Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Spear Gun fishing in Ireland

Options
2

Comments

  • Options
    #32
    Pkiernan
    Registered Users Posts: 4,315 ✭✭✭Pkiernan


    Can I ask where you got that info from please?

    Thanks!


  • Options
    #33
    mathepac
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,991 ✭✭✭mathepac


    I've never gone spear-gun fishing. What kind of bait do they take?


  • Options
    #34
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users Posts: 14,906 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    zarat80 wrote: »
    Yes, totally illegal
    Thats just not true.
    If you are going to post information make sure its accurate.
    I KNOW that there is no legislation regarding spearfishing on SCUBA here.
    Its the same as freedive spearfishing.
    Actually there is no legislation at all regarding spearfishing.


  • Options
    #35
    Freedive Ireland
    Registered Users Posts: 254 ✭✭Freedive Ireland


    afaik CJ is correct spearing on scuba isnt illegal but is frowned upon. I also think spearing freediving is safer. Once you shoot the spear and have either a reel or simply a few metres of mon in the water along with all the other danglies I think entanglement is a high possibility. If you are a very comfortable scubie its possible and is very common in the states. All that said I just dont see the point and also you cannot collect any lobies or crabs if on scuba so you cant just take it off and put it back in the van then go freediving for them as was also mentiones its a good way to get bent so imho safer to go free.


  • Options
    #36
    Pkiernan
    Registered Users Posts: 4,315 ✭✭✭Pkiernan


    Actually, I don't have a spear gun, but a pole spear. It doesn't shoot a projectile.

    speargun15.jpg

    I have yet to go after any fish with it, and am not sure if I will.

    I was just wondering if it was allowed to go after fish while on Scuba.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #37
    locum-motion
    Registered Users Posts: 5,143 ✭✭✭locum-motion


    Pkiernan wrote: »
    ...

    I was just wondering if it was allowed to go after fish while on Scuba.

    I have to confess, I thought it was actually illegal to take anything other than photos when using scuba, but in the absence of any posts to the contrary, I'll have to believe those that say it isn't actually illegal.

    That being said, if I ever found myself diving with anyone in Irish waters who DID take lobsters or spear fish, they wouldn't ever be invited to dive with me again.


  • Options
    #38
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users Posts: 14,906 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    Pkiernan wrote: »
    Actually, I don't have a spear gun, but a pole spear. It doesn't shoot a projectile.
    I was just wondering if it was allowed to go after fish while on Scuba.
    We used to call them Hawaiian slings, I don't get too worried about guys spearing on SCUBA. its not like most fish are going to come too close when you are making that much noise.
    Probably a good way to get something like a Ling that most freedivers will never see.
    Each to their own and all that.


  • Options
    #39
    Freedive Ireland
    Registered Users Posts: 254 ✭✭Freedive Ireland


    locum-motion wrote: »
    That being said, if I ever found myself diving with anyone in Irish waters who DID take lobsters or spear fish, they wouldn't ever be invited to dive with me again.
    Locum its still illegal to take crab or lobster on scuba afaik something that the real CJ Haughey actually brought in.
    CJ I have seen Ling freediving but only once in about 15-18m right into a crevice under Thumb rock Mullaghmore I wasnt spearing just looking and they woudl be very hard to access. That was a few years ago and havent seen one since tbh.


  • Options
    #40
    seadeuce
    Registered Users Posts: 277 ✭✭seadeuce


    It is illegal to scuba and catch fish or shellfish.
    Read the following exchange from Dail Eireann, July 1976:



    Parliamentary Debates - Díospóireachtaí Parlaiminte Leinster House - Teach Laighean



    Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Skin Diving Activities.

    7. Mr. Gallagher asked the Minister for Agriculture and Fisheries if he is aware that commercial fishermen are concerned about the increase in the number of persons engaging in skin diving; and if he will state the action he proposes to take to prohibit such activities.

