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Malaysian airline MH-17 discussion thread

24567…89

Comments

  • #52
    joe316
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,598 ✭✭✭joe316


    Doubt that the Russians will let themselves face the blame (blame separatists) but if it is proved that they are responsible and that there are US or EU citizens on board then you wonder what sort of action (if any) should be taken.


  • #53
    A Greedy Algorithm
    Registered Users Posts: 252 ✭✭A Greedy Algorithm


    Christ what a messed up world. All that's on the news these days are wars, killings and death.


  • #54
    stevedublin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 980 ✭✭✭stevedublin


    who_me wrote: »

    (Amazingly, she also did have to point out that this isn't the missing Malaysian flight from several weeks ago!)

    What is so amazing about that? The missing flight was Malaysian, and also a Boeing 777 and who on earth would fly over an active war zone where an aircraft was shot down yesterday?


  • #55
    TeddyTedson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,758 ✭✭✭✭TeddyTedson


    Jesus it would never have entered my mind the thought of being shot down on a commercial flight. It's really shocking stuff if confirmed.
    If true the best anyone can really hope for is that they didn't know much about it. :(


  • #56
    who_me
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,669 ✭✭✭who_me


    stevedublin wrote: »
    The only party that should be to blame is the Malaysian pilot/flight planners.
    Imagine flying over an active war zone where militiary aircraft are being shot down (one was shot down yesterday!), civilian air traffic control and military air force may not be communicating with each other (especially if on opposing sides of the war!). It may have been mistaken for a spy plane.
    I mean, how stupid can you get?

    I doubt if it's possible to avoid flying over warzones in many parts of the world. I'm sure there are even flights taking off from/landing in many warzones at the moment. And "East Ukraine" is a big area to fly around.


  • #57
    Skylinehead
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,690 ✭✭✭✭Skylinehead


    TeddyTedson wrote: »
    Jesus it would never have entered my mind the thought of being shot down on a commercial flight. It's really shocking stuff if confirmed.
    If true the best anyone can really hope for is that they didn't know much about it. :(
    It's rare, only ones I can think of are the Vincennes (Iran) and the Soviets shooting down a Korean flight, both in the 80s.


  • #58
    gouche
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 416 ✭✭gouche


    stevedublin wrote: »
    What is so amazing about that? The missing flight was Malaysian, and also a Boeing 777 and who on earth would fly over an active war zone where an aircraft was shot down yesterday?

    It's amazing that someone would think a plane missing for the last few months and presumed lost would miraculously appear on the other side of the world in the middle of an armed conflict.


  • #59
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,365 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    darkpagandeath wrote: »
    Wonder where they got that, Not like you can go into a shop and buy one. And you need proper training to use them.

    Russians I guess.

    If this does turn out to the the case, what will the repercussions be?


  • #60
    The_Valeyard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,452 ✭✭✭✭The_Valeyard


    Rebels mistook it for a government troop transport?

    And it wouldn't be the first time Russian forces or Russian backed forces have downed a civilian airliner.


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  • #61
    Lingua Franca
    Registered Users Posts: 2,800 ✭✭✭Lingua Franca


    whiskeyman wrote: »
    Yep, a lot of Europeans likely to be on this.
    :(

    That's what Dutch news is reporting. Lots of Dutch and Europeans. No survivors.

    This is hitting very close to home. The scotch will be getting an airing in this house tonight.


  • #62
    I Heart Internet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,678 ✭✭✭I Heart Internet


    Amalgam wrote: »
    I wonder how the US Administration and European Politicians will react to this. So many vested (economic) interests..

    There are so many drawbacks to having an 'unstable' Russia, unwilling to behave normally, in the region. Really quite unsettling.

    We need to be careful. Even if this was Rusian kit and the idiot firing it is Russian or had Russian training, it is unlikely that Russia's intent was for people to shoot down passenger aircraft. Even they aren't that crazy.


  • #63
    TeddyTedson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,758 ✭✭✭✭TeddyTedson


    A Greedy Algorithm wrote: »
    Christ what a messed up world. All that's on the news these days are wars, killings and death.

    It's always been that way though I guess.
    I can't comprehend how someone like the US President could ever give the go ahead to bombing a country know that there will be many civilian casualties. Never in the world would I want someone killed.


  • #64
    vicwatson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,404 ✭✭✭✭vicwatson


    Indo says no survivors ;-(

    Surely the end of Malaysian Airlines

    RIP passengers


  • #65
    Falthyron
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,835 ✭✭✭Falthyron


    The_Valeyard wrote: »
    Rebels mistook it for a government troop transport?

    And it wouldn't be the first time Russian forces or Russian backed forces have downed a civilian airliner.

    Quite possibly.

    Russian News Source

    Translation:
    Donetsk, July 17. / ITAR-TASS /. Militias proclaimed the People's Republic of Donetsk (DNI) near the town of Torez downed military transport aircraft An-26 Ukrainian Air Force. This is reported by witnesses from the scene. According to them, the plane was hit by a missile, and then began to lose altitude, crashed to the ground and burned.
    Militia proclaimed the People's Republic of Lugansk (LC) July 14, also shot down the AN-26 Ukrainian Air Force.


