Calor Gas

shane0007 · 09-07-2013 10:37pm

scudo2 wrote: »

Oil is 20-30% cheaper to run. Look it up.SEAI.IE or grantengineering.ie

Sorry but that is simply not true. The SEAI really should stop taking their information from PixieLand & realise that PixieLand is a made up place & the information & stories that come out of there are usually made up too.

If you take Calor for example, you can sign up for as low as 65 cent per litre. This equates to 8.3 cent per kwh, which is the identical to kerosene.
If you sign up for their advertised price of 75 cent per litre, this equates to 9.4 cent per kwh.
They are claiming it is 13.49 cent per kwh.

I'm an oil & gas man. I am on oil myself. I am also a service engineer for Grant. It is not in my interest to knock oil & I don't. However, I also like to stick to facts for as much of the time as I can.

phormium · 09-07-2013 11:40pm

I am not looking to change from gas, I prefer it. Bad experience in the past with a rented house and oil coloured my opinion of oil, no doubt incorrectly but I will stick with what I have.

Flogas is my only other option as far as I know, I didn't think there was any other companies, is there?

I actually rang them last year when it originally went up to 200, rang twice actually, they were to call me back, never got a call, so not sure if they are that bothered about new customers.

scudo2 · 11-07-2013 6:20pm

phormium wrote: »

Just came across this thread while searching for info on Calor. Would anyone know what the tank rental is with them and does it vary? I am with them for many years and the annual rental was always 70ish, however got a letter last year saying it was going up from next renewal for everyone to 200, sure enough in due course my renewal arrived and I had to pay 200. I did ring them and complain about the massive increase but got nowhere.

Now as it happens I pay the bills for another family member and their renewal for tank arrived couple of weeks ago and it was still at the old rate of 70, mine arrived yesterday and it is 200, before I ring them to ask and maybe end up costing my relative more. Any info?

Also is it possible to buy one's own tank, I see reference in one of the previous posts to it being better to own the tank, is this an option with Calor does anyone know. And finally one last question is it possible to switch to Flogas while there is gas in the tank or is it even possible to switch at all?

PM Shane 0007, he seems to have the best info on Calor Gas

shane0007 · 11-07-2013 6:26pm

Thanks, but really no need to PM me. The best option is to ring them, get the mobile number for the rep for your area & start negotiating hard with them. Tell them you know people are getting tank rentals for between €100 & €140. Tell them you will move to Flogas is they do not give in to something. You really need to play hard ball with them but it is the rep that has the say. You should also find the rep to be very easy to get on with and are very obliging. Likewise, if you are with Flogas & considering going to Calor, the same ethos applies.
If will really not to your long term or even short benefit to swap over. You can do, but it will be a lot of hassle, so play some hard ball & find some middle ground between you.

phormium · 11-07-2013 6:31pm

Thanks for that Shane, will get on to it tomorrow. Actually it was a local rep I dealt with originally. I don't really want to change from them but that was a hell of a jump in rental for the same tank that is sitting there for 23 yrs, but as they told me they service it every 10 yrs, now that is some service charge!

shane0007 · 11-07-2013 6:35pm

They change the tanks now every 15 years. Full inspection every 5 years testing all parts of the thickness of the steel. The new tanks have gas level transmitters, so their batteries are also changed every 5 years.

To me, this gives you even more bargaining power as you can say the tank is due to be changed so whether Calor changes it or Flogas puts in their makes no odds to you.

As I said, deal directly with your rep & I think you will be happy with the outcome.

phormium · 11-07-2013 8:01pm

They just serviced it last year and painted it, odd thing to do if they are considering changing it! Definitely last year as it was just before I got the renewal and when I rang Calor said advised that the cost of rental included servicing the tank, when I said I had never seen anyone service it before the most recent one, she told me it had also been serviced also in 2002, it was installed in 1990.

Will let you know how I get on

phormium · 15-07-2013 7:32pm

The update. Rang Calor today to get the name and number of local rep, the guy I was talking to offered to take my number and get rep to ring me but first wanted to know what it was about as it might be something he could help with. Explained that when I rang last year on same issue I got no help just very much take it or leave it attitude.

Anyway after telling him my gripe it turns out I am now 'eligible' to be put back to the old rate of 70+ tank rental. I queried how come this was so and he said to be eligible for that rate you had to buy over 650 somethings (not sure what measure of quantity he used!) per year. I queried how much was this in money as I would use pretty much the same amount every year and was told around 600 euro. Now I pointed out that I have always paid more than that per annum, I pay on average 1,200 p.a., no real answer for me but just kept assuring me that I would be moved back to old rate. When I queried why that requirement was not mentioned in the communication received advising of increases last year, was told it was something that was being monitored on a yearly basis and that there were quite a lot of costs associated with tank rental. I am sure there are but my 23 yr old tank with 2 services in that time and one paint job is certainly not costing them much and has been well paid for at this stage.