    Mr. M. O'Leary: I assume the question refers to the taking of fish by means of skin diving. Taking or attempting to take shellfish by this method is prohibited under the skindiving for shell fish bye-law No. 533, 1966, made under the Fisheries Acts, and the introduction of further legislation to deal more effectively with this matter is being considered in my Department.

    Mr. Gallagher: Is the Minister aware this is becoming rather a serious problem? Skin diving seems to be fairly well organised at the moment. People go off at weekends in gangs and invade areas where there are lobster and crayfish, and stocks are being seriously damaged as a result of their activities.

    Mr. M. O'Leary: This is governed by the shell fish bye-law No. 533, 1966, and apparently the main difficulty resides in not being able to detect persons engaged in this kind of activity. I suppose the solution lies in more close vigilance on the part of the local fishing communities and others interested in the industry, as well as the normal security people.

    Mr. Molloy: Can the Minister give any indication as to the methods of enforcement employed to ensure compliance with this regulation which was introduced in 1966?

    Mr. Haughey: By me.

    [2343] Mr. Molloy: I remember it well. Would he let me know if his Department have received complaints about excessive taking of shell fish by skin divers in the area stretching from Slyne Head to Innisboffin?

    Mr. M. O'Leary: It is causing the Department some concern. There is difficulty in proving an offence under the relevant section. The main vigilance is provided by local gardaí who very much need the co-operation of the local community to prevent such offences occurring. Before I came in here the Parliamentary Secretary emphasised that this was causing him and the Department concern, and they are keeping the position under very close review indeed.

    Mr. Molloy: Where it has been brought to the notice of the Department that skin divers are taking shell fish in the area I mentioned, what action have the Department taken?

    Mr. M. O'Leary: This practice reached the point that there was a Press advertisement on 30th May. It was a public advertisement and the Fisheries Division sent a copy to the Commissioner of the Garda pointing out this was an offence under the Act. I give that as an illustration of the Department acting on a central basis. What is required for full success is full co-operation from the local communities with the local gardaí. It may be necessary for the Department to review the legislation. I take the point that Deputy Haughey was involved in drawing up the legislation. Apparently in practice it has turned out that it is difficult to make this law stick since it calls, as all our law does, for apprehension of the person in the course of the commission of the crime.

    Mr. Haughey: Would the Minister agree one line of approach would be to prevent people purchasing illegallytaken lobster? The regulations provide that a skin diver may take one fish for his own personal use, but in so far as there is any abuse of the regulations, the way to deal with it most satisfactorily would be to make sure that nobody buys these illegallytaken lobsters.

    [2344] Mr. M. O'Leary: That seems a very common-sense observation and I will convey it to the Parliamentary Secretary for his consideration.

    Mr. Gallagher: Would the Minister suggest to his colleague that bye-laws might be introduced whereby skin diving would be prohibited during certain periods of the year?

    Mr. M. O'Leary: That is a much larger question and, for all I know, may fall outside the ambit of the Fisheries Division. I think Deputy Haughey's suggestion should be pursued, and I will bring it to the Parliamentary Secretary's attention.


  • Options
    #41
    Pkiernan
    Registered Users Posts: 4,315 ✭✭✭Pkiernan


    seadeuce wrote: »
    It is illegal to scuba and catch fish or shellfish.
    Read the following exchange from Dail Eireann, July 1976:



    Parliamentary Debates - Díospóireachtaí Parlaiminte Leinster House - Teach Laighean



    Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Skin Diving Activities.

    7. Mr. Gallagher asked the Minister for Agriculture and Fisheries if he is aware that commercial fishermen are concerned about the increase in the number of persons engaging in skin diving; and if he will state the action he proposes to take to prohibit such activities.

    Mr. M. O'Leary: I assume the question refers to the taking of fish by means of skin diving. Taking or attempting to take shellfish by this method is prohibited under the skindiving for shell fish bye-law No. 533, 1966, made under the Fisheries Acts, and the introduction of further legislation to deal more effectively with this matter is being considered in my Department.

