Pre-pay pumps soon to be norm.

mfceiling · 18-08-2012 9:58am

But this is Ireland and paddy doesn't like change...

Fill her up and give us a lucozade and 20 players.

How much fuel sir?

Ah sure whatever she takes.

Sir I need an amount.

Sure Jesus I don't know how thirsty she is.

Queue is now outside the shop while paddy lies across the counter arguing with some poor Lithuanian young one!!

The Pontiac · 18-08-2012 10:50am

kuro2k wrote: »

Did the price of petrol/diesel in these Cork stations drop after the change over to pre-paid? AFAIK the rochestown road station was alway one of the most expensive in the city..

Just curious if the change in payment condition is reflect in the current price, prepaid should mean cheap...........

The one in Little Island was always expensive, before and after pre-pay.

Just head a half a mile down the road in Glounthaune for cheaper fuel.

Jogathon · 18-08-2012 10:55am

I use a prepay, unmanned pump and its great. Your card is pre-authorised for a certain amount but you fill up the amount that you want or can fit in. You are only charged for the amound dispensed.

sandin · 18-08-2012 11:12am

AltAccount wrote: »

I'm unsure how one station going pre-pay = "becoming the norm"...

because this time its some of the busiest stations that are doing it and the software is there to pre auth a card and fill up, sell by litres and sell by amount.

The manager in brennans said the industry expects to be primarily prepaid within 12 months.

If the scum stopped doing driveaways, there'd be no issue. But the only way to stop that is prepaying.

deandean · 18-08-2012 7:31pm

Well I heard from a source in the retail trade about the reason the pay-at-pump-with-credit-card systems have not taken off here: - the few that were intalled have been disabled - is that retailers were losing too much add-on business, i.e. you go in to pay and come out with a coffee, crisps, lotto ticket, etc etc

Bandara · 18-08-2012 7:40pm

Untrue, stations are simply not going to be moving to PrePay

The odd motorway place may introduce it on some pumps for evening times, high speed pumps etc

Normal garages won't, we'd be out of business in a few months (at best).

I would estimate that my profits would drop by about 40% immediately. And things are shockingly bad as it is in the business.

Damien360 · 18-08-2012 7:54pm

I would love to know the number of driveaways this garage in Newbridge gets. It is my local garage and it is spotlessly clean, fuel price is reasonable compared to the rest in the town. His CCTV is on view in the store and is high quality.

Looking at the pictures of his pumps, they are equally good quality. That should make prosecution easier. Is there a policy with garages not to chase this due to court costs. Surely it is just a garda issue of stealing and no court costs for the business. Lots of scumbags in Newbridge, putting a picture of those that rob him up in a public place would help surely. Are we looking at this getting ignored by gardai as it may not be seen as a serious crime ?

Bandara · 18-08-2012 10:04pm

Damien360 wrote: »

I would love to know the number of driveaways this garage in Newbridge gets. It is my local garage and it is spotlessly clean, fuel price is reasonable compared to the rest in the town. His CCTV is on view in the store and is high quality.

Looking at the pictures of his pumps, they are equally good quality. That should make prosecution easier. Is there a policy with garages not to chase this due to court costs. Surely it is just a garda issue of stealing and no court costs for the business. Lots of scumbags in Newbridge, putting a picture of those that rob him up in a public place would help surely. Are we looking at this getting ignored by gardai as it may not be seen as a serious crime ?

I've reported approx, 60+ this year, all with crystal clear footage, most with reg plates visable etc etc

I've heard back from the police a total of three times. And have not got one single euro back. I'm down just shy of €4500.

I've a lot of respect for the police but they do not seem to have any real interest in following up at all. They tell me that it's very valuable to them as a route to regular criminals, but they in my opinion do not respect the fact that we are being hit very hard.

There would be an equal amount that I do not even report for various reasons.

Re: putting up pictures of the offenders, it's a risky area, what are you claiming by putting them up? They have not been found guilty of anything. You could be dealing with very violent people who are capable of attacking your staff to remove the photo (I know of incidents of photos being torn down). The police don't like it either, it makes them look bad.