  • #66
    abelard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,837 ✭✭✭abelard


    Russia will deny responsibility and the western governments will accept it as it's not in their interests to raise aggression.


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  • #67
    WesternZulu
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,972 ✭✭✭WesternZulu


    Awful news!

    If Russia is to blame, why would they do it in the 1st place?
    What purpose does shooting down a passenger plane serve?


  • #68
    Lingua Franca
    Registered Users Posts: 2,800 ✭✭✭Lingua Franca


    Ukraine and separatists blaming each other, but Russian separatists released a press statement claiming to have downed a military transport plane at the same time. - unconfirmed reports, Dutch news.


  • #69
    who_me
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,669 ✭✭✭who_me


    stevedublin wrote: »
    What is so amazing about that? The missing flight was Malaysian, and also a Boeing 777 and who on earth would fly over an active war zone where an aircraft was shot down yesterday?

    It's pretty unlikely that someone could have stolen a 777, landed it safely, kept it hidden for several weeks despite one of the largest search and rescue operations in recent times, then taken off and flown thousands of miles to the Ukraine without anyone noticing it en route until it enters a border area in dispute.


  • #70
    laugh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,745 ✭✭✭laugh


    Would be nice to have some UN peacekeepers in that region at this stage.


  • #71
    cson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,478 ✭✭✭✭cson


    Jaysus there's a poster on the A&A Forum who changed his flight from this one to an earlier one. :eek:

    **** me I'd be goosed mentally for a while if that ever happened me.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=91319021&postcount=62


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  • #72
    Tarzana
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,062 ✭✭✭Tarzana


    Banjo String wrote: »
    If true, and it's looking likely, this could have the potential to finish the airline. If it's due to mechanical or pilot error any way.

    I certainly would be apprehensive of flying with them now, (rightly or wrongly)

    Yup, they're goners.


  • #73
    Highflyer13
    Closed Accounts Posts: 954 ✭✭✭Highflyer13


    The world seems like a melting pot at the moment. So much madness going on all over. Has it been confirmed the flight was downed? Shocking if true and even more shocking considering Malaysian 'lost' a 777 a few months back which frankly I find very hard to believe.


  • #74
    Spring Onion
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,087 ✭✭✭Spring Onion


    It's fascinating how people react to a vacuum of information these days.


  • #75
    calex71
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,126 ✭✭✭✭calex71


    BBC quoting a defence expert as saying that satellite imagery would be able to pick up if long range weaponry has been used. No doubt the US would have one trained on the area.


  • #76
    wretcheddomain
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,094 ✭✭✭wretcheddomain


    cson wrote: »
    Jaysus there's a poster on the A&A Forum who changed his flight from this one to an earlier one. :eek:

    **** me I'd be goosed mentally for a while if that ever happened me.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=91319021&postcount=62

    This assumes that this exact plane was deliberately targeted for many weeks in advance - this isn't the case.


  • #77
    Donkey Oaty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,533 ✭✭✭Donkey Oaty


    There's already some creep on Twitter saying it was shot down to deflect the world's attention from Israel's actions in Gaza.


  • #78
    vicwatson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,404 ✭✭✭✭vicwatson


    BBC reporting it has to have been an air - air missile, who knows, whoever pressed the button on the rocket is a bastard. End of.


  • #79
    loosetongue
    Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭loosetongue


    Just listening to sky news and it said that questions will be asked as to why the planed was flying in middle of Ukraine as pilots have been instructed not to fly in that area.

    It seems like the separatists probably assumed it was a Ukrainian military plane carrying a large number of Ukrainian soldiers possibly about to parachute down somewhere for military operations. They probably assumed it was not a passenger airline as they have been instructed not to fly in that area. From what sky news was saying its likely it was a surface to air missile as mobile RPG would not have the range to shoot it down 10,000 feet in the air. Seems highly unlikely that they just found such hardware lying around and that Russia did not supply it.

    Pretty scary so close to Europe and really escalates the situation there.


  • #80
    EoghanIRL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,080 ✭✭✭EoghanIRL


    Wow . Watching sky news now. Just heard about it . This must be bad for stock prices .


  • #81
    mal1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 811 ✭✭✭mal1


    Spring Onion wrote: »
    It's fascinating how people react to a vacuum of information these days.

    Tell us more about the auld days Grandad.


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  • #82
    wretcheddomain
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,094 ✭✭✭wretcheddomain


    EoghanIRL wrote: »
    Wow . Watching sky news now. Just heard about it . This must be bad for stock prices .

    That's your initial reaction? Stock prices? :eek:


  • #83
    Spring Onion
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,087 ✭✭✭Spring Onion


    mal1 wrote: »
    Tell us more about the auld days Grandad.

    Well in my day we would me much less ghoulish and wait for the facts to come out in the newspaper. Then we would discuss them rationally.


  • #84
    My name is URL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,069 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    It crashed just over an hour ago and all the news channels already have weapons and military experts on for interviews. Can they not just wait until more details become clear before whipping up a load of fear and hysteria?