    Mr. Gallagher: Is the Minister aware this is becoming rather a serious problem? Skin diving seems to be fairly well organised at the moment. People go off at weekends in gangs and invade areas where there are lobster and crayfish, and stocks are being seriously damaged as a result of their activities.

    Mr. M. O'Leary: This is governed by the shell fish bye-law No. 533, 1966, and apparently the main difficulty resides in not being able to detect persons engaged in this kind of activity. I suppose the solution lies in more close vigilance on the part of the local fishing communities and others interested in the industry, as well as the normal security people.

    Mr. Molloy: Can the Minister give any indication as to the methods of enforcement employed to ensure compliance with this regulation which was introduced in 1966?

    Mr. Haughey: By me.

    [2343] Mr. Molloy: I remember it well. Would he let me know if his Department have received complaints about excessive taking of shell fish by skin divers in the area stretching from Slyne Head to Innisboffin?

    Mr. M. O'Leary: It is causing the Department some concern. There is difficulty in proving an offence under the relevant section. The main vigilance is provided by local gardaí who very much need the co-operation of the local community to prevent such offences occurring. Before I came in here the Parliamentary Secretary emphasised that this was causing him and the Department concern, and they are keeping the position under very close review indeed.

    Mr. Molloy: Where it has been brought to the notice of the Department that skin divers are taking shell fish in the area I mentioned, what action have the Department taken?

    Mr. M. O'Leary: This practice reached the point that there was a Press advertisement on 30th May. It was a public advertisement and the Fisheries Division sent a copy to the Commissioner of the Garda pointing out this was an offence under the Act. I give that as an illustration of the Department acting on a central basis. What is required for full success is full co-operation from the local communities with the local gardaí. It may be necessary for the Department to review the legislation. I take the point that Deputy Haughey was involved in drawing up the legislation. Apparently in practice it has turned out that it is difficult to make this law stick since it calls, as all our law does, for apprehension of the person in the course of the commission of the crime.

    Mr. Haughey: Would the Minister agree one line of approach would be to prevent people purchasing illegallytaken lobster? The regulations provide that a skin diver may take one fish for his own personal use, but in so far as there is any abuse of the regulations, the way to deal with it most satisfactorily would be to make sure that nobody buys these illegallytaken lobsters.

    [2344] Mr. M. O'Leary: That seems a very common-sense observation and I will convey it to the Parliamentary Secretary for his consideration.

    Mr. Gallagher: Would the Minister suggest to his colleague that bye-laws might be introduced whereby skin diving would be prohibited during certain periods of the year?

    Mr. M. O'Leary: That is a much larger question and, for all I know, may fall outside the ambit of the Fisheries Division. I think Deputy Haughey's suggestion should be pursued, and I will bring it to the Parliamentary Secretary's attention.

    Maybe I am reading your post wrong, but the transcript you quoted would seem to apply to skin divers, not SCUBA divers.
    Furthermore, if these Dail notes became law, then it would appear to make skin diving for fish illegal.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #42
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users Posts: 14,906 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    Seadeuce

    I have a copy of it, it refers to the taking of shellfish by divers using apparatus.

    There is nothing in the byelaw that prohibits the use of SCUBA for finfish.


  • Options
    #43
    Freedive Ireland
    Registered Users Posts: 254 ✭✭Freedive Ireland


    Parlimentary debate is one thing actual law in statute another. Define a skin diver etc etc.


  • Options
    #44
    locum-motion
    Registered Users Posts: 5,143 ✭✭✭locum-motion


    The debate mentions Bye-Law 533; that's the text we need to find!


  • Options
    #45
    locum-motion
    Registered Users Posts: 5,143 ✭✭✭locum-motion


    Freedive Ireland wrote: »
    Parlimentary debate is one thing actual law in statute another...

