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masturbation.

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Comments

  • #52
    Pompey Magnus
    Registered Users Posts: 5,406 ✭✭✭Pompey Magnus


    The Biblical scholar Bart Ehrman deals with the issue of Jesus and this uncomfortable passage in Matthew and points out that it is too widely attested in our sources to be ignored, it is found Matthew, Mark, Luke, Thomas and Q. The breakdown of family values was obviously an important aspect of Jesus' ministry and the witnesses were in little doubt about this.

    Ehrman points out that this fits with the preaching of someone who believed the Kingdom of Heaven was imminent, the present social order was going to fall apart and family ties and institutions were ultimately unimportant and would have no place in the new age. As the Q Gospel said: "If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters and even his own life, he is not able to be my disciple". There is little doubt that this is what Jesus said as it was independently preserved in the Gospel of Thomas.

    Just like Jesus rejected (and was rejected by) his family he demanded the same of his disciples. The evidence preserved in the Gospels point strongly to such a conclusion.


  • #53
    wolfsbane
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,980 ✭✭✭wolfsbane


    Depeche_Mode said:
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wolfsbane
    Depeche_Mode said:

    He never told them to do that - and they never did it. Paul defends his right to have a wife, even though he voluntarily did not take it up. He reveals many of the apostles had wives who accompanied them:
    Oh, so when Peter said: "We have left everything to follow you! What then will there be for us?" he wasn't being entirely true, they didn't leave absolutely everything? Did the apostles leave everything or not?

    Or when Luke 5:11 says that as soon as Peter, James and John arrived on shore after Jesus calls them "they forsook all and followed Him" did Luke really mean to say that actually the three first went home and collected their wives and children and then forsook everything else?
    PDN has answered true and comprehensively.

    Let me just add:
    Basically, they left their careers and being able to spend every day at home. They still had their families and enjoyed their company, but not as much. Like long-distance truckers, or soldiers and sailors.

    For the period of Christ's ministry they were intensively engaged with Him. After His ascension, they took their wives with them as they itinerated.
    Quote:
    Any prostitutes were former ones. Just as with true Christians at all times:
    Jesus said to them, "I tell you the truth, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God ahead of you.

    I don't see Jesus specifying former prostitutes there. He seems to be referring to women still in the game.
    You are mistaken. Like Christ told the woman taken in adultery, "Go, and sin no more" is the requirement for all sinners. Only repentant prostitutes enter the kingdom. Just like repentant Pharisees, thieves, homosexuals, murderers. Practising ones are outside the kingdom and will ever be so.


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