Damien360 · 18-08-2012 10:20pm

Hammertime wrote: »

I've heard back from the police a total of three times. And have not got one single euro back. I'm down just shy of €4500.

I've a lot of respect for the police but they do not seem to have any real interest in following up at all. They tell me that it's very valuable to them as a route to regular criminals, but they in my opinion do not respect the fact that we are being hit very hard.

This is a bit like the stuff taken off the back of a truck and the strange idea that nobody is getting hit for it. "Sure is'nt that what you have insurance for ! " . Far too much petty crime ignored everywhere.

AltAccount · 18-08-2012 10:20pm

sandin wrote: »

because this time its some of the busiest stations that are doing it...

Like who?

Pottler · 18-08-2012 10:49pm

Hammertime wrote: »

I've reported approx, 60+ this year, all with crystal clear footage, most with reg plates visable etc etc

I've heard back from the police a total of three times. And have not got one single euro back. I'm down just shy of €4500.

I've a lot of respect for the police but they do not seem to have any real interest in following up at all. They tell me that it's very valuable to them as a route to regular criminals, but they in my opinion do not respect the fact that we are being hit very hard.

There would be an equal amount that I do not even report for various reasons.

Re: putting up pictures of the offenders, it's a risky area, what are you claiming by putting them up? They have not been found guilty of anything. You could be dealing with very violent people who are capable of attacking your staff to remove the photo (I know of incidents of photos being torn down). The police don't like it either, it makes them look bad.

I was in a ss this morning at 6.45, someone did a drive-off for €280.00! 6.45am. The girl at the till shrugged and said "there's the first". I asked here what was the story with that and she replied that it was happening all day every day there. The losses must be very substantial. Oh and barriers won't work. We fix every sort going - they are muppet magnets and get driven into on a continual basis even with a security guard in a hut watching them, they still get ploughed out of it on a regular basis.

Mint Sauce · 18-08-2012 10:58pm

New unmanned* 24hr station in Sligo on the Bundoran Rd, on the site of Hendersons Ford Garage, card payments only. I assume the card activates the pumps, not sure how it works after that.

*there is someone there currently during certain hrs, but only to advice on operation.

lau1247 · 19-08-2012 9:52am

Pottler wrote: »

I was in a ss this morning at 6.45, someone did a drive-off for €280.00! 6.45am. The girl at the till shrugged and said "there's the first". I asked here what was the story with that and she replied that it was happening all day every day there. The losses must be very substantial. Oh and barriers won't work. We fix every sort going - they are muppet magnets and get driven into on a continual basis even with a security guard in a hut watching them, they still get ploughed out of it on a regular basis.

metal bollards as I suggested. Problem solved

Eggonyerface · 19-08-2012 10:15am

The maxol in Artane is gone fully prepay the last few months but its still dearer or the same as the others around. A prepay garage would have to be cheaper for me to bother.

On the other hand I go out of my way to use the pay at pump stations like tesco in Clare hall and finglas and the one up near the airport. Its much easier, especially if you've kids in tow

Bandara · 19-08-2012 10:56am

Pottler wrote: »

I was in a ss this morning at 6.45, someone did a drive-off for €280.00! 6.45am. The girl at the till shrugged and said "there's the first". I asked here what was the story with that and she replied that it was happening all day every day there. The losses must be very substantial. Oh and barriers won't work. We fix every sort going - they are muppet magnets and get driven into on a continual basis even with a security guard in a hut watching them, they still get ploughed out of it on a regular basis.

That's the staff members fault, it's unimaginable that the till operator would stand there for the 4-5 minutes that it take to fill that amount and not think something is amiss, it would be rare enough to get fills over a 100 these days.

