Pubs in Galway closing at 1am

biko · 19-08-2012 1:23pm

This thread is about the closing times only. Let's try to stay on topic.
This is the last warning before thread is closed.

Any more uncivil comments directed towards the Super will result in a long ban.
Do discuss, but discuss as adults.

Seaneh · 19-08-2012 1:41pm

JustMary wrote: »

Just to share the information:

Very well informed sources tell me that late this week the pubs that have traditionally opened just a teeny-tiny bit before 10:30am received visits from the guards, with very strict reminders about when they were allowed to open.

So at least the guards ain't being age-ist.

I hope Tig Coili start opening earlier just to annoy the licencing sergeant.
Put their Market licence to good use.

GalwayGaillimh · 19-08-2012 4:25pm

Considering the amount of shift workers in Galway factories, pubs should be allowed to open 24/7 if the business is about.

inisboffin · 19-08-2012 9:22pm

Seaneh wrote: »

I hope Tig Coili start opening earlier just to annoy the licencing sergeant.
Put their Market licence to good use.

Who else in town have an early license these days (utilised or not)
The Old Forge I think?
Richardsons?

Duffy the Vampire Slayer · 20-08-2012 12:16am

dloob wrote: »

The Gardai are not for turning it seems.

http://www.galwaynews.ie/27314-city-garda%C3%AD-stand-firm-face-pubs-furore

Is there any way of lobbying the district court to change their mind or are judges as unaccountable as usual?

thesandeman · 20-08-2012 9:27am

inisboffin wrote: »

Seaneh wrote: »

I hope Tig Coili start opening earlier just to annoy the licencing sergeant.
Put their Market licence to good use.

Who else in town have an early license these days (utilised or not)
The Old Forge I think?
Richardsons?

Taffes, Murphys for the Saturday market and a few of the Woodquay pubs for the Potato market.

leeroybrown · 20-08-2012 11:55am

Seaneh wrote: »

I hope Tig Coili start opening earlier just to annoy the licencing sergeant.
Put their Market licence to good use.

Quite unlikely. If the "market pubs" do that there'll likely be a Garda in them every night on exactly half past the hour to check that they've stopped serving.

chuky_r_law · 20-08-2012 2:08pm

popepaisley1 wrote: »

my point being that, today, this isn't happening randomly. the gardaí are doing this for a very specific reason. maybe, as someone else pointed out, it has something to do with cuts in pay and staff and work condidtions. whatever the reason they have made their point. infact i would go as far as to say that if this is the reason then it is a gross waste of gardaí resorces, having gaurds going round to pubs checking that they close at 1am. i know alot of people here have been of the opinion that they are only enforcing the law. well how come now? were they being hugely negligent in not closing them on time before? and if there was a wink-wink agreement between them and the club and pub owners about the use of late licences, whereby they would let them flout the law and keep their establishments open late, is it right that the gaurds should be possession of that power to revert to the law, ie this ridiculous early closing time, anytime they saw fit? sure they way the whole system is set up is hugely open to abuse and corruption. in this case i wouldnt say the gaurds are enforing the law but rather dictating what laws they see fit to enforce

thats a very good point. if the law had been set up right from the start then we wouldn't be having this problem. just as you and i cannot decide which laws we obey, so should it be for the gardai, that they cannot pick and choose which laws they enforce. lets hope that they sort out this problem in the next few weeks and bring the late licencing laws into line with the rest of the country. and there should be a proper night club act brought in to differentiate night clubs from pubs. i can't be that hard to do, if there is a will to do it

antoobrien · 20-08-2012 2:11pm

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Look, people are forgetting the whole point here, especially publicans with their frankly risible threat that millins of valuable jobs do be lost and that the guards will have to deal with house parties.

It's not just the publicans that have this fear, the SU have gotten in on the act.

NUI Galway Students’ Union has hit out at local gardaí for their recent clampdown in opening hours in the city, saying that it is putting student jobs at risk.

The organisation has expressed concern at the recent practice of gardaí closing pubs and nightclubs at 1am will have a “negative effect” on the hundreds of part time staff employed in the sector, most of whom are students.

A petition was started by workers in the club and pubs industry last Monday night and has already collected over 3,500 signatures.

