Did we vote against the World Cup?

Snickers Man · 13-09-2007 5:01pm #1

Is it true that Ireland and Scotland voted against holding a World Cup tournament in 1987? And if so, what were the reasons given?

I am looking for a factual response to this, not the usual "Because the IRFU are a bunch of old fart died in the wool amateurs"

Anybody got access to a historical tome that would confirm and/or explain this?

smashey · 13-09-2007 5:03pm

Snickers Man wrote:

Is it true that Ireland and Scotland voted against holding a World Cup tournament in 1987? And if so, what were the reasons given?

I am looking for a factual response to this, not the usual "Because the IRFU are a bunch of old fart died in the wool amateurs"
Anybody got access to a historical tome that would confirm and/or explain this?

I know it's not what you want to hear but you answered the Irish side of the question there. They feared it would lead to professionalism.

zAbbo · 13-09-2007 5:06pm

In the context they did what they thought was right I guess.

Sure look at the farcical situation at this years RWC, both Scotland & Wales got 'rewarded' with key fixtures in their backyard despite the World Cup taken place in a different country !

Absurd

Snickers Man · 13-09-2007 5:13pm

smashey wrote:

I know it's not what you want to hear but you answered the Irish side of the question there. They feared it would lead to professionalism.

Well I did guess as much, but is there anywhere where they outlined specifically what their objections were?

Stev_o · 13-09-2007 5:34pm

Its mostly to do with the professionalism theory and that it would lead it to it and the great honor and tradition of the IRFU would be ruined. Basically they were incredibly blind as to what was going on in the other Unions

komodosp · 13-09-2007 5:34pm

Sure look at the farcical situation at this years RWC, both Scotland & Wales got 'rewarded' with key fixtures in their backyard despite the World Cup taken place in a different country !

Supposedly Japan had a higher bid for the 2011 world cup, but New Zealand promised All-Black tours in exchange for votes...

Danie Gerber · 13-09-2007 5:41pm

As far as I know the Irish RFU never officially objected. They just voted against the inaugural world cup at a vote back in '85. Unions were (and still are) not required to state their objections or reasons for voting a certain way, but the matter would have been (and matters still are) debated behind closed doors during IRFU board meetings.

They weren't alone, most of the home unions voted against the world cup citing fears that such a tournament would deminish the importance and prestige of the then 5 nations tournament and also leave rugby union open to commercial exploitation and even professionalism! Ireland, at the time, was one of the most outspoken unions against professionalism.

No wonder that the southern hemisphere unions all voted in favour of the tournament, since this was pre-tri-nations and no major competition existed for their teams. South Africa cast the decisive vote even though they would not be able to compete in the first tournament because of the apartheid-related sports boycott.

Guy:Incognito · 13-09-2007 5:52pm

zabbo wrote:

In the context they did what they thought was right I guess.

Sure look at the farcical situation at this years RWC, both Scotland & Wales got 'rewarded' with key fixtures in their backyard despite the World Cup taken place in a different country !

Absurd

Im a casual rugby fan and thought I was hearing wrong (up until right now) when one of the commentators said somethign about Scotland playing someone at Murrayfield. Whats that all about?

Stev_o · 13-09-2007 6:04pm

zabbo wrote:

In the context they did what they thought was right I guess.

Sure look at the farcical situation at this years RWC, both Scotland & Wales got 'rewarded' with key fixtures in their backyard despite the World Cup taken place in a different country !

Absurd

Yeah but remember we'v done it aswell both in 1991 and 1999. I honestly dont know why i think it has something to do with countries not meeting the quota for stadium capacity so they have to go to the neighbor unions to make some fixtures there

Sangre · 13-09-2007 6:30pm

I somehow doubt that previous holders of the WC and the Euros couldn't accomodate all the rugby fixtures.

Stev_o · 13-09-2007 6:35pm

Sangre wrote:

I somehow doubt that previous holders of the WC and the Euros couldn't accomodate all the rugby fixtures.

The only ones i know that didnt have any other matches in other Unions was 1987, 1995 and 2003 quote me if im wrong

Sangre · 13-09-2007 6:40pm

im referring to france having already hosted the football WC (a much bigger event) and the Euros. They could easily accomodate this. I think its more a case of the 6N countries scratching eachother backs. No doubt Ireland would have a game if Lansdowne was around.

BOHSBOHS · 13-09-2007 6:49pm

1987 was australia +new zealand
1995 first to have all matches in one country
2003 was supposed to be australia +nz but there was a row over summat

yes ireland were originally hosting a couple of games in this years WC but due to lansdowne being out of commission, they were scrapped

ruck-it · 13-09-2007 8:04pm

It's been explained in a few threads how ridiculous the IRB selection process for world cups is. They should have a panel that selects the best bid. Not the ridiculous horse trading that currently happens.

With regard to the irish aspect of all this anyone who wants to get an idea of just how amateur and backward the IRFU were (and sometimes still are) should pick up a copy of Brendan Fannings book - From There to Here

Stev_o · 13-09-2007 9:37pm

ruck-it wrote:

It's been explained in a few threads how ridiculous the IRB selection process for world cups is. They should have a panel that selects the best bid. Not the ridiculous horse trading that currently happens.

With regard to the irish aspect of all this anyone who wants to get an idea of just how amateur and backward the IRFU were (and sometimes still are) should pick up a copy of Brendan Fannings book - From There to Here

Its a great book i read it while i was in France defiantly worth a read. Sure i bet 8/10 of people here wouldnt know that Brian Ashton coached us and introduced us to running rugby :rolleyes:

Junior · 13-09-2007 10:12pm

Stev_o wrote:

Its a great book i read it while i was in France defiantly worth a read. Sure i bet 8/10 of people here wouldnt know that Brian Ashton coached us and introduced us to running rugby :rolleyes:

Good old Brian has the 'honour' of being the coach in charge of Ireland's worse defeat to England, and being the coach in charge of England's worse defeat to Ireland in the 6N.

Dunno what that says about his ability.

Stev_o · 13-09-2007 10:30pm

Junior wrote:

Good old Brian has the 'honour' of being the coach in charge of Ireland's worse defeat to England, and being the coach in charge of England's worse defeat to Ireland in the 6N.

Dunno what that says about his ability.

Oh i relise he;s a absolutely crap coach but in fairness he's often given coal and told to turn it to gold alot of time.

MikeHoncho · 14-09-2007 10:21am

Stev_o wrote:

Sure i bet 8/10 of people here wouldnt know that Brian Ashton coached us and introduced us to running rugby :rolleyes:

Probably the smugest comment ive read on boards for a long time.

prospect · 14-09-2007 3:11pm

Stev_o wrote:

Sure i bet 8/10 of people here wouldnt know that Brian Ashton coached us and introduced us to running rugby :rolleyes:

Anyone that watched the Post Ireland V England @ Croker match analysis would know this for this reason:

Junior wrote:

Good old Brian has the 'honour' of being the coach in charge of Ireland's worse defeat to England, and being the coach in charge of England's worse defeat to Ireland in the 6N.

This was mentioned then.

Did we vote against the World Cup?

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