    While you are right in saying that a parliamentary debate is not a law, I think that when the relevant minister - during a parliamentary debate - makes reference to a particular act being illegal, then it is not unreasonable to assume that the act is illegal.*


    *: Or was illegal at that time.


  • Options
    #46
    richiek67
    Closed Accounts Posts: 305 ✭✭richiek67


    Your obviously not into diving for observing the marine life then...pity.


  • Options
    #47
    nathan184
    Registered Users Posts: 158 ✭✭nathan184


    Hi richie. Not sure who your comment is directed at but it just seems to be a negative dig at people who spearfish.

    Do you eat fish? I believe spearfishing to be probably the most selective and conservative method of catching fish. If a line fisherman drags a fish up from depth quickly but decides to release them very often that fish has a burst gall bladder from the rapid ascent and is a feast for the seagulls anyway. A good spearfisher sees his prey up close and will only fire if he intends to put his target on the dinner table and if the environment can sustain the loss of this fish.

    Most spearfishers I know are just as interested in observing marine life as any scuba diver I know but as with all activities, there will always be a few people who give the rest a bad name.


  • Options
    #48
    Pkiernan
    Registered Users Posts: 4,315 ✭✭✭Pkiernan


    richiek67 wrote: »
    Your obviously not into diving for observing the marine life then...pity.


    I congratulate you on being a macrobiotic vegan, who does not eat or use any products derived from animals. I imagine it is a tough enough road to follow.

    I myself only eat meat or fish that I hunt or catch myself, and am therefore mostly vegetarian (though I still have 5lbs or wild boar meat and a side of ribs from one I shot in 2011 left in the freezer).

    I am also undecided as to whether or not I would spear a fish for dinner. Sor far I have not. I may do so in the future.

    But fair play to you.

    All the best.


  • Options
    #49
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users Posts: 14,906 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    richiek67 wrote: »
    Your obviously not into diving for observing the marine life then...pity.
    I don't know if you dive or have ever dived, but I can tell you from my own experience that breathhold spearfishing will allow you to be much closer to marine life than Scuba will, the bubbles make a lot of noise and disturbance and lots of fish simply won't hang around to see what is making that noise.
    Most of the best underwater wildlife cinematography is done by freediving as it doesn't disturb the animals.
    When you spearfish you are part of the ecosystem not just a visitor, you are a predator stalking the fish and they know it.
    Don't make the mistake of thinking its just about holding your breath swimming down and shooting a fish, if you think thats it you'll probably never spear a fish.
    It takes a lot more effort than that and most spearos will tell you that its more about the whole experience rather than the moment that you pull the trigger.
    Spearfishing in Ireland has negligible impact on marine life, there aren't enough people doing it to really make an impact here.


  • Options
    #50
    yankinlk
    Registered Users Posts: 2,731 ✭✭✭yankinlk


    CJhaughey wrote: »
    Spearfishing in Ireland has negligible impact on marine life, there aren't enough people doing it to really make an impact here.

    +1 to this. I went out with the guys from spearfishing.ie recently. Very impressed with their methods. They are looking for specimen size fish for the table, not shoot anything/everything they see. In fact i had a great shot (if i had a camera) of one of them "hunting" with a dogfish as a hunting partner. Never even considered shooting the dogfish.


  • Options
    #51
    richiek67
    Closed Accounts Posts: 305 ✭✭richiek67


    CJhaughey wrote: »
    I don't know if you dive or have ever dived, but I can tell you from my own experience that breathhold spearfishing will allow you to be much closer to marine life than Scuba will, the bubbles make a lot of noise and disturbance and lots of fish simply won't hang around to see what is making that noise.

    Hmmm, what rubbish. Ever hear of a re-breather.. I have one ..no bubbles
    QED. Also I can stay down for 60minutes, try holding your breath for 60 minues...no, dident think so..lol


    Most of the best underwater wildlife cinematography is done by freediving as it doesn't disturb the animals.
    Not true.

