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Plan to merge the 2nd Level Unions

  • 23-04-2014 11:29am
    #1
    whiteandlight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,359 ✭✭✭


    Just read this on RTE
    http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0423/610363-tui-quinn/

    I think this is an excellent idea, one voice is crucial in negotiations and it eliminates the 'leaving one group out in the cold' mentality particularly from votes leading up to strike. It also removes the divide of schools by negotiation rights where for example I must be a member of the TUI in my current school


Comments

  • #2
    sitstill
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,380 ✭✭✭sitstill


    Musicmental85 wrote: »
    Just read this on RTE
    http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0423/610363-tui-quinn/

    I think this is an excellent idea, one voice is crucial in negotiations and it eliminates the 'leaving one group out in the cold' mentality particularly from votes leading up to strike. It also removes the divide of schools by negotiation rights where for example I must be a member of the TUI in my current school

    I think it's a great idea too. I work in a school where we have both unions and it was a bit messy this year when TUI accepted the HRA and we (ASTI) didn't.

    Does anyone know why we ended up with two unions? How did it develop that way?


  • #3
    ethical
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 725 ✭✭✭ethical


    Of course it would be welcome........but the present make up of the TUI where it has to represent 3rd level as well as second level personnel would have to change otherwise there would be lots of infighting which would take the eye off the main concerns of second level teachers.....and play in to the Governments hands!


  • #4
    whiteandlight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,359 ✭✭✭whiteandlight


    Actually I just assumed that TUI would continue in some guise with a seperate union for 3rd level!
    I completely agree, needs to be 2nd level only-no diluting the message


  • #5
    teacherhead
    Closed Accounts Posts: 666 ✭✭✭teacherhead


    sitstill wrote: »
    I think it's a great idea too. I work in a school where we have both unions and it was a bit messy this year when TUI accepted the HRA and we (ASTI) didn't.

    Does anyone know why we ended up with two unions? How did it develop that way?

    historically the vocational teachers were in completely different sectors up until the time that the lc was offered in vocational schools. Nowadays voluntary schools and etb schools are broadly similar.


  • #6
    Boober Fraggle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 238 ✭✭Boober Fraggle


    ethical wrote: »
    Of course it would be welcome........but the present make up of the TUI where it has to represent 3rd level as well as second level personnel would have to change otherwise there would be lots of infighting which would take the eye off the main concerns of second level teachers.....and play in to the Governments hands!

    I agree. I would not want to be a member of a union that represents people at different levels. This is why I chose Asti.


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  • #7
    2011abc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,705 ✭✭✭2011abc


    Well seeing as this is the latest the TUI has 'achieved' Id not be too excited...

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/teachers-to-work-year-round-in-further-education-sector-1.1771312


  • #8
    teacherhead
    Closed Accounts Posts: 666 ✭✭✭teacherhead


    2011abc wrote: »
    Well seeing as this is the latest the TUI has 'achieved' Id not be too excited...

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/education/teachers-to-work-year-round-in-further-education-sector-1.1771312

    Minister dreams up something and you blame the TUI. Jesus wept. Such hostility.


  • #9
    2011abc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,705 ✭✭✭2011abc


    Yes he 'dreams' it up and you can be sure the union head honchos will do everything in their power to make sure his dreams come through -and then quelle surprise end up on Quango boards a year or two later .
    I despise the ASTI head office for what they have done and have now left but its the best of the three teachers unions in Ireland .The TUI HRA vote was influenced by Third Level lecturers -I have only heard of TUI second level teachers bemoaning the fact -none , not one who was Pro HRA . And as for the INTO , Sheila may be putting on a show this week but she oversees an organisation that effectively shut down their Facebook page to posters rather than allow dissent be raised .Her wages are frankly obscene .
    The ESB union is the only one worth anything and their boss retired immediately after giving the government and directors a metaphoric bloody nose .Even the nurses union and boss who used be a figurehead for proactive leadership collapsed in the end .True trade unionism in this country is almost extinct .


  • #10
    RealJohn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,099 ✭✭✭RealJohn


    This needs to happen in fairness. I don't know how exactly it can be achieved given that whoever ends up representing the IT lecturers will be faced with a massive drop off in income and are unlikely to be happy about it (unless they merge with the union that represents university lecturers maybe?) and I imagine the heads of the ASTI and TUI won't want to lose their positions either but it is high time we had a union that represents all of the secondary teachers and only the secondary teachers. Principals and deputy principals should probably be separate too but one step at a time I suppose.


  • #11
    teacherhead
    Closed Accounts Posts: 666 ✭✭✭teacherhead


    RealJohn wrote: »
    This needs to happen in fairness. I don't know how exactly it can be achieved given that whoever ends up representing the IT lecturers will be faced with a massive drop off in income and are unlikely to be happy about it (unless they merge with the union that represents university lecturers maybe?) and I imagine the heads of the ASTI and TUI won't want to lose their positions either but it is high time we had a union that represents all of the secondary teachers and only the secondary teachers. Principals and deputy principals should probably be separate too but one step at a time I suppose.

    I'm not sure about a union for principals and deputies. Theres only about 1500 potential members, theyd want to be forking out savage subscriptions to pay for officials etc at the wages they're on.

    There is definitely a need for a single union at second level.


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  • #12
    Pwpane
    Closed Accounts Posts: 457 ✭✭Pwpane


    teacherhead wrote: »
    I'm not sure about a union for principals and deputies. Theres only about 1500 potential members, theyd want to be forking out savage subscriptions to pay for officials etc at the wages they're on.

    There is definitely a need for a single union at second level.
    What about the NAPD? How does it work?


  • #13
    teacherhead
    Closed Accounts Posts: 666 ✭✭✭teacherhead


    Pwpane wrote: »
    What about the NAPD? How does it work?

    It's not a union, part funded by des afaik.


  • #14
    evolving_doors
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    TUI are opposed to the principle of Fee Charging Schools so refuse to represent teachers paid privately by the school. Shame really as it should be about preserving equal employment rights for all teachers.

    Personally I'd prefer 1 public service union so no messin about.


  • #15
    Pwpane
    Closed Accounts Posts: 457 ✭✭Pwpane


    teacherhead wrote: »
    It's not a union, part funded by des afaik.
    Does it not act as a union though? I wonder if it could mutate into one.


  • #16
    whiteandlight
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,359 ✭✭✭whiteandlight


    Armelodie wrote: »
    TUI are opposed to the principle of Fee Charging Schools so refuse to represent teachers paid privately by the school. Shame really as it should be about preserving equal employment rights for all teachers.

    Personally I'd prefer 1 public service union so no messin about.

    1 public service union for all areas? Not just teaching? Don't think that would work very well-a bit unwieldy when there would be issues in nursing and not teaching etc


  • #17
    teacherhead
    Closed Accounts Posts: 666 ✭✭✭teacherhead


    Pwpane wrote: »
    Does it not act as a union though? I wonder if it could mutate into one.

    Doesn't get into employment matters. In my view it shouldn't comment on asti or TUI activity either. It doesn't help the management versus teacher talk you get.


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