Anyway I am happy for the moment, but if I hadn't rang I would be left paying 200, they weren't rushing to write to tell me of my new 'eligibility' for the lower rate. Bit of sharp practice really!

shane0007 · 15-07-2013 8:11pm

That's great news. The main thing is you got a fantastic deal & a lot more than expected.
Without Boards you may have been left in limbo or over-paying or going through the hassle of changing supplier, so it just shows how good a public service Boards provides.
Well done.

glic83 · 15-07-2013 8:31pm

If hes tank is 23 years old shouldn't they be replacing it?

shane0007 · 15-07-2013 8:35pm

glic83 wrote: »

If hes tank is 23 years old shouldn't they be replacing it?

That would have been decided by the inspecting engineer. The decision would not be taken lightly & they would take thickness readings of the steel to determine their decision. The condition of the tank would have been in very good condition.

scudo2 · 15-07-2013 9:18pm

Fair play to you Shane for all the free advice you give out. + all the time you put into the long reply's to everybody.

phormium · 15-07-2013 10:16pm

Yes I agree, this is a great facility and thanks for the advice Shane.

Still a bit pee'd off though that I paid the 200 last year when clearly under their 'eligibility' I shouldn't have had to. Still think I might write a little letter of complaint about that

JD6910 · 18-07-2013 8:22am

shane0007 wrote: »

That would have been decided by the inspecting engineer. The decision would not be taken lightly & they would take thickness readings of the steel to determine their decision. The condition of the tank would have been in very good condition.

what happens in relation to underground tanks? do they change they out also every couple of years - if so the digging would be very disturbing????

shane0007 · 18-07-2013 8:40am

JD6910 wrote: »

what happens in relation to underground tanks? do they change they out also every couple of years - if so the digging would be very disturbing????

Obviously not. Underground tanks are not open to the elements. A bit like underground tanks in your forecourt.
There is still an inspection process though.

JD6910 · 18-07-2013 10:33am

shane0007 wrote: »

Obviously not. Underground tanks are not open to the elements. A bit like underground tanks in your forecourt.
There is still an inspection process though.

heard through the grapevine that flogas look to change out UG tanks after X amount of years due to corrosion from ground water etc....

by the by: which would you install in a super insulated house: oil or gas?

shane0007 · 18-07-2013 10:40am

JD6910 wrote: »

by the by: which would you install in a super insulated house: oil or gas?

Calculate the exact kw demand. If demand is very low, either gas because it is modulating or oil through a small buffer tank to eliminate cycling. Then modulate out if the buffer.

There are many pros & cons for both systems. It will depend on your preference. Obviously we are talking about LPG as Nat Gas would win hands down if available.

I am oil & gave serious consideration to swapping to LPG but decided to remove HW demand & stick with oil but change to buffer.
With LPG the cost per kwh is marginally higher but you get it back with modulation of the boiler.

shane0007 · 18-07-2013 10:41am

JD6910 wrote: »

heard through the grapevine that flogas look to change out UG tanks after X amount of years due to corrosion from ground water etc....

That could well be on older tanks.

shane0007 · 18-07-2013 10:43am

JD6910 wrote: »

by the by: which would you install in a super insulated house: oil or gas?

The other consideration is what are you heating, rads, low heat rads, fan assisted rads or UFH?
All can give differing options on the source.

glic83 · 18-07-2013 11:19am

You said you removed the HW demand, what way are you now heating hot water?

shane0007 · 18-07-2013 11:31am

glic83 wrote: »

You said you removed the HW demand, what way are you now heating hot water?

Sorry, I installed an Ariston NUOS.

Here's the thread on the various types. The NUOS is an air to water. The Energia (LVP) uses a panel on the roof.

http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2056600822/16/#post85576500

JD6910 · 23-07-2013 8:15am

shane0007 wrote: »

The other consideration is what are you heating, rads, low heat rads, fan assisted rads or UFH?
All can give differing options on the source.

i am going to install normal steel rads....

JD6910 · 23-07-2013 8:24am

shane0007 wrote: »

Sorry, I installed an Ariston NUOS.

Here's the thread on the various types. The NUOS is an air to water. The Energia (LVP) uses a panel on the roof.

http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2056600822/16/#post85576500

why did you install this???;)

shane0007 · 23-07-2013 10:56am

JD6910 wrote: »

why did you install this???;)

Because it is extremely cheap to run giving me continuous 250L of hot water every day of the year.

JD6910 · 23-07-2013 3:20pm

shane0007 wrote: »

Because it is extremely cheap to run giving me continuous 250L of hot water every day of the year.

can you give us the lay man talk on this?

what is it?
capital cost to buy it?
cost per day to run it?
expected life expectancy etc...

shane0007 · 23-07-2013 4:16pm

JD6910 wrote: »

can you give us the lay man talk on this?

what is it?
capital cost to buy it?
cost per day to run it?
expected life expectancy etc...

This is not really the thread for discussing this but the other thread deals with most of your questions, but
Air to water heat pump
€3,500 installed including labour
Approx €4 per week but I have solar so my running cost is less. Braka's is more realistic of actual running cost.
Life expectancy can be anything really depending on parameters of the installation. If conditions are not suitable, the compressor is under strain & won't last as long. Proper conditions & external conditions suitable, no reason why it cannot last for many trouble free years. Warranty is 5 years parts & labour

JD6910 · 24-07-2013 12:08pm

shane0007 wrote: »

This is not really the thread for discussing this but the other thread deals with most of your questions, but
Air to water heat pump
€3,500 installed including labour
Approx €4 per week but I have solar so my running cost is less. Braka's is more realistic of actual running cost.
Life expectancy can be anything really depending on parameters of the installation. If conditions are not suitable, the compressor is under strain & won't last as long. Proper conditions & external conditions suitable, no reason why it cannot last for many trouble free years. Warranty is 5 years parts & labour

so at 3500 it is a similar capital cost of a solar installation BUT with the NUOS you are guaranteed results and not depending on the sun!!!!!

if it is essentially a heat pump would a fellow not install an air to water unit that does heating and DHW????

shane0007 · 24-07-2013 7:04pm

JD6910 wrote: »

so at 3500 it is a similar capital cost of a solar installation BUT with the NUOS you are guaranteed results and not depending on the sun!!!!!

Yes & no really. €3,500 will get you a solar system but you are really talking about bottom end & under-sized for Irish "normal" weather. You are generally talking about in the region €5,000 for a decent system. SEAI have made it near impossible to qualify for the grant of €800 with the kwh/yr rule for most houses. A BER survey is also required at a cost of approx €175. This invesemt offers 50% of your demand.

So NUOS is a cheaper option to install & provides 100% of your demand.

Don't get me wrong, I install many solar systems. Each system has merits & differs from home to home which is suitable.

JD6910 wrote: »

if it is essentially a heat pump would a fellow not install an air to water unit that does heating and DHW????

Yes of course a fellow could. However, as a retrofit, that same fellow would have to achieve air tightness & improve the home insulation to the levels of current regs/standards. Otherwise the heat pump is working overtime to keep up with unnecessary losses. This can be detrimental to a heat pump.
He would also have a very high capital cost. So it goes back to what he wants to achieve for what budget.

JD6910 · 25-07-2013 11:19am

shane0007 wrote: »

Yes & no really. €3,500 will get you a solar system but you are really talking about bottom end & under-sized for Irish "normal" weather. You are generally talking about in the region €5,000 for a decent system. SEAI have made it near impossible to qualify for the grant of €800 with the kwh/yr rule for most houses. A BER survey is also required at a cost of approx €175. This invesemt offers 50% of your demand.

So NUOS is a cheaper option to install & provides 100% of your demand.

Don't get me wrong, I install many solar systems. Each system has merits & differs from home to home which is suitable.

Yes of course a fellow could. However, as a retrofit, that same fellow would have to achieve air tightness & improve the home insulation to the levels of current regs/standards. Otherwise the heat pump is working overtime to keep up with unnecessary losses. This can be detrimental to a heat pump.
He would also have a very high capital cost. So it goes back to what he wants to achieve for what budget.

this is a very interesting discussion and thanks for the valuable input.

what would YOU put into an A3 rated family home of 3000 sq ft. House will have little heat demand due to the A3 rating and airtightness work done. room heating stove also installed and piped for normal steel rads.

shane0007 · 25-07-2013 5:29pm

JD6910 wrote: »

this is a very interesting discussion and thanks for the valuable input.

what would YOU put into an A3 rated family home of 3000 sq ft. House will have little heat demand due to the A3 rating and airtightness work done. room heating stove also installed and piped for normal steel rads.

How old is the house?

Calor Gas

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