    When you spearfish you are part of the ecosystem not just a visitor, you are a predator stalking the fish and they know it.
    How romantic...lol


    Don't make the mistake of thinking its just about holding your breath swimming down and shooting a fish, if you think thats it you'll probably never spear a fish.
    Dont ever intend on spearing a fish, thanks. I prefer to look at the wonderment of my ecosystem..


    It takes a lot more effort than that and most spearos will tell you that its more about the whole experience rather than the moment that you pull the trigger.
    Spearfishing in Ireland has negligible impact on marine life, there aren't enough people doing it to really make an impact here.
    Good.

    See above


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #52
    nathan184
    Registered Users Posts: 158 ✭✭nathan184


    nathan184 wrote: »
    Hi richie....Do you eat fish?...

    Please see my earlier question.

    If you eat fish your argument is invalid

    Google "Bycatch and Discards Ireland" and see what I mean

    EDIT: Forgot to include this:
    wrong.jpg


  • Options
    #53
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users Posts: 14,906 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    richiek67 wrote: »
    See above
    If diving with a rebreather is the pinnacle of your experience then I am truly sad for you, one day if you are able you should open your mind and try freediving
    No bubbles for sure but that doesn't mean no noise.
    I can dive all day, more than 60 minutes bottom time for sure...
    Why bother?, your mind is like an oyster....


  • Options
    #54
    richiek67
    Closed Accounts Posts: 305 ✭✭richiek67


    Lol, a come on , I'm winding you guys up...Yes , I do eat fish. Love it...


  • Options
    #55
    richiek67
    Closed Accounts Posts: 305 ✭✭richiek67


    Don't like Oysters though, too slimy....lol


  • Options
    #56
    Freedive Ireland
    Registered Users Posts: 254 ✭✭Freedive Ireland


    Can't we all just be friends? Serioulsy even if everyone who currently scuba dives started spearing it would make naff all differences to fish stocks in the Atlantic. it would make a difference to how many stayed around you in the shallows etc so I wouldn't like us to end up like the Med. Responsible spearfishing is the way forward and I am glad to see the positive peer pressure out there when someone does take the piss seems to work.


  • Options
    #57
    richiek67
    Closed Accounts Posts: 305 ✭✭richiek67


    Yis are all very quiet now...lol

    Anyway, I have no problem people catching their own fish.:) I don't like the dredger type factory ships that are depleting the fish stocks in a radical way. We soon will have to sea life to look at, it'll be all gone if we don't watch out...:rolleyes:


  • Options
    #58
    Freedive Ireland
    Registered Users Posts: 254 ✭✭Freedive Ireland


    Ain't that the truth.


  • Options
    #59
    scoopdog
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭scoopdog


    zarat80 wrote: »
    Yes, totally illegal

    lads what planet are you living on, spearfishing is not illegal, in fact most garda or coast gaurds don't actually know the law on this and can't prosecute, if your spear is propelled by gas it can be seen as a firearm.

    If it is propelled by elastic it's fine.

    As with diving it's frowned upon if you dive and use any mechanical means to hunt fish but it's not illegal. If you can catch a fish or lobster with your bare hands while diving well then it's yours. I dive with one of the biggest clubs in the country and have never seen a diver do it but i know some who do, it's not illegal , but not very popular. ;)


  • Options
    #60
    richiek67
    Closed Accounts Posts: 305 ✭✭richiek67


    Yr right. Its not illegal as such but I remember diving for some 10 years in my 30's and it was always frowned upon to go taking Lobsters, though I had the pleasure of seeing some huge ones in the west while looking around the rocks....Yes, there's always some who'd take them but then I was only in it to marvel at the undersea world and to appreciate it, not to take from it...Though to be honest I wouldn't have a problem with spear fishing.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #61
    yankinlk
    Registered Users Posts: 2,731 ✭✭✭yankinlk


    https://acuriouscure.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/spear-fishing.jpg


Advertisement