The person needs to be removed from the job

edward1988 · 01-09-2012 1:07am

Brennan's Maxol Mace has gone prepay i was in there today, don't see the problem with this system you cant blame them for changing to prepay, the profit margin on fuel is so low at the moment that if you have a couple of drive offs a day and this is the case in this garage your profit is gone! This system will not effect those those who no what amount(10 20 50) they want to put in their car the problem is when you want to fill up which is what i do once a week, but if that is your biggest problem all week your doing well!! its simple find out what the capacity of ur fuel tank is and do a bit of maths on your phone.....once a week not really a big deal and this garage is nearly always the cheapest around!! Today i paid for 100euro diesel but could only fit 97euro so i just went back in they scanned the receipt and returned me my 3euro!

paddy147 · 01-09-2012 1:24am

The Maxol beside Artane Castle is pre pay for a few months now.

They have had some serious amount of "bilkings"..so they changed to pre pay only.

Trouble is that half the pumps dont work and are allways locked to the pump machine.

Maxol really need to fix the pumps there and sort out that petrol station once and for all,as there are more broken pumps than working pumps there.

Been that way for quite a while too.

Chriscl1 · 01-09-2012 7:34am

edward1988 wrote: »

Brennan's Maxol Mace has gone prepay i was in there today, don't see the problem with this system you cant blame them for changing to prepay, the profit margin on fuel is so low at the moment that if you have a couple of drive offs a day and this is the case in this garage your profit is gone! This system will not effect those those who no what amount(10 20 50) they want to put in their car the problem is when you want to fill up which is what i do once a week, but if that is your biggest problem all week your doing well!! its simple find out what the capacity of ur fuel tank is and do a bit of maths on your phone.....once a week not really a big deal and this garage is nearly always the cheapest around!! Today i paid for 100euro diesel but could only fit 97euro so i just went back in they scanned the receipt and returned me my 3euro!

The ones I used in Wales you pre authorise your card in the pump then you can put whatever amount you need in and it totals up after you replace the hand pump, much better I reckon especially if your doing a full tank.

harr · 01-09-2012 7:58am

Our local garage has the pumps furthest away from the shop pre-pay,there was a few people giving out at first but people have got used to it,go to till or hatch tell how much you want and the pump stops at that amount.
Girl at till was telling me that drive offs have gone from 7 or 8 a week to less than two a month without any loss of custom.

Eggonyerface · 01-09-2012 8:24am

paddy147 wrote: »

The Maxol beside Artane Castle is pre pay for a few months now.

They have had some serious amount of "bilkings"..so they changed to pre pay only.

Trouble is that half the pumps dont work and are allways locked to the pump machine.

Maxol really need to fix the pumps there and sort out that petrol station once and for all,as there are more broken pumps than working pumps there.

Been that way for quite a while too.

Its usually the most expensive in the area too

sandin · 01-09-2012 7:14pm

AltAccount wrote: »

Like who?

Brennans in newbridge have commenced it today. - They are one of the busiest stations in the country. I hear MCL & Fraser in Newbridge are following suit.

You can't blame them as drive offs are costing some stations over 1k every single week. It was also one of the reasons given for losses in the recent examinership of 3 Topaz stations (Newbridge, Athy & Ashford).

Pedro K · 02-09-2012 1:43am

Hammertime wrote: »

Pottler wrote: »

I was in a ss this morning at 6.45, someone did a drive-off for €280.00! 6.45am. The girl at the till shrugged and said "there's the first". I asked here what was the story with that and she replied that it was happening all day every day there. The losses must be very substantial. Oh and barriers won't work. We fix every sort going - they are muppet magnets and get driven into on a continual basis even with a security guard in a hut watching them, they still get ploughed out of it on a regular basis.

That's the staff members fault, it's unimaginable that the till operator would stand there for the 4-5 minutes that it take to fill that amount and not think something is amiss, it would be rare enough to get fills over a 100 these days.

The person needs to be removed from the job

Sure there's nothing she could have done is there? Maybe cut the pump off after a while? I don't know.

Would it not be harsh to fire her because some other arsehole stole their petrol? I think so.

avalon68 · 02-09-2012 2:22am

Why can't they just bring in the machines where you swipe credit or debit card? Drives me insane when I'm back in ireland having to go inside to pay. Worse still, when people disappear into the shop for 10 min while parked at the pump! So much faster here in the states. And while theyre at it, allow the auto fill thing so you don't have to stand there like an eejit holding the lever!