NUI Galway Students’ Union President Paul Curley said that up to 80 per cent of part-time staff in the industry are students and these jobs have now been put in danger.

yoyo · 20-08-2012 2:24pm

If off licenses are forced to close at 10 then I can see why pubs should be forced to close at whichever time their license requires so. Both laws are ridiculous, but I don't see any off licenses staying open serving after 10 as there can be severe fines/loss of license and I don't see why pubs/nightclubs should be treated any different. The law is the law (and its ridiculous but thats life...)

Nick

chuky_r_law · 20-08-2012 2:35pm

yoyo wrote: »

If off licenses are forced to close at 10 then I can see why pubs should be forced to close at whichever time their license requires so. Both laws are ridiculous, but I don't see any off licenses staying open serving after 10 as there can be severe fines/loss of license and I don't see why pubs/nightclubs should be treated any different. The law is the law (and its ridiculous but thats life...)

Nick

clearly pubs and nightclubs were being treated differently before they started enforcing this silly law. they were throwing a blind eye to them staying open later for years, probably because they saw that it was a ridiculous law too. why that position has changed now is beyond me.

yoyo · 20-08-2012 2:47pm

chuky_r_law wrote: »

clearly pubs and nightclubs were being treated differently before they started enforcing this silly law. they were throwing a blind eye to them staying open later for years, probably because they saw that it was a ridiculous law too. why that position has changed now is beyond me.

I'd say the same about the off license laws being silly, but they are very much enforced. I can't see why pubs should be treated any different. I'm not for one moment saying I agree with it, but both premises have a specific license to serve booze, and both should be adhering to the terms of that license. It does seem the pubs are more lax about it than the off licenses, but shouldn't expect to play the poor struggling card when they purchase a license with explicit opening/closing hours and are then paid a visit by Gardai encforcing the law.

Nick

20-08-2012 3:36pm

yoyo wrote: »

I'd say the same about the off license laws being silly, but they are very much enforced. I can't see why pubs should be treated any different. I'm not for one moment saying I agree with it, but both premises have a specific license to serve booze, and both should be adhering to the terms of that license. It does seem the pubs are more lax about it than the off licenses, but shouldn't expect to play the poor struggling card when they purchase a license with explicit opening/closing hours and are then paid a visit by Gardai encforcing the law.

Nick

Well for a start the 10 o'clock closing for off licences is a hard rule set for the country as a whole whereas late licences are set by the local district court and Galway district court has set a stricter closing time (1am) than the majority of the country (2am or 2:30am) so really turning a blind eye to the extra hour or so was just bringing Galway in line with the rest of the country.

chuky_r_law · 20-08-2012 4:21pm

yoyo wrote: »

I'd say the same about the off license laws being silly, but they are very much enforced. I can't see why pubs should be treated any different. I'm not for one moment saying I agree with it, but both premises have a specific license to serve booze, and both should be adhering to the terms of that license. It does seem the pubs are more lax about it than the off licenses, but shouldn't expect to play the poor struggling card when they purchase a license with explicit opening/closing hours and are then paid a visit by Gardai encforcing the law.

Nick

in fairness they should have been lobbying hard all these years trying to get galway late licence laws in line with the rest of the country, but i still dont think you can blame them now for feeling hard done by when the gaurds, in their infinite wisdom, suddenly decided that this was an offence worth pursuing.

yoyo · 20-08-2012 4:24pm

Hugh Echoing Orchid wrote: »

Well for a start the 10 o'clock closing for off licences is a hard rule set for the country as a whole whereas late licences are set by the local district court and Galway district court has set a stricter closing time (1am) than the majority of the country (2am or 2:30am) so really turning a blind eye to the extra hour or so was just bringing Galway in line with the rest of the country.

If the pubs wanted to stay open later they could buy a late license. I'm sure the pubs buying a late license would be annoyed if the pub down the road didn't have one but stayed open late anyways. Even though the opening hours are not country wide they are applicable to the publican and their license, its up to the publicans to complain to the local councillors or whoever to have the closing time raised from 1-2.

in fairness they should have been lobbying hard all these years trying to get galway late licence laws in line with the rest of the country, but i still dont think you can blame them now for feeling hard done by when the gaurds, in their infinite wisdom, suddenly decided that this was an offence worth pursuing.

