peter Power was on a few moments ago deluded enough to explain the result as "people wanted change after 14 years", as if FF hadn't screwed up colossally; THAT is the problem that FF needs to sort out - they cannot see the truth, and like an alcoholic, the first step is to admit the facts.

Everybody knows its a justifiable, logical stance ? You can speak for yourself thank you very much. I know many people who are rightly angry with FF. Hell, I am disgusted and dissalusioned with the decisions they have taken, but that doesnt mean I cant look at all the variables involved and at least try to be objective (then simply dismissive and judgemental).

If a quarter of the police are on the take, does it mean the whole police force is corrupt ? No, it means there is a significant amount of corruption in police. If you really think every FF member and politician represented corruption you are very ill informed. Of course you would hope that the good cops would root out and discourage the bad cops, but I wouldnt say they should all be sacked because they didnt do enough to clamp down on it !

Your attitude is similar to that of "you are either with or against me" in that you cannot properly debate the flaws in your logic. You think that either you are with FF or against them. I dont support any party. I voted independant but will honestly say I would of voted for Thomas Byrne had he been in my area. I know him well (only from when I was one of his constituants, nothing else) and found him more honest and approachable then the other politicians in other parties. When I was speaking to him once and mentioned a social welfare query, he gave me some advice but said he did not want to get involved (which I applaud), but the others were making ridiculous statements/promises and unable to discuss their parties policies in more debth.

Other partys do have the same kind of politicians you protest that you hate. I saw some of them in my constituancy, but I didnt think I wouldnt vote for their party because they only represent a portion of their party. I also didnt tell all my friends "dont vote for labour cause my candidate is a chancer" . .

FF have been in power too long and the people at the top of the FF ladder were the ones who did 99% of the damage and cronyist action (because they were in a position to do so). . You can bet that backbenchers were the ones on the ground trying to implement change. While you would say that they should of just quit FF, that is too easy a position to take. If you support a party (I dont understand it personally), I imagine that its like supporting a team. If your team do well, you dont abandon them, you try to fix them, make them better.

While I feel many party members have been harshly treated (I know in Meath East, the bigwigs in FF tried to force candidates on their members who nearly revolted), they need to start standing up to their leaders. What has happened is that politicians in all parties have grown accustomed to telling their members how things will role when it should be the other way around. If there is one criticism I would certainly give to FF supporters , its that you never held your own people accountable for letting the people of Ireland down. .

As for my sister, she did a job, shame on anybody for accusing her of propaganda. There are similar people in Lab/Fg doing the exact same job and nobody is stupid enough to think that they do any differant a job at messaging the truths of these parties. People need to stop thinking that wrong practises in FG/Lab are ok because they are not FF, its just ridiculous for me to even have to say this. .

I will support a party that puts the country ahead of its own personal gain . . It might be a time before I will be voting for a party (as opposed to candidate). .

the bolt wrote: »

dont know about republicans but i know what you mean

Shhhh .. Your not suggesting the world is perfect now that FF are gone are you ? :eek:

kbannon wrote: »

Under FF "governance" we have now got a huge number of unemployed and the reliance on at least 1,000 to emigrate each week so that their financial forecasts work out.
In the last two years we have seen very little productive efforts from FF in terms of job creation. Christ, Mary Coughlan was assigned this role only to have the likes of Michael Dell refuse to even see her.
And I should feel sorry for some FF spin doctors?

I saw no humility and don't recall seeing any humility from a FF member in a long liong time.
Anyhow, how much will they get?

If you sleep with dogs then you catch fleas. If they were honourable politicians with integrity then they wouldn't have stood by and endorsed the mess their party have created for us all.

I agree. A leopard doesn't change their spots that easily.

Don't assume that it is down to apathy.
How much of the 30% is down to emigration?
How much is down to the fact that we still don't have a system that uses PPS numbers? Lots of people still are getting more than one ballot paper. There was a report during the week of a baby receiving their card.
True but what we have now is a start. People are not going to endorse the corruption, cronyism, lies and economic recklessness that we have seen from FF.
What have you done to have the workings of FF changed then?
Firstly, a quarter of gardai are on the take? Have you any form of source for this?
Secondly, how many members of FF stood up and said that enough is enough with regard to the corruption?
Well its been said on air by a number of FF TDs in the past that they and FF come before the country. Its probably the same for FG and Lab but they have the tact not to tell everyone.

You have to understand humility to recognise it. Congradulating the victors is humble.

I didnt ask you to feel sorry for anybody. Empathy is something people just have, you dont have to ask for it. You can tell the kind of person somebody is when they think they need to be asked to feel sorry for somebody . .

Since you struggle to understand the principle of my policy, I am saying everybody who can vote, should vote. If you live abroad and feel you have nothing to contribute , you should cancel your registry. If you have a good reason for not being able to vote, then fair enough, but most people just dont bother.

I never said a quarter of police were corrupt. Once again I have to ask you to understand a post before replying will ill informed waffle.

In terms of who in FF stood up to the corruption, you are correct but this is a problem with the political culture within politics. How long did Labour wait to call no confidence in JOD ? And at that they didnt even want to.

Its remarkable how people think that all FFrs are hateful people when nearly all TDs from all parties get on . . Why ? Because they work in the same environment and know the hypocracy of ill informed attitudes/opinions like yours. Obviously voting in an alternative to FF simply because you hate them is kind of pointless if the very people you vote in, will engage and actually get on with the same people you dispise . .

If you are looking for everybody to be accountable , you need look no further then the many Labour and FG councellors that rezoned land for development that had as much to do with the bubble (Im sure some got a few quid in their back pockets) as anything else. Dont let the door hit you on the way out of your glasshouse . .