Wise Old Elf · 03-09-2012 10:29am

avalon68 wrote: »

Why can't they just bring in the machines where you swipe credit or debit card? Drives me insane when I'm back in ireland having to go inside to pay. Worse still, when people disappear into the shop for 10 min while parked at the pump! So much faster here in the states. And while theyre at it, allow the auto fill thing so you don't have to stand there like an eejit holding the lever!

Was in the previously mentioned Maxol in Newbridge yesterday and they had just started the pre-pay. I was chatting to the owner/manager on the forecourt, he was out there helping people and explaining what was going on. He said they were losing at least €200 a day with drive offs.
Interestingly enough, he also said that the most hassle and abuse he got about pre-pay was from "older folk", younger drivers just shrugged and got on with it.
I asked him about the pre-pay credit machines, it's been said here before, and it was his point that the margin in petrol/diesel is so poor that they want you to go in to the shop and pick up the can of coke or sliced pan or whatever to boost sales.

furtzy · 03-09-2012 10:42am

My post from another thread on the matter:

Used the Great Gas automated station on the N2 a while back. never again. Needed to fill my car so choose the €110 max option. Filled up the car which came to around €90 or so. The next day my account showed 2 transactions..one for the €110 and another for the €90. Rang them and they explained they block €110 off your card until the actual petrol amount comes through and then release the €110 back to your account. Problem is they are with a different bank than me so the whole process takes 3 days so I was down €110 for the 3 days. :mad:

Our man in Havana · 03-09-2012 12:26pm

That is not their fault, that is the banking system to blame.

dahamsta · 03-09-2012 12:39pm

I think there's at least one station owner here, perhaps they can explain what steps they take when a drive-off happens? It strikes me as a pretty open and shut example of theft, with evidence, are the Gardaí refusing to deal with them? (I understand that they can be dismissive of so-called "petty theft", but if it's happening that often to you, then it's not really petty.) I presume there's some kind of association of station owners, what are they doing about it?

I have no problem with prepay if I can pay at the the pump, in fact I'd prefer it. If you make me go to the counter, I'll buy my petrol elsewhere. I accept that petrol is a small part of your business, but that's your problem, not mine. There's a lot of ye out there, make some noise.

harr · 03-09-2012 12:47pm

I have a friend who runs a small station in the west and he gets 2 or 3 drive offs a week, false number plate on car or even a bit on tape over a letter or number and he has no hope of getting his money back as with most places it takes the guards 20-30 minutes to get there and by that stage they are miles away with different reg on the car.
So the chances of ever getting your cash is slim and even if they are caught the guards are happy for them just to pay the money back rather proceed with a court case for the sake of 40 euros worth of fuel.
These type of crimes are not very high on the guards list of priorities it would seem.

dahamsta · 03-09-2012 12:50pm

Perhaps it's time to put someone back on the forecourts, at least temporarily, to watch for potential drive-offs.

Yakuza · 03-09-2012 1:24pm

I used one in a Carrefour (shopping centre chain) in Spain - you tell it how much you want (€10, €20, €40 or "llena el tanque"(two guesses what that means

)), swipe your card and enter the pin at the pump, only then does the petrol flow. Once the limit is reached (well, in my case I went for a fill, so once I put the nozzle back in the holder) the pump stops and a receipt is issued from the pump. There was no-one at the station and I had to walk all of two steps from the door to the petrol cap and back again. Simples. Will it happen in Ireland on a widespread basis? - pfft.

sandin · 03-09-2012 2:08pm

dahamsta wrote: »

I think there's at least one station owner here, perhaps they can explain what steps they take when a drive-off happens? It strikes me as a pretty open and shut example of theft, with evidence, are the Gardaí refusing to deal with them? (I understand that they can be dismissive of so-called "petty theft", but if it's happening that often to you, then it's not really petty.) I presume there's some kind of association of station owners, what are they doing about it?