  • #85
    IvaBigWun
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭IvaBigWun


    Lingua Franca wrote: »

    This is hitting very close to home. The scotch will be getting an airing in this house tonight.

    You're going on a whiskey bender because a plane you know no-one on was shot down?


  • #86
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,365 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    loosetongue wrote: »
    Just listening to sky news and it said that questions will be asked as to why the planed was flying in middle of Ukraine as pilots have been instructed not to fly in that area.

    It seems like the separatists probably assumed it was a Ukrainian military plane carrying a large number of Ukrainian soldiers possibly about to parachute down somewhere for military operations. They probably assumed it was not a passenger airline as they have been instructed not to fly in that area. From what sky news was saying its likely it was a surface to air missile as mobile RPG would not have the range to shoot it down 10,000 feet in the air. Seems highly unlikely that they just found such hardware lying around and that Russia did not supply it.

    Pretty scary so close to Europe and really escalates the situation there.

    It was flying at 10,000 metres, not feet. That is cruising altitude.


  • #87
    Lingua Franca
    Registered Users Posts: 2,800 ✭✭✭Lingua Franca


    IvaBigWun wrote: »
    You're going on a whiskey bender because a plane you know no-one on was shot down?

    No. It's not for me. My partner started that plane up this afternoon.


  • #88
    IvaBigWun
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,368 ✭✭✭IvaBigWun


    Lingua Franca wrote: »
    No. It's not for me. My partner started that plane up this afternoon.

    Eh?

    Im not being insensitive. Just genuinely confused.


  • #89
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,028 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    The fighter jet pilot would need permission to take it down surely?


  • #90
    Larbre34
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,375 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    That is an unbelievable turn of events.

    How can it happen that civilian airliners are flying over a conflict zone where ground-to-air engagements with sophisticated weapons are taking place. Absolute lunacy.

    And for it to be another Malaysian plane is bonkers. A 10 on the Garth Brooks scale.


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  • #91
    Lingua Franca
    Registered Users Posts: 2,800 ✭✭✭Lingua Franca


    IvaBigWun wrote: »
    Eh?

    Im not being insensitive. Just genuinely confused.

    He's an ATC in Schiphol, start up control. He spoke to the pilots to give them start up instructions today. Gets home from work to hear this.


  • #92
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    My name is URL wrote: »
    It crashed just over an hour ago and all the news channels already have weapons and military experts on for interviews. Can they not just wait until more details become clear before whipping up a load of fear and hysteria?
    This is the inevitable consequence of the 24 hour news instant media world in which we live.


  • #93
    Penny Tration
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,687 ✭✭✭✭Penny Tration


    Lingua Franca wrote: »
    He's an ATC in Schiphol, start up control. He spoke to the pilots to give them start up instructions today. Gets home from work to hear this.

    Jesus, he must be very shaken up. Hope he's okay. :(


  • #94
    aloyisious
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,031 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    RTE news interview/report mentioned the airspace was NOT closed to Civil Aircraft. It remains to be seen if the different parties follow-up with claims that Airlines and Civil Aircraft were/were not warned to keep outside Russian/Ukrainian border airspace zone/s.


  • #95
    Specialun
    Registered Users Posts: 3,068 ✭✭✭Specialun


    Kay burley is currently doing stretches before her long night of sky exaggeration and one sided news coverage


  • #96
    Conas
    Registered Users Posts: 1,071 ✭✭✭Conas


    Mr. Incognito wrote: »
    They only people with the technology to shoot it down are the Russians.

    They will immediately blame "Separatists" and annex the rest of the non-Russian Ukraine using this as an excuse.

    And we'll let them.

    Since when did it become our business, and obligation to meddle in the affairs of other countries? We can't even run our own country.


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  • #97
    EoghanIRL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,080 ✭✭✭EoghanIRL


    wretcheddomain wrote: »
    That's your initial reaction? Stock prices? :eek:

    Could be a good opportunity to invest seeing as how this will go away eventually just like the missing plane did and stock prices should rise again . The shares could eventually be sold at a profit. People take advantage of bad situations all the time .
    Obviously it's an awful tragedy that people died.


  • #98
    Beal Tuille
    Registered Users Posts: 38 ✭Beal Tuille


    Didn't think surface to air missiles could reach 33,000 feet.

    Surely the jet has a sensor to know a missile is locked on it which would help identify where it came from once the black box is recovered. Dont think the pilot could do anything once the missile is locked on.

    This could get a wee bit intensive......


  • #99
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    An air to air missile? Find it very hard to believe a Ukrainian military pilot would engage a passenger jet. Must be ethnic russians from the ground.


  • #100
    wendell borton
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,336 ✭✭✭wendell borton


    vicwatson wrote: »
    BBC reporting it has to have been an air - air missile, who knows, whoever pressed the button on the rocket is a bastard. End of.

    They said it could also have been a ground to air missile, but that would require radar tracking at that altitude.


  • #101
    Lingua Franca
    Registered Users Posts: 2,800 ✭✭✭Lingua Franca


    green_screen wrote: »
    Jesus, he must be very shaken up. Hope he's okay. :(

    He's more stunned. You can't let this sort of thing get to you too much or you couldn't do the job.


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