I agree with you it is ridiculous, but you also can't have that much sympathy for them either as they are knowingly breaking the rules staying open later. It could well be the case that if other pubs are buying a late license in Galway they are the ones getting annoyed if other pubs are staying open later and not paying like they are. Who knows what reason the Gards are pursuing this but there may well be genuine complaints have been made.

Nick

chuky_r_law · 20-08-2012 4:34pm

i thiink it will blow over soon anyway. i reckon that when the next batch of late licences are up for grabs they will most likely bring local licencing laws in-line with everywhere else.

and if they dont it really would be a sorry time for galway

chuky_r_law · 20-08-2012 4:43pm

yoyo wrote: »

I agree with you it is ridiculous, but you also can't have that much sympathy for them either as they are knowingly breaking the rules staying open later. It could well be the case that if other pubs are buying a late license in Galway they are the ones getting annoyed if other pubs are staying open later and not paying like they are. Who knows what reason the Gards are pursuing this but there may well be genuine complaints have been made.

Nick

my heart doesn't exactly bleed, but i do feel sorry for those whose jobs may be at risk

but again i still think that they are being treated unfairly. whatever about closing time being 1am for a late licence in galway, im sure they knew that they were operating in a grey area of the law, seeing as the gaurds were allowing them to operate. that grey area shouldnt have been there in the first place. no one knows exactly what motives the gaurds have for doing this in the first place but law should have been tighter so as they cant do what they are doing now just to make a point. that is too much authority for the gardai to have. to say that they are only doing their job is nonsense.

and as was pointed out earlier, the gardai are wasting their own time by sending gaurds around to all these establishments, making sure they keep to the letter of the law. im sure these gaurds could be doing something more useful than this

20-08-2012 4:45pm

yoyo wrote: »

If the pubs wanted to stay open later they could buy a late license. I'm sure the pubs buying a late license would be annoyed if the pub down the road didn't have one but stayed open late anyways. Even though the opening hours are not country wide they are applicable to the publican and their license, its up to the publicans to complain to the local councillors or whoever to have the closing time raised from 1-2.

I agree with you it is ridiculous, but you also can't have that much sympathy for them either as they are knowingly breaking the rules staying open later. It could well be the case that if other pubs are buying a late license in Galway they are the ones getting annoyed if other pubs are staying open later and not paying like they are. Who knows what reason the Gards are pursuing this but there may well be genuine complaints have been made.

Nick

But they are buying late licences thats the point but the late licence in Galway technically only allows pubs open until 1am Monday to Thursday whereas in Dublin or Limerick the same late licence would allow opening until 2am or maybe even 2:30am.

Late licences cost a bomb and in reality its only right that the Guards have always turned a blind eye to the extra hour (up to 2am) which Galway pubs stayed open. Paying the extortionate late licence fee to just be allowed open until 1am is madness. That last hour is also a profitable one for pubs as people tend to drink faster (rounds of shots) and drink more expensive drinks (double vodkas and mixers etc) so this is the period that really pays having a late licence.

I know personally speaking I could spend nearly as much money in the last hour as in the 4 or 5 hours drinking before it.

yoyo · 20-08-2012 5:19pm

chuky_r_law wrote: »

my heart doesn't exactly bleed, but i do feel sorry for those whose jobs may be at risk

but again i still think that they are being treated unfairly. whatever about closing time being 1am for a late licence in galway, im sure they knew that they were operating in a grey area of the law, seeing as the gaurds were allowing them to operate. that grey area shouldnt have been there in the first place. no one knows exactly what motives the gaurds have for doing this in the first place but law should have been tighter so as they cant do what they are doing now just to make a point. that is too much authority for the gardai to have. to say that they are only doing their job is nonsense.

and as was pointed out earlier, the gardai are wasting their own time by sending gaurds around to all these establishments, making sure they keep to the letter of the law. im sure these gaurds could be doing something more useful than this

But they are buying late licences thats the point but the late licence in Galway technically only allows pubs open until 1am Monday to Thursday whereas in Dublin or Limerick the same late licence would allow opening until 2am or maybe even 2:30am.