I have no problem with prepay if I can pay at the the pump, in fact I'd prefer it. If you make me go to the counter, I'll buy my petrol elsewhere. I accept that petrol is a small part of your business, but that's your problem, not mine. There's a lot of ye out there, make some noise.

I know someone that has 2 stations and its false number plates for the majority. Too easy to attach and then take off down the road.

as for your problem goin to the counter - you already are doing so, with prepay you simply go there first.

GarIT · 03-09-2012 2:11pm

Yakuza wrote: »

I used one in a Carrefour

They seem to be doing things right. I was in one in spain where you drove down a one lane sort of slip road, a bit like a McDonalds drive thru and then it widened out into a 6 pump wide 1 pump deep fourcourt, then it narrowed back to one lane where you have to go through something quite similar to the M50 toll plaza before the barriers were removed.

Just an idea for false number plates, should they not be painted on to make them difficult to change.

dahamsta · 03-09-2012 2:35pm

sandin wrote: »

I know someone that has 2 stations and its false number plates for the majority. Too easy to attach and then take off down the road.

I'd still like to hear what station owners have to say.

as for your problem goin to the counter - you already are doing so, with prepay you simply go there first.

Once. Not twice, and not with the risk of €100+ of my money not being available for several days.

fear le solas · 10-07-2015 3:57pm

There seems to be a lot of confusion about pre-pay and how it works.
It depends what type of pumps/system the station has, but most of the modern ones nowadays in Ireland operate the same way.

1) Pre-pay at the counter
Park at pump and then go to counter. You tell the sales assistant how much (€ or l)fuel you want. Then you fill. The pump will stop at your selection. Off ya go.

2) Pre-pay at the pump
Park at pump. Go to pre-pay machine. Enter card/selection etc. Then fill. The pump will stop at your selection. Off ya go.

3) Pay after
Park at pump. Start filling. Move your car to a more suitable spot if there is a queue. Pay inside/at the counter. Off ya go.

Pre-pay at pump details-
When you enter your (debit) card/selection etc..you are pre-authorising that amount from your account which is deducted immediately. If this transaction is authorised, say..€50 for example, the pump is now ready to dispense that exact amount. Then off ya go.

That is unless you decide to stop before your selection for whatever reason. In this case, a second transaction goes through to your bank for whatever amount you stopped at.. say..€44.
Now, both €50 and €44 will be deducted from your account (two transactions) but because you only ended up getting €44; this is all you will be charged for.
The €50 originally pre-authorised will remain as a pending transaction and will clear in your bank in a few days. This time depends on your bank, not the station you got the fuel. It's completely out of their hands.

Where it gets confusing is when a station has all three options, and 'cust1' tries to use the pre-pay machine to pay AFTER they fill fuel when they should be going to the counter to pay!!
All this does is sets up the machine for whatever they select i.e €20, now its ready to fill €20- so that's when 'cust2' drives up to the now empty pump and starts filling but it's already set up and paid for by the previous customer! 'Cust1' thinks they've paid the €20 (yes,they have pre-authorised €20 and it's been deducted but if it's not pumped,the €20 will clear in their account) and the sales assistant sees an awaiting payment message on the till, but nobody around to pay it cos 'cust1' drove off thinking they just paid €20! Then 'cust2' comes inside and asks why the pump stopped at €20 cos they wanted to fill the tank!
Do you follow?! ;p

That's when it gets deep..real deep..

The pre-pay machines ALWAYS have the instructions plastered all over them, probably along with more info printed out/laminated beside them so you can't go wrong...however..people seem to miss all these..but not the small sign in the corner that reads something about an upcoming price increase!!

Bottom line - RTFS !!

Have a nice day

Bio Mech · 10-07-2015 6:08pm

You got here just in time. I have been confused these last three years.

Special Circumstances · 10-07-2015 6:22pm

Money can be exchanged for goods and services?????

colm_mcm · 10-07-2015 6:43pm

Ah here....

Pre-pay pumps soon to be norm.

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