The most and least Gaelic counties?

There was a bbc documentary years back called blood of the vikings where they wanted to establish what was genetically the most viking place in Britain.
For this they needed a comparison population, somewhere where they thought had the least amount of incursions by foreigners over history, the most genetically unchanged/ inbred.
They picked castlerea co roscommon.

Well at a minimum 75-80% of population have "native" (eg. Gaelic) surnames. But I think you be hard pressed to find someone who doesn't have a Cambro-Norman surname somewhere in their tree. Likewise for someone bearing a Cambro-Norman or "New English" surname will have countless ancestors bearing "native" surnames. It's worth bearing out of course the Cambro-Norman barons tended to be marrying Irish nobility within the first 2-3 generations in Ireland. Thence their adaption of native Irish customs on marriage, inheritance, language etc.

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Catholic landholders were quite a small grouping, the thing people keep forgetting is that the actual peasants weren't forced off the land. It was land holders who often held several thousand acres (eg. "Captain of their nation")

You also have to remember that certain people regained land holdings during the restoration. One of more interesting affects of this period the fact that the O'Flaherty's lost their land holding (which they had held for over 500 years) due to duplicity of the Martin family, basically swindling Roderick O'Flaherty (one of most important authors/scholars of 17th century) out of their patrimony.

deadlybuzzman wrote: »

There was a bbc documentary years back called blood of the vikings where they wanted to establish what was genetically the most viking place in Britain.
For this they needed a comparison population, somewhere where they thought had the least amount of incursions by foreigners over history, the most genetically unchanged/ inbred.
They picked castlerea co roscommon.

I was led to believe that it was generally agreed years ago that the population of the Orkney Islands was the part of the British Isles least affected by incursive genetic material.

tac

tac foley wrote: »

I was led to believe that it was generally agreed years ago that the population of the Orkney Islands was the part of the British Isles least affected by incursive genetic material.

tac

Generally agreed by who? The Orkneys were subject to a large migration of Norse settlers in the Viking era. If anything it's one of the prime candidates to be most affected by "non-native" genetic material.

tac foley wrote: »

Let me just re-phrase that slightly - 'SINCE the incursion of Norse settlers...'

tac

Well that makes absolutely no sense in relation to the post you quoted.

Jesus. wrote: »

Humour will not be tolerated on this Board :rolleyes:

Nor will questioning a moderator's direction, last time I looked it carried a 2 week "tarriff"

robp wrote: »

I don't know specifically the evidence for this but just a point of information on the surnames. Joyce is long associated with Connaught. Power is probably French and is so widespread in the south east I don't think it could be associated with any one class. Dukes in Ireland might be Anglicized Gaelic name but the others seem pretty English.

I'd agree, if anything in Connacht alot of the travellers surnames are native to Connacht but do reflect major land holding families up until the 17th century. So for example the Ward's of Ballymacward were heridetary poetic families to the "Kingdom of Uí Maine". McDonagh's and Connors obviously point to major families of the Uí Briúin Aí, Joyce and Barrett obviously been major landholding families of "Old English" background.

pedroeibar1 wrote: »

I’ve never queried it Dubhthach, and I’ve no proof to back it up, but it’s always been at the back of my mind that the Irish population was comparatively (e.g. to England/Cont. Europe) static. There was some disruption at the Cromwellian resettlement* and again at the Famine, but the main mobility catalyst of Industrial Revolution largely passed us by. Hence the odds are that a McNamara is from Clare, an O’Sullivan from Cork/Kerry and an O’Reilly from Cavan.

*In her transplanter's certificate, dated 19th December, 1653, Lady Castleconnell is described as "adged 70 years, middle statue, flaxen hair. Her substance 20 cows, 20 sheep, 10 mares and garrans, and two riding nags ; four sows, and six acres of winter corn, out of which she pays contribution," also, "27 servants and retainers."

Sure, not on the scale of what we see in other countries that's for sure, and it's more something that's reflective of last 150 years (particulary 90 years since independence) where we've seen migration into Greater Dublin region.

But even with names such as McNamara which have only arisen once you find people bearing them in Belfast in 1901 census, it's long way from Clare

Irish Times surname page is quite useful as it plots data using Griffith survey's, in case of Reilly unsurprising there is huge concentration within the former Kingdom of Bréifine (they were after all Lords of East Bréifne after their little "civil war" with the O'Rourkes), still even by 1850's we are seeing a major spread of surname all over the country. Up until the destruction of O'Reilly lordship (250 years prior) it would have been considerably more compact I'd imagine



Of course there is a case that with certain surnames you have multiple independent occurrences, so for example O'Neill (4x), Duffy (3-4x), O'Connor (6x), O'Carroll (6x plus McCarroll), McMahon (2 x), McManus (2 x), Murphy (4-6x), Kelly (10-12x !!!)

What helps here is large scale Y-DNA sampling which can help spilt out origins of specific branches. So for example it's very easy to tell a Connacht McManus (branch of O'Conor family) from a Fermanagh McManus (branch of the Maguires) based on Y-DNA test, same goes for McMahon of Oirialla (Oriel eg. Monaghan) or Murphy of Leinster (Mac Murchadha/Ó Murchadha)

Reilly's unsurprising are showing up in genetic cluster with other Connachta/Uí Briúin surnames which ties in with genealogical sources.

Well Arthur Young writing in 1770's had it that no traces of Irish were to be found in Forth and Bargy, which makes sense given the presence of Yola which derives from Middle English.
In general the "more irish than the Irish" implies heavy intermarriage with the Irish aristocracy, this can be seen in extreme form with the Burkes of Connacht who other than regarding themselves as "Gall" due to their male lineage were culturally entirely Gaelic, and nearly always married women of major Gaelic families (O'Malley, O'Flaherty, O'Conor, O'Kelly etc.)

The last native speakers of Irish in Wexford died in late 19th/early 20th century up by Bunclody in the north.