Late licences cost a bomb and in reality its only right that the Guards have always turned a blind eye to the extra hour (up to 2am) which Galway pubs stayed open. Paying the extortionate late licence fee to just be allowed open until 1am is madness. That last hour is also a profitable one for pubs as people tend to drink faster (rounds of shots) and drink more expensive drinks (double vodkas and mixers etc) so this is the period that really pays having a late licence.

I know personally speaking I could spend nearly as much money in the last hour as in the 4 or 5 hours drinking before it.

If the late license only gives them until 1, well then people working there should know that they will be working an hour less than in other counties. I can't see how they would loose their job just because a premises closes an hour early. Obviously I agree that the hours should be 2/2.30 to be in line with the rest of the country but that is something for the publicans to lobby (and frankly they seem to be able to get the laws on their side more often than not with little effort in this country).
If the Gards have been finding they have less resources in the hours following to takle the anti social behaviour from the people spilling out of the pubs at 2/2.30 that may also be a reason for them to be enforcing the rules more now? Only the Guards know why but I doubt they would do it just for the sake of it. They must have their reasons...

Nick

leeroybrown · 20-08-2012 5:44pm

yoyo wrote: »

If the late license only gives them until 1, well then people working there should know that they will be working an hour less than in other counties. I can't see how they would loose their job just because a premises closes an hour early.

It's not so much a case of a slightly shorter night but rather whether those nights even happen. There's a reasonably large fixed cost associated with purchasing a late license meaning that lost hour of sales really does call into question whether it's profitable to open. We've already seen since the start of the downturn that some bars dropped late opening even with the old licensing situation. A few closed nights quickly turns into 10+ hours loss of income for late night bar staff. If clubs don't open that's zero income on those nights for bar, door and promo staff. It adds up pretty quickly.

Ray Burkes Pension · 20-08-2012 6:13pm

What a lot of people fail to realise is that if late licences are only gonna to 1am midweek then a lot of places will sensibly give up their late licences during the week.
So instead of losing an extra hour, there will be only one or two place willing to be open to 1am in whole city.
Galway will be a ghost town during the week.

Duffy the Vampire Slayer · 20-08-2012 6:30pm

chuky_r_law wrote: »

i thiink it will blow over soon anyway. i reckon that when the next batch of late licences are up for grabs they will most likely bring local licencing laws in-line with everywhere else.

and if they dont it really would be a sorry time for galway

We can only hope that the judge will have the good sense to do so.

charlie_says · 20-08-2012 6:35pm

chuky_r_law wrote: »

i thiink it will blow over soon anyway. i reckon that when the next batch of late licences are up for grabs they will most likely bring local licencing laws in-line with everywhere else.

Hopefully this will be the case.

The licensing laws are counter productive in my opinion. People choose to behave or not when they are drinking irregardless of the availability of alcohol.

inisboffin · 20-08-2012 8:52pm

Is no one else getting a little happy at the thought of Speakeasys?

TheCosmicFrog · 20-08-2012 9:37pm

inisboffin wrote: »

Is no one else getting a little happy at the thought of Speakeasys?

Speaky McEasy's - "The best damn pet shop in town!"

chuky_r_law · 21-08-2012 2:34am

inisboffin wrote: »

Is no one else getting a little happy at the thought of Speakeasys?

most good local pubs are sheebeens already!! tbh most of the places i drink wont matter a jot whether the licencing laws change or not. i have quite often found myself drinking away in pubs at 4 or 5 in the morning in places that wouldnt have a notion of paying for the late licence.
if this was taken away from me would i start going in to pubs that do have a late licence...front door...roisins...kellys...skeff??? not a chance!! i like to go for a quiet late pint, not a party!
my local gets raided by the cops a couple times every year. nothing ever happens over this. they just have to do the rounds every now and then. as im sure this will blow over.

thesandeman · 21-08-2012 3:34am

I noticed that The Bently only kept normal pub hours last night (Monday). I doubt that was in their business plan when they agreed to pay crazy money for the lease a few months ago.

Wompa1 · 21-08-2012 3:48am

The NUIG Students Union should stay out of it. Their ****e hawkin over the last few years means if they are behind something you'd have to wonder if it is a good idea.

BhoscaCapall · 21-08-2012 4:05am

I was in an unnamed nightclub last night which stayed open until around 2am. I was sickened at such a brazen breach of the law and had to leave early and phone the guards.

lol jk what sort of sad tosser gives a crap

dloob · 21-08-2012 11:40am

BhoscaCapall wrote: »

I was in an unnamed nightclub last night which stayed open until around 2am. I was sickened at such a brazen breach of the law and had to leave early and phone the guards.

lol jk what sort of sad tosser gives a crap

I suppose someone who likes the see the law actually enforced rather than the Bertie culture of the nod and the wink that you espouse.

chuky_r_law · 21-08-2012 12:35pm

dloob wrote: »

I suppose someone who likes the see the law actually enforced rather than the Bertie culture of the nod and the wink that you espouse.

it was the gaurds who encouraged this nod and wink culture by allowing this to happen in the first place.

21-08-2012 12:47pm

dloob wrote: »

I suppose someone who likes the see the law actually enforced rather than the Bertie culture of the nod and the wink that you espouse.

I just cant understand why people care about stupid laws like this to be honest. There are real laws that everyone wants to see enforced and plenty of mickey mouse laws that anyone with a bit of sense couldn't care less about.

theresadaly · 21-08-2012 12:57pm

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

There is only one answer to this madness... Picket the Garda Station !

love this pic-where did you find it?

Mrs OBumble · 21-08-2012 1:35pm

chuky_r_law wrote: »

most good local pubs are sheebeens already!! tbh most of the places i drink wont matter a jot whether the licencing laws change or not. i have quite often found myself drinking away in pubs at 4 or 5 in the morning in places that wouldnt have a notion of paying for the late licence.
if this was taken away from me would i start going in to pubs that do have a late licence...front door...roisins...kellys...skeff??? not a chance!! i like to go for a quiet late pint, not a party!
my local gets raided by the cops a couple times every year. nothing ever happens over this. they just have to do the rounds every now and then. as im sure this will blow over.

I don't have your stamina (I flake by 2am, generally), but agree with your overall sentiments re not going to the "name" pubs. And yes, I do knowingly break the law sometimes .... and take my chances re getting caught / arrested / convicted.

However I do believe that laws do need to be enforced more rigorously when patrons leaving pubs are behaving loudly, assaulting people (or driving - but that's mostly dealt with).

On a related note, when do the applications for late licenses in September go through the court? I suspect they'll be watched a little harder than usual, this time ...

chuky_r_law · 21-08-2012 2:05pm

JustMary wrote: »

I don't have your stamina (I flake by 2am, generally), but agree with your overall sentiments re not going to the "name" pubs. And yes, I do knowingly break the law sometimes .... and take my chances re getting caught / arrested / convicted.

the main pub i drink in has had the cops call in a few times well after 1am. while the pub will close immediately i have never heard of anything coming from this. definitely no customers getting convicted, and i still have to hear of the pub even getting a fine. just every now and then the gaurds have to do the rounds. its not even a question of taking your chances. you would have to be very unlucky, or have committed a major crime, to get arrested after hours in a pub

BhoscaCapall · 21-08-2012 5:41pm

dloob wrote: »

I suppose someone who likes the see the law actually enforced rather than the Bertie culture of the nod and the wink that you espouse.

Just how subservient do you have to be to want to see laws enforced purely because they are laws? Tragic.

dloob · 21-08-2012 6:28pm

BhoscaCapall wrote: »

Just how subservient do you have to be to want to see laws enforced purely because they are laws? Tragic.

JFK, Septemeber 30, 1962 wrote:

This is as it should be, for our Nation is founded on the principle that observance of the law is the eternal safeguard of liberty and defiance of the law is the surest road to tyranny. The law which we obey includes the final rulings of the courts, as well as the enactments of our legislative bodies. Even among law-abiding men few laws are universally loved, but they are uniformly respected and not resisted.
Americans are free, in short, to disagree with the law but not to disobey it. For in a government of laws and not of men, no man, however prominent or powerful, and no mob however unruly or boisterous, is entitled to defy a court of law. If this country should ever reach the point where any man or group of men by force or threat of force could long defy the commands of our court and our Constitution, then no law would stand free from doubt, no judge would be sure of his writ, and no citizen would be safe from his neighbors.

Of course that doesn't apply in utterly corrupt countries, with an established nod, wink and brown envelope culture.
It's funny the same people complaining about bankers getting off support the nod and the wink when it suits themselves.

You think they would have learned by now but no.

I think the whole thing comes from a post-colonial hangup some Irish people have with authority, so they are always trying to fight the man and rip off the state.

If you don't like the law then get it changed, let the pubs put their arguments to the district court when the September applications are heard.
That's how it's supposed to work not the law as an a la carte menu where you ignore what doesn't suit you.

EuskalHerria · 21-08-2012 6:32pm

dloob wrote: »

I suppose someone who likes the see the law actually enforced rather than the Bertie culture of the nod and the wink that you espouse.

Bertie culture is best summed up in individuals who took as much as they could, for as long as they could.

This is an entirely different issue. At stake here are a collective group of businesses and workers losing their jobs based on geography. It's as simple as that really. The pub and club trade has suffered hugely over the last number of years and anything to further cut their income will be devastating to business and jobs.

dloob · 21-08-2012 7:10pm

EuskalHerria wrote: »

Bertie culture is best summed up in individuals who took as much as they could, for as long as they could.

This is an entirely different issue. At stake here are a collective group of businesses and workers losing their jobs based on geography. It's as simple as that really. The pub and club trade has suffered hugely over the last number of years and anything to further cut their income will be devastating to business and jobs.

Yes and they should be making sure it gets changed when the district court sits again.
Garavan is gone and Fahy refused to register convictions against restaurants on good Friday in the past so should be sympathetic.

PomBear · 21-08-2012 7:33pm

Wompa1 wrote: »

The NUIG Students Union should stay out of it. Their ****e hawkin over the last few years means if they are behind something you'd have to wonder if it is a good idea.

It's a pretty legitimate concern for their members (students), some would think you're ****ehawkin!

WallyGUFC · 21-08-2012 10:15pm

PomBear wrote: »

It's a pretty legitimate concern for their members (students), some would think you're ****ehawkin!

In fairness, the SU do spout a lot of s**te and don't really represent the views of the vast majority of students, this time being an obvious exception.

dloob · 21-08-2012 11:46pm

So does anybody know when the district court deals with the applications for extensions?

leeroybrown · 22-08-2012 12:17pm

dloob wrote: »

So does anybody know when the district court deals with the applications for extensions?

They're dealt with at the end of the preceding month. One off applications for extensions can be made in advance during the month to the licensing sergeant.

fishy fishy · 22-08-2012 12:31pm

I don't know if this has been posted previously, but I heard that the reason that this is happening is because they have cut down on garda hours and basically there is now not enough garda on duty to cover the late night openings anymore - its a case of a "cutback in garda" rather than anything else. I could be completely wrong of course, but it's just what I heard.

chuky_r_law · 22-08-2012 1:08pm

that has been mentioned on the thread already. pretty handy that they were able to pull this stunt to make their point

Nal · 31-08-2012 8:12pm

has there been any "let up" at all with this the last while?

michaelr666 · 31-08-2012 8:54pm

Carbon closed at 2 last night.. as to the rest of the pubs/ clubs I aint too sure..

Foreverdelayed · 31-08-2012 8:54pm

Nal wrote: »

has there been any "let up" at all with this the last while?

Was out last Monday and Carbon stayed open until 2am. The staff said it really depends on when the Gardaí show up; could be 1 some nights and 2.30 others. Open until 2.30am tomorrow though.

michaelr666 · 31-08-2012 8:59pm

yeah the weekends are unaffected alright.. i wonder if the gardai would enforce this law so vigorously in the coming months

Wompa1 · 31-08-2012 9:48pm

PomBear wrote: »

It's a pretty legitimate concern for their members (students), some would think you're ****ehawkin!

Holding the University to ransom over RAG week is out of a legit concern of there's? They must be some pampered little brats if that's the case

Pubs in Galway closing at 1am

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