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Free GP visits for all

  • 23-06-2012 11:30am
    #1
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭


    .......coming soon according to local Greystones councillor, James O'Sullivan.
    Councillor O&#8217 wrote: »
    This announcement by the Minister reaffirms the commitment of the Department of Health, under the leadership of Minister James Reilly, that Fine Gael in Government are committed to free GP care for all.
    This will no doubt have a positive effect on residents living in the North Wicklow area.

    more


    I wonder if he really believes this stuff :pac:


Comments

  • #2
    Annasopra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,104 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Moved to politics

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • #3
    bmaxi
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,859 ✭✭✭bmaxi


    recedite wrote: »
    .......coming soon according to local Greystones councillor, James O'Sullivan.



    more


    I wonder if he really believes this stuff :pac:


    Roisín Shortall said the first batch is to be rolled out this summer but it's a five year plan. Don't die just yet :)


  • #4
    Chuck Stone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,030 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    Politicians should not be allowed to use the word 'free'.


  • #5
    Delancey
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,451 ✭✭✭Delancey


    Given the well-publicised delaying tactics used by the HSE recently in the granting / renewal of medical cards I think we can safely say free GP visits for all is a pile of horse manure.


  • #6
    mike65
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88,972 ✭✭✭✭mike65


    LTI card holders are due to be the first cohort to be able to visit a GP without parting with 60 euro. So yipee! Its not all bad having a chronic condition!


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  • #7
    Defiler Of The Coffin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,117 ✭✭✭Defiler Of The Coffin


    In theory it sounds like a good idea but in practice it will be abused by people who don't really need to go at all. Even a small cost is enough to deter most time-wasters.


  • #8
    Sierra Oscar
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 8,531 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sierra Oscar


    People will be compelled to buy into health insurance schemes - calling it free is just optics.

    And of course those of us who are responsible in how often we attend GP's will have to fork out money to cover those who abuse the system and attend for petty reasons every second day.

    FG are basing their proposals on the health system in place in the Netherlands, which is now considered widely flawed. Within the Netherlands the average family pays out approximately 10% of their yearly income on covering their health insurance commitments. Labeling such a system as "free" is nothing short of absurd. Within the Netherlands, approximately 50% of public hospitals are facing bankruptcy and the price of health insurance premiums have risen by nearly 50% since the systems introduction. It really is a truly appalling system to model our health system on, however the Netherlands is seen as one of these sort of hipster countries in the eyes of our policy makers at the moment so apparently its OK to just carbon copy their policies despite them being flawed.


  • #9
    femur61
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,588 ✭✭✭femur61


    mike65 wrote: »
    LTI card holders are due to be the first cohort to be able to visit a GP without parting with 60 euro. So yipee! Its not all bad having a chronic condition!

    I am still waiting for mine. Already forked out €150 for GP and €400 on physio since the start of my renewal date for health insurance.


  • #10
    Good loser
    Registered Users Posts: 3,212 ✭✭✭Good loser


    Even without the Dutch experience it's an absurd 'promise' from beginning to end.

    Moving any service from the private sector into the public sector is crazy in principle.

    Doubly so in our parlous state.


  • #11
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Sierra Oscar wrote: »
    People will be compelled to buy into health insurance schemes - calling it free is just optics.
    Ah right...... so its like the free* car insurance we have already.

    *free claim payouts as long as you have paid the premium


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  • #12
    Boulevardier
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,375 ✭✭✭Boulevardier


    No country has a perfect health system, but our "system" must be among the worst.

    Britain has had free GP care for all for over 50 years now, and in my experience of 10 years living over there, it works reasonably well.

    In fact, when I see the difference between Britain's health care and ours, I sometimes wonder whether our independence from Britain was really worth it.


  • #13
    cavedave
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,164 ✭✭✭cavedave


    We spend more on medicine than other European countries
    expenditure2.png

    We are the outlier green box

    And if you are interested in health spending money on medicine is not a good way to get it (US stats)
    health-infographic.png


  • #14
    creedp
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,814 ✭✭✭creedp


    Good loser wrote: »
    Even without the Dutch experience it's an absurd 'promise' from beginning to end.

    Moving any service from the private sector into the public sector is crazy in principle.

    Doubly so in our parlous state.

    You do realise that all GP care in Ireland is currently 'provided' by the private sector. No GP's are employed by the State. What's being considered here is whether people (non-medical card holders) pay up front to visit the doctor or pay throught their compulsory taxtation contribution. No other european country forces its citizens to pay full cost up front to visit the first point of access to the health system. It is recognised that people should be incentivised (at least not massively disincentivised) to visit their GP on a regular basis. I wonder why we have such a high proportion of health services delivered in the most expensive possible setting - the acute hospital. I wonder also why so may people visit the A&E becasue of unecessary delay's in visiting their GP? When they could and should be treated in primary care by their GP if they attending on time before their condition deteriorated.

    Of course its easier to play the public bad private good card.


  • #15
    the groutch
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,096 ✭✭✭✭the groutch


    there's no such thing as free healthcare.
    The money the pay for it has to come from somewhere, be it via the PAYE system, or backdoor stealth taxes.
    Either way everyone will indirectly pay for it.


  • #16
    Lockstep
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,031 ✭✭✭Lockstep


    Boulevardier wrote: »
    No country has a perfect health system, but our "system" must be among the worst.

    Britain has had free GP care for all for over 50 years now, and in my experience of 10 years living over there, it works reasonably well.

    In fact, when I see the difference between Britain's health care and ours, I sometimes wonder whether our independence from Britain was really worth it.

    +1

    I lived in the UK for a few years and had nothing but amazing experiences with the NHS.


  • #17
    Boulevardier
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,375 ✭✭✭Boulevardier


    Groutch, I'm pretty sure we all know and accept that.


  • #18
    gaffer91
    Registered Users Posts: 1,307 ✭✭✭gaffer91


    bee_keeper wrote: »
    GP,s are no more private sector than the ESB is , both operate in a highly sheltered enviroment

    Irish Bob?

    I started a thread on this a while ago, here.

    I have actually since changed by opinion a bit, and think that in an ideal situation, GP's could be government employees, almost free at point of access with a nominal fee to try and prevent abuse. People would have to be willing to pay extra taxes and whether it is affordable given the current state of government finances is another matter.


  • #19
    donegal_road
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭donegal_road


    in parts of China, people pay the doctor when they are well, and stop paying him when they become ill. The Chinese say to seek treatment when you are ill is like digging a well when you are thirsty …it’s a little too late.


  • #20
    Icepick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,456 ✭✭✭Icepick


    Going from one extreme to another will not improve things.
    Tax and health insurance payers should have cheaper GP and specialists visits but medical card holders should pay at least something to prevent